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Newsweek Cover Story (Dec. 15th issue): The Religious Case for Gay Marriage

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keepCAblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-08-08 09:50 PM
Original message
Newsweek Cover Story (Dec. 15th issue): The Religious Case for Gay Marriage
Of course, this has the cave-dwelling conservatives in a tizzy...but, THANK YOU, NEWSWEEK!!!!!!!

http://www.newsweek.com/id/172653

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20081207/capt.333ddb...
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Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-08-08 10:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. I have it. It is *outrageously* good.
The editorial alone is merciless in shooting down every myth and canard put forth by the opposition. As succinct and effective a case for equality as I've seen in a MSM organ.
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RetiredTrotskyite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-08-08 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
2. The article is refreshing....
but the comments are the same old tired, bible-banging crap as always. I urge people to read the articles and comment from here so that these people are not the only voices when it comes to commenting on a great article.
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Aslanspal Donating Member (303 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-09-08 12:41 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Wow! the fundy whack jobs turned out for this one
also look into the BaptistBoard and FFF board Fighting Fundy Forum they frequently bash just as bad as the posts, I am reading in the Newsweek article.


These people must be diminished we must take them on now! or some big crisis will happen and they will have a national audience telling them to be afraid and believe like them.


STRENGTHEN SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE
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RetiredTrotskyite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-09-08 04:38 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I Got So Sick of All the Fundie Bigotry That I Posted This At the Blog Connected With the Article...
Edited on Tue Dec-09-08 04:45 PM by RetiredTrotskyite
I don't want or need the Bible in the public discourse. This country was founded by DEISTS. There is separation of Church and State in the Constitution and I want YOUR Church out of MY State! You have the right to spew all the hatred you want in your churches...funny how, for a religion founded on love...how hateful Christians tend to be...and the more Biblically-oriented, the more hateful they seem to be. I don't care what you teach in your churches, but you have NO RIGHT to dictate to me how to live my life or to tell me who I can or cannot marry. I do not tell you how to live your lives or tell you whom you can and cannot marry. I, like millions of other Americans, do not believe in the Bible and do not want it determining the laws of the land.

God help your children if any of your children are gay, lesbian, bisexual, or transgendered. Millions of LGBT youth are in fear of people like you finding out. It is NOT a choice. Did you choose to be straight? I assure you that none of us CHOSE to be gay, lesbian, bisexual, or transgendered. In many cases if your children turn out to be anything but heterosexual, they will have the Bible banged over their head metaphorically (and in some cases, physically), beaten, rejected, or dragged to ex-gay therapy (which doesn't work, by the way).

How many of you out there who spew hatred have been divorced and then remarry? Jesus says you are ADULTERERS and ADULTERESSES! Do you hate someone? Then you are a MURDERER, according to Jesus. You all need to go home, read the Bible, work on your own souls and your own lives and stay out of everyone else's!

My spouse and I had to go to Canada to marry to get away from religious hate and bigotry. Unlike many Christians who serial marry, cheat on their spouses, and divorce, only to remarry, both my HUSBAND and I are monogamous, take our wedding vows very seriously, are deeply in love and intend to be together in wedlock "until death do us part". My mother, a pious lifelong Missouri-Synod Lutheran, managed to work her way past fear and homophobia to attend our wedding a few months before she died this past spring. I asked her was she truly OK with coming because if she wasn't she didn't need to come, I would understand, and would still love her just as much. She said,
"I don't think I have long to live and when I die, I want to die knowing that you are happy." She believed very strongly in the Lord and I believe that if there is a Heaven, she is there now.

I did not choose to be gay. I have been gay as long as I can remember. The only sadness I have had in being gay is the hatred and bigotry being spewed by those who are SO secure in the belief that they already have a place in heaven. I can tell you from when I was growing up...It's not that simple. In addition to belief, there is action--here's an action plan for all you bigots: go home, pick up your Bibles, pray for understanding, work on YOUR OWN SOULS and STAY THE HELL OUT OF POLITICS!!!
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gaspee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-09-08 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Awesome
You need to save that and post it whenever you see the bigots out trying to take over blogs.
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RetiredTrotskyite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-09-08 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Thank You.
Edited on Tue Dec-09-08 06:21 PM by RetiredTrotskyite
This is the reply I got addressed specifically to me. :eyes:

To MerlynLights:

I am very sorry that Christians have wronged you in the past. That is the only reason I can think of to account for your extreme distaste for them, since that is the only kind of religious people you refer to. I will not deny that Christians have messed up tremendously in how they treat other people when their beliefs do not coincide with that of Christians. I know my apology will not count for much, if at all to you, but I am truly sorry for the harm that has been done/said to you. You don't deserve it. I am a Christian, and I believe in the Bible, but more than believing in the passages that go against your lifestyle I also believe in loving people regardless of race, creed or way of life. Jesus loves all people, so I try to do the same. I am human of course, and am completely imperfect. I can't even begin to tell of the many, many mistakes I have made. But I try my best, and that's all I can do.

I have a friend who is gay, and he knows my religious beliefs and convictions. We do not let our differences hinder our friendship. I do not condemn him for the men he loves, and he does not condemn me for believing his lifestyle is wrong. We simply do not discuss it. I do not love the sins of people, but the people themsevles. Just as if you should catch your son stealing from you or find out your 16 year old daughter is pregnant--you are not happy with the choices and ultimate consequences, but does that mean you stop caring for them and loving them? Of course not. I wish more Christians had that mentality. We can disagree all we want, but people are going to believe what they want to believe and we should not hate anyone for that. We should all get along as best we can. Life is too short to keep hating each other just because we disagree.


And this was my answer:
Hi, Heather678.
This is not about whether or not Christians have wronged me. I thank you for the apology since the religious right (of which the overwhelming percentage are Christians) rarely apologizes for the hatred it spews.
I submit that your friend says nothing about the truth of his life because he knows your opinion on the subject, I am certain. Have you even considered the comment above: I have a friend who is gay, and he knows my religious beliefs and convictions. We do not let our differences hinder our friendship. I do not condemn him for the men he loves, and he does not condemn me for believing his lifestyle is wrong. We simply do not discuss it. Any discussion of what might be going on in his life or what is really important to him might, indeed more than likely would, disturb YOUR comfort zone. I submit this attitude is arrogance. You are not truly interested in what really goes on in your friends lifehis loves, his hurts, etc.you only want to hear what makes YOU comfortable. Your friend has been more than likely hurt many time by religious condemnation and doesnt try to make you see how arrogant your view really is. Thank the Goddess that I have friends who truly love me for myself and are interested in what is really going on in my life, just as I love them for who they are and want to know what is really happening in their life.
I did NOT choose to be gayit is no more a lifestyle choice than your being heterosexual is. I take offense at your comparing gay people to an unwed teen mother. She had the choice to abstain from sex or not. I have that choice in the religious right view and I had better make the choice to abstain or I will be damned. Well, I made a choice to share my life with a wonderful man whom I love and who married me in Canada because he wanted us to be married legally, Just as you are heterosexual and have a choice to marry and be with someone you love, so I am gay and have a choice to marry and to be with the man that I love. Actually, it is our right. You have a right to be happy and so do I. By your lights, though, I should settle for a cold, lonely life alone.
One of the reasons we chose to legally marry in Canada is because we saw no sense in marrying in a country where, even when LGBTQ people ARE given the right to marry, they can expect endless challenges to that right. How would YOU feel if you were not able to legally marry the person you love?
I keep reading posts which simply ooze entitlement and arrogance such as one which suggests that anyone who doesnt fit the religious rights definition of marriage will have to settle for less. NO, WE DO NOT! Neither do you. I wont tell you how to live your life, and you do the same where I am concerned. Its called tolerance.



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