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Were you guys aware that we're all "fucking crazy people"?

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Lyric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 07:00 AM
Original message
Were you guys aware that we're all "fucking crazy people"?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4808950&mesg_id=4829165

That same poster then goes on to inform us that Donnie McClurkin isn't really all that bad. There are much worse people out there, after all. :eyes: Of course, said poster is a 50-post n00b, so it might just be a troll. But still.

I alerted on it just now, but I can't believe I'm the first to have done so. And yet, there it is. *sigh*

You all realize that if Obama doesn't fulfill the wet dreams of GD-P and win the primary by a landslide, we're probably going to be blamed for it. Again.

The knee-jerk "Defend Obama no matter what he does" mentality around here lately is flat-out fucking scary sometimes. Apparently we have our own cadre of "19 percenters" who will blindly support everything their Anointed One says and does, no matter how repulsive it might be.

It's just sickening.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 07:12 AM
Response to Original message
1. I let a few people know about that and took him to task
I purposely didn't alert on it because I wanted more people to see it as a shining example of the bullshit homophobia we have to put up with, yet others claim does not exist here on DU (and also so others could take him to task).

I'm sick to death of these nitwits who berate us over the McClurkin when they have little/no idea what it was all about, dismiss any and all other concerns we have, tell us to get over our "faux outrage", call us names because we're asking for the rights we should never have been denied in the first place (or whatever), yell that we're "going to cost Dems the election", etc, etc.

:rant:




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Lyric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 07:43 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I'd just like to see people stop
the brainless knee-jerk defense of everything Obama does. Is it really that freaking hard to say, "Yeah, Obama seriously fucked up there. He caused a lot of hurt to GLBTs and some ugly divisions within the party itself. Let's all write to him and give him hell so he knows that kind of crap is not acceptable."

Apparently holding Obama accountable for the mistakes he makes is a double-plus-ungood of a taboo here at DU, and admitting that he has made a mistake is grounds for Liberal Excommunication. If we can't meaningfully and decisively call out our candidates for missteps and mistakes, how the hell are we any better than the right-wing jerks we oppose? The ones we've all been so infuriated with because they are willfully blind to everything that contradicts their hero-worship of Bush?

I don't want our side to become Liberal versions of them. We are not Obama's Mommy. Our job is to ride his ass to keep him in line, not to coddle him and tell him that we know he didn't really mean to hurt anyone, and we'll just forget all about that nasty unimportant business.

Argh! :banghead:
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. I agree
But there's this bizarre thing about some Obama supporters in that they refuse to admit that he's done any wrong or can do any wrong (much like the Bush supporters were). Then there are others who admit that the McClurkin thing was bad, but we're overreacting to it, or what Hillary has done is far worse, blah blah blah. Then there's the "I'm gay/I have a brazillion gay friends and none of us have ever even heard of McClurkin" thing so y'all are just nuts because none of this even matters" thing that drives me bonkers. Just one more way they marginalize us and our concerns.

If the candidate I supported had done something like that I would have been on their backside like white on rice. Sadly the way others are behaving just goes to show that we don't count, as usual. We're second class citizens and we're treated as such, every single time.

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Lyric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Yeah, I've heard some of that too. (Longish, sorry)
"But I have this gay friend/brother/sister/whatever who isn't the least bit bothered about McClurkin!" As if we all share a homosexual hive mind. :eyes:

But the actual gay people who pull that crap are even worse. I can vaguely sort-of tolerate a straight person who might honestly not know any better, but when gay people start giving me the "The McClurkin thing doesn't bother me, so why should it bother you?" routine, I tend to get a little upset. A better question would be, why doesn't it bother you?

I've noticed that a lot of that kind of rhetoric within our community comes from the ones who are fortunate enough to live in a place where they don't face as much danger and discrimination on a daily basis as some other GLBTs do. If someone is lucky enough to live somewhere that allows marriage/unions, and/or has lots of non-discrimination laws in place, I'm happy as hell for them. But not all of us are that lucky. There are gay people in South Carolina who could be in more danger than ever right now, because Barack Obama decided that courting the religious nutjobs was a higher priority than protecting the vulnerable red-state GLBTs, and most Democratic voters didn't give a damn. The fundies didn't learn any lessons in tolerance; all they learned is that Obama is willing to overlook their bigotry and hate in exchange for a few key votes. Winning took precedence over principle. Well congratulations Obama for moving the Dem party just a little bit closer to the dog-eat-dog miasma of the right wing.

History has proven that the go-along-to-get-along types are NOT the ones who change things for the better. If we aren't willing to stand up and call out our leaders when something they do is Just Plain Wrong, how are we ever going to see any real progress? If the liberal community had risen up with a strong, clear voice to tell Obama that the McClurkin incident was NOT acceptable, and that such instances of bad judgment would NOT be tolerated in a Democratic President, he would have fallen all over himself to apologize, and he would have learned an important lesson--Democratic candidates do NOT give soapboxes to bigots. Ever.

Instead, the complacency crowd chose to ignore it for fear of "weakening" his candidacy. Ha. If he can't handle what we throw at him and still win, he doesn't have a freaking prayer when the Republicans get their paws on him. All the liberal complacency in the world isn't going to stop the right-wing media machine from tearing him to shreds. They'll make him look more liberal than Ted Kennedy, and they'll hit him on everything that the Dems tip-toe around without feeling an iota of guilt. Like Obama, the right-wing doesn't give a damn about principles--they care only about winning, and will use every filthy weapon in their arsenal to make that happen.

All I know is that, if Obama gets the nomination and then loses the General to McCain, I don't want to hear a single fucking person trying to blame the GLBT community, or crying "Diebold!", or any other such nonsense. Our party is currently in the midst of sowing a big old crop of willful blindness. My biggest fear is that, come November, we'll reap every bit of it right back, because nobody does willful blindness like the American political right-wing. Goddess help us.
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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. You're right in so many ways
"But I have this gay friend/brother/sister/whatever who isn't the least bit bothered about McClurkin!" As if we all share a homosexual hive mind.

But the actual gay people who pull that crap are even worse. I can vaguely sort-of tolerate a straight person who might honestly not know any better, but when gay people start giving me the "The McClurkin thing doesn't bother me, so why should it bother you?" routine, I tend to get a little upset. A better question would be, why doesn't it bother you?


They accuse us of having a hive mind (or say they're being unique and not having a hive mind) because we think they should be outraged over McClurkin. I don't understand how people can't be hurt over it, but then I don't like being trampled. Maybe some people are so used to being treated like dirt they no longer care.


I've noticed that a lot of that kind of rhetoric within our community comes from the ones who are fortunate enough to live in a place where they don't face as much danger and discrimination on a daily basis as some other GLBTs do. If someone is lucky enough to live somewhere that allows marriage/unions, and/or has lots of non-discrimination laws in place, I'm happy as hell for them. But not all of us are that lucky. There are gay people in South Carolina who could be in more danger than ever right now, because Barack Obama decided that courting the religious nutjobs was a higher priority than protecting the vulnerable red-state GLBTs, and most Democratic voters didn't give a damn. The fundies didn't learn any lessons in tolerance; all they learned is that Obama is willing to overlook their bigotry and hate in exchange for a few key votes. Winning took precedence over principle. Well congratulations Obama for moving the Dem party just a little bit closer to the dog-eat-dog miasma of the right wing.


Exactly. It's as if they've forgotten that not everybody shares the same rights/privileges they do and they don't even care. What Obama did in SC was say to those homophobes, in so many words, "I'm in agreement with you. I don't like those gay people any more than you do--so vote for me". If anybody thinks that the homophobes aren't going to expect him to live up to that implied promise once he's in office they've got another thing coming, his recent ads in LGBT publications notwithstanding.



History has proven that the go-along-to-get-along types are NOT the ones who change things for the better. If we aren't willing to stand up and call out our leaders when something they do is Just Plain Wrong, how are we ever going to see any real progress? If the liberal community had risen up with a strong, clear voice to tell Obama that the McClurkin incident was NOT acceptable, and that such instances of bad judgment would NOT be tolerated in a Democratic President, he would have fallen all over himself to apologize, and he would have learned an important lesson--Democratic candidates do NOT give soapboxes to bigots. Ever.




Yes, and the people who can't understand the difference between putting McClurkin on stage with a microphone and HRC just associating with a regular homophobe are the ones that drive me insane. I've been planning an intensive blog post on why the "Ex-Gay" homophobes are worse than the run-of-the-mill homophobes but I haven't got it together yet. Sadly I don't think it would do any good with this crowd. At any rate, putting anybody on stage to spew bigotry is not "reaching out", it's spreading hatred. Somehow neither Obama nor many of his supporters can understand that.


Instead, the complacency crowd chose to ignore it for fear of "weakening" his candidacy. Ha. If he can't handle what we throw at him and still win, he doesn't have a freaking prayer when the Republicans get their paws on him. All the liberal complacency in the world isn't going to stop the right-wing media machine from tearing him to shreds. They'll make him look more liberal than Ted Kennedy, and they'll hit him on everything that the Dems tip-toe around without feeling an iota of guilt. Like Obama, the right-wing doesn't give a damn about principles--they care only about winning, and will use every filthy weapon in their arsenal to make that happen.




Indeed. If he can't stand up to pointed criticism from his own party, how will he tolerate the rabid dogs of the RRRW? They're going to tear him to shreds then run the remains into the pavement. But the supporters don't want to hear any of that. They'd rather pretend his Hope and Change mantra is going to have everybody singing Kumbaya around the non-partisan campfire come election time.



All I know is that, if Obama gets the nomination and then loses the General to McCain, I don't want to hear a single fucking person trying to blame the GLBT community, or crying "Diebold!", or any other such nonsense. Our party is currently in the midst of sowing a big old crop of willful blindness. My biggest fear is that, come November, we'll reap every bit of it right back, because nobody does willful blindness like the American political right-wing. Goddess help us.



They're going to blame us, and the HRC voters who refused to vote for him, and Diebold, Ralph Nader, and anybody else they can blame. Because according to them Obama has this locked up and in the bag. So, of course, the only reason he could lose would be because of somebody/something out of his control.

But here's something we might want to use when they start whining about us or anybody "losing the election" for them (thanks to the Green Party):

The subject: How should Greens handle attacks from Dems who call a
Green presidential candidate a "spoiler"?

The perfect response:

"Tell them you wish we had 'spoiled' the election because then they
might pay attention to our demands!"



Until later,
Buffy
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. It's stunning the apathy around here.
There has been discussion here about McClurkin and the disgusting "ex-gay" crap he and other people peddle. The information IS out there on the internet. I would think that if you had a particle of interest about this and GLBT people and you didn't know the facts, that you'd do some basic research about it.

It's hardly the worst secret in the world that Democratic Underground is infested with homophobia. It's so freaking...sad, I think...that those homophobes here don't try to begin to educate themselves. There is, as I'm writing, a whole forum devoted to us, our lives, the problems we face. Discrimination, hate crimes...it's all here. And those people don't even fucking try. That's how insignificant they see us.

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NMMNG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. They don't care to eduate themselves
It's only "that gay thing", as one of the Obama supporters called it recently. It just gets in our way and skews our perception, you know. We're selfish and think only of ourselves, blah blah blah.

I have to keep asking myself why I participate in a forum where I'm so hated. :banghead:
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DarkTirade Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 08:00 AM
Response to Original message
3. Obvious troll. Don't rise to the bait.
I hit alert and resisted the urge to hit reply.
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
8. Oh, to be blamed for a poor performance!
There will be a lot of incoming. It will feel so validating after almost singlehandedly ruining Kerry's chance ( ask Dianne F.)I welcome the chance to destroy presidential ambitions as I do with strait marriages.(several hundred to date, I'm sure)
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Lyric Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. You and me both
I fear for the longevity of straight marriages and Democratic politicians with us GLBTs on the loose ;)
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mitchtv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. I should have enough points for a LCD HDTV
after all we were "married" in '77
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mondo joe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
11. I have never so felt like a 3rd rate person on DU as in GD:P. Whatever was deleted, I'm
surprised they even bothered with the amount of shit allowed there.
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Tyo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-01-08 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. We're increasingly being ghettoized
But if that's the price for not buying into their hypocrisy then I'm happy to pay it. I've about had my fill of their selective dreams and their unprincipled "idealism".
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Zuiderelle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-02-08 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
14. Every day that goes by makes me resent him more and more.
I wonder how dangerous it IS for us to say that we will vote for him in the general election despite this? He is completely taking our votes for granted. I'm sick to death of waiting around to have the same rights as every straight American. Why should I vote for you, Barack? Nothing's every going to change if we give away our votes.
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racaulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-03-08 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
15. That post has been deleted now.
And based on the replies that it received, and your OP, I'm glad I missed it. I hope the troll that posted it has been tombstoned.
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