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What about that gay caveman thread, Skinner? I have alerted on several posts,

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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:21 PM
Original message
What about that gay caveman thread, Skinner? I have alerted on several posts,
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 12:21 PM by closeupready
And they are ALL STILL THERE. :mad:
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Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
1. Skinner has an inbox, you know
.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Yes, your post is one of them I alerted on.
I'm not surprised you responded to me here.
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Alerting doesn't guarantee a post or a thread will be disappeared...
It takes many eyes and opinions to do that, as it should be. What might appear homophobic to you might not be so to others. Getting yourself tombstoned isn't going to help your "cause" at all.
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Vinnie From Indy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
2. What thread?
What posts?

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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. This one - many such posts.
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 12:26 PM by closeupready
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...


"I'm embarrassed to be a scientist"

"They expect us to believe this shit?"

"Junk science"
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Vinnie From Indy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. I must be missing something because I do not see how these opinions violate
DU's rules. Please explain why you think these opinions are DU violations.

Cheers!
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Sure - it's skirting the line between "gay is bad/wrong" and "this is bad/wrong."
It's the type of discussion that was brought up in Skinner's mending fences thread, which got really long, but there is a post in their from Saracat, IIRC, where she brings this very thing up.

I'm sorry if that's inadequate; if I'm wrong, I will apologize.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. See this post.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. I'm am cross-posting hopefully without objection from Sapphocrat:
>> From 2003:

I am not anti-gay rights but. I dont think this is a good time for the gay-marriage issue.

Please dont get me wrong. Im not gay, but Im not homophobic either. Im just thinking that this decision is bad, bad timing politically. ...

It is too soon for gay marriage

Why not advance the idea of civil unions first. Let people get use to that idea and then push for marriage.

This isnt the time. Our number one priority has to be getting bush the hell out of office. This wont help that cause.

Ive never met anyone, liberal or not who didnt express utter disgust at the idea of gay marriage. This includes people I know who are otherwise open-minded and liberal on most every other issue.

Some form of gay rights such as a civil union of some sort would be more acceptable. But for 99% of the people out there the very idea of gay marriage is just repulsive with capitial R. The gay marrige issue would severely cripple any democratic candidates to beat Bush if they support it. Lets not go down that road."

... These are much more pressing issues then whether a gay person should be allowed to marry. Im not homophobic, but I feel that gays ought to think about the well-being of others much less fortunate than themselves.

How should we handle wedge issues? Like gay marriage, flag burning & abortion I say we dismiss them completely. Firmly say that its manufactured to divide us & leave it at that. When pressed, just say you wont take the bait. If someone feels so strongly about it, they can join a special interest group.

From 2004:

The gay marriage issue hijacked our party. I think the gay and lesbian community decided to make this a visible issue on state ballots because they thought they could ride on the coattails of the Mass. court decision and Kerry. They ended up hurting him. They could have waited until an off Presidential election year to go ballistic. This issue ended up being identified directly with Kerry on the Ohio ballot and ten other states. Many Democratic Christians who would have normally voted for Kerry went with their family and moral values. Im not homophobic

What would be hilarious if it weren't so utterly ridiculous: This poster seems to believe gay people were responsible for putting anti-gay marriage BANS on twelve state ballots in 2004! These were marriage BANS, not marriage-equality bills!

You DO need to get over it! You are a citizen of the United States before you are gay. You owe a responsibility to your country FIRST!! Yeah, youre gay, many people are, we cannot allow the you know whos to use gays as the new blacks to divide our country with the gay marriage issue.

I think the Democratic Party should not even come close to this issue. The farther away the better. If this becomes a major issue with leading Democrats crusading for gay marriage, George McGovern will end up looking like a successful candidate.

my gay friends, delay marriage Just delay till December. Why hand Republicans 5 percent more of the vote, when you can stay quietly on the sidelines and deny them this issue?

I Am Outraged By Gay People Well, not really. But I am kinda annoyed by their (meaning those forcing the issue, not all gays) impeccably bad sense of timing. By pushing this into an unpopular culture war during an election year, these gay activists are screwing up their own agenda. If they demonstrated a few months of patience, it would serve them well.<<

AND HER CONCLUSION:

>>Mind you, these comments I quoted were limited solely to the issue of marriage equality, and have nothing to do with any of the other "classic" blow-ups such as the Snickers ad, the neverending "discussion" about why we gays have to act so gay at Pride parades, etc., etc.

I'm sure some reading this will want to jump all over me for digging up posts now as much as eight years old. After all, you will want to say, "But things have changed! Skinner has really been working hard to bring DU together! It's not fair to dig up such old posts!"

Before you do, however, consider these points (and here comes The Big Rant, with "YOU" referring to all those people who think we should sit down, shut up, and let the "grown-ups" decide what's best for us):

1) The posts I quoted above represent the smallest fraction of the garbage we have had to put up with for the better (or rather worse) part of a decade.

2) These posts represent a pattern that has never ended.

3) That I was able to dig up such posts which were then more than five years old tells you that such blatantly anti-gay, offensive, and downright cruel posts were never deleted. Oh, I can guarantee you some (I'm guessing most) were alerted on, but there they remained (and may even exist today -- I don't know).

4) These posts represent the attitude: "It's not about YOU GAYS! It's all about US, and how YOUR issues affect US!"<<
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Vinnie From Indy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #22
28. Again, I understand that many of the ideas expressed in Sapphocrat's post
are abhorrent to the gay community and many are just plain stupid in my opinion, but to call them homophobic seems a bit extreme. In fact, most of the above posts it would seem to me would be an excellent opportunity to engage in debate and maybe change a few minds as a result. Civil rights struggles are never easy and the above posts clearly demonstrate how much work still needs to be done.

Cheers!
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
5. Oh, the irony...
Your OP is against DU rules... calling out other DUers, discussing DUers instead of issues... and calling out moderators/Skinner... there is a proper way to do things, and this isn't it.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. This is important. And he SAID he wanted to mend fences.
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 12:28 PM by closeupready
He either meant it or he didn't.
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. Then do it the right way...
Stop being part of the problem and it will go away faster.

Breaking the rules to bellow about others breaking the rules is just not smart.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:31 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Why don't you mind your own business?
I am not appreciating your concern right now. Peace.
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. What the fuck ever dude...
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 12:34 PM by JuniperLea
You can't even accept good advice right now, that tells me you are far too emotional to make good judgement.

I can post here... I decide what my business is, not you... I'm not breaking the rules... you are. Deal.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Just putting you on ignore.
Cheers.
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JuniperLea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Fine... ignore the truth...
Don't break a tooth.
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Tuesday Afternoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #10
20. the minute you made this a public thread, you gave up the privacy
issue, wouldn't you agree :shrug:
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. I don't understand your question.
Can you rephrase? Thanks.
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Pab Sungenis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #9
27. Juniper, the posts mentioned in this OP break the rules, too.
The whole question has been unequal enforcement. The only posts I can find in that thread that have been removed, in fact, are ones bringing up how wrong the other statements are.
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Vinnie From Indy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. There is another alternative...
It could very well be that you are simply unhappy that others post opinions you personally do not like and that angers you.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. That is a possibility but since at least two or three other DU members
clearly take my position on this, as well, as you can see from the caveman thread, and also the locked thread from Pab Sungenis here in the GLBT forum, it doesn't seem that my opinion is out there.

There was also another thread Pab started that got simply deleted; it was that thread that alerted me to the GD thread. You can't see it now, though.

Honestly, do you feel that my objection is based upon the fact that someone is merely expressing a conflicting viewpoint, rather than thinly-veiled homophobia?
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Vinnie From Indy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. I am not sure...
Edited on Thu Apr-07-11 12:44 PM by Vinnie From Indy
It could be that I am missing some underlying subtext in the responses, but it does appear to me that most of the opinions are simply a disagreement over the findings of these scientists. I will read the thread again with a closer focus.

Cheers!
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Thanks. And I may be overreacting. LOL
I would be interested in your comments, after you have done so. :)
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #18
26. Actually is does look a lot like your objection is based upon that someone is
expressing a conflicting view.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #26
29. Thanks for posting.
I'm going to think about it some more. Maybe I just shouldn't get involved where I see shit going down - not sure why I care so much - I shouldn't.
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The Philosopher Donating Member (621 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:28 PM
Response to Original message
6. The posts
(unless there's some new ones I haven't seen yet) don't violate the rules, I think, technically, because they can always use the excuse "I didn't mean that." We're fighting a tone of voice, which isn't easily perceptible to those who don't face discimination everyday.

With posts like that, that don't easily violate the rules, I believe the mods have a discussion on it. It may take longer than usual, so give them some time. If the posts aren't dealt with in a reasonable time, then the ATA forum is a place to ask this sort of question, not here (because it violates rules if you ask it here, but not there).

Let's everyone keep a level head. We need numbers, not graveyards.



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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #6
25. Okay, thanks. I'm not opening that thread anymore today. :-D
But I am still angry about those remarks. W/e.
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Tuesday Afternoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:40 PM
Response to Original message
19. wow.
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cbayer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-07-11 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
30. Locking
Questions for the administrators of the site can be sent to them directly or posted in the ATA forum.

Please do not start threads to call out the moderators or question moderator decisions.

Thanks,
cbayer
DU Moderator
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