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Joe (Torre) must GO, and take arod with you

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Zech Marquis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 03:32 AM
Original message
Joe (Torre) must GO, and take arod with you
The Tigers just stomped my Yankees, who beyonf wang, Jeter, Posada and Matsui, just didn't show ANYTHING :-( Everyone else--pack your bags, clean out your lockers and get out :argh: That means you to Joe! arod--gather all your skin care products and beat it! i'm going to enjoy the METS--a team who actually plays like one and is fun to watch.
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theHandpuppet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
1. Just curious...
Why is this Torre's fault? Does he swing a bat? Does he pitch?
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Auggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I always thought Torre was a good post season manager.
The Yankees got beat by superior pitching. And Detroit, as a team, seemed a bit hungrier.
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Counciltucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Exactly.
Good pitching always beats good hitting. And damn, Detroit has GOOD PITCHING.
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Reverend_Smitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 12:07 PM
Response to Original message
3. I think Torre has been phoning it in the last few years...
If you look at the Yankee's line-ups from 96-00 and the line-ups from 01-06, on paper the latter should have been the ones that won all the championships. I mean on paper who would you rather have at third base Scott Brosius or A-Rod? Tino Martinez or Jason Giambi? Paul O'Neill or Gary Sheffield? I guess my point is the team with all the superstars should have been cleaning up in the championship department but I think the "team" aspect gets overlooked when you assembled a group of individuals who are as good as the Yankees. I think Torre thought that you could just "throw" a bunch of all-stars on the field and you would automatically be successful but that's clearly not the way to win it all. I think before he had the mega-stars he actually had to manage, you know hit and run, bunting, etc instead of "hit the ball real far Sheff". I call it the Phil Jackson school of coaching.

Also I've noticed over the years that the Yankees don't have any fun playing the game, it's all business to them. The fundamental truth about baseball is it's still a kids game, you should enjoy yourself once and a while. When the Mets clinched the NL east earlier this year, I was watching the post game celebration with my Yankees fan dad said something to the effect of "we don't celebrate until we win it all" I think that statement says a lot about that team, they stopped having fun years ago. All the money in the world can't buy the chemistry those 96-00 teams had...I'm not sure where the Yankees go from here but I think buying more overpriced superstars is not the answer.

One more thing that just sort of popped into my head as I was writing this, what about Jeter? I mean if the Boss fires Torre how will Jeter take it? Torre was the only manager that he has ever worked under and no doubt he has a lot of loyalty to the man, so I think that story is going to be really interesting in the upcoming months.

Full disclosure: I'm a really happy Mets fan, and can't help but smile when I see the Yankees lose
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inthebrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
4. It takes heart to be a Met fan
I don't think you'll last long on our bandwagon.

I really think that the next round will be our out. I think it ends when we get past our first two starters.
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #4
16. Being a Mets fan ain't for sissies.
The other day I was walking around in my Mookie shirt and some guy yelled at me, "Mets suck!!!" I turned around and said, "Well, yes, they often DO suck, but not this year." He laughed.
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Reverend_Smitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 01:14 AM
Response to Reply #16
27. LOL perfect response!
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hijinx87 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #4
26. the mets may indeed be hard pressed to win a 7 game series

with the back of their rotation looking like it does.

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Kingofalldems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
6. The Nats would love to talk to Mr. Torre
How could he win with two pitchers who are way past prime? In fact I think he did a great job with what he had.
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. every team with an opening would love to talk to Mr. Torre
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Captain Hilts Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #7
17. Yes, the Nats would...but he's been a lousy manager for teams...
with lousy players, such as the Mets.
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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
8. Said it before, say it again
Midwest is best. ChiSox last year, possibly Tigers this year. See, here in the heartland our boys know how to play team baseball. BYE BYE YANKEES!!!!!!!!HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:36 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. you need a geography lesson
Oakland is on the west coast

Go A's!!!!!!!
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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Um...I never mentioned Oakland in my post
The White Sox and Tigers. Oakland cannot stand up to the onslaught of Midwest baseball. And I also think St. Louis may beat the Mets, even though the Mets are a clearly superior team. It is all about being hot at the right time.
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davidinalameda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:53 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Oakland just took care of Minnesota in 3
hello, Minnesota is in the midwest, no?

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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. Win a few, lose a few
Yep, the A's took care of Minnesota but I still think Midwest is the best.
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Auggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #12
21. You neglect to mention Cleveland. This is an exciting team,
with a core of good, young players signed to long-term contracts. They're a few pitchers away from being contenders next year.
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SDDEM06 Donating Member (157 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #12
28. Go Royals!
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PDittie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
13. Does Torre want to keep working?
He's got one year and $7 million left on a contract with Steinbroomer. He's a cancer survivor; his brother wasn't -- or maybe it was a heart attack that took Frank. At any rate, if I were Joe I would get on a cruise ship for a month if I found myself without a job.

More interesting question: will Dusty go back to San Francisco? Will they take him back?
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #13
20. frank torre
is still alive and well. he had a heart transplant. it was a different brother that died from a heart attack.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
14. Are you channeling Steinbrenner?
Lose the last game in October and suddenly the manager is a loser and the players are slackers.

Get real. The Yankees are a fine team and for a week the Tigers were a little better.
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northzax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. the Bronx is the ultimate 'what have you done for me lately?' locale
Steinbrenner doesn't pay 175 million in payroll to lose in the first round.
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MaineDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #15
25. Two years in a row, in fact
2001 they lost in the World Series.

2002 they lost in the ALDS.

2003 they lost in the World Series.

2004 they lost in the ALCS (after being up 3 games to zilch).

2005 they lost in the ALDS.

2006 they lose again in the ALDS.

Six years since the Yankees have won the World Series and in 3 of those six years they've lost in the first round of the playoffs. I wouldn't imagine Steinbrenner is really happy about that. Most teams would love to have that record but it seems to me that George wouln't like it.
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erpowers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
18. Get Rid of the Boss
Maybe the real problem with the Yankees is the Boss-Steinbrenner. It seems to be that Steinbrenner is the one who keeps making mistakes with this team. Steinbrenner is the one continually pays too much for players that are no longer good. Steinbrenner is the one who brought Giambi, Johnson, A-Rod, and all the other overrated players. In addition, it was Steinbrenner who paid too much to get Johnny Damon. It seems to me that Damon may not have been that effective for the Yankees. I will admit that I did not follow the Yankees that much this year, but I did not hear very much about Damon helping the team. So maybe Steinbrenner should just sell the team and let someone else run the team.
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. damon
did a lot of good and helped the team tremendously this year. he provided a huge spark at the top of the lineup, provided unexpected pop as well. he also helped to try and keep the team loose at times when they were a bit tight. Damon is paid a lot of money, but I dont consider him overpaid.

Additionally Steinbrenner has stepped back a lot from his past meddling ways. Giambi when he was brought in was still in his prime. A-rod was gotten in a trade for Soriano, with the rangers picking up about half the cost of his contract) Johnson's last year in arizona was a very good one, but now his back went out again, but still managed 17 wins.

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northzax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
23. say what you want
but the Boss has six rings- only two other TEAMS have six rings (the Cards and the Red Sox) so in the hundred+ year history of MLB, only two teams have won as many championships as Steinbrenner has in 33 years. yeah, he sucks. big time.
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Jack Rabbit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. The Yankees have needed to do that for thirty years
Mickey Mantle: The difference between baseball now and when I played is then in those days the owners were smart and the players were dumb.
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paulk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
22. nothing wrong with the Yankees that better pitching
wouldn't fix. The team is built too much around hitting - which is great when it comes to winning the division - but, it's ALWAYS been pitching that wins championships.... and the Yankees haven't had a solid staff in years.

IMHO - they could cut half their big name hitters and use that money to either put into their minor league teams - with an eye toward pitching prospects - or use the money to hire some free agent pitching...

Who's gonna be in the free agent ranks for next year?
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DeeDeeNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
24. Torre is not really the problem.
The whole momentum of the series shifted when Mussina gave up the lead in game 2.
But they do have too many high-priced players who think they can waltz in and get their rings.
I agree I would like ARod gone, but I wouldn't want the young guys to go -- Melky, Cano, Bruney, Karstens.
And there are guys who do play with heart -- Damon and Abrieu come to mind.
It would be difficult for me to root for the Mets. I grew up in the Bronx and have been a lifelong
passionate Yankees fan.
(Besides, I read that the person David Wright would most like to meet is Bush!)
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-10-06 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
30. WHO
CARES?
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