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Panel may drop limbo for unbaptized babies

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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 06:45 AM
Original message
Panel may drop limbo for unbaptized babies
http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/87808,CST-NWS-limbo...

VATICAN CITY -- Vatican theologians are leaning toward revising centuries-old teaching that babies who die without baptism go to limbo instead of heaven.

''All of us have hope for the babies'' that they will go to heaven, under the revised thinking on limbo, said the Rev. Luis Ladaria, a Jesuit who is secretary-general of the Vatican's International Theological Commission.

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countryjake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 06:51 AM
Response to Original message
1. I'm so relieved...
Sitting here in Limbo
Waiting for the tide turn.
Yeah, now, sitting here in Limbo,
So many things I've got to learn.
Meanwhile, they're putting up a resistance,
But I know that my faith will lead me on.

Sitting here in Limbo
Waiting for the dice to roll.
Yeah, now, sitting here in Limbo,
Still got some time to search my soul.
Meanwhile, they're putting up a resistance,
But I know that my faith will lead me on.

I don't know where life will take me,
But I know where I have been.
I don't know what life will show me,
But I know what I have seen.
Tried my hand at love and friendship,
That is past and gone.
And now it's time to move along.

Sitting here in Limbo
Like a bird ain't got a song.
Yeah, I'm sitting here in Limbo
And I know it won't be long
'Til I make my getaway, now.
Meanwhile, they're putting up a resistance,
But I know that my faith will lead me on.

I don't know where life will take me,
But I know where I have been.
I don't know what life will show me,
But I know what I have seen.
Tried my hand at love and friendship,
That is past and gone.
And now it's time to move along.

Gonna lead me on now.
Meanwhile, they're putting up resistance,
But I know that my faith will lead me on.
Sitting in Limbo, Limbo, Limbo.
Sitting in Limbo, Limbo, Limbo.
Sitting in Limbo, Limbo, Limbo.
Meanwhile, they're putting up a resistance,
But I know that my faith will lead me on.

Sitting In Limbo by Jimmy Cliff



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GeorgeGist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:02 AM
Response to Original message
2. How pretentious...
affected, arty, assuming, aureate, big*, bombastic, chichi*, conceited, conspicuous, euphuistic, exaggerated, extravagant, feigned, flamboyant, flashy, flaunting, flowery, gaudy, grandiloquent, grandiose, high-flown*, high-sounding*, highfalutin', hollow, imposing, inflated, jazzy*, la-di-da*, lofty, magniloquent, mincing, ornate, ostentatious, overambitious, overblown, pompous, puffed up*, put-on*, rhetorical, showy, snobbish, specious, splashy, stilted, swank, too-too*, tumid, turgid, utopian, vainglorious

of them.


'All of us have hope for the babies'' that they will go to heaven, under the revised thinking on limbo, said the Rev. Luis Ladaria, a Jesuit who is secretary-general of the Vatican's International Theological Commission.
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hobbit709 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:02 AM
Response to Original message
3. Theological hairsplitting
is an exercise in discussing the unknowable by examining the unprovable to reach a conclusion about the unforeseeable.
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trumad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. ROTF
exactly......
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:07 AM
Response to Reply #3
18. Brilliantly put
Side-splittingly funny for athiests. :rofl:
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Big Kahuna Donating Member (903 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:04 AM
Response to Original message
5. I don't know which I find more disturbing...
that 1 billion people think unbaptized babies would be punished by god, or that they will change their religious beliefs overnight because a panel tells them to.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #5
16. I personally don't know of one Catholic who believes in Limbo
When I taught CCD in the late 80's and very early 90's, I didn't even bring it up.
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #16
23. When I was in Catholic grammar school in the late 50s-early 60s
it was part and parcel of what we were taught by the nuns. Emphasized was our responsibility to perform an emergency baptism if a priest was unavailable and the child might die unbaptized.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #23
25. "Pagan babies"?
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Got to save the Pagan Babies, doncha know...
Edited on Sun Oct-08-06 08:06 PM by mcscajun
:) That was a separate 'bit of business' though.
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moggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 08:35 AM
Response to Reply #23
30. Emergency baptism??
Do you get a cool uniform for that, like a paramedic?
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Dr.Phool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:06 AM
Response to Original message
6. So, humans can change what God thinks.
I guess God really was created in mans image.
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Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:07 AM
Response to Original message
7. Doesn't it seem sometimes like some people have....
>>>>Vatican theologians are leaning toward revising centuries-old teaching that babies who die without baptism go to limbo instead of heaven.>>>>>

too much time on their hands? Shouldn't they be thinking about... I don't know....how to keep starving Africans alive, or how to cure cancer ?

Does someone actually pay them a salary to sit around and 'revise' rules about when and how babies can get into heaven? Isn't... ummm... "God" in charge of that?

Is this the same dynamic that produces hostility to homosexuals? i.e Nothing better to do with their time?

Maybe the folks in the Vatican could use a to-do list?
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:13 AM
Response to Original message
8. Hmmm, I thought they dropped that years ago!
I don't know if it's only me being a poor Catholic, or this Popewho's out of the loop here!
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:19 AM
Response to Original message
9. there has been no formal docrine.


No formal Catholic doctrine
The commission, which advises the pope, has spent the week debating limbo in view of preparing a document.

Although Catholics have long believed that children who die without being baptized still have original sin and are thus excluded from heaven, the church has no formal doctrine on the matter. Theologians have taught that such children enjoy an eternal state of perfect natural happiness, commonly called limbo. AP
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countryjake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:45 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. I thought John Paul II appointed the commission that's looking into limbo?
Ratzinger went on record long ago saying he didn't believe in limbus puerorum.


Waiting outside the gates of hell can be a real drag.
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Freedom_from_Chains Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:21 AM
Response to Original message
10. What, first Pluto and now this. What is the world coming too.
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JohnnyLib2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:13 AM
Response to Reply #10
22. LOL,, and how much time did we waste in school and catchecism

learning and being tested on these things. Jeeeeeeez.
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boston bean Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
11. I'm a catholic and not matter what the Church said, I always believed
that unbaptized babies and children were on the express train to heaven along with everysingle other baby or child.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:26 AM
Response to Original message
12. And God laughed at them.
Edited on Sun Oct-08-06 07:32 AM by cornermouse
I'm sure he listened to their latest decision and was obedient.

Add: I agree with MassDemm. They're already there. Its not God's fault some of us weren't smart enough to know it.
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Maine-ah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 07:53 AM
Response to Original message
14. but I was so looking forward to going to limbo damn it!
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. You couldn't go to Limbo
Only Hell, Heaven or Purgatory. Sorry to disappoint you -- and on a Sunday, no less!
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iamahaingttta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:58 AM
Response to Original message
15. Who cares?
It's ALL a bunch of made up mumbo-jumbo fairy tales to begin with!
When unbaptized babies die, they're dead. Like everybody else.

End of story!
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. Lots of people on DU are Catholics
And, they do care about many things concerning the Church's doctrine. I left the Church, and I'm no longer a Christian, but that doesn't make me piss on the beliefs of good DUers.

I guess I'm a believer in mumbo-jumbo fairy tales, too, because I don't believe dead is dead. That's your belief -- and you have a right to your opinion. As do I, and our Christian DUers.

"And Harm you none, do as you will."
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #20
26. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Random_Australian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-09-06 02:26 AM
Response to Reply #26
29. Hey, you! Bring it!
Basically, you are saying believing (as you put it) fairy tales is a bad thing.

Then you say things that not only prevent people from even considering your point, but also add stress to society - in other words, you're screwing things up far more than you fix.

Bieng an intolerant fool and decreeing that those who think differently to you are less than you is what will destroy the species once and for all, not having respect for others beliefs.

And what's more, DU is a broad umbrella for any leftists - you're breaking the rules for civility, so I gotta tell you - no-one is making you come here. This is a place for people who want to converse with fellow leftists - not a free for all shit-on-people-who-you-don't-like forum.

Any response?
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blogslut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
19. How can anyone worship, much less respect a God
...that punishes babies? What an asshole.
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evirus Donating Member (782 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
21. familar
I think I remember hearing about this a year or two ago.
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 10:28 AM
Response to Original message
24. How many angels can dance on the head of a pin?
In the category of "things we need a theological position on" because the Church is asking.
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mcscajun Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-08-06 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. I have an answer for that one...
...not my own, as I gave up religion decades ago, but one I heard from a Catholic friend who works with developmentally disabled and emotionally disturbed teens.

When the question was mentioned in the hearing of one developmentally disabled young girl, her answer was: "As many as want to." :)
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