Vatican to reach out to atheists

[skepticscott]

The Vatican announced a new initiative aimed at promoting dialogue between theists and atheists to be launched with a two-day event this March in Paris.

The Vatican's Pontifical Council for Culture will sponsor a series of seminars on the theme of "Religion, Light and Common Reason," at various locations in the city, including Paris-Sorbonne University.

The initiative, called "Courtyard of the Gentiles," takes its name from a section of the ancient Temple of Jerusalem accessible to non-Jews, which Pope Benedict XVI has used as a metaphor for dialogue between Catholics and non-believers.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/28/vatican-to-reach-out-to-a_n_815600.html



Why do I suspect this "dialogue" will only be about converting non-believers to Catholicism (the only true faith), and not the other way around? But I guess we should be grateful that the RCC can no longer get away with conducting the type of "dialogue" that they used to with non-believers, which basically involved a choice between forced conversion or torture and death.

[GodlessBiker]

1. What, so they can get at our children, too? They should focus on their own house.

[snappyturtle]

2. If the RCC invited devote atheists to their seminar series...well,

it wouldn't be pretty. I doubt that will be the case. And the winner is..............

[Angry Dragon]

3. Here is a question for the pope

Christianity would not exist without women, how come the church puts women as second class citizens??

[Mumble]

4. Give me a break.

You can't have a dialogue with someone whose brain is stuck in the 3rd century and refuses to budge.

[muriel_volestrangler]

5. Only "noble" atheists and agnostics welcome - those using "irony and sarcasm" need not apply

The "Courtyard of the Gentiles", as the foundation is known, is being set up by the Pontifical Council for Culture, the influential Vatican department that is charged with fostering better relations with non-Catholics. It was founded by Pope John Paul II in 1982 to spearhead his attempts to create a better dialogue with other cultures and faith, including those with no religion at all.
...
But in an interview with the National Catholic Register, Archbishop Gianfranco Ravasi, the president of the Pontifical Council for Culture, made it clear he would not be willing to give a platform to certain prominent atheists.

The foundation, he said, would only be interested in "noble atheism or agnosticism, not the polemical kind – so not those atheists such as (Piergiorgio) Odifreddi in Italy, (Michel) Onfray in France, (Christopher) Hitchens and (Richard) Dawkins".

Such atheists, he added, only view the truth with "irony and sarcasm" and tend to "read religious texts like fundamentalists".

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/vatican-reaches-out-to-atheists-ndash-but-not-you-richard-dawkins-1987518.html

[toddaa]

10. "Such atheists, he added, only view the truth with 'irony and sarcasm'"

Irony


:rofl:

[old mark]

6. That pope- he never calls, he never writes unless he wants something...

Money, money, money-always has his hand out.

Ratz, you have absolutely nothing to say to me.


mark

[Goblinmonger]

7. The Vatican can keep their dirty hands off me.

That being said, it will be interesting to see if they get the real voice of atheism there or just some Uncle Tom apologists. I'm putting my money on the latter.

[onager]

14. Agree. Tthose will be very tame Pet Atheists.

I bet few, if any, will even use the dreaded "A"-word to describe themselves.

They will probably be those mushy "SpeerIchul" types who have doubts, but know there just has to be a higher power, and don't believe in throwing the baby out with the bath water. (Despite the fact that nobody has ever seen the damn baby, after millenia of looking for it.)

IOW, we'll be seeing the kind of atheist that reminds me of Lenny Bruce's line about some Reform Jews: "So reformed, they're ashamed of being Jewish."

[Rob H.]

8. It does sound more like an attempt at conversion than anything

All emphases added by me.

The events will conclude with a party for youth in the courtyard of the Cathedral of Notre Dame, followed by prayer and meditation inside the cathedral.

...

"I believe that the church should also today open a sort of `courtyard of the gentiles' where men can in some way hook on to God, without knowing Him and before having gained access to His mystery," Benedict said in Dec. 2009.

And seriously, "a party for youth"? With all the revelations of organized, long-term cover-ups of molestation and protection of pedophile priests that have come to light recently, no one looked at that particular idea and thought, "Um, maybe we shouldn't do that"?

[Iggo]

9. Nazi Pope Fuck Off.

Thank you.

[Goblinmonger]

12. Jello needs to do a re-release

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tQ19tAw6h0&feature=fvst

I'm assuming that was your reference......which I loved.

[Iggo]

13. You assume correctly.

And yes he does.

[toddaa]

11. What's the age limit?

Only 8 to 15 year old male atheists need apply?

[Odin2005]

15. Go to Hell, you pedo-coddler!

[DeSwiss]

16. Hope their methods have improved since the last time they tried this.....

[frebrd]

17. Why can't the ridiculous old fart....

just mind his own business? There's certainly enough of it to mind, what with the diddling priests all over the world!

[Manifestor_of_Light]

18. No Hitchens, dadgummit.

Hitchens was the Devil's Advocate when they were beatifying Mother Theresa. Hilarious.

He wrote a pamphlet about her called The Missionary Position exposing her as a complete fraud. She did not spend any money on pain relief or helping people get well. They just laid there and suffered until they died. She had millions in Swiss Bank accounts.

Hitchens ----> :yourock:

[rug]

19. He was called as a witness by the Vatican. He was not the promotor fidei, aka devil's advocate.

This was at the same time he was hilariously boosting the invasion of Iraq.

[skepticscott]

20. So the fact that he was wrong

about Iraq proves he was wrong about Mother Theresa and the RCC in general, right? Of course it does.

:silly:

[rug]

21. If you read the post correctly, it proves the poster was wrong that he was a "devil's advocate".

And to say Hitchens is wrong about Iraq is a gross understatement.

BTW, nice hat.

[skepticscott]

22. Uh, yes, I read the part about his not really

being a devil's advocate. But if that was the sole point, what was the purpose of bringing up Iraq (which the person you were responding to never mentioned), if not to imply that since Hitchens was wrong about one thing, he shouldn't be believed about others, in spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary?

[rug]

23. It was a comment on his unceasing hilarity.

[skepticscott]

24. So the example you use to demonstrate

"unceasing hilarity" is, what, 9 years old? And you couldn't come up with anything more recent? Sure sounds "unceasing" to me...

[rug]

25. He hasn't changed his position.

It seems the Mother Theresa anecdote itself is 8 or 9 years old.

Is there a problem observing he is a warmonger? Feel free to revel in his hilarity.

[trotsky]

26. Neither has your pope about the rape of little boys.

He and his church are still protecting the child rapists. I would be disgusted if an institution that I gave my time and money to was engaged in such revolting behavior. YMMV, I suppose. Easier to pick on a dying atheist who had a stupid opinion about war.

[rug]

27. Nice non sequitur, trotsky.

You've become a caricature.

His propaganda was much more than "a stupid opinion about war."

[trotsky]

28. Says the king of the non sequitur!

Oh, did Hitchens rule a country and commit troops to the conflict?

I'd say your pope has a far greater role in the protection of child rapists than Christopher Hitchens did with the Iraq War. Prove me wrong.

[rug]

29. Did the Pope urge the invasion?

You have difficulty staying on topic.

[laconicsax]

30. Did Hitchens actively protect child rapists? n/t

[rug]

31. Is that how you defend a neocon agenda?

Lame.

I'm sure you can do a better job of defending Hitchens' call for invasion.

[laconicsax]

34. Why should I defend your red herring?

You brought up Hitchens' support for *'s war, and conflated it with the Pope's protecting child-rapists.

[rug]

36. Bullshit.

You do nothing but try to steer any mention of the Catholic Church, on any topic, at any time, into sex abuse.

It's understandable, considering you regard Hitchens' neocon history to be a red herring.

[laconicsax]

45. Wow! More than a four word response? I must have touched a nerve. n/t

[rug]

48. Don't flatter yourself.

You don't want your grid to turn entirely blue.

[laconicsax]

49. Actually I do.

All dark blue means beautiful clear skies.

[trotsky]

32. You're one to talk.

Was the topic of the thread the invasion of Iraq? LOL

[rug]

33. It wasn't about Hitchens either.

Nor abut sex abuse, despite your best efforts.

You need a new shtick.

[trotsky]

38. When the Catholic Chuch is involved,

it's ALWAYS about the sexual abuse and rape of children. I don't even need to try.

[rug]

39. Get off your high horse.

All you're doing is using the tragedy of sexual abuse to promote your antireligion and antiCatholic bigotry.

And you do it clumsily.

[trotsky]

40. Your church's leadership are the creeps who have to get off the high horse.

And if speaking out against pedophiles and their enablers/protectors is "anti-religion" or "anti-Catholic," then I'm guilty as charged.

Because until I see serious change and reform, I'll continue to hold them responsible for their actions AND remind the people who support them, with time and money, just what kind of corrupt old evil institution they are perpetuating.

[rug]

42. And your hero urges war.

"Because until I see serious change and reform, I'll continue to hold them responsible for their actions"

:rofl:

Keep pecking away, trotsky

[trotsky]

46. My "hero"?

:rofl: indeed!

I hold Christopher Hitchens in no particular regard other than he's a highly intelligent person with strong opinions who's not afraid to voice them.

I do not give money to him, or work for an institution that he leads.

You keep reaching though!

[darkstar3]

41. There's no horse.

You're looking up at trotsky because you're in the gutter. When you stop rabidly defending and supporting an organization with a systematic history of child-rapist protection, you might be able to climb out of it.

[rug]

43. No, but there's a part of one.

BTW have you repudiated Hitchens' warmongering?

I'd love to see the post.

[darkstar3]

44. I frankly don't give a shit about Hitchens' warmongering. Sometimes brilliant people are wrong.

Being wrong on one matter doesn't automatically negate everything you say for the rest of your existence.

Of course, Hitch really isn't related to the problem at hand, but don't let that stop you from trying to distract the masses from the continued idiocy of your chosen Church as further illustrated in the OP.

[rug]

47. I do.

As should you.

[trotsky]

50. Do you care about your pope providing cover for child rapists?

I do.

As should you. You should start by disassociating yourself from the institution he leads, instead of supporting him with your time, membership, and money.

[rug]

51. Actually, I doubt you do.

[trotsky]

52. You are completely and utterly wrong. I assure you that I care.

People like you who continue to feed the beast, I'm not so sure.

[rug]

53. Say it a few more dozen times, perhaps when discussing weather, and you may convince someone.

[trotsky]

54. I guess this really strikes home for you.

Considering how much you just HAVE to lash out.

[rug]

55. Lol, your posts have more lash, pound for pound, than eyelids.

Why are you wasting time here? Don't you have some churches to burn, priests to expose, and wafers to destroy? Get on with it, man. There's an evil institution out there that needs destroying. We're all counting on you, trotsky.

[trotsky]

56. So what are YOU doing to help, noble rug?

I mean, apart from keeping an eye on atheists at DU and berating them whenever you get the chance?

[rug]

57. More than you know, my dear trotsky.

Adieu.

[darkstar3]

58. So you are contradictory?

You claim to secretly do things to help destroy such an evil institution and at the same time spend time and energy to defend it?

Doesn't make much sense...

[trotsky]

59. We gotta BINGO!

Thanks, rug!

[Manifestor_of_Light]

35. Technically you are right.

During the month of October, 2003, I must have been called several times a day by media outlets wishing to know what I thought about the "canonization" of "Mother" Teresa. I had been, as far as I know, the only witness called by the Vatican to give evidence against her. (The present pope, in his feverish campaign to make as many saints as possible, has abolished the traditional office of "Devil's Advocate," so I drew the job of representing the Evil One, as it were, pro bono. Fine by me—I don't believe in Satan either.) I told my journalistic inquirers what I had told the panel of priests and monsignors before whom I testified: it's really none of my business who is beatified or canonized by the Roman Catholic Church. I am not a Catholic.



http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=hitchens_24_2

[Ian David]

37. These "common ground" initiatives always seem to be more about "common enemies."

My guess is Der Popenfuhrer is trying to find Atheists who hate gay people.

[Evoman]

60. Give all your money to child protection agencies and aids research.

Then, if I don't hear a motherfucking peep from you for 10 years, I'll let you reach out to me. And then I'll probably tell you to fuck off. If you do, then I will respect you.

[LiberalFighter]

61. Why would any atheist want to attend?

It wouldn't do any good to converse with that group of Catholics as they are the upper level scum.

The lower and possibly middle may be more open minded.

[Deep13]

62. Atheists respond by telling Vatican to keep their hands to themselves. nt

[Iggo]

63. For The Win.

:toast:

[trotsky]

64. !

:thumbsup: