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oldtime dfl_er Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:38 AM
Original message
Ohioans watch out
They're doing it here in King County and they'll do it anywhere there's a recount:



Republicans file suit to limit King County recount

By DONNA GORDON BLANKINSHIP
ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER

SEATTLE -- The Washington Republican Party filed a lawsuit in U.S. District Court Saturday afternoon to try to stop King County from including certain ballots in its recount for the governor's race.

The party is asking for a temporary restraining order against hand-counting of ballots that are rejected by voting machines and hopes to have a hearing on Sunday.

The ballots the Republicans want excluded include those rejected by a machine and checked over by hand. The party calls this process "human enhancement."

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/aplocal_story.asp?c...
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freeplessinseattle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
1. a vote is a vote dammit!! they had better not get away with this!! (nt)
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wildflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. Makes me think of that Gandhi quote...
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win...

I wonder if this will start getting some MSM press now that the Republicans are involved.

-wildflower
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shelley806 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
28. I Love all of your Quotes! eom
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wildflower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-22-04 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #28
39. Thank you! Here's one from Peace Pilgrim I ran across recently:
On anger: "Do not suppress it - that would hurt you inside. Do not express it - this would not only hurt you inside, it would cause ripples in your surroundings. What you do is transform it."

I must credit DU with the Gandhi quotes; I first saw them here.

:hi: to all

-wildflower
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dmac Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #2
35. perhaps, but I don't think that it will be the kind of press we are
Edited on Sun Nov-21-04 07:10 PM by dmac
looking for...unfortunately.
(Sorry - this should have been a reply to the original post, not the quotes, which are great)
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JD Lau Donating Member (209 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #2
38. wildflower: thank you for the gandhi quote. something to hold close
and dear.
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gorbal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
3. What would really worry me
Would be if people respond to republican pressure and don't allow the rcounts. I doubt their lawsuits will succeed in most areas but what if they do?
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oldtime dfl_er Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #3
8. So far the elections officials are standing firm
I genuinely believe they want every vote counted. I'll post if I hear anything about the hearing the Repukes want. They must be pretty damn desperate if they hope to have the hearing today, a Sunday.
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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
4. Nice.
Any miscalibration in the machine to be more sensitive to one candidate than another becomes the law of the land.
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Eric J in MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
5. People are better able to tell if chad is hanging or an oval is
filled in than a machine.

This is like saying, No common sense allowed.
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pointsoflight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
6. You have to ask, what are they afraid of?
If everything is on the up-and-up, republicans shouldn't have any problem with recounts. Why are they doing everything they can to stop recounts, run out the clock on recounts, etc.?
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jdog Donating Member (569 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. "human enhancement"
as opposed to "machine enhancement."
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Wordie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
25. I'll take the risks of "human enhancement" over risks of machine error any
time!

When there are hand recounts, isn't there a group of people reviewing each vote (as we all remember from FL?), and a final referee if they can't agree? Maybe that's what the repubs are worried about: who are the referees in WA?
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ahyums Donating Member (348 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
7. that's one the more absurd things I've ever heard.
so if a machine can't vote a now, it's not a vote? that's ridiculous. The fact alone that the Republicans seem to think that the machines are completely infallible makes me suspicious.
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
16. Is "HAL" the new symbol of the Republican party?
Shall we nickname their elephant "Hal"?
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fliesincircles Donating Member (174 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #16
27. LOL
"Count the damn VOTES, Hal!!"

"I'm sorry. I can't do that Dave."
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oldtime dfl_er Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
10. Gregroire and Rossi are separated by 262 votes right now
and this is King County doing the recount, where Gregoire is extremely strong and could easily pick up a lot of votes. The stink of desperation in the Rossi camp is overwhelming.
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rosyhue Donating Member (85 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
11. bush supporters will fight any recount
so we shouldn't be surprised by this.
They have the media on their side, since no mainstream
coverage will be given to this issue. We have to keep
others informed via the web.
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oldtime dfl_er Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. It actually is getting some coverage on the locals
Surprisingly...
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #11
26. Hi rosyhue!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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mdb Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
13. Ohio is going to be on the map again
I don't think Ohio was expecting and wanting to have a recount with the margin won by.

JK looked at the difference in votes in Ohio and said no go. The same thing in Florida. I believe this was planned this way by having a win so high nobody will challenge it.

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Eloriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #13
17. Nio one would challenge AND
when/if vote fraud allegations were made, the high popular vote would tend to negate that as a theory. And I've seen that very thing used by both pundits and GOPers too -- "but he won by 3.5 million votes, so....."
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anamandujano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. That's why they had to pad like crazy and over reached
and can be caught in lots of places. Making the popular vote insurmountable may well be their downfall.

As I just posted on another thread, wherever the GOP brings a lawsuit to stop a count or recount is probably a good sign that hanky panky is alive and well.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Wouldn't that be so sweet? The chimp overreaches, mainly for ego, because
not having a mandate didn't stop them from acting like they had one before.
Inflating his damaged ego may bring the whole dynasty down.


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anamandujano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. OMG, that picture
Look at everyone's face, the guy holding the door, Clinton, even Bush Sr. The faces run the spectrum from horrified to grim resignation. What a freaking loser.

In answer to your "ego" idea. Probably true but I think the main idea behind the excessive padding to insure huge popular vote was to try to blow any ideas of challenging the election out of the water, and as Elorial stated, to use in their post election spin to submerge any recount with ridicule.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. I am sure you're right about the popular vote discouraging recounts
But I also think everything they do takes into account the need to bolster the * ego.

Did you see the other picture from the library opening, where they were all seated in a row and the Clintons were turned to the camera for a photo op and chimp leaned way back to be a part of it? It was posted yesterday but I can't find it.
Very indicative of his true nature.
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anamandujano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #23
24. Saw it but
this one was incredible. In the other one, he just looked like a teenager who didn't know how to behave at a social event.
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Ducks In A Row Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
14. excuse me, but why weren't those rejected ballots counted by hand
being rejected by a machines doesn't mind you get to ignore that vote.
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Indeed - but I think they should recount ALL the votes by hand, not just
the ones the machines reject. Been writing emails stating that to info@gregiore2004.org but no response.
Maybe if it does go to hearing the judge will insist on it.
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99Pancakes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 01:21 PM
Response to Original message
20. Those repukes
They lie, they cheat, they steal...........they obstruct justice.
The Evil Empire strikes again.
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truehawk Donating Member (797 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 01:31 PM
Response to Original message
21. Voting is not supposed to be a lottary where maybe you vote will count
and maybe it won't.
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 06:47 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. We've got a Republican Secretary of State too, (In Washington)
is there even ONE democrat secretary of state in the U.S?
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. My question exactly!
I am amazed that YOU have a Rep. SOS in WASHINGTON... Look how much power they have at election time--way more than the governors.
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 06:55 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. Yep, it always ends up in their lap and it seems like they are
ALWAYS REPIGLICANS
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glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #31
36. Quite the coincidence, isn't it?
NOT!
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Toucano Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 06:59 PM
Response to Original message
32. OMFG! That is so funny!
Human Enhancement!

"You see, children, we can only do what the MACHINES tell us to do. You wouldn't want to engage in human enhancement now would you?"
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Carl Brennan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 07:01 PM
Response to Original message
33. Key variable from something I read today. Keep this
Edited on Sun Nov-21-04 07:02 PM by Carl Brennan
in the forefront:

The Repugs are only asking to stop recounts in Dem dominated areas.

This was in the Seattle Times today.

This shows that it is a partisan act and not a genuine attempt to keep things on the up and up. If it was they would be trying to stop the recount in the entire state. }(
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Carl Brennan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. Here is the link. This is very important for the
word to get out in OHIO.

They have an excellent editorial on how to fix our fucked up election system: use a mail in system. Oregon is 100% mail in. But a word of caution for anybody going to the Seattle Times website. It is the biggest pain in the ass to find anything of any website I have been to. I cannot find this editorial though I have a copy of it in my hand.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2002096...



.....The lawsuit could decide the fate of at least 306 ballots in King County, a stronghold for Democrats where Gregoire won with 57 percent of the votes. It could also delay the recount beyond its scheduled conclusion Wednesday, if a judge suspends counting while the lawsuit is sorted out.
The suit, which names Washington's Republican Secretary of State Sam Reed and King County Elections Director Dean Logan, alleges that when optical scan machines won't accept ballots, workers have filled in ovals on ballots or created duplicate ballots after determining the intent of the voter.
Logan said that's the approach called for by state election rules. He said records of all changes are kept, and the process is monitored by representatives of both political parties. He also noted that the GOP didn't file suit against other counties following the same procedure in the recount.
"I think the intent of the lawsuit would be to restrict us from counting some of the votes for the office of governor," Logan said.
.

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dmac Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-21-04 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
34. Human enchancement??? they have to be kidding!
God forbid our votes have anything to do with "humans" - I guess they think it is bad enough they allow us "humans" to vote at all but then to additionally let humans interfere in the machine logic that they have plundered to assure their victory? Surely they will be laughed out of the courts, right?????
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