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IAMREALITY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:53 PM
Original message
IS ANYBODY ELSE HERE STARTING TO GET EXCITED
About all of this???? I was letting it sink in tonight. All the things I've read so far, analyzed so far, heard so far, seen so far. I am more convinced then ever that the fraud took place. Then I think about what Bev is doing, what we are doing, what the GLIBS are doing, and then I realize we are getting a recount in OHIO, a state with 70% paper ballots. I am really starting to think that this election is in fact not yet over. Starting to think that an Ohio recount may very well go to Kerry, as the NY senate race is now leaning to Andrea Stewart-Cousins. I applaud all of our efforts, all of others efforts, and am starting to really get excited that we really have a shot here!!!! There is just too much. Too much unexplained events. Too much inexplicable discrepancy in the Exit Polls. Kerry MUST'VE won, I am convinced!!!! An Ohio recount is going to be reallllllllly interesting.

We are all tired, anxious, exhausted, and now borderline obsessive (as my wife loves to point out daily now), but I think it is time for a second wind. IT IS TIME TO GET EXCITED, WE ARE WINNING!!!!!

Please, Please, fellow DU'rs, Post your motivating thoughts below on what has occurred so far. Your hopes, why you are convinced, why you know we will pull this out. WE CAN DO THIS!!!!!
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kuozzman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
1. You're damn right!!!!!!
Reclaiming democracy!!!!
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Halliburton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
2. Almost there...
Edited on Sun Nov-14-04 10:55 PM by Halliburton
Cobb has $144,000 as of 9 PM. We should be able to get over $150,000.
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GHOSTDANCER Donating Member (550 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. I sure hope Cobb gets his nose into washington real good. That guy rocks!!
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #5
24. parliamentary democracy?
German prof and friend of mine were talking the other day about the Nazi context and also about the diversity of our country and he said "what we really need is a PARLIAMENTARY democracy" -- something anyway that allows for cooperation between parties. If there is one thing I do miss about Germany it is that.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Oh, that's great! I didn't think they were gonna be able to make it in
time!
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Kralizec Donating Member (982 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
3. Sometimes I find myself going over everything and thinking to myself that
this is too much... too much to not have in the news. At least in the amount we've seen it. But low-and-behold it is all there, it's not a dream. Are we already on the slippery slope?
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Tandalayo_Scheisskopf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Everything is not going to happen at once.
It is going to be a long and arduous process t bring into the light whatever is presently lurking in the darknesses. I think that when it all comes out, even we will be surprised at who was and wasn't a player in all of this mess.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:06 PM
Response to Reply #8
21. I'm glad this thread was written.
I know it wasn't realistic, but I associated a Kerry win with a return to integrity. I really believed it would send the cockroaches in my neighborhood running for cover because there would be a new era of goodness. Until I have reason to seek elsewhere for answers, this election audit is the only light in the darkness.
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. everyone who is not really aware yet that this is happening
is still really depressed and really hurting...I try to give to tell them....but they don't understand...it's not just the Audit, there's something really much bigger happening here. we don't even know each other and we are working together and talking and laughing


that is going to spread.

the other point: you don't have WHINE to work hard man. That is one of the things I find so amazing about this forum....
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #27
118. I tell people about what I know and when they tell me they had
no idea this was going on and how do you know - I say 'it's all over the web'. That loses them and they just roll their eyes and think I'm a flaming idiot (I think I was abducted by aliens last night).
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:14 PM
Response to Reply #3
26. well the snowball's sure as hell have subsided
and on that note -- is anyone else noticing a decrease in SPAM, especially the filthy dick stuff....it's like I haven't been getting ANY or is that bc of Du filters or st?
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Ladyhawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
78. Yes, we are on the slippery slope.
The media hasn't been honest or fair for quite some time. :(
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #3
117. It is so completely obvious that the news organizations
are for some strange reason going WAY out of their way to not cover this mess. The only good reason that makes any sense is that they are all part of the same conspiracy.
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GHOSTDANCER Donating Member (550 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
4. What are they goona recount 10101010110101? Good Luck?
Edited on Sun Nov-14-04 11:00 PM by GHOSTDANCER
I mean if fraud took place it was done under the Diebold servers nose. I'm sure the Convicted Embezzoling Asshole who wrote the software for the system,gave the koolaid drinkers the backdoor. Not to mention the fact that Koolaid Powells son is Man in Charge overlooking the whole thing. Besides when ever anything goes wrong they just have their own private investagation.
LOL...... I lub the spirit though!!!
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IAMREALITY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Come Onnnnnn
Edited on Sun Nov-14-04 11:47 PM by IAMREALITY
I said MOTIVATING POSTS!!!!!! YOU CAN POST THAT STUFF IN THE MILLION OTHER FORUMS HERE. I WANT TO HEAR NOTHING BUT POSITIVE ENERGY AS TO WHY WE CAN, NAYYYYYY, WILLLLLLLL DO THIS!!!!!!
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GHOSTDANCER Donating Member (550 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #6
16. Ok let me GULP down some Brazzle Razzle Berry and will
Pretend it will all go away, It was all a big dream and Jesus is coming back tommorrow.
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #6
30. What's with the future tense
We ARE doing it. It is happening. They can't stop it. Yikes! NEITHER CAN WE!!!!!!

That's what was so disturbing about the 2008er and the 2006ers I knew if we did not do it NOW, we were dooooooooooomed

I just can't believe i stumbled right into the people who were actually doing it.

It was total and complete ACCIDENT, yeah like 250 million to one!



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fearnobush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #30
68. Its happening now, right this very second.
The energy is strong and unstoppable. This is our Kong fu, this our time. It's real, very real. I have friends calling me up, asking for the latest. Requesting more info, more activism, asking what to do, saying... "What can I do." I tell them to turn off there TV and turn on there computer. I tell them where to go... And they do come. Momentum is a strange thing, it's on our side because we chose to fight while they gave up and coward. This is our fight and it's a fight for Democracy over Fascism. It's that simple.
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wlubin Donating Member (190 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:02 PM
Original message
But what about the scantrons. They do have a paper trail, and it seems as
if they were tinkered with as well. All it will take is one piece of evidence that fraud has occured, and it will put the entire election into question. Can't be such a thing as an isolated fraud case. Fraud either occured, or it didn't.
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:25 PM
Response to Original message
34. hmmm....from a legally and mathematically naive perspective
I keep saying what about the 30 K "irregularities" in the election that ran so "smoothly" -- as expected? don't they constitute a form of F. (god am i going to have to change my name after this, like to greenberg or something)

The f word will never be the same.
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ZRB Donating Member (229 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:02 PM
Response to Reply #4
15. A recount won't help with e-voting...
But it WILL make up for the hacked vote tabulators.
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:29 PM
Response to Reply #15
39. yeah but can they even count, i thought that was the deal
they don't have a paper trail so they can't count and if they can't count what's the legal situation then, doesn' t that mean re-elect....

Oh god, would that make us the committee to re-elect....

more like re-erect... democracy
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #39
62. I think each machine keeps a local tally that is separate from the...
tabulated one. At least that is what happened in New York. They did a recount of machines and the Democrate state senator gained a full 2% in the machine recount alone, winning that race.
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wlubin Donating Member (190 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
7. For sure a recount in Ohio will have to be covered in the major media,
don't you think? And then at that time they will have no other alternative but to explain exactly why this recount is occurring. It should then become apparent to america that something weird happened during the election.
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RUAWHACKO Donating Member (40 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:01 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. HA! The Media
I dont know WL. They haven't actually covered a REAL story in years.
Bush has basically Housebroken & Neutured about 99% of the media.

F em. They may not report on it But it IS happening
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #11
42. International press
that may be where the international press comes in (i've been shooting everything over there to a friend of mine who A) expat mourning over possibly having to actually trade american eagle in on an adler b) computer science prof c) occasionally writes for Spiegel... if the stuff is getting read...well then i can't see how any international journalist would not be booking flights right now...anyone else on that? (i'm not well connected enough) but doing what i can. all my canadian friends responded the same way...we were being repuked in more ways than one and it's gonna take some time to put those fires out as well

as I said, i was HORRIFIED by what i saw out on the German forums, the absolute vengeful, hateful disdain for americans... no longer for bush, but for US, they were blaming US this time... the people. and it was UGLY. i'm sure it still is...

talk about missing the bullet.

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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #42
48. expats...
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #7
18. And when Chimp loses alot of those ghost votes, there goes that
mandate baby!
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #7
119. That's what I would think if this was still 'the land of the free'
If the media isn't covering it now when 2 recounts are already being requested, with one of them able to overturn the outcome of the presidential election, you'd think that would merit a sentence or two in between Peterson trial coverage.
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Mike Nelson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:00 PM
Response to Original message
10. GIMME SOME TRUTH
I'm excited that this woman Bev (whom I'd never heard of) is in there fighting. It's exciting that we're all doin what we can... I'd feel so helpless if not for Bev and DU. They are up against a lot of power, but at least truth has a chance. Let's all keep doin whatever we can. LIBERATE AMERICA!
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #10
49. they have SAVED THE UNIVERSE
it's too unreal, i used to do performance pieces by that name, in Europe and everyone thought I was bombastic as i was, but i always knew...,it's a dirty job, somebody's gotta do it.

how will we ever be able to thank them?
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illuminaughty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:20 AM
Response to Reply #49
109. I'm getting catastrophically optimistic
I think there will be a slow roar when this news cycle begins this week. The word is spreading. This site has some amazing people. And you, my Man, you are a performer and have a Zappa avatar! I still play my Zappa when down. Call Any Vegetable, Who Are The Brain Police? It Can't Happen Here. You're Probably Wondering Why I'm Here.

Now don't tell me Frank didn't try to tell us what was going to happen a long time ago.
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knowbody0 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:01 PM
Response to Original message
12. ive gone from what if to what next
wondering how this will affect amerikans. thinking about the chaos etc...the market will crash.domino effect to big to imagine.
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Erika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:01 PM
Response to Original message
13. The Bushie Sites Are In Total Disarray
How funny.
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ZRB Donating Member (229 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:30 PM
Response to Reply #13
40. Link to the Bush sites?
I'd love to see what they're saying about all this!
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:45 PM
Response to Reply #13
50. funny yes but....
gee if y'all want to yuck it up over them, could you take it to another thread... i just don't want them in here.
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:02 PM
Response to Original message
14. This helps...
Edited on Sun Nov-14-04 11:06 PM by jsamuel
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IAMREALITY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #14
37. I hope everybody Realized
The Ohio recount WILL take place. Remember, the 150,000 is only an estimate to include their traveling expenses etc.... the Minimum amount they needed was about 110,000, which they are way over!!! The rest is gravy for their expense budget, but they DEFINITELY have enough to proceed with the FULL RECOUNT!!!!!
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #37
46. Does that include machine recounts too?
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:48 PM
Response to Reply #14
52. celsius 3/11
the meltdown.......
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skylarmae Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
17. I tried to talk to my Dad about the rigged election and he told
me that he agreed with me; BUT, that 'I AM A DREAMER'. That nothing will change because there is no-one to lead us out of this. This was yesterday and I can't get it off my mind. My heart just doesn't hold any visuals of georgie porgie as president, period.

So, I'm with you, my fellow DUer. My motto has been for a long time, 'tits to the wind', and now it rings truer than ever for me!
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Erika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:08 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. We don't Need Anyone To Lead Us Out Of this....
we're doing it ourselves! Bushie sites are totally pathetic. I think they realized they voted for a guy who is UnAmerican but willing to hide it. Must be a tough time to be GOP. The suckers.
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intheflow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:57 AM
Response to Reply #23
87. "If the people will lead, the leaders will follow." :) n/t
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mak3cats Donating Member (489 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:04 PM
Response to Original message
19. I AM! I AM!! I AM!!! I AM!!!! I AM!!!!! I AM!!!!!! I AM!!!!!!!
I haven't needed my industrial-strength antidepressants for a few days now...

:bounce:
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:05 PM
Response to Original message
20. I'm very glad you're here.
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savetheuniverse Donating Member (455 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
22. Starting?
Edited on Sun Nov-14-04 11:12 PM by catastrophicsuccess
I don't remember when it hit me...I suppose sometime in the middle of the night when I was wandering through the threads (sorry folks, I know i was in the way, but damn....it was all just so much truth...and so true...and we have been so fucking starved for truth--i haven't slept in days.

What this forum has pulled together is the most spectacular thing I have Ever seen (aside from the Northern Lights and Chester NEz)...

I couldn't analyze any of it mathematically, but I knew as soon as I saw it what was going ON, that is DOWN here....

Now what I think is happening (realize I know nothing about "critical mass" except that I know when its there....its coming...we don't need the media what were we fussing about..

(I wonder how many people have actually discovered EIR :)

It is amazing. (OF COURSE anyone who is not in this parallel universe right now really thinks we're nuts.) My cat hit the deck something this ayem--yeah that same cat who pissed all over the floor in front of the TV on 3/11

Hey maybe we can make a movie: Celsius 3/11 where's moore
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R Hickey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:17 AM
Response to Reply #22
108. Congratulations on your one hundredth post
According to my clock, your post #100 appeared just after three AM, which means you're up way past your bed time.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:11 PM
Response to Original message
25. I am excieted, but... cautiious
I had a talk wtih my brother in law, and he was saying that even if we find the evidence it will have to be good enough to go to the courts

I said, look these people will avoid it going to the court

So I am cautious and to a point fearful of what they are capable of doing

Folks I raise my glass for a better future and success, but also command caution... for this is the darkest moment before the sun rises... and teh coldest moment of the day... and these rats may now be cornered and cornred animals are the most dangerous


So I also advise you to join us in the boycotts that are under way and other means of PEACEFUL AND LEGAL resistance... for this is what we have left

And I do hope that at the end of the day the rats will be exposed, and I know it will happen... sooner or later.

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Erika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. Agreed. I don't Support Any GOP Businesses, News, etc.
since November 2nd. I challenge every business to admit to their politicial affilliation and act accordingly. We are bringing awareness that politics does play a part. In the last week, I estimate we cut off profits to GOP businesses by about $300.00 and transferred them to Democratic businesses. We'll keep it up.
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #28
35. Oh turst me they are startign to notice
did you catch that story fromthe AP that there may be a backlash
againts the talking heads?

That was the ther thing,I did mention the two cases of buyers remorse I have had from some repukes, and otheres reported here. My brother in law said, that even savage seemed to be having one. I told him, look I don't want to know what savage, o'reilly and the rest think. The only way that those MoFo will get off the air is if we stop listening to them, in toto...

I know the theory, know what the enemy thinks. Well I think we all do, just get PNAC and read that in the morning, and in the eveneing Mein Kampft... I don't need Savage's translation
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jhgatiss Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #28
41. I wish someone would...
start a website that listed Democratic and Republican friendly businesses. Quite frankly, this whole business of boycotting "red" states is somewhat lame. As we've seen in some of the maps, most of the country is "purple".
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #41
56. We could here,
after all if I don't know a business or a state I will work accordingly

If I know a businesss is pro GOP and I know a couple, I don't suport them, end of discusion. In fact had a great pleasure telling this to one proprietor

He went far, he even removed the mil discount he gave active duty folks, BAD MOVE, as he is always going over how we have to kill them rag heads,

Care to guess how many days he has served in uniform? Zero... when the draft comes I will push him out the door, and to the Marine buss if you know waht I mean
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jhgatiss Donating Member (369 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #56
79. I know...
the coffeeshop I frequent is run by non-denominational Christian types who I KNOW voted Bush. I saw the owner today and he asked me how I was.... I told him I wasn't well... He asked why and I told him, "Because our country is run by a neo-conservative right-wing Christian fundamentalist bastard." I don't think he knew what to say. He walked away :)
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #79
122. I don't know why everyone assumes that Bush is a
'Christian fundamentalist bastard'. He's a bastard for sure, but I think the 'Christian' part is just a Karl Rove meme to get Bush more votes. The bastard certainly doesn't act like any Christian I've ever known.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #122
151. Chimpanzee, he isn't. He's a "fake Christian", a false prophet, if you
will.
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berner59 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #25
36. I'm onboard....
ALL THE WAY!!! I truly think this has been and will continue to be an amazing process... Most people I talk to who haven't followed the internet have no clue and think I'm nuts but my gut says something was wrong that election night and the answer really does have to come from the people in order to legitimize this... I still think Kerry & Co. know what they're doing - they've learned from 4 yrs ago...

I'm listening to the audio of the Ohio hearings and this is powerful stuff...

NH starts gets counted next week (week of Thanksgiving) and that will get the ball rolling... Someone awhile back said get ready for the "Dec Surprise"...I believe it!!
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kerry2win Donating Member (321 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:21 PM
Response to Original message
29. New Hamshire starts when? anyone know?
Thats when the real hope for me starts. Hopefully it's this week. Thanks for the bright outlook.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #29
33. A day before Thanksgiving. This is why I asked Ida to tell Nader to
secure the ballots!
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Ilsa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:22 PM
Response to Original message
31. There were so many anecdotes of cross-overs for Kerry,
and I heard there were five Kerry crossovers for every one for *.

This weekend I was talking to a friend whose husband ALWAYS votes rethuglican. He's a pilot with an airline and told her he was voting for Kerry because he has to "vote for my job", as he put it. These are former military people, and very on board with the fight on against terrorism. But if he went for Kerry, I figured it would be a landslide.

As for anything else happening, I'll hope and pray, but I can't allow myself to get my hopes up.
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chomskysright Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
32. CONTRIBUTE TO OH RECOUNT HERE
http://www.votecobb.org

GO!!!!!!!!!!!!

marsha hammond, phd: licensed psychologist; NC & GA
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #32
38. I wish I could give more
I gave my limit, we are unemployed, it tears me apart.... and I am so far away I cannot even be there either

IT is my country damn it and these mofos are trying to steal it from me
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #38
123. Don't worry - we'll take care of each other
At least unlike the pubes and the mudia, we will at least try!
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prairie populist Donating Member (175 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:56 PM
Response to Reply #32
57. Just dropped in my 20 bucks' worth
They are damn close to their $150,000 goal, with tomorrow set as the target date. Ante up everyone, let's go for it.
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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 03:35 AM
Response to Reply #32
105. Done.
Only had ten bucks, but now they have it. Give 'em hell!
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nodehopper Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #32
143. done n/t
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nofurylike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:36 PM
Response to Original message
43. yes. and thank you for this inspirational thread, IAMREALITY! n/t
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OldLeftieLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:37 PM
Response to Original message
44. Beautiful, just beautiful
I've been preaching since November 3 that the election isn't over until the electors meet to cast their electoral votes - this takes place on the first Monday after the second Wednesday of December, in this case, December 13. After that, the votes are delivered to the President of the Senate who opens them and announces the results of the election to the assembled Senators on January 6.

That means there's almost one month until the election ends, and, speaking as an old lawyer, I can tell you that a lot of investigating can take place during that time, especially since I also believe that Kerry had forces in place to pursue precisely this course.

After what happened with Gore in Florida in 2000, Kerry and his people were smart enough to go under Republican radar and work a very narrow plan. This is immaculate, if it's going the way I think it's going to go.

History could be made this month, folks.

Just remember Kerry's apparently off-the-cuff response to a guy in the audience the night of the concession speech (and I think the audience guy was a plant and Kerry was sending a very coded message) when he said, "Just you watch." Remember that.

Watch the Nader movement in New Hampshire. That's where the legal groundwork will be laid.

Absolutely cool. I'm loving this.
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IAMREALITY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:39 PM
Response to Reply #44
47. By the way,
My 30th Birthday is December 13th. I may have one hellllll of a birthday this year!!!!!
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OldLeftieLawyer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:14 AM
Response to Reply #47
64. Kerry's birthday is December 11
I propose we celebrate both birthdays by going to our respective neighborhood liquor stores and getting boxes for Stepford Laura so that she can start packing.
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #47
127. Mine's December 11th - I still have my bottle of Dom Perignon!!
Edited on Mon Nov-15-04 10:53 AM by Chimpanzee
Shit! I didn't know Kerry was December 11th too! Sounds like a personal omen for me!
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #44
51. Oh, my God, OldLeftieLawyer! That's what I was thinking too! Kerry
telling that guy "Just you watch, I've got yours." I didn't think to realize he may have been a plant, but thought it was odd to relay that message. Sure sounds like he knows something, huh?
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nashville_brook Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #51
55. i've been happy since ann coulter's column
swiping at Olbermann. then the coverage on FOX. the mounting piles of great research done here. all the mentions about DU in the press.

i've been all up on how it's like Horton Hears a Who. this forum and ones like it have given the people enough of a boost to be heard. it's a community of smart and passionate people. it's a beautiful thing.
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #55
133. "Horton Hears a Who": We are here We are here We are HERE!
You rock, I rock, we all rock. :yourock:
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BlueStateBlue Donating Member (470 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #51
59. That's the way it struck me, too! n/t
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #44
53. You too, about Kerry that is
I think that people are in for a surprise

If my gut is right, the RWers will be caught with their pants down, seriously down


:-)

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txindy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:01 AM
Response to Reply #44
90. Precisely
Every word you've written here, I agree with. That's been my thinking since I picked my jaw up off the floor the day after Senator Kerry conceded. :)

I'm lovin' it, too. :toast:

In the meantime, let Junior alienate everyone just as he's doing now. The fundies are attacking Mary Cheney, Gonzalez, and Spector. Moderate repubs are scurrying to protect themselves. They wanted this, they got it. Sometimes, you really need to get what you wish for in order to learn a valuable lesson. ;)
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #90
134. Rock-a-bye monkey, down on the ranch...
Rock-a-bye monkey, out on a branch... ;) :thumbsup:
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txindy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #134
146. Smirking monkey, hangs on a limb
Sleeping monkey, life'll get grim

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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #44
125. I'm still convinced
that even if we don't overturn the election outright, if major fraud is proven, some of the Bush electors may just find they have a conscience at the last moment. They may need to enter FBI protection and assigned new identities though.
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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:39 PM
Response to Original message
45. Yep
I'm so excited
I just can't hide it
They're about to lose control
They just can't hide it

***************

It has been one hell of a ride, eh? But we've got two recounts coming and knowing what we all know, we know those new counts may just turn the vote around.

When you look at how the game has played out with the bad side thinking it's all over as the good guys persued getting recounts....Surprise!

The mofos are gonna be surprised when the paper tells them Ohio is getting counted all over again. I wished I could see their faces.
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99Pancakes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:50 PM
Response to Original message
54. Here's to the faith of the Saints!
You all are amazing!
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Broken Acorn Donating Member (590 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #54
61. Kerry holds the Key
And when the EV get certified, all that needs to happen is for a House Member and a Senator reject the vote and then the fun begins? Remember Florida in 2000 when none of the Senators would stand up and fight?

Maybe Senator Kerry has more tricks up his sleeve than we realize.
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BlueStateBlue Donating Member (470 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-14-04 11:57 PM
Response to Original message
58. I'm psyched!!
If this really comes to pass (please, please, please!!), it will be better than having won on Election Day. This way *Co is exposed and maybe prosecuted! :bounce:
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #58
60. The shock on the Fundies faces! And then, we can call back all those
smug relatives who called us and say to them "Who's a cheat and who is now president, hmm?"
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JusticeForAll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 05:30 AM
Response to Reply #60
112. I hope you do not do this
Let's win with grace and be the first to start the healing. We can do it and it is worth it.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 06:59 AM
Response to Reply #112
114. Of course I'm not gonna do this! It was just a joke! n/t
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renate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #58
83. I know! I'm not proud of myself for feeling this way, but
I am really really really really looking forward to hearing the press make their sorry excuses while Keith Olbermann runs triumphant laps around them. Also, to knowing how crushed and disappointed my Republican religious nut neighbors, with their stupid bigot anti-gay marriage bumper sticker, will be.
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driver8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:38 AM
Response to Reply #83
95. karma is a bitch
"Karma is a bitch" -- that's what I tell all the rethugs at work who have been giving me crap for supporting Kerry. I, for one, will not have an ounce of sympathy for these criminals when they finally get their due.

Democratic Underground -- you guys rock!!!

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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #95
128. Same here.
I have some sympathy for the rubes that have been duped (as incurious as they are), but the mofo's that have been insulting me for 4 years are going to get their just desserts from me!
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BlueTarheel Donating Member (90 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:11 AM
Response to Original message
63. Thank you all!
I'm new to the board but have been reading for a few days. I wanted to thank you all for being here and caring and willing to say something and do something about this election. So many people around me have just given up. It's so unbelievably refreshing to read your posts.

This is going to be a great week - the storm is brewing!

It is happening!

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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #63
65. Hi, BlueTarheel! Welcome to DU!
Just you wait, Kerry has our backs! :toast:
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BlueTarheel Donating Member (90 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #65
77. Thanks for the welcome- happy to be here
B-)
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KeireG Donating Member (115 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:19 AM
Response to Original message
66. The lawyers
It is interesting that the Kerry lawyers arrived in Ohio, and then the other candidates started asking for a recount. Could the Kerry people be in cahoots with the other candidates?
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:21 AM
Response to Reply #66
67. No, no way
I am sure there are laws against that and they would know not to do that.

Plus, Nader only did the NH recount because people like us here at DU sent him signed requests asking him to do a recount in NH. It had nothing to do with Kerry. For all we know, these recounts could screw Kerry up.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:24 AM
Response to Reply #67
70. jsamuel, I understand what you are saying. But, I think I disagree with
you on the NH recount. Kerry was easily up two digits in the exit polls and barely won by the seat of his pants. Recounts will probably prove that he won that state more than the official vote count shows.
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:27 AM
Response to Reply #70
72. Oh, I definitely agree with that...
what I am saying is that Kerry may want to try to win Ohio without a recount by counting all the Prov. and thrown out ballots. That way he isn't seen as stealing it from * who won the popular vote (suposedly).
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #72
74. True, but doesn't the Green party have the recount in focus? Why would
Kerry get involved. I think this is part of his strategy.
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #74
75. It could be, I don't know, but it didn't seem to come from him
Of course, I could believe it if there was a meeting or a phone call as some point between them.
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #72
130. Fuck the popular vote!
Did the fact that Bush lost the popular vote in 2000 or the SCOTUS stopped the voting in his favor bother BushCO??? It's the electoral vote that counts. Our system purposefully ignores the popular vote, so why should I feel guilty about it?
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #67
129. No campaign laws have been violated
The campaigns are over as of November 2nd, remember?
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #66
69. There is that speculation. Kerry did meet with Nader during the
campaign. Don't know when.
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #69
71. Haha, Kerry met with Nader in I think, May...
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Lisabtrucking Donating Member (807 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:29 AM
Response to Original message
73. Florida just quietly certified the votes tonight.
Florida just quietly certified the votes tonight. They were very sneaky about it too. only two reporters witnessed it. Hmmm I smell a bigger rat then Ohio.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:31 AM
Response to Reply #73
76. Lisabtrucking, do you think Ohio is just a diversion? The big game
could actually be taking place in Florida! But, my gut feeling is that Ohio is still the big picture.
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Lisabtrucking Donating Member (807 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:46 AM
Response to Reply #76
81. Yes I do
someone from blackbox e-mailed me and asked if they needed me to request data if I would be willing. they don't even have to ask me, I'm ready.
I do think that florida is the biggest fraud case of all the states. they may of certified the votes, but we will find the fraud. Then we need to put jeb bush and his sad crew in jail.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:52 AM
Response to Reply #81
86. Why is that sad, sorry ass governor? n/t
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Hobbes199 Donating Member (430 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 03:19 AM
Response to Reply #81
103. Treason
will be a grand label to slap on these guys. Florida just doesn't seem as big, because it was already stolen once.
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BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:43 AM
Response to Original message
80. Don't curse the darkness, turn on the light.
And we, dear people, are turning on the light with what we are doing.

We've talked a lot about this being about proving fraud and not getting Kerry elected, and that's true, however, if recounts in Ohio are enough to change the outcome think how much easier it will be to get to the truth with Kerry as president.

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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:48 AM
Response to Reply #80
82. You think it's possible
that Kerry Won Ohio? So many peeps around me have given up too.

"Keep Hope Alive"---Jesse Jackson
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BlackVelvet04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #82
140. If there is in fact widespread fraud, anything is possible. n/t
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Lisabtrucking Donating Member (807 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:49 AM
Response to Reply #80
84. This is going to be a hard fight, don't be fooled, but we are just as
strong. That is why they are going to fight us all the way. It's not going to be easy either. Don't think they don't have something up their sleeves
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ClarkinMich Donating Member (116 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
85. Thanks for the motivation
First of all - DU kicks some serious A.

I have never been here before Nov 3, and I have done a lot more lurking than my post count might suggest.

I have a recommendation on how we all can push this over the top.

First, my story -- important background...

I am a white male professional engineer, early 30's. I work among a large group of conservatives and listen every day to their views of the world. I live mostly among my wife's family who are strongly religious and voted for W on the Pro-Life issue alone. I have always been a centrist in my thinking, well, slightly left of center. While thinking they are intriguing, and even having read quite a bit on some of them, I have never *believed* a conspiracy theory in my life.

FF to 2004. I started this election in the "anyone but W" crowd. I voted for Edwards in MI Caucasus. Clark was my #2 choice. I did not like K because of the NE liberal branding and his lack of "Clintonesque" charisma necessary to galvanize the people. I became convinced that K could be a good (if not great) president after the debates. I wanted to volunteer in GOTV, but my wife's health has left me as a significant caregiver to my 6 mo old daughter... couldn't do it. I first want to thank all of you that did volunteer based on what I have read (here and elsewhere) all of you did a fantastic job, perhaps turning out the largest vote for a president in history. In the weeks leading up to the election, I became a student of the electoral vote and polling sites (left, right and center), and I was convinced if turnout was 55% or more, K would carry the day - likely 50/49 or best case 51/48... with about 280-290 EV.

Election Day, I went and voted for K, my wife voted for W (convinced by her mother that she would go to hell for voting for a pro-choice candidate - still working on her). I did not listen to much of the media and did not surf the net. Starting about 7 PM I was watching the returns - CBS, Fox, CNN mainly. For me it was the KY Senate race that I was tuned into to watch the "mood of the electorate." Anyone who had been paying attention knew that Bunning was an idiot and only idiots would re-elect him. I am from southern Indiana, and I will not express my deep -seated views on those from KY, but even I did not think that they were that stupid. Well sure enough, Bunning was loosing (KY was first state with polls to close)... and everything else seemed to go as I expected - close, but in K's column Then -- seemingly all of a sudden -- the coverage turned, the tide turned, everything turned.

Nov 3, I smelled a rat, came looking and eventually ended up here, where I have been ever since, lurking here 4-6 hrs per day and reading everything I can get my hands on, listening to talk radio (never have) and watching Olbermann (O'Riley before)

NOW I KNOW THAT I AM SUPPOSED TO BE SHORT < YOU ALL DID NOT COME HERE TO READ MY LIFE STORY > I WILL GET TO THE POINT. THE ABOVE IS NECESSARY TO EXPLAIN WHAT I AM GOING TO SAY NEXT.

To this topic of this thread. So far, I have been pretty quiet about what I believe and read here. With all of these people that I live around, they all think I am nuts... FOR BELIEVING WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT HERE.

BUT some of them are sympathetic, and many are patriotic... I HAVE BECOME CONVINCED THAT WE HAVE TO GET THEM ALL TO UNDERSTAND MORE ABOUT HOW WHAT HAPPENED IS AN AFFROUNT TO FREEDOM. WE NEED TO GET PEOPLE WHO HAVE NEVER HEARD OF BLOGS, LET ALONE EVER BEEN TO ONE, TO BE INTERESTED. SCREW THE MEDIA... WE CAN BE THE MEDIA.

To this end, I have made a **really cool** flier that I am hanging everywhere. I want more people to see it, read it, and help us make it perfect. Then we all can put it where more people will see.

I need a web host to put this up on a site... so all at DU can see.

Any volunteers?


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Lisabtrucking Donating Member (807 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:00 AM
Response to Reply #85
88. Great Idea
I'm going to work on one also, I live in florida, and jeb bush ain't maken it easy on any of us. I have already thought of doing that and just leaving them at college's, in stores or where ever, I can't post because I don't have a scanner, but rest assured I will have one floating around the Tampa area.
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TexasChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #85
91. ClarkinMich, first off, welcome to DU! There are many free web hosting
Edited on Mon Nov-15-04 01:06 AM by TexasChick
sites you can go to. Yahoo! Geocities (they're Repuke donors though), Bravenet, etc. Google: +free+web+hosting and you will find a lot of sites that will give you free web space to upload your flier. In fact, some on DU use a service that lets you upload pictures for free. Maybe you don't need to get free webspace, just use that free picture service. I'll try to search and see if I can find it. Just upload it there and we can all link to it!

(On Edit: I mean you can convert the flier to a .gif or .jpg to upload it to that picture service)



I have another question. How can Bush be pro-life to these people? I don't get it! He has killed more Iraqi children and pregnant Iraqi women with our bombs! When he was governor of our state, he put more people to death than any other governor. Was actually the only governor in American history to put a female prisoner to death (Karla Fay Tucker - who was a born again Christian like Chimp claims to be). How can you be anti-abortion but be pro-death penalty. Chimp can't have it both ways!! Geez, these people are messed up! Of course, these are the same dummies who still think Saddam had WMD!

Sorry for the rant, and again, welcome to DU! :toast:
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RagingInMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:07 AM
Response to Reply #85
94. You guys rock
I may be a newbie here, but I am just as pissed off as the rest of you. I had been volunteering for the Kerry campaign as well as MoveOnPAC in the weeks prior to the election and from all the canvassing I did, as well as the exit polls I conducted in a voting precint north of downtown Miami, I had no doubts that Kerry was going to win.
I was at a Kerry function that night, which was suppose to be a victory party, when the AP announced that Bush won Florida. I knew right then and there that we had been robbed.
I was so angry that I wanted to take to the streets in protest, but instead, I started an anti-Bush blog.
But I believe in karma and I think it's going to catch up to the Bush crime family. And that will be one of the happiest days of my life.

http://bringbushdown.blogspot.com/
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Ladyhawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 02:03 AM
Response to Reply #85
97. I could host a flyer. PM me.
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ClarkinMich Donating Member (116 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #97
98. too new
Edited on Mon Nov-15-04 02:34 AM by ClarkinMich
either I cant PM or cant figure out how. Can you emailme?

Edit: I got help... many thanks.

The flier is at:
http://election2004.freehosting.net/Flyerver3t.pdf


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demwing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 03:06 AM
Response to Reply #98
102. You Cant PM
till your post count gets a bit higher. Sorry

Da Rules:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html#...

POSTING RESTRICTIONS ON NEW MEMBERS

Please be aware that new members are restricted from starting new discussion topics. We require you to first post responses to a few existing discussion threads before you are given the privilege to do so. We wish we did not have to enforce this rule, but we have found it very helpful to keep disruptors off of our message board. Please do not email us to ask what the minimum number is; we won't tell you, and it's not very high.

New members are similarly restricted from using the private messaging function.
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ClarkinMich Donating Member (116 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 02:52 AM
Response to Reply #85
101. flier now online
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
This is an 8.5x11 file... ready for printing color or B&W (using your printer options)

Thanks to all the DU'er that posted information allowing me to pull this together.

Thanks for help from:
TexasChick -- for pointing me to free web hosting solutions
A big helper at
http://www.solarbus.org/stealyourelection /
who made the .pdf

I want this to be a collaborative effort. The other fliers posted here
are awesome also...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

This one is just targeted a little differently. I want your feedback. email is best.

see also:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...



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m berst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 03:33 AM
Response to Reply #85
104. "Any volunteers?"
Yes. PM me, or if you can't I will give you an alternative way to reach me.

Great story Clark. Not enough of us are reaching out to everyday people and Republicans IMHO. This is not a a partisan issue. Ironically, I have gotten a better reception from Republicans than Dems on the election fraud issue. It is difficult of course for them to take the lead on this, but I think there is a lot of potential support there. Most Republicans I know did not think that Bush stood a chance, were not very comfortable with him, and have not been celebrating. These are mostly older traditional Republicans I talk to, and it may be different among the young hothead Bush supporters, I don't know. For some reason, the evidence of election fraud is the last straw for them with Bush and is the missing piece in the puzzle.

I am hoping that Democrats will make it easy for misguided but decent Republicans to turn on Bush and not keep calling them names etc.
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ClarkinMich Donating Member (116 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 05:51 AM
Response to Reply #104
113. Thanks
critique the flier, hand it out, etc.

It is now online:

see:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

other good fliers in this thread also.
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shakerbaker Donating Member (157 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
89. Carfefully planned Coup
I have donated to BBV and the Green Party. I have hope that the truth will be found. I also am aware that TPTB planned their coup very carefully.They were not going to lose.They have most of the cards-the executive branch,the senate,the house, and the judiciary system in their corner.

What we need is concrete evidence that voting machines were tampered with/that votes were altered. I pray that someone will come up with proof of what we all know/feel in our hearts.
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burn the bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:04 AM
Response to Original message
92. We're raging against the machine
for some odd reason I had gotten interested in the 60's with Leary and Kesey, Abbey Hoffman, the chicaco 7 trials, ginsberg. It's just so all the same. It's exactly the same. They were raging against the same machine that we are now. Their war was viet-nam but it was the same thing that is happening now.(except without the drugs)
Wish I'd known about Keseys bus and his Koolaid back then though. Lol i would definately have been on the bus.
Anyway, I was getting into the 60's stuff before i was getting into this political stuff. I thought how cool it would have been back then. They really did change our world and I thought wow, that would have been cool.
And now, here we are Raging against the same machine. And we're gonna change the world too. Some of these people involve like Ida and Bev may be in our childrens history books. We got things moving and we are gonna stay on it until that shrub grows only in Texas. Texas State Pen
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NJ_Lib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
93. Thank you for
starting this inspirational thread... We need to believe we can do this!!!

I BELIEVE!


:yourock:
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angrydemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:58 AM
Response to Original message
96. I Still Have Hope Because I Know..........
Kerry is a fighter! This man has never and I do mean NEVER give up anything without fighting! All anyone has to do is go back and check out his career all the way back as far as you can find. You will see for yourself this man is a true fighter, true patriot, and he loves this country! Just knowing all I know about John Kerry is enough to give me hope! You can beleive that this man has been working behind the scenes on all of this. He is a very smart,intelligent man that knows what he is doing and will go about it in the right way to get the best results possile out of it. He was a attorney himself and he brought down BCCI. It didn't happen overnight but he did it! If people really got to know who John Kerry really is instead of listening to all the negative nasty remaks and lies they would feel as confident as I do!
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 02:23 AM
Response to Reply #96
99. Proud to have my first post on such a cool thread.
I have only signed on to DU about 10 minutes ago. And only came across you guys the day after the election. But I want to say you guys are motivating as hell! True American spirit is at work here. I really believe your desire to get to the bottom of this fraud and break it wide open is working. Its cool to be able to see it happening. I gave some money for the Ohio recount and it makes me feel good to be a part of this movement!!! Great work Democratic Underground.The MSM should be ashamed of themselves for not asking the pertinent question, "Did Bush steal the election?".
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juajen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 03:36 AM
Response to Reply #96
107. I'm glad you're angry
You must know that so many on this board feel the same way. Disappointment has caused some to rant and rave; but, believe me, they're behind John Kerry and wonderful crew.
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nodictators Donating Member (977 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 11:41 AM
Response to Reply #107
132. If Cobb gets the Ohio recount to go for Kerry, I'll support...

Cobb in 2008!

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angrydemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #132
145. That is your right and your choice but I myself
......will continue to support KERRY all the way!!! But again that is my right and my choice. But I will never give up on KERRY because I know he will never give up on me!!!! KERRY ALL THE WAY!!!!
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The Bear Donating Member (27 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 02:26 AM
Response to Original message
100. DITTO on Thanx for starting this thread!
I've been sending 1-2 emails a day with various articles, etc. to my local Democracy for America group to keep them updated on the election irregularities, fraud, and recount issues, and I get the distinct impression that they're irritated with me for bugging them with all this nonsense. After working so hard for the past year-and-a-half to oust Bush, I thought they might be interested in the bloodless coup that just took place...... Maybe they're just not ready yet. Listening to Randi Rhodes and reading threads like this on DU, though, helps me to maintain my sanity and keep my confidence that we will prevail!

As for "Where's Kerry?" - check this article by Betsy R. Vasquez. It'll help you feel more optimistic about the situation.

INSIDE THE ELECTION FRAUD BATTLE
Think Kerry Is Not Involved In This Fight? Think Again. Also: Fallujah = Operation Distract From Fixed Election.

http://www.moderateindependent.com/v2i21election.htm
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Carolab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 03:35 AM
Response to Reply #100
106. Just keep at it
you're not bugging them--you're trying to help and I am sure that they understand. It's just that it's a lot of information and some people grasp it better than others.
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ewulf Donating Member (156 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:57 AM
Response to Original message
110. More Recounts:
The Badnarik blog team offers us this:

Word is slowly getting out and the money is piling up. $115,000 has come in and that covers the $113,00 estimated Ohio recount fee. Additional funds will cover the expenses of volunteers and researchers. (Are any Ohio area Libertarians interested in helping out?) If even more funds arrive, other states will be targeted as well.

If we give them more money, maybe we can get a recount in Florida,
maybe we can get a recount in Iowa,
maybe we can get a recount in New Mexico,
maybe we can get a recount in Navada,
maybe we can get a recount in Arkansas,
maybe we can get a recount in Colorado,

(and for the Senate)
maybe we can get a recount in Alaska,
maybe we can get a recount in North Carolina,
maybe we can get a recount in Oklahoma,
maybe we can get a recount in Kentucky,

etc. etc.

Yaya!
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jsamuel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:58 AM
Response to Reply #110
111. SOUNDS GREAT!!!
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Nightjock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:03 AM
Response to Original message
115. Kick for the good mood
you put me in with this thread. I was started to feel a little down.

I believe we will see bushco fall hard for trying to steal our democracy. I really, REALLY believe it.
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musette_sf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:14 AM
Response to Original message
116. Kick it , baby!
Keepin' it kicked... DU is keepin' me sane!!!!

(PS, got my "IMPEACH BUSH" sign over the weekend and it's in the front window. Yeah, I'd rather have the victory, but it's my committment to get these fucks out, by any legal means necessary! If we get the victory, even sweeter.)
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spoogly Donating Member (75 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:33 AM
Response to Original message
120. Question. What would a smart litigator do
if he or she really wanted to win an election, but on the day after the election he or she was down in the projections of the popular vote and in the projections for the electoral college?

I propose that in the PUBLIC arena, he or she would do nothing different than Kerry has done...so far. Concede and create the appearance that he is moving on.

The new federal act and provisional ballots changed all of the time frames and all of the strategery for this election? The time hasn't come yet. A candidate is not forced to hang his or her ass out there as fast...like Gore was forced to do in 2000...before he had the opportunity to sit back and survey the battleground.

This may turn out to be a very big week indeed. Keep the faith and keep KICKIN!!
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Nederland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
121. Prediction
The recount will reveal errors and fraud but not in sufficient quantities to change the results.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #121
131. Aww man
I was hoping we'd see some history.
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McCamy Taylor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
124. I am
The Bushies are in serious trouble. Even if they manage to overturn the election results or declare martial law or perpetrate some other sort of Machiavellian fraud that you would have to be Karl Rove to dream up...even if that happens, their "mandate" is toast.

Everything that is happening right now indicates a White House in panic. It started with the surreal theater we saw on election night with the entire Bush clan sitting around smiling like the Stepford wives----I can almost hear Karl Rove saying "If you look like a winner, they will call you a winner". The invasion of Fallujah was timed as a smokescreen to keep the mainstream news too busy to investigate the stories of election irregularities. The embrace of the Far Christian Right is an attempt to mobilize the base to support W. when the s**t hits the fan. Karen Hughes sudden return to Texas on election night was just the first indication that the rats were jumping ship---how many cabinet reignations do we have now? Six? The Washington "Moonie" Times story about how easy it would be for anyone to hack the vote is designed to create plausible deniability once the recount results start coming in.

Pretty soon, I expect to read right wing bloggers posting that Kerry personally hacked the vote in order to pin the crime on W. (I'll send a kiss to whoever finds this one first, I know it is coming and may already be out there.)
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Sarbannes Oxley Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
126. Very, very, very!!!
n/t
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:10 PM
Response to Original message
135. Be the Media! Keep spreading the word, because it ain't on TV
or in the papers that this recounting is even happening. Bush is acting as Presidential as all get-out, trying to cememt that image of inevitability, but BOY I can imagine the panic now that they've already put as much bully into the bully pulpit as they can, and are up against procedural realities that they can't spin their way out of. God, this may end up being really fun to watch.
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Chimpanzee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #135
138. If it goes the way I hope - it will be fucking hilarious!!!!!!
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renate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:11 PM
Response to Original message
136. kick
I think it's important to keep this positive energy going! :bounce:
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bearfan454 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
137. Yes !
We will win !
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BlueDog2u Donating Member (692 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 01:31 PM
Response to Original message
139. Kick!
Keep up the great work, everyone.
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IAMREALITY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #139
141. Ohio Is On!!!!!!!!!!! Recount Those Votes Babyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!
Man, I wish I could fly there and count them myself. I can't wait till they get started!!!!!!!!!
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luaptifer Donating Member (215 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:16 PM
Response to Original message
142. Think Kerry Is Not Involved In This Fight?, Think Again.
INSIDE THE ELECTION FRAUD BATTLE

Think Kerry Is Not Involved In This Fight? Think Again. Also: Fallujah = Operation Distract From Fixed Election.

(apologies if it's already been posted, hadn't seen it here yet. and, fwiw, in trying to make connections between online activists and those who can make things happen once a clear basis exists, i've had a couple communications with folks who indicate that there's much more happening in deep water that doesn't show ripples at the surface. i take heart from that!)

by Betsy R. Vasquez


NOVEMBER 10, 2004 When Senator John Kerry (D-MA) talked about how his policy would be different in Iraq, he kept saying, in effect, Its the how, stupid. He said repeatedly he would fight a smarter war.

Flash forward to today. Following the election, there was a problem apparent. The exit polling didn't match the ballot count, and many reasons for that began to become apparent.

John Kerry was faced with three options. One, fight on publicly rather than conceding and put the nation into a media frenzied limbo. Two, concede and go on with his life, turning his back on his promise to his supporters to ensure that every vote will be counted.

Most people are assuming that John Kerry opted for the second of these while John Edwards, his runningmate, opted for the first, and since Kerry was the big dog, he won out. But people who think this are thinking in Bush terms, all or nothing, either you are for the war or against it, that either Senator Kerry was for recounting the votes or he was against it.

The reality is, John Kerry has chosen a third, much smarter course just as he said he would all along.

John Kerry realized that to launch a public campaign calling the vote into question would be disastrous. In fact, he likely realized he would we walking right into a Bush-set booby trap.

In particular, during our election coverage we talked about the pending battle of Fallujah, about the timing of it being an election ploy, about how it was following in the constant Bush pattern of creating a media event to sway the election, as he did last time by making the run up to the Iraq invasion come to a head exactly on election week.

Well, the battle in Fallujah began hitting the media hard in the week before the election, right on cue. Of course it was billed as the solution, the battle that if you just keep Bush in office will wipe out those insurgents and solve the problems over there. This was yet another obvious use of our nations troops by President Bush as if they were campaign volunteers rather than non-partisan volunteers to defend our nation.

But Fallujah, it turns out, seems to be even more than that. Fallujah, in effect, was the get away car for an election heist.

Following the fiasco in Florida in 2000, Gore was able to battle on for 30 days to try and get a fair accounting. All the while, the Bush camp claimed he should just stop and give up because his delaying of what they were saying was the inevitable end was threatening the nations security and stability. They said the stock market was suffering, the nation was unstable, and so Gore should just give up and accept the result as is.

This time, John Kerry had made clear he was prepared to fight 100 times as hard and long as Gore did if necessary. In fact, he had solicited fund just for that eventuality so he could battle all over the nation if necessary to ensure that every vote was properly counted.

Enter Fallujah. As we know and saw on election night, as Bushs people began calling Networks and demanding they call Ohio for their camp the Bush teams strategy was to try and force all questions to be closed ASAP. Last time, they werent prepared for that part. This time, they were.

Picture if John Kerry had chosen to call the election into question. Immediately, the Bush camp would talk about how 50,000 of our troops are just about to launch the biggest military operation since the invasion of Baghdad. And, just a couple of days after the election, it was launched.

You can imagine the arguments from the Bushies: How could Senator Kerry undermine our security while our troops are in the midst of battle. Fallujah was to be the pressure point that would, if not stop Kerry from uncovering all the dirt and getting a fair election count, would at least tarnish his name with much of the nation and, as importantly, create something for the right-wing dominated media to hammer away at him on, making it seem as if he is only caring about himself and not the nation.

It was quite a well-crafted plan. Completely amoral, but smart.

Unfortunately for them, John Kerry was smarter.

As Keith Olbermann of MSNBC, who has been about the only mainstream journalist to actually follow up on the many serious problems with regard to the integrity of the election, has pointed out, a concession speech, in effect, means nothing. It is not legally binding.

So, if you were thinking like a Bush goon, you would expect that either Kerry would stand up to the mischief that went on, not conceding in the meantime, and so your booby trap would work perfectly, or that he would just give up and let it go, as wimpy Democrats are prone to do.

But John Kerry chose a smarter course. Ask yourself the question, what if John Kerry were to do both, concede publicly but, at the same time, look into every instance of mischief, and see if in fact the election was fair or fixed.

This would be a no lose situation for him. The booby trap set up for him would become irrelevant, as he would have done the right thing for the nation, not putting it into turmoil while its troops are in battle.

But at the same time, he is still just as free to look into any voting irregularities as he would have been had he not conceded. Even better, he could do it without the press going insane and the nation being kept on tension-creating edge. All of the lawyers he could have sent to look into things still could be sent to look into things, and if the election is truly called into question, he could then, with ample justification so as to make it legitimate, come out publicly and retract his concession. It is the prosecutor, also one of Kerrys previous jobs, who knows well enough to thoroughly prepare and investigate his case be leveling charges. You may have a real hunch that someone is responsible for a murder, but until you believe you can win that case in court, you do not make the allegation.

This is called fighting smart. And the Bushies, in the same way they failed to plan for the subtleties of doing battle in Iraq, havent even caught on yet that this is what is occurring, that they are, in fact, being outflanked and attacked after being tricked into looking the other way.

And just in case you dont quite believe John Kerry is on the case, and instead think he just turned out to be a wimp who didnt live up to his word, take a look at this letter from his brother, released privately to his supporters:

CAM KERRY'S LETTER

I am grateful to the many people who have contacted me to express their deep concern about questions of miscounting, fraud, vote suppression, and other problems on election day, especially in Florida and Ohio. Their concern reflects how much people care about the outcome of this election. I want to you to know we are not ignoring it. Election protection lawyers are still on the job in Ohio and Florida and in DC making sure all the votes are counted accurately. I have been conferring with lawyers involved and have made them aware of the information and concerns people have given me. Even if the facts don't provide a basis to change the outcome, the information will inform the continuing effort to protect the integrity of our elections. If you have specific factual information about voting problems that could be helpful to the lawyers doing their job, please send it to (e-mail removed for the story) rather than to me. The election protection effort has been important to me personally, and I am proud of the 17,000 lawyers around the country who helped. It's obvious that we have a way to go still, but their efforts helped make a difference. Their work goes on. Thank you, Cam Kerry

Notice that he chose to have his brother, who is not well-known to the public, sign the letter. As far as the public is concerned, John Kerry has conceded at that is that.

But now you know that that is not truly the case.

Make no mistake, he will never publicly call the election into question unless enough fraud turns out to truly challenge the end result. And so, in effect, he is not at this point contesting the election. But in reality, he is like the DA who says, At this time we are not charging President Bush with anything. Evidence first. It is the best strategy for him personally, the best strategy politically, and the best strategy for the nation.

And now stepping in to help is the man who was supposed to be the spoiler, Ralph Nader. As the Washington Post reports (see article: Losing by 335,000 in N.H., Nader Demands a Recount), Nader is using New Hampshire as a staging ground to call the Diebold machine-recorded electronic votes into question.

Why is he doing it in New Hampshire, which Kerry won? Does this mean he is going after Kerry?

Not at all. It is tactically brilliant. In New Hampshire, any candidate can call for a recount as long as he offers to pay for it. And that cost in this small state is only $2,000 dollars. So Nader is choosing to challenge the results there, but only to make the case that, if there turns out to be a problem with the machines there, the votes must be challenged everywhere.

As the WashPost reports, "We have received reports of irregularities in the vote reported on the AccuVote Diebold Machines in comparison to exit polls and trends in voting in New Hampshire," Nader wrote Secretary of State William M. Gardner. "These irregularities favor President George W. Bush by 5% to 15% over what was expected."

So you see clearly he is charging that the machines skewed in favor of President Bush. New Hampshire was just the easiest, smartest, and cheapest place to get a first crack at making the case, and so opening a Pandoras Box that will spread out across the nation.

So enjoy the non-Moderate Independent medias coverage of Fallujah and ignoring of the recount. But rest assured that people are on the case, and that Kerry is taking the fight to them in such a smart matter they dont even know whats hitting them. And remember, Watergate didnt break the week after the election. No one knew anything was even fishy, but in the end, the devil go his due.

And on another note, the non-M/I media should be given some credit. As one Washington Post reporter told me, you can bet they are looking into all of this. And, as you see with the above Washington Post story, when they get something concrete they are going to print.

But it is the new media the blogs that are powering this one as much as the mainstream media.

So rest assured, and feel free to help out in anyway you can. We are the eyes, ears, and analysts of our nation. Support Olbermann at MSNBC, and rest assured, Kerry is on the case.

And lest you not realize what exactly is going on, this today from Olbermann: With news this morning that the computerized balloting in North Carolina is so thoroughly messed up that all state-wide voting may be thrown out and a second election day scheduled, the story continues.

And, even better, this from a first-hand witness e-mail being circulated among Kerry supporters:

Subject: Basic report from Columbus

I worked for 3 days, including Election Day, on the statewide voter
protection hotline run by the Ohio Democratic Party in Columbus,
Ohio. I am writing this because the media is inexplicably
whitewashing what happened in Ohio, and Kerry's concession was
likewise inexplicable.

Hundreds of thousands of people were disenfranchised in Ohio. People
waited on line for as long as 10 hours. It appears to have only
happened in Democratic-leaning precincts, principally (a) precincts
where many African Americans lived, and ( precincts near colleges.

I spoke to a young man who got on line at 11:30 am and voted at 7
pm. When he left at 7 pm, the line was about 150 voters longer than when
he'd arrived, which meant those people were going to wait even
longer. In fact they waited for as much as 10 hours, and their
voting was concluded at about 3 am. The reason this occurred was
that they had 1 voting station per 1000 voters, while the adjacent
precinct had 1 voting station per 184. Both precincts were within
the same county, and managed by the same county board of elections.
The difference between them is that the privileged polling place was
in a rural, solidly republican, area, while the one with long lines
was in the college town of Gambier, OH. Lines of 4 and 5 hours were
the order of the day in many African- American neighborhoods.

Touch screen voting machines in Youngstown OH were
registering "George W. Bush" when people pressed "John F. Kerry" ALL
DAY LONG. This was reported immediately after the polls opened, and
reported over and over again throughout the day, and yet the bogus
machines were inexplicably kept in use THROUGHOUT THE DAY.

Countless other frauds occurred, such as postcards advising people
of incorrect polling places, registered Democrats not receiving
absentee ballots, duly registered young voters being forced to file
provisional ballots even though their names and signatures appeared
in the voting rolls, longtime active voting registered voters being
told they weren't registered, bad faith challenges by
Republican "challengers" in Democratic precincts, and on and on and
on.

I was very proud of the way so many Ohioans fought so valiantly for
their right to vote, and would not be turned away. Many, however,
could not spend the entire day and were afraid of losing their jobs,
due to the severe economic depression hitting Ohio.

I do not understand why Kerry conceded and did not fight to ensure
that all Ohioans would have a chance to vote, and for their vote to
be counted.

If he is an M/I reader, now he will know.
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NY lib NY Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #142
144. I hope Kerry....
hasn't abandoned us.
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Lucypher Donating Member (46 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
147. very excited
Especially with all of the resignations as the count gets nearer!
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faithfull Donating Member (154 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #147
150. SHUT UP!!!!!

:grr: :nuke: :grr:

CONSPIRACY THEORISTS AND YOUR :grr: :nuke: :grr: DELICIOUS INTOXICATING EVIDENCE!!!! :nuke: YOU ARE BLOW UPPED!!!
:nuke:
YOU ARE LIKE THIS---> :tinfoilhat: !!!!!!!! :grr: :nuke: :grr:!!!!!!!!!
AND THIS----> :pals: ... :grr: :nuke: :grr:WITH OTHER MEN....!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THIS IS DILD O' REILEY SIGNING OFF!!!!!! ITS GODDAMN SHOWERTIME!! :spank: WHOS WITH ME?



:donut:
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John Q. Citizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:47 PM
Response to Original message
148. It's like the Boston Red Sox.
Down 3% and then we we come back 7 straigt, NH (Fraud) OH FL
NC (Fraud)NM NV and CO.


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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-15-04 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
149. it's quite possible * simply went to far this time
wouldn't be the first time the neocons make a mistake.
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