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BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 09:35 PM
Original message
4 years ago tonight
If you were like me, you were anticipating tomorrow's action in congress.

They were gonna decertify the second Bush election. We all hoped.
We had dredged up enough evidence right here on this board that would make it all possible.

Alas, they didn't come through.
Even tho Sen. Boxer and one Rep. stood and made our case, it was for naught.

The next day we all vowed to Kerry on, and we did. In as many diverse ways as America is diverse, we slogged on for the next three and a half years, building our case and tearing down the enemy with a million cuts to its body: The computerized vote stealing machines.

Well, we almost killed it. We did injure it so badly that many states got rid of the machines that allowed Bush to win in 2004. This time, Obama won.

We won the battle. We beat Rove, et al.

It really is just now sinking in. We won and therefore, Obama won.

Take a bow all you ER people, you know who you are. America owes you a great deal.
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 10:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. But the War is ongoing
there are people here in the ER, trying to sell paperless Lever and paperless Touch Screen voting machines apparently, their brain keeps misfiring.

At the end of election day there must be paper ballots to count at the polling or the election in that polling place is a scam.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

K&R
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Exactly WHO is "selling" paperless touchscreens here ?
and is your county/state using HCPB?

As for Levers, Do you prefer that NY has voting machines?

Right now NY is trying to stay out of the fire that is called computerized
vote counting.

As for HCPB in NY, have you done any work in New York to know what the chances of that are?

Tell us all about your work in NY.

Apparently you know better than the folks in NY.

Why they should let go of lever machines for the voting systems currently available?

Why go from what you call a bad thing to something much worse?


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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. The crooks in NY are the sharpest of the two crime families
I'll give them that, they know mechanical paperless gives them (the local crooks) control of election outcomes in their state, they also know that with paperless touch screens they can throw that control out the window. Hence the battle over the two PAPERLESS voting machines.

Fun to watch, but disturbing for the people of NY, which if they would fight for Hand Counted Paper Ballots at the polling place at the close of election could BOOT both crime families the F*ck out of NY, at the end of the first hand counted election.



:)
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. if what you say is true, then surely you have hand counted paper ballots in your jurisdiction
Edited on Mon Jan-05-09 11:34 PM by WillYourVoteBCounted
right?

Cause surely if you just try hard enough, its going to happen.

And you have been working hard, right?

How many years have you been posting the same message about HCPb?
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. You have to admit "the battle over the two PAPERLESS voting machines"
is pretty godamn hilarious, one crime family wants to keep election control at the local level with the use of mechanical paperless vote counting machines and the bigger crime family wants to take that control away from them, by installing paperless electronic vote counting machines, you have to admit thats funny stuff.

Who will win "the saga continues" more details at 10pm.




:rofl:
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. do you have hand counted paper ballots in your county/state
KSTER, you said that if someone worked hard enough, they would have HCPB.

Where's your HCPB,

Where's your accomplishments?
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 12:39 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. Do I have to answer to you?
Edited on Tue Jan-06-09 12:41 AM by kster
I didn't read that rule when I joined the DU, but, you know I am SPOT ON with the paperless mechanical and electronic vote counting machines so you are trying to divert attention from these machines on to me.

Do the people have paper ballots that they can hand count at the close of election at the polling place, when they voted on a lever machine?

Do the people have paper ballots that they can hand count at the close of election at the polling place when they voted on a paperless touch screen?

If your answer is no, that states election would be a scam (period)

You know it and I know it. but there is only one of us that supports the use of these machines, and its not me :)
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 06:31 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. You don't have hand counted paper ballots
so I guess you were wrong when you said that if people
pushed for HCPB they would get them.

Surprise.
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. Just For You
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-07-09 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #25
29. KSTER you don't have them, do you?
didn't you work hard enough?
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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 02:51 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. NY banned paperless DREs in 2005 and would have done it sooner
Edited on Tue Jan-06-09 02:57 AM by Bill Bored
if we didn't take the time to also allow op scans.

The battle is now between computerized and non-computerized vote counting.

Those who are pushing op scan obviously favor computers. Those who want to keep levers, are trying to do without computers, like the hand count folks.

I don't know WHAT you're trying to do with respect to New York, computers, or hand counts, but I haven't seen any paperless touch screen advocates in the state for years.

Now why are you killing BeFree's commemorative thread about Jan. 6, 2005, huh? The levers worked fine in that election, by the way. The vote switching occurred on paper in Ohio.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 12:38 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. Actually, there IS a frightening increase in paperless touch screen advocacy here as of late.
Surely you've noticed.

Posts like;

http://DU_ER/HowILearnedtoStopWorryingandLovetheDRE

http://DU_ER/SaveTrees_PaperlessDRE!11!!1Series

http://DU_ER/HowKarlRoveRigsHCPBinNewHampshire


and the defamatory...

http://DU_ER/KsterOwnsAPrintingBusiness

Fortunately, the pizza man delivers in short order and they down a slice of tombstone, but I'm finding it all a bit unnerving. :scared:

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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #8
10. No I do not own a printing business
but I do own a business, and my business wants

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

:hi: Happy New Years Wilms!!!!
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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 02:56 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. A lumber jack perhaps?
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 03:05 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Keep the Levers, Save a Tree!
:shrug:

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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 03:23 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. A typical county before kster's ER advocacy:


And after:


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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 03:48 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. Actually, that second image looks like the ER forum after kster's HCPB advocacy. n/t
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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. No, that would be this one:
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 01:07 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. Just the opposite Bill, this is
what the county looks like because the people took control of the ballot counting process.



This is what the county will look like if we allow crooks to count the ballots in secret.






CASE IN POINT...



http://www.takepart.com/2008/11/14/sarahs-social-action... /

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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-07-09 12:26 AM
Response to Reply #10
31. got an Ink Cartridge business? n/t
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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 03:15 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. Yeah! I found this in the New York forum:
Edited on Tue Jan-06-09 03:43 AM by Bill Bored
:loveya: :loveya:

It's only a matter of time before it makes its way to ER!
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 03:56 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Oh dang! That one is back.

It has all the markings of Rove. You can tell.


    Karl Rove and Susan Ralston Disrupting the Election Reform Forum

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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. Rove and friends rigging the Bush-Kerry vote -- in New York!


The Urban Legend continues!
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. .
:rofl: :rofl: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :kick: :kick: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :nuke: :nuke: :beer: :beer: :spank: :spank: :pals: :pals: :fistbump: :fistbump: :toast: :toast:

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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-07-09 12:28 AM
Response to Reply #18
32. what no picture of Rove crapping his pants?
because there's no central tabulators in NY?
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OnTheOtherHand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #8
20. damn... rickrolled again! ;) n/t
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #8
22. Hah you made my day, especially the "printing business" thing
Hah! Good thing I wasn't drinking coffee, I would have to sue you for a damaged keyboard.

:)
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. Will the NY crime family win
Edited on Tue Jan-06-09 11:56 PM by kster
will they be able to maintain control of their vote counts via mechanical machines, or will the super power take control.

Don't underestimate the super powers they will get Paperless touch screens or optical scan voting machines in place with 0 to none audits or absent a full hand count of the optical scanned paper ballots at the polling place and your SISSY as will like it, all you will be able to do is look on.

Good luck to the local crooks, your states elections will soon be counted by the electronic vote counting CROOKS, are you having fun yet?

Good Luck to ya.
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-07-09 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #27
30. looks like the crime family won in your state
no HCPB there, right?
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WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-05-09 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. and you are shooting blanks n/t
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kster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #3
11. What the
hell are you talking about? :silly:
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demodonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-06-09 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
26. January 4-6, 2005 I was with Kip Humphrey & the 51 Capital March in DC...

Those were heady days. Things were happening on DU in the ER forum then, good things. I think half of DU was in DC. On the 6th, about 1000 of us marched down Pennsylvania Avenue (without a permit) while others were doing last minute lobbying in the Capitol to get a Senator to stand up and challenge Ohio. God bless Stephanie Tubbs Jones (God rest her soul) and Barbara Boxer.

Here, for those who want to remember....

http://www.51capitalmarch.com /

http://www.americainexile.com/index.html

http://fairnessbybeckerman.blogspot.com/2004/12/save-ou...

http://web.archive.org/web/20050204063536/http://thanky... /

Video of the march ended up in UNCOUNTED, Help America Vote On Paper, and other movies. A great video of it was posted online by Mike Flugennock (sinkers.org) with David Cobb, Jesse Jackson, etc. speeches, Wil B and many shots of the march up Capitol Hill. But it is not on YouTube and I can no longer find it online. There were other good videos, but none have turned up on YouTube either. Somebody should track this footage down and get it preserved.

Anyway -- I would STILL like to start celebrating January 6 as Democracy Day EVERY year.

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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-07-09 12:29 AM
Response to Reply #26
33. Thanks for finding the thankyoupatriot link. nt
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-07-09 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #26
34. Most relevant post of the thread!



    Stephanie Tubbs Jones

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Bill Bored Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-08-09 12:59 AM
Response to Reply #34
35. May she rest in peace. nt
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