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TruthIsAll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:07 PM
Original message
To believe that Bush won the election, you must also believe...
To believe that Bush won the election, you must also believe:

1- That the exit polls were WRONG...

2- That Zogby's 5pm election day calls for Kerry winning OH, FL were WRONG. He was exactly RIGHT in his 2000 final poll.

3- That Harris last minute polling for Kerry was WRONG. He was exactly RIGHT in his 2000 final poll.

4- The Incumbent Rule I (that undecideds break for the challenger)was WRONG.

5- The 50% Rule was WRONG (that an incumbent doesn't do better than his final polling)

6- The Approval Rating Rule was WRONG (that an incumbent with less than 50% approval will most likely lose the election)

7- That Greg Palast was WRONG when he said that even before the election, 1 million votes were stolen from Kerry. He was the ONLY reporter to break the fact that 90,000 Florida blacks were disnfranchised in 2000.

8- That it was just a COINCIDENCE that the exit polls were CORRECT where there WAS a PAPER TRAIL and INCORRECT (+5% for Bush) where there was NO PAPER TRAIL.

9- That the surge in new young voters had NO positive effect for Kerry.

10- That Bush BEAT 99-1 mathematical odds in winning the election.

11- That Kerry did WORSE than Gore agains an opponent who LOST the support of SCORES of Republican newspapers who were for Bush in 2000.

12- That Bush did better than an 18 national poll average which showed him tied with Kerry at 47. In other words, Bush got 80% of the undecided vote to end up with a 51-48 majority - when ALL professional pollsters agree that the undecided vote ALWAYS goes to the challenger.

13- That Voting machines made by Republicans with no paper trail and with no software publication, which have been proven by thousands of computer scientists to be vulnerable in scores of ways, were NOT tampered with in this election


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althecat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. There's that post I love!!!
GO TIA!!!!
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TruthIsAll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
27. Coming soon: a probability analysis based on exit polling
You will be amazed.
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kath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-04 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
33. KICKing this thread
because TIA gives such a great and succinct summary of the election problems.
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althecat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-04 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
35. Still love this... did you hear Randi Rhodes reading it out yesterday?
Don't think she credited you mind.

:)
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wurzel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
2. Can #8 be verified? It is the most powerful case.
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shelley806 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #2
22. Here are some really good links below, especially the one by Otter...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Exit polls analysis versus reported vote count
Faun Otter

There is a graph on this thread posted by pandorasox, that shows the results of 9 states, 3 with paper ballots, and 6 with electronic cheating machines. There was excellent correlation between the exit polling and the actual counted votes in the paper ballot states. In FL and OH, Kerry won in the exit polling, but B* won by a huge increase in the electronic count. Otter showed that B* gained from 4%-15% for the difference between the exit polls and the electronic tabulation of the actual vote in 7 states. He believes this is evidence of tampering.

**If we can obtain all exit polls and compare paper vs. electronic machines, this might be adequate evidence for demanding a recount. I don't know how to obtain the exit polls, and many have been "corrected.."

**Also, is it possible to do a post election poll in all counties in which there is a clear discrepancy between the exit polling data and the electronic voting data? Post election polling actually favors the one elected somewhat, because people like to say they've voted for the winner, though I don't think it would occur in this case...because there was high interest, high voter turnout and willingness to wait in adverse circumstances because people did not want to re-elect B*, and sadly, many are now feeling disenfranchised.


Two other good links are:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

althecat
George Bush's 8 Million New Votes Found STATISTICAL ANALYSIS

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph ...

Ladyhawk
Raging Against the Machines--I Need Your Help to Compile Resources!!!!

These are just the threads that I've read thoroughly. There are many others and we need to keep them posted together...maybe have a separate page or section (sort of outside of mainstream traffic?)


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nothingshocksmeanymore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. And that a Redskins' loss favors the incumbent
Sorry TIA, couldn't resist ;-)
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shelley806 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 03:06 AM
Response to Reply #3
23. You beat me to it!!
Skins win, incumbents in; Skins lose, incumbents old news (D...I wish!)
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Stew225 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:17 PM
Response to Original message
4. Excellent. eom
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wtmusic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:18 PM
Response to Original message
5. My post-election prediction: 100% CHANCE OF BUSH VICTORY
the math is not complicated, and it doesn't even tend to make anyone complacent...
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autorank Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:27 PM
Response to Original message
6. You speak the truth in clear terms. Powerful.
Corporate America controls the media and we get manufactured news.
Corporate America now controls the voting machines and we get manufactured elections.


http://www.blackboxvoting.org /
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are_we_united_yet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:29 PM
Response to Original message
7. TruthIsAll
That was an outstanding post.
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Spiffarino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:31 PM
Response to Original message
8. The election was stolen, fascists control the media
What are we left with? What must we do to take back America before it becomes Mussolini's Italy, Hirohito's Japan, or Hitler's Germany?

Think about that for a while and get back to me...
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xpat Donating Member (295 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 06:31 AM
Response to Reply #8
26. What did we have to do
to get the British East India Company off our backs in 1776?

PS: That was BEIC tea we dumped in Boston Harbor.


A must read: http://www.gangsofamerica.com/read.html
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joeunderdog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:32 PM
Response to Original message
9. That the Dead Heat predictions of all major news outlets were way off...
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Chili Donating Member (832 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
10. TIA... did you see these stats from Florida?
http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm

Check out the percent change column.

Can you and the other DUers join up, collate all this data, and present it to some media source who will follow-up? We've got until the Electoral college votes, right? Can you guys team up? Sounds like you all have different angles, and together you can tie up neatly and succinctly.
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sksoapfan24 Donating Member (20 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Your totally right
It is rather inconceivable how this happened. All the signs pointed to Kerry.
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genius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
12. MInd if we send this around? It's really good.
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TruthIsAll Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 11:27 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Send it all over. Fine with me. Maybe it will start the shitstorm.
tia
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henslee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 11:40 PM
Response to Original message
14. Love this post.
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Matilda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-04-04 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
15. You also probably believe in the tooth fairy.
And pigs that fly, and the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
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britpopper Donating Member (209 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 12:15 AM
Response to Original message
16. Hey Dammit...
Don't make me believe your lies, because the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus told me that GWB fairly won this one...
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ParanoidPat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 12:21 AM
Response to Original message
17. Well put.......
.......now keep digging for the truth.
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DELUSIONAL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
18. Thank you -- I've copies this and will send it far and wide!
Someone on Seattle's KIRO radio -- Dave Ross show called in and said that she feels like an "expatriate in my own country".

It is up to us to scream -- THIEF THIEF THIEF THIEF.

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GoblinToe Donating Member (49 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 01:49 AM
Response to Original message
19. Yes, sir


Damn good post. I don't believe any of it.

I'm printing this out so I can read it every damn day.

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budkin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 02:09 AM
Response to Original message
20. Awesome!
And makes it all even harder to swallow.
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SoCalDemGrrl Donating Member (786 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 02:09 AM
Response to Original message
21. You might also add that people stood in line for up to 10 hours to vote
for an incumbent with a 47% approval rating. Yeah sure...
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The Flaming Red Head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 06:13 AM
Response to Original message
24. Everyone is happy with the economy, the war in Iraq is going as planned
no one minds the price of gasoline, milk, and that Bush did just swell during the debates and that the pundits on FOX truly reflect our national mindset.
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kayell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 06:18 AM
Response to Original message
25. And you have to forget all the rw pundits that were mourning their loss
all day Tuesday.
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Raster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
28. Even if you believe--which I don't--that the process was sound and...
...the results authentic, which they weren't, everyone should be aghast at the openly vicarious, underhanded methods used to suppress the vote. Harassment in minority neighborhoods, harassment near Indian reservations, moving polling places and nazi soccer moms from hell challenging anyone with the wrong skin color. Modern-day plantation mentality, complete with electoral lynching.

Please, explain to me how good people would allow this to happen to someone else, maybe even participate, but if it were them, they'd be screaming to high heaven.
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cubsfan forever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-05-04 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
29. Superb post! n/t
Professor 2
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Shopaholic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. Bump
Because this needs to be bumped and read by ever Du'er
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99Pancakes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
31. Yes!
Exactly! I have been rolling those points over in my mind and when you put ALL of it together, it does make things quite suspicious. Too weird! And then, I ask myself, how can we catch the crooks who rigged the machines or the final counts?

Anyway, if BBV finds some criminal behavior, won't we all be filled with complete delight to watch * pack his bags after thinking he stole it from us again. Ha!
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shelley806 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-08-04 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Let's hope so... It's good to see this post again; Hopeful n/t
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Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-04 05:36 PM
Response to Original message
34. 14. In Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy
and HARVEY.
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Heddi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-04 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
36. If I credit you & link to this thread, can I paste this in my blog?
Thanks! Great thread!!!
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mhr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-11-04 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
37. Kick
eom
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Nov-13-04 01:55 AM
Response to Original message
38. People should be far more suspicious.

Americans really don't pay attention to what is happening around them.
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