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When did it turn into "sovereigntist"?

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jim3775 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 09:53 PM
Original message
When did it turn into "sovereigntist"?
Did I miss a memo or something? Is separatist a dirty word now?

Looking at the definition of both words, they certainly provide a cover for opposite points of view; sovereign is defined as “complete independence and self-government,” and separation is defined as “the act of dividing or disconnecting”.

I’m going to stick with separatist, unless someone can provide me a good reason not to.
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Maple Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 09:55 PM
Response to Original message
1. Well see, all those people
defending 'English Canada'... can't speak the language. :D
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getmeouttahere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 09:57 PM
Response to Original message
2. Oh, this could be interesting....
is this in reference to the controversy surrounding the new Governor general?
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LosinIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 09:57 PM
Response to Original message
3. ummm, didn't Bowie sing about that?
back from sovereigntist's city???
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getmeouttahere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Hee hee, close enough for a good life!
should that "t" after the "n" be there?
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getmeouttahere Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:01 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Geez, I meant good "laugh" I swear!
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LosinIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:02 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. probably not, I just cut and pasted it
cause I wasn't sure wtf
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jim3775 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
7. Thanks for the information, you are all very helpful
Edited on Fri Aug-19-05 10:17 PM by jim3775
/:sarcasm:

Jeez, why all the snark? Separatist was the accepted term nationally and internationally leading up to and after the referendum. Why has it changed?
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Canadian Socialist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. No snark
really. I think that "separatism" went out of vogue, then sovereignist became the new meme. Just because it sounds better. :::shrug::: I guess it doesn't sound so divisive. YMMV.
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achtung_circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
9. Long story short,
Edited on Fri Aug-19-05 10:41 PM by achtung_circus
when it was apparent that complete separation, and a clear question, would result in definite loss of the last referendum by the Pequistes the story was spun.

Instead of separation, we would have sovereignty/association. There would be close ties, Residents of the new nation of Quesbec would continue to be issued Canadian passports (ha, ha) and Quebec would use the Canadian dollar. After the last referendum the matter was referred to the Supreme Court in the form of the "Clarity Act".

More here:
<http://www.law.ualberta.ca/ccskeywords/sovereignty.html>

‘Sovereignty-association’ is one manifestation of Quebec separatism. It calls for political independence and an ongoing economic partnership with Canada. Conceptualized by René Lévesque, ‘sovereignty-association’ was the centrepiece of the Parti Québécois' (PQ) secessionist platform during the years Lévesque led the party (1968-85). ‘Sovereignty-association’ was intended to increase the strength of the independence movement by calming fears that a political divorce from Canada would deliver tough economic times to the people of Quebec. Lévesque's political instincts were shrewd. In the 1970s Quebec public opinion polls consistently reported that people were more likely to support political independence if it included maintaining an economic partnership with Canada.

A mandate to negotiate ‘sovereignty-association’ was the subject of the 1980 Quebec referendum, the first Quebec referendum on sovereignty. Premier Lévesque sought majority support from Quebec voters to negotiate the terms of ‘sovereignty-association’ with Canada. The results of those negotiations would be put to the public in a second referendum.

In a 1979 position paper the PQ stated that sovereignty-association should include free trade between Canada and Quebec, common tariffs against imports, and a common currency. New joint Quebec-Canada political institutions were proposed to govern these economic arrangements. Various English Canadian political leaders declared that they would not negotiate an economic association with a sovereign Quebec. These declarations generally are conceded to have contributed to the decisive defeat the separatists suffered in the 1980 referendum.

In the 1990s, the idea that an economic association with Canada must be a condition of Quebec independence waned in popularity. The question posed in the 1995 referendum only stipulated that Quebec should offer a new economic and political partnership to Canada before declaring independence. Canada's acceptance was not a prerequisite for sovereignty. Unlike in 1980, the separatists lost this second referendum by the narrowest of margins (50.6 percent to 49.4 percent) (see secession).

Submitted by Ian Urquhart
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jim3775 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Aug-19-05 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Thank you
You answered my question.
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