Pelosi: Bush Admin Never Briefed Congress on Waterboarding

[AtomicKitten]

Oh, what a tangled web they weave!

Pelosi: Bush Administration Never Briefed Congress On Waterboarding

04/23/09 02:49 PM

The Bush administration did not inform Congress that it had waterboarded detainees in classified briefings, after the agency had already done so, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) charged Thursday.

Pelosi told reporters that the administration officials only told her and those in a classified briefing in the fall of 2002 that they believed they had the legal authority to do so, based on Office of Legal Counsel memos which have recently been released by the Obama administration.

"In that or any other briefing...we were not, and I repeat, were not told that waterboarding or any of these other enhanced interrogation techniques were used," said Pelosi. "What they did tell us is that they had some legislative counsel...opinions that they could be used, but not that they would."

Pelosi said that the officials promised to inform Congress if they ever did waterboard a detainee, but never did so. Her assertion contradicts a recently released Senate committee report that cited CIA records to claim that senior members of Congress in both parties were briefed on the waterboarding, which had already been done to detainee Abu Zubaydah. Pelosi, in the strongest terms should could conjure, said the report was untrue and that she never approved, tacitly or otherwise, the waterboarding of detainees.

"Further to the point was that if and when they would be used, they would brief Congress at that time," said Pelosi. "I know that there's some different interpretations coming out of that meeting. My colleague, the chairman of the committee, has said, well if they say that it's legal you have to know they're going to use it. Well, his experience is that he was a member of the CIA and later went on to head the CIA. Maybe his experience is that they'll tell you one thing but may mean something else."

Pelosi is referring to then-GOP Rep. Porter Goss. "My experience was they did not tell us they were using that, flat out. And any, any contention to the contrary is simply not true," she said.

Republicans have recently been making the case that if Democrats insist on investigating torture, they must own up to their own culpability for remaining silent. Pelosi's insistence that she wasn't briefed on the occurrence of waterboarding is an effort to push back on that offensive.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) also pushed back against the GOP Thursday. "They know that this is all Cheney-driven and are making excuses," Reid told the Huffington Post.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/04/23/pelosi-bush-administratio_n_190661.html

[ClarkUSA]

1. Surprise, surprise: Porter Goss was lying. Too bad others here believed the worst of our Speaker.

[beachmom]

2. How do you know he is lying? What if Pelosi is lying?

[FrenchieCat]

4. Pelosi was not Speaker of the house at that time.....

So perhaps Goss is talking about having briefed Gephard.

[AtomicKitten]

5. she refers to a "classified briefing in 2002"

:shrug:

[beachmom]

6. She was a ranking member on the Intelligence Committee.

It seems there is a discrepancy between what the CIA said they briefed her and what she recalls.

I guess what I am saying is we should all be skeptical.

[Hippo_Tron]

16. No, apparently this one was limited to the "Gang of Four"

Which is something I didn't even know existed. I knew the "Gang of eight" was when they only briefed the Speaker, House Minority Leader, Senate Majority and Minority Leaders, and the Chairmen and ranking members of both intelligence committees. But I didn't realize that they had a "Gang of Four" which is only the chairmen and ranking members of both intelligence committees. So Pelosi as ranking member of the committee was briefed but Gephardt as Minority Leader was not. Goss was also not CIA director at the time but I think Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.

IMO this whole "Gang of Four" business is absurd especially since the Speaker of the House as second in line of succession for the presidency should be privy to all national security information as should all congressional leaders. There should also be a professional staff with the necessary clearances that works for both intelligence committees that these members can consult with on these sorts of matters to get advice independent of the executive branch.

[ClarkUSA]

7. Because I tend to trust fellow Democrats over BushCo shills. I'm funny that way.

[AtomicKitten]

9. the wingnuts are spinning their wheels lying

should be great theater!

[ClarkUSA]

14. It's what they do best, after all... they obviously think Pelosi is Democrats' weakest link.

Must be all those focus groups and internal polling they do in the bowels of Dick Armey's PAC. It worked well for those teabaggers, eh? :rofl:

[beachmom]

12. I see reasons not to automatically trust Pelosi, just because she's a Democrat

[ClarkUSA]

15. Do you also see reasons to automatically trust Porter Goss, even though he's a BushCo shill?

[frylock]

18. i see reasons not to trust either

[beachmom]

20. Exactly.

[ClarkUSA]

35. I only see reasons to mistrust Porter Goss' sudden shit-stirring allegations.

[ShortnFiery]

36. She did admit that the techniques were BRIEFED but that she wasn't told when they were used.

Like her condescending "Impeachment's off of the table" Pelosi is, once again, proving that she has feet of clay.

Why didn't she INQUIRE when all the stories were surfacing from the Press.

I'm disgusted with her gutless antics and willful ignorance. :thumbsdown:

[meli224]

37. the media is starting to turn the tables on her now.

all I have heard this morning is that she is lying, she was briefed. It is going to make her look bad. The media keeps trying to push the point that if the Democrats go down this road, the country will kick them out in the next elections. I guess no one gives a shit about breaking the law in this country. If the tables were turned, and this was a Democrat who tortured people, you better believe the Republicans would be holding impeachment trials!

[ShortnFiery]

38. She made HERSELF look bad. She was briefed on the techniques - the fact that they didn't say

when they used these techniques is NOT a justification for her ignorance.

Doesn't Nancy read the damn newspapers?!? Even our corporate M$M has leaked "torture" reports.

She SHOULD have shown an ounce of "moral courage" that would not have cost her politically by stating that she was "sworn to silence."

Nancy dug this hole for herself and I regretfully say (because I'm very pro-women achieving the highest posts) REPLACE HER (and Reid).

[SalviaBlue]

44. My rule of thumb is: if the media says its true, its probably a lie.

[Duer 157099]

3. This is the 2nd thing I read today where Pelosi seems to confuse herself with "Congress"

The other incident being with regards to Harman - Pelosi disputing that Harman got any indication that she'd get the chairmanship, when it was Gephardt who had done the assuring. Pelosi sees "Congress says" and thinks they're talking about her. Specifically.

I think Pelosi has grown some sort of grandiosity complex or something. Which of course would explain why she felt so completely justified in taking impeachment off the table, as if it were her decision to make for all of us (which she did, so I guess she's right)

[smiley_glad_hands]

8. She is the speaker, so yeah she would personify the House anyway.

[beachmom]

10. No, she is talking about herself and a 2002 briefing:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/08/AR2007120801664.html?hpid=topnews

In September 2002, four members of Congress met in secret for a first look at a unique CIA program designed to wring vital information from reticent terrorism suspects in U.S. custody. For more than an hour, the bipartisan group, which included current House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), was given a virtual tour of the CIA's overseas detention sites and the harsh techniques interrogators had devised to try to make their prisoners talk.

Among the techniques described, said two officials present, was waterboarding, a practice that years later would be condemned as torture by Democrats and some Republicans on Capitol Hill. But on that day, no objections were raised. Instead, at least two lawmakers in the room asked the CIA to push harder, two U.S. officials said.

[AtomicKitten]

13. hmmmm, well this should be interesting

I find the pushback on this fascinating. Who really knows who's telling the truth? Of course, my kneejerk inclination is to never believe the GOP, but I also think some Democrats are trying to tuck in their complicity.

Still, in the end BushCo is responsible. President Obama turned on the light by releasing the memos and the cockroaches are scattering.

[Supersedeas]

17. thanks for the link beachmom

[Soylent Brice]

11. ???whaaa?

:crazy:

my head hurts.

[vaberella]

19. Ain't that the truth. But I support Nancy Pelosi...I'm giving her the benefit of the doubt. n/t

[AtomicKitten]

21. I find the finger-pointing absolutely riveting.

I think it's proof-positive that the shit has hit the fan.

[vaberella]

22. Totally...and I'm not surprised NP's name was the first called.

I get annoyed that she's the first blame. Then it comes out that NP was never involved or had a limited role. So, she knows that this always happens and on my part I know it happens so I'm giving her---her chance to tell us her side and wait to see if there is anything to disprove it. But I doubt it. Most Repubs apparently are surprised my these memos so I'm wondering why they assume NP would be in the "know" and I'm talking about some rather well known and popular Repubs.

[ShortnFiery]

39. Yes, I would love this controversy to remain with the GOP, but those democrats who were directly...

involved in a cover-up or action should also be held accountable.

[AtomicKitten]

46. I agree. The whole truth is required and will be cathartic. n/t

[ProSense]

23. Clear the air.

It'll be Pelosi and the Democrats' word against Goss, Bush Officials and the GOP. My bet is that the former are telling the truth.

This is the same tired spin that was debated a couple of years ago.

Time to investigate, prosecute and clear the air.

[AtomicKitten]

24. I agree and perhaps the accusation of complicity will nudge them to do just that. n/t

[Clio the Leo]

25. And here is where we get into trouble.....

.... because as we get deeper into all of this we'll start to see just how many folks, us and them, had their fingers in the pie. There were varying degrees of course, but I personally dont see a lot of difference between commission and omission.

And I LIKE Nancy, I really do. But here explanation isn't cutting it for me.

I dont see much difference in "could be used" or "were being used." If it's wrong to DO it, is it not also wrong to know that it COULD happen and not stop it?

It's very easy for us to appear to be hypocritical on all of this.

Again, I agree what the Bush admin did was wrong and I'd love to see Cheney et al thrown into the big house ... but at the same time, the more I see of this, the more I understand why the President is like "Ok .... who wants to talk about windmills!" :)

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[PBS Poll-435]

27. But she was briefed on Harmon's wiretap?

Right...

[struggle4progress]

28. Golly. This sure is perplexiating. After all the forthrightiness and honestitude of the Bush era,

I am really confuserated. I'd really like to believe Nancy -- but then I'd have to believe that nice man from Crawdad Texas had lied to us ...

[Hekate]

30. And that's the truth. nt

[Hekate]

29. I'll trust Nancy Pelosi over Porter Goss or any other Bushite any day of the week.

Bush-Cheney Inc. lied to us for 8 years straight. They lied to Congress. Why would they stop now that prison is staring them in the face?

Hekate

[Luminous Animal]

31. Waterboarding is not the sole definition of torture.

Is that really going to be our only criteria for defining torture in the U.S.?

As far as I can read from the memos, there are a lot of other "enhanced" interrogation techniques that the U.S. employed that the rest of the western world agrees are torture.

Come on, Nancy, in the spirit of transparency, what "enhanced" interrogation techniques did you champion?

[nod factor]

32. Pelosi is NOT lying.

Listen to her words. Nothing she said there is inconsistent with the original report.

Report: Pelosi and others were briefed on the "intention" of the administration to start using torture.
Pelosi: I was never briefed that they had "used" torture.

I hate politics.

[opihimoimoi]

33. I trust her more than Joe, Boner, or Newt.....

[ShortnFiery]

40. No but she's morally smarmy and willfully ignorant. No, she's not guilty but she's no LEADER.

:thumbsdown:

[nod factor]

41. Yup.

So let's recap the cowardice then.

Iraq: "We gave you the authority, but we didn't know you were actually gonna go through with it."
Interrogations: "You briefed us, but we didn't think you were actually gonna go through with it."

Lovely.

[BlooInBloo]

34. Then she has nothing to fear from an airing of all the laundry.

[Life Long Dem]

42. This is a tough one.

Let me see here? Do I trust the media? Or do I trust a Democrat/

Tough one...:silly:

[ShortnFiery]

43. It's hard to motivate ourselves to defend Pelosi when she parses words.

All I could have wished for is that she would have been "stand up." She could have conveyed her points much clearer IF she had made ANY inquiries after the news leaks.

It's hard to defend fellow democrats when they first seemingly wish to stand up for "their image" before the interest of "their country."

[Hell Hath No Fury]

45. Pelosi is my Representative.

And I think what she is saying is bullshit wiggling.

Any investigation into torture and who approved/ordered it needs to go wherever the evidence takes it.

And if it takes it into Democrats' offices, so be it.

It's time to dump all the gargage.