If Edwards does with poverty what Gore did with Global Warming, would you forgive him?

[PresidentObama]

Poll question: If Edwards does with poverty what Gore did with Global Warming, would you forgive him?

Forget what you think of him now. You can think he's a pony, fake, and sleazeball.

But pretend for a second, he's honest. And he wants to make ending poverty the cause of his life.

Would you give him a chance, and forgive him?

I know a lot of DUers are pissed at him, still. And I understand that.

I hope if Elizabeth Edwards is still a DUer, she forwards this to John. I have to believe if John has an incredible impact on this issue, Americans and Democrats will forgive him and put the past in the past.

[HopeFor2006]

1. Forgive him for what?

Being human?

[PresidentObama]

3. I agree, many don't though n/t

[tblue]

40. Agreed. It's between him and Elizabeth. Not my business.

[mnotme]

53. It is not human to cheat and lie.

He might become a great champion in the fight against poverty but that will not take away his despicable past.

[Mojambo]

58. We are clearly not associating with the same humans. n/t

[mnotme]

59. A slight clarification

To use that as an excuse is "too easy"...as that would mean that we have to forgive Bush's lies too.

[MarthaMyDear]

84. Yeah, forgive him for what?

His personal life is none of my business...until it starts effecting how he's performing his job as an elected official.

[Lorien]

98. Agreed. Forgiveness is for Elizabeth to decide

their personal life is NONE of my business.

[Orsino]

107. Forgive him for funneling campaign funds to his girlfriend.

And endangering the party's chances to beat the Republican nominee.
And hurting his family, friends and colleagues.

Humans need forgiveness, on occasion. I think Edwards has already earned a measure of it for his work on poverty.

[Traveling_Home]

2. Do you really mean would I trust him? nt

[JeffR]

4. It's not for me to forgive him, even as a former Edwards supporter.

I hope he brings his formidable intelligence and skills to bear on this cause, and on any other he wishes to tackle. I wish him all the success in the world.

Forgiveness or lack thereof doesn't even enter into my thinking about John Edwards. That's for his wife to deal with, and I wish her all the best too. She's a shining star.

[MrSlayer]

5. Suppose you don't feel you need to forgive him for anything?

What do you answer here? He's done nothing to me at all and his personal life is his personal life.

[PresidentObama]

7. I agree with you, vote yes...n/t

[iamthebandfanman]

6. everyone makes mistakes

so long as his family forgives him, i dunno y anyone on du should give a crap.

[PresidentObama]

9. I wish more thought like you, because Edwards has a lot to give.

He has a lot of energy and passion, and can give voice to this issue.

[tblue]

41. He sure does. He spoke of poverty more than anyone else in politics, maybe ever.

[cali]

51. bullshit. and he talked and didn't do- not while he was a Senator. Bernie

Sanders has done far more than JE. Kucinich, Sherrod Brown, lots of folks have done more.

And historically, FDR and LBJ. JE? What a fucking joke.

[karynnj]

76. Mario Cuomo? FDR?

Even LBJ with the Great Society? Hubert Humphrey?

You may not be as impressed by how they speak, but the entire Kennedy/Dodd/Kerry/Sanders/Leahy etc wing of the Democratic party wrote legislation as well as spoke of poverty - Edwards was not an advocate for the poor in Congress. He voted for the bankruptcy bill - and he can't claim he had no idea what the impact would have been if it became law (as the similar 2005 one did)- his wife's specialty was bankruptcy law. Given that, he should have been getting ideas from her on how to change it for the better and using his eloquent to lobby against that bill.

There have been people outside government who have done the job Gore did on global warming for poverty issues. Gore's main achievement is that he did an amazing job teaching people the facts of a complex scientific phenomenon and getting them to make it a voting issue. In the past, during the great depression and again in the 1960s, photographers and photojournalists used their talent to show Americans that there was incredible poverty in their country. I know the 1960s ones made an impact - because I was a teen then. (here's a link that mentions a Look article with photos by Al Clayton (I remember Life also had a photo essay - but I could be wrong.) http://lcweb2.loc.gov/ammem/awhhtml/awpnp6/look_coll.html )
I think they helped pass the Great Society programs - and I still remember McGovern, a sponsor of the Food Stamps legislation speaking of the percent of kids in Mississippi who went hungry every night. (No, he was not as fiery as Edwards, but the message clearly was made and he had the record to back it up.) In today's world there were many photojournalists whose work showed the devastation that happened and still, in places, exists after Katrina. So, Edwards does not need to "teach" us about poverty. What he could do is act as an advocate for good programs, government or not, that could help people with specific needs.

As to forgive, there is nothing he needs my forgiveness on. The real question you ask is whether he can regain my respect. This is hard as he never totally had it. In 2004, the only 2 things that made me trust him at all was that EE was clearly a solid person and she had married him and because Kerry, who I did trust because of his long record, took him as VP. Now if Edwards went to work and really did a great job on poverty, I would respect his work on poverty. So, I would in fact, for the first time, respect him on his own merits.

[Occam Bandage]

94. Now that is just ridiculous.

Seriously, that kind of statement says far more about your tenuous grasp on American history than it does about Johnny Reid Edwards.

[The Wielding Truth]

8. If she forgives him. I will forgive him. If he does good with his life

that's good, but his forgiveness is not for me to give.

[Cleita]

10. It's not my place to forgive him. It's Elizabeth's

I hope he does what he set out to do and I will applaud him.

[ben_meyers]

11. He will always be a pony to me. nt

[PresidentObama]

13. So you're saying even if he pushed this issue into the spotlight, you'd still think he was a pony?

Why?

[IA_Seth]

92. Yep, a pretty pony with a saddle and everything.

Ha ha.

Seriously though, while it is hard for me to understand or respect his actions as a husband, I have nothing to forgive him for.. I hope that his wife does though.

It's just like with Bill Clinton. He wasnt a good husband at the time, but that doesn't take away his professional abilities.

We can still use John Edwards as a leader against poverty.

[Chipper Chat]

12. Already have (There for the GoG go I).

Maybe a cabinet position is in the offing?

[tblue]

43. This is a beautiful sentiment. Agree 100%. Who are any of us to judge?

[MadBadger]

14. Are you his Publicist?

[PresidentObama]

18. Excuse me? n/t

[Stop Cornyn]

15. To forgive is not to forget.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

16. He is very human, and prone to human frailties...

I do not hold his mistakes against him, ever.

And I think he has much to give the nation...

I would love to see him involved in taking on poverty...

[Occam Bandage]

17. He's shown no indication that he will, as far as I'm concerned.

He canceled or abandoned each of his tentative programs after it became clear he couldn't ride them to President.

[PresidentObama]

20. Fair enough, but you didn't answer the "what if" question posed in the OP.

[Occam Bandage]

26. I don't think he needs my "forgiveness." He never did anything to me.

However, it would probably make me think more highly of him, at any rate.

[PresidentObama]

28. Ok, thanks for the input. I think I should have said trust and not forgive in the OP.

Hmmm.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

78. I'll second that. nt

[FKA MNChimpH8R]

19. Yes. It is too big an issue to ignore

and if he did what Al Gore has done, he would regain my respect.

[Beacool]

21. I have nothing to forgive him for,

his private life is none of my business. It's up to Elizabeth and his family to forgive him, not me.

;)

[PresidentObama]

22. Well said, Beacool. n/t

[Beacool]

89. Well, I felt the same way about Bill's indiscretions.

So it would be hypocritical if I slammed Edwards for his peccadillo. Don't get me wrong, I was disappointed in both men because I like their wives, but I didn't think that it was the end of the world, let alone grounds for impeachment in Bill's case.

I'm a woman of the world who has lived in several countries, sexual indiscretions do not shock me. Furthermore, I don't expect my politicians to be saints. As long as anything they do is with an adult and nobody is forced to do anything against their will, fine with me.

Live and let live........

;)

[Sebastian Doyle]

23. It's up to Elizabeth to forgive him. He didn't cheat on me.

I'm glad he wasn't the nominee, for obvious reasons, but that was settled long before the so called scandal broke.

[meowomon]

24. I'd never trust this liar or his wife again.

I was an Edwards supporter and sure, people are human and make mistakes. But it wasn't the crime, it was the cover-up! Elizabeth went right along with the lies. I felt betrayed and used for one couple's quest for power. I will never ever trust John Edwards or Elizabeth again. I know this sounds harsh, but I believe it to be true. Both are looking forward to clearing their names in the history books. Good luck with that, but I won't be on the ride with them.

[ClarkUSA]

83. That's right. It's not a question of forgiveness, but of TRUST. Voters have had enough of liars.

Both John and Elizabeth Edwards knowingly jeopardized Democrats' chances of winning back the White House.
Imagine if he had won the primary?! I shudder when I think of it. Shame on both of them.

[jaysunb]

25. I'm not mad w/ him...

that's between him and his wife. :shrug:

[Robeson]

27. I'm not going to obsess about him one way or the other...

...if he can truly help poverty, great. If it's just a photo-op to rehabilitate his "image", then I could care less. The ball is in his court.

[Cali_Democrat]

29. NO WAY!!!!

I could only forgive him if he cheated with a better looking woman.

Rielle Hunter is NASTY!!!

Therefore he can never be forgiven.

:thumbsdown:

[JI7]

30. these threads are not really helpful

[PresidentObama]

31. Ok, thanks for your opinion.... n/t

[saracat]

32. I have nothing to forgive him for. This was a private matter. I still admire both Edwards.

[PresidentObama]

34. Well said. And hello saracat, haven't seen you around.

How are you?

[DU GrovelBot]

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[PresidentObama]

35. You're posting flamebait, Grovelbot

[Indenturedebtor]

36. None of my damn business where he puts his weiner now that the election is over

But I don't think that he'll be able to wield much influence now that he's damaged goods. One really has to be a paladin to fight the good fight nowadays and hope to get away with it.

[XemaSab]

37. I'll believe it when I see it

I'll also compare him to Gore when Al takes me up on my offer and puts me on his staff... so to speak. :blush:

[Monk06]

38. This thread is disgusting. A man has an affair and his mistress gets pregnant.

His wife finds out, they sort it out in private
and a sleazy gossip mag creates a scandal
about it even though Edwards occupied no public
position at the time and his primary campaign
was already in the dumpster. He was not a contender
or representative of anything save the interests of
working people.

For this he has to wear a hair shirt because Puritan
DUers say so?

Well I for one pity people who think Edwards must be
held accountable for their pitiful disappointments.

[MadBadger]

39. And what if he had gotten that nomination

How would you feel then?

[PresidentObama]

42. Did you quit your Clinton bashing long enough for some Edwards bashing?

We don't know what would have happened if he won the nomination, because he didn't win the nomination.

And if you think that would have cost him the election, I've got two words for you: Gennifer Flowers.

Obama was the nominee, and he won. Thank god.

[MadBadger]

44. You know, I dont have an issue with Hillary right now, but her campaign was miserable

Thats what I take issue with. I also take issue with people considering her some saint or that her campaign was like some gold standard for the future. And many people on both the left and right had their doubts about Edwards' genuiness. And having an affair on his cancer-stricken wife would have been game-ending

[Monk06]

60. So what, he had an affair. Can you claim to be pure in terms of your own sleeping arrangments???

[MadBadger]

61. I wasnt running for the Presidency of the United States, and I didnt have a cancer-stricken wife

You or I can dismiss his affair, but it wouldnt have been good for the campaign.

[Monk06]

63. He wasn't even contention for president when National Enquirerer 'broke' the story.

The scandal was designed to taint the entire
Dem ticket. And the DU church lady crowd fell
for it.

Luckly the RW 'scarlet letter' campaign against
Edwards didn't succeed in contaminating the
Dem ticket.

[MadBadger]

64. He ran with the intention of winning. He placed the entire country's future in jeopardy.

[Monk06]

65. Believe what you will. Edwards was the Rebug's attempts to taint the Dem ticket

and open the race for Hillary, who the Repugs
saw as their beatable candidate.

It didn't work out, so much the better for the
world in general.

[MadBadger]

66. I have no idea what you're saying.

It sounds like you're saying Edwards was a GOP Plant

[Monk06]

104. No I'm saying he was punked by the Repugs so they could vote Hil in primaries

All the RW pundits thought Hillary was the candidate
they could beat. Edwards stood in the way of an early
shift to H. I don't know that there was a lot of
Rs registering as Dems in the primaries but there
was a lot of talk about crossing over to vote for H
and knockout Barack

[karynnj]

86. How do you get that it would have helped Hillary?

First of all it broke in August a few weeks before the convention - Obama was already the clear winner of the nomination. In addition , why would Edwards cheating favor either candidate.

[Monk06]

105. The tabloid sleaze campaign tainted the entire Dem ticket. Or at least that was what

the Repugs hoped. Anyway it's just one of many
attempts to sew a scarlett letter on the Dem
tunic. Thankfully none of them worked this time.

[PretzelWarrior]

45. what did Al Gore do with global warming? It's still as bad as ever.

I understand what you mean. But really....if he raises awareness about the problem and gets a Nobel Peace Prize related to his work on it but nothing is accomplished....why should we feel good about it?

[Radical Activist]

47. Some things are getting accomplished

Many cities and states are taking action. And the shift in public attitudes in the last few years is monumental. Changing that many minds in such a short time is no small task.

We just elected a President who talked about global warming in his standard stump speech (the first time a Democratic nominee made the environment a major theme in his campaign) and Obama says energy is one of the first things he's going to tackle.

[Radical Activist]

46. I have a hard time taking Edwards seriously or believing he could do that.

I liked Edwards at one time. But I think Obama has a more believable commitment to ending poverty than Edwards and he probably has a better idea of how to do it. Obama fought poverty by empowering low income neighborhoods door-to-door. He has worked on it for his entire career.
What has Edwards ever done about poverty other than give speeches and be a DLC leader in the Senate? Wake me when John actually accomplishes something.

I don't really care about the affair except that it confirms by general impression of him after his sudden jump to the left for his 2008 run.

[kitticup]

48. I didn't support Edwards, so I never felt betrayed...

There is nothing for me to forgive. HOWEVER, I don't trust him; I find him insincere.

If he were to take poverty as an issue, put in his own time, money and resources into fighting poverty, I would be happy and willing to reconsider his sincerity, as something other than as part of a presidential campaign. Nothing is stopping Edwards from fighting poverty. If it is his life's mission, he should work on it, but it is not realistic and unnecessary for him to do so as part of the Obama administration at least not at this time. Gore has led on Global Warming withoug being in govenremnt. MLK, Cesar Chavez, ACLU and other organizations have made an impact without being part of an adminisration.

[Crunchy Frog]

49. It's not a question of forgiveness, I just don't think he belongs in national politics.

I would be very pleased if he could accomplish something substantive concerning poverty issues.

[cali]

50. unlikely that he will. he doesn't have the stature, the platform

or the history.

But yes, if JE works hard on the issue, even if he doesn't achieve great success, I'll gladly give him credit.

Now how much is he charging per speech?

[mnotme]

52. It is not for me to forgive, but I will not forget.

It is human to err but cheating on your wife says something about your character - he will forever be a sleazeball.

[elkston]

54. I already forgive him. I am a man. I know the lure of "new" sex is very strong. (n/t)

[Political Heretic]

56. Not sure what being a man has to do with it really.

[Political Heretic]

55. It's not about "forgiving" him.

If he can get positive work done, he should do it.

If he ran for president again however, I wouldn't vote for him in the primaries like I did this time. It's not personal, its simply that he was willing to take my money and cover up information that would have cost him a general election - that's extreme mishandling of the public trust in my view, and I'm not willing to risk a second chance. That said, I think there's much important work to be done where he could potentially be a great advocate.

[Whisp]

57. it' s not my place to forgive him. just not to like him much.

[LittleApple81]

62. What I think has his supporters mad at him is his RISKING THE ELECTION for Democrats in case

he had been the Democratic candidate. His supporters feel betrayed. And I think there is something to this.

[foo_bar]

67. if you posted the same poll with "trust" instead of "forgive", who knows?

Although I suspect DU polls (like most online polls, but more so) are prone to a supahsize bandwagon effect, since the results are visible before the poll closes, so the first dozen votes have a disproportionate influence on what the rest of the populace considers publicly acceptable (also, historically nixing people who voted "the wrong way" ensures that nobody will vote "the wrong way" until or unless there's safety in numbers, so these polls are better at Magic 8-ball than capturing a virginal landscape).

All that said, Edwards' public crime wasn't jeopardizing his wife's health for his ambition, or even jeopardizing the presidency and his party and his country by making himself an easy target, it was using (public) campaign funds to pay for the aforementioned deceit. I know the cover-up tends to exceed the crime, but at least Clinton had the integrity to buy gifts out of pocket instead of billing his foibles to other people. Hypocrisy also enters into it:

"I think this President has shown a remarkable disrespect for his office, for the moral dimensions of leadership, for his friends, for his wife, for his precious daughter. It is breathtaking to me the level to which that disrespect has risen."

<John Edwards, describing Bill Clinton> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/08/11/AR2008081102016_pf.html

So it's difficult to "pretend for a second, he's honest". He's human, sure, but there's plenty of humans I'd rather not see in public office.

[bunnies]

68. He should never have run knowing that could come out.

He could have cost us this election.

My issue with JRE has nothing to do with his personal life, thats between him and his wife. But risking the election that way?! Not cool.

[mtnsnake]

69. Nice thought, but don't go getting your hopes up that such a phony is going to become a crusader

in the cause of poverty. The guy is a phony. He always was, and he still is. Chances are he always will be.

[high density]

70. He's screwed himself

If he thinks he's going to be the next Al Gore, he' got a rude awakening ahead of him.

[Marrah_G]

71. Elizabeth forgave him- that's enough for me

I hope he goes on to do wonderful things for causes her is passionate about.

[geek tragedy]

72. He doesn't have 1/10th the clout or statute that Gore has, so

the point is moot.

[stuntcat]

73. humans aren't perfect

hardly any of them anyway. Helping people or the planet earns Goodness though.

[davidpdx]

74. Yes, but I still firmly believe Obama shouldn't appoint him to a

WH position. Gore has found ways to work on his issue, global warming, outside of the government. There is no reason Edwards couldn't do the same. The "no drama" promise is just that. We need to govern by example.

[spanone]

75. who the fuck am i to judge him?

[rvablue]

77. Giving a $35,000 speech when you are already a multimillionaire

really gives me no indication that he is working hard to end poverty, but feeding his massive ego.

If there is proof in the future that he is doing so, I would consider moving on.

One must remember, though, that as soon as his bid for the presidency ended, he rescinded some offer he made to pay for college for every kid at some school who did well.

I'm sure you can help further with that information since you are such a big fan.

All this man did was show us that he is #1....and when there is no spotlight, there is no "fight on poverty."

Al Gore plodded away for years and years, quietly giving speeches, until a documentary filmmaker who saw it thought it could gain a wider audience by doing the film. Gore didn't start out on the premise of making an Academy award winning movie or for that matter, hiring someone to film cheesy, ridiculous self-serving web videos of him traveling the country.

[ClarkUSA]

81. Also, he has ended a college scholarship program for poor kids he'd touted as a national model.

Kids and teachers were crying over it, saying that the end of the grants meant the end of their college dreams.
If he really was committed to ending poverty, why'd he do that? Link

[bigwillq]

79. He's forgiven in my book.

It's between him and his wife. It only really matters if his wife and his family can forgive him. It's not our business.

And you can go on and on about how *you* donated to him or how he let *you* down. He's a politician. These are risks people take when supporting a candidate. People that invest too much in a politician will be ultimately disappointed anyway.

He's human. He made a mistake. I'm cool with it. But it really doesn't matter what I think, only how his wife and family feels.

[Colobo]

80. I don't have to forgive him. He did nothing wrong to me personally.

[demokatgurrl]

82. I don't even understand the point of the question-

it's not my place to forgive him, he didn't cheat on me.

[arcos]

85. "If he is honest" ?

If there is something Edwards proved is that he is NOT honest.

[secondwind]

87. I would take the 6% and add it to the "Yes".........the question was "if

Edwards does with poverty WHAT GORE DID WITH GLOBAL WARMING".........

If we do not forgive John Edwards, we are no better than the hypocrites who jumped on Bill Clinton for "being human"......men like Bob Barr (had an affair), Henry Hyde (RIP Henry, you had your affairs also), and let's not forget good ole BOB DOLE, whose wife found out about their divorce in a newspaper, while he was gallivanting around town with Liddy.

We are better than this.

[ecstatic]

88. Yes, but why did he shut down the scholarship programs

not long after his campaign ended? Why did he abandon the poverty foundation he was working on? :shrug:

He might change and do the right thing, but how can one ignore his track record?

[Dappleganger]

90. What is doing for poverty now?

Yeah, he'd be forgiven but there hasn't been enough time to put it behind us yet. The question of paternity still needs to resolved.

[beachmom]

91. He won't do anything with poverty. It was merely a stepping stone

for his second presidential run. His main accomplishments were: being a successful trial lawyer, being elected to the Senate in a red state, and being a VP running mate. I hope I am proven wrong, but the guy doesn't do anything because it's the right thing to do; it is always a political angle for him. And since he has no political future to speak of, I am very doubtful he will do anything to help stem poverty besides lip service.

[SeaLyons]

93. His personal life is none of my business....

he's a human being first, and not a perfect one. Yes, I think if he gets poverty to the forefront, that's much more important than judging his personal behavior.

[peaches2003]

95. It's NOT going to happen. Dream on.

He is toast, finished, over, done. He can do whatever he wants to behind the scenes to try to seek his own forgiveness, but he will never have a public or political life again. I have read the Edwards are separated, so evidently Elizabeth is not willing to forgive and forget anymore either.

[hamsterjill]

96. Forgiveness

It would have been disastrous had Edwards secured the nomination and then the story broke about his affair. The Republicans would have had a field day with another "Bill Clinton" scandal. So, yes, perhaps in one sense, the country might or might not "forgive" him for taking such a big gamble during the primaries.

But the forgiveness that counts must come from Elizabeth.

[Fovea]

97. I really think this is a case where politics and real life disconnect

do we hold our doctor to the same standards?

[Khaotic]

99. Yes

[CakeGrrl]

100. Nothing for ME to forgive. If Obama thinks he's a good asset, I hope he uses him.

I wonder if Edwards didn't have an agreement with the Dems or the Obama camp to stay off the radar until after the election, THEN quietly work his way back into the public eye.

I agree with Bill Maher, who commented after the Dem convention that the Democrats' need to hide Edwards' misbehavior may have cost them the strongest anti-poverty voice they had. Maybe they just decided to quiet things down temporarily.

Should Edwards lead any anti-poverty efforts, Republicans have zero moral high ground to take offense, what with all the criminals, philanderers and sex predators in their party who continue to hold public office.

[gypsylud]

101. Forgive him for what?

It is not my place to forgive. He did nothing to me. As a public servant he is spot on. The matter (of his infidelity) is entirely personal. Between he and his wife. No stones cast from this hand.

[Hippo_Tron]

102. Forgive him for what?

I never held a grudge against him for cheating on his wife because it's none of my business.

[Demi_Babe]

103. he's already forgiven

[JustAnotherGen]

106. Nothing to forgive

He's not my husband.

[cherokeeprogressive]

108. Al Gore stopped global warming? Who knew? n/t

[HeraldSquare212]

109. If he had ben nominated, McCain would be president-elect.

That was pure selfishness and I would never trust him with anything again.