Okay, As I Understand It... Even The Democratic Plan Isn't All That Great For

[ChiciB1]

"we the people!" So does ANYONE have any ideas how we can let them know that MORE TIME is needed to do this thing CORRECTLY??

I've already called my Rep, and Senators and I actually got a reply from Bill Nelson saying he won't vote for bailout, but I keep hearing Dems ARE going to work to pass this. It seems it still gives Wall Street a lot of clout, so what shall we do?

If I'm wrong about this, please inform me. Can't write snail mail, too late...

Should we contact Chris Dodd and Barney Frank or just sit here blogging and complaining. If this Democratic (sort of) bailout goes through and doesn't do much good, the next POTUS will be screwed. Just asking.

[leftofcool]

1. No one has a plan the is "good for the people"

The Dem plan was never going to pass and even had it passed, Bush would have vetoed it in a heart beat

[Youphemism]

2. If this legislation is not passed within days, there will be no point...

Credit is already freezing. Businesses that require loans for payroll will have to start laying off people next week.

There is no good way out of this fix. There is only a dark path with a drawbridge that goes up on it very soon.

[TechBear_Seattle]

5. So better a half-assed quick-fix that can be implemented next week...

... than a thought out plan that might actually make a difference?

Why am I reminded of the PATRIOT ACT?

[Youphemism]

14. The difference: People kept their homes and their jobs whether or not the Patriot Act was signed...

This is not a case of panic mongering. We've seen how the stock market vacillates wildly with each scrap of news about the bailout and how it completely ignores the usual influences.

Countries are going to stop taking our paper. They're already starting. Business will close, layoffs will happen.

This is not a Chicken Little scenario. Our economy is on the edge, and it's very clear to the world. This time next week we'll either have a bailout bill or we'll be watching the first aftereffects of a market crash.

Once that happens, the best written bill in the world won't turn things around.

[TechBear_Seattle]

18. Which makes it extremely necessary that any actions be thought out

Things will definitely NOT get better if investment corporations and banks being bailed out hand the money over to pay for golden parachutes. A knee-jerk reaction of "We gotta do something, and quick!" will not improve the situation at all; most likely it will make things much worse.

[Youphemism]

19. The golden parachutes have been out (per both sides) since negotiations started...

No, you don't run in a panic to fix these things. But anybody who's watched Congress knows that things tend to get bogged down far more often than they zip through too quickly.

Other legislation that hasn't been considered properly was not couched in a time bomb.

Right now, our economy is a car on the freeway with its gas needle pegged on Empty and the Low Fuel indicator is flashing and beeping. We might not like the gas prices we're seeing at the next exit and we should try to get the best deal we can among those gas stations, but to stay on the freeway and hope we make it to a more accommodating place would be folly.

Principled negotiation is definitely important. But there's plenty of time and very little benefit from exploring other paths we might have taken on the roadside next to a dead car, while the vultures are circling.

We'll have a whole new set of problems by then.

[TechBear_Seattle]

3. It is a difference between breaking both arms, and cutting them off completely

Sure, one is a more "humane" option, but I very much wish there was a third option on the table.

[Zynx]

4. There isn't a good solution to this. We can make sure executives don't profit.

That's about the best we can do.

[RaleighNCDUer]

7. My thought exactly. The sad fact is, there is NO solution that will be

good for 'we the people'. At best, we can find one that is least damaging, and will include repercussions for those who created this mess.

[RoadRage]

6. There is no GOOD PLAN for the people.

At the end of the day.. the PEOPLE get screwed.. either way.

If we DON'T pass the bailout, then the countries financial system collapses.. or takes a big hit. Large banks continue to go bankrupt, forcing international banks to increase interest rates to the US or stop loaning us money all together.

If we have to pay more to borrow money, that eats into profits, wages, product prices, etc. When that goes up, companies have to cut the fat (ie, jobs). People lose their jobs - all while prices go up. That's how we get a 10 - 15% jobless rate, and skyrocketing inflation. So, people with jobs stop buying anything except the neccessities. People continue to lose homes & are on the streets. Houses sit empty owned by banks that are now in China.

THAT IS WHAT HAPPENS IF WE DO NOTHING.

If we do SOMETHING - and pass a $750,000,000,000 bailout, then we the taxpayers are on the hook for the next 30 - 40 years.. but it's possible that we could get some of that money back when people pay off their homes.

So, realistically we'd be better off by doing some sort of bailout - however it doesn't look good politically. Anyone who votes for it will have it hanging over their head for the rest of their career. Dem's can't vote for it if Republicans don't - or we will have to listen to them say "we forced taxpayers to pay 750 billion" even though it was the de-regulation of Republicans that led us down this road in the first place.

So, in typical fashion, the Republicans caused the problem.. and they want to blame democracts if we try to fix the problem.

[ChiciB1]

13. So, Bottom Line... Just Go Along To Get Along And Make A Big Wish It

won't hurt too bad! This country doesn't even resemble Democracy anymore, and yet WE are spreading it to as many OTHER countries by way of invading them!

As a long time activist, and a Boomer who garners a "bad image" by some here at DU, I wonder why I try! I said I wasn't going to jump in and work my ass off this time, but I'm still here and feeling "crazy" after all these years!!

My kids chided me into getting out and working for Obama, because I've ALWAYS taught them the need to let your voice be heard, but I wonder what they will think if getting screwed ALL THE TIME is the ONLY ANSWER!!

[seabeyond]

8. there is NO good plan for we the people. greed fucked us. once fucked, never good resolve

cause you are well and goodly fucked.

period

the best we have is to take the fucked and go from there

that is what happens when 7 yrs of greed has been ignored.

or we can deny being fucked and it will fester and grow
we can whine about being fucked but that resolves nothing

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

9. No, but it doesn't seem like you understand ALL of it.

If no bailout goes through, we're all totally screwn. There are a lot of good sources of information on this, but unless we shore up the credit situation quickly, businesses will start to fail, people will lose jobs, and it doesn't take an astronaut to figure out where things lead from there. From THAT perspective, it's very good for "we the people"

[shraby]

10. Here are the outlines to Obama's plan

and it's close to the Dem. plan. I think it looks pretty good.

Broad outlines of Obama's bailout plan:
1. Taxpayers should have equity, not just debt. This means they will have an upside as well as a downside.
2. Oversight will be bipartisan and without conflicts of interest.
3. Homeowners must be helped as well as their lenders in this mess. This means a moratorium on foreclosures involving principal residences. This could be done without infusion, but with non-cash backstopping and would help stop the property price crash.
4. Caps on salaries and other compensation will be strictly imposed on any institution that receives tax dollars.

In other words, taxpayers should own, not merely bail out, America's financial institutions. And borrowers as well as lenders should be given breathing space.

[Barack_America]

11. There's no "good" plan. But the House Republican plan, which calls for further deregulation...

...and corporate tax cuts to allow private funds to be used is the WORST plan for the people, long-term.

[Youphemism]

15. The House Republican plan is to provide banks with insurance, rather than a bailout...

...I really like that ex post facto insurance idea. We should expand it to cover other areas.

I want car insurance I only have to buy *after* the crash, flood insurance I can buy when my sofa is floating out the living room window, and life insurance my relatives can buy for me posthumously.

[Barack_America]

16. But considering the damage has already been done...

Won't the "insurance claims" be collected on immediately?

That plan is just asinine, IMO.

[Youphemism]

20. Totally agreed. My reaction exactly. /nt

[orwell]

12. There are at least two thoughtful proposals that I have seen...

...from John Hussman and Nouriel Roubini. They both involve directly buying preferred shares in some of the at risk banks to inject fresh capital. The preferred shares would be senior in the capital structure so that current share and bondholders would not be at an advantage.

Roubini's plan also invoves setting up a new Governemnt entity which would purchase distressed mortgages, mark them to market, and allow the existing homeowner to essentially refinance at the lower price. Something like this has been done before and it was successful.

Roubini's plan has many other points. It is both thoughtful and thorough, but it would take time to implement. In the current climate of stampede and crisis it would be tough slogging to pass. The House Repugs would not be on board as they would claim it as socialist.

It is difficult to pass thoughtful legislation with a gun pointed at your face.

[Barack_America]

17. It is my impression...

That the mortgage provisions Obama has insisted must be in the plan are very much like what Roubini has proposed. I haven't seen the plan, of course, but just extrapolating from Obama's stated mortgage-rescue plans of the primary season, it sounds very similar.