I will NEVER forgive the key-rattlers, and here is why-

[chieftain]

DISCLAIMER:

This is chieftain's son, I have my own account but am unable to access it at the moment. So if you're going to hold a grudge against me for this post, hold it against me, and not chieftain. I post occasionally as "mirrorashes" and have about 700 posts. Direct your anger my way if that is what you need to do.

So, that said, let me reiterate: I will NEVER forgive the key-rattlers. Not just because its rovian, not just because its mean-spirited and petty and beneath us, not just because it could very well lose us the election in November. No, all of those things are true, but by doing this you take what is possibly our very best weapon, given to us by McCain himself, and put him in a defensive position over it and allow him to a) stop the bleeding, b) get sympathy, and c) further paint us as unpatriotic.

Yes, yes, its about the HOUSES, not the PTSD, right, I hear you. GET THE F*** REAL. Sure, we can say its about the houses until we're all blue in the face. No one will listen.

WE ARE GETTING ENOUGH TRACTION ON THE HOUSES GAFFE ALREADY.

By pulling some stupid stunt like this we step on his deadly mistake and allow it to be re-framed it as OUR deadly mistake.

They will spend every day until November talking about the audacity of the democrats and how they'd torture poor old man McCain with terrible visions of his time spent in prison. Will they get traction? The media will enable them, you can bet on that. Will we get traction enhancing the impact of the houses gaffe? No. None whatsoever. If you can come up with a sensible explanation as to how this enhances our gain from the houses gaffe, please explain it to me. "We get to rub it in his face a little more" isn't good enough. It won't be taken that way, as much as you may wish it would be. It just won't.

The *moment* those keys get airtime the entire convention will be overshadowed by the media ripping us to shreds for this, and we'll be caught in a "but... but... but... its about houses!" back-pedaling explanatory mode that will lead us nowhere but to defeat.

Let the gaffe stand as it is.

We have to play tough, yes, and I know everyone wants to go for the jugular, but you have to be SMART before you get TOUGH. Isn't that what the Obama/Biden ticket is all about, anyway?

Do we really want to open the doors to being compared to Vietnamese prison guards? Seriously? With what we have at stake in this election? Good god, no. If that scenario plays out WE WILL LOSE IN NOVEMBER. So don't take the chance. Its pouring gas on a blaze already burning, but we're the ones who will come out burned.

To those that say "oh, but they won't want to bring up the PTSD, we're safe," no, you're wrong. They don't ever have to bring up PTSD. They just have to bring up the imagery of PRISON KEYS. THATS IT. No matter how good your intentions are with this they will be trumped by the way it can SO EASILY be twisted against us.

If you do this, you are doing Obama, Biden, the Democratic Party and the entire country an enormous disservice.

STOP THIS MOVEMENT NOW BEFORE YOU OPEN A DOOR THAT CANNOT BE SHUT!!!!

[grannie4peace]

1. good post!!!

[Kire]

206. What about Big Huge Foam Keys?

I guess it's a moot point, because this PTSD thing will be in every story about it forever.

[bjobotts]

211. You act like a republican troll. with this "please stop hitting me" nonsense.

[bjobotts]

215. This has been enormously successful and will continue to be. It will have the opposite affect

of the one you suggest. Most people did not know of McCain's great wealth...and this house gaffe just reinforces how our of touch McCain is with the public. Every time he uses the POW defense it minimizes it's effectiveness because it has nothing to do with the issues where he has been using it. It makes him look like and old man walking around with no pants on but pushing the medals on his chest out while saying "I've got medals...see, I've got medals".

Besides being true, it emphasizes his leadership is determined by lobbyists who can only see with the eyes of multimillionaires. This is one time where McCain has really screwed the pooch and the gift keeps on giving. It will last all the way through the elections and hopefully will get McCain removed from the senate as sympathy for his having been a POW 40yrs ago will have been all played out. The more he plays that POW card the more people will realize it has nothing to do with good judgment or with government leadership.

suggest you go to www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com and see the growing numbers of people putting McCain's emotional blackmail in it's place.

McCain is an out of touch millionaire controlled by Big Oil and only serves the corporate interests and not the interests of the people which his house blunder makes more obvious. Dems should continue speaking the truth and this house gaffe will only continue to benefit the Obama campaign.

[Kire]

245. Have you ever been hit?

Have you ever tried to talk a family member with PTSD down from a proverbial ledge?

Do you think you would be saying that if they were in the same room as you?

I just want to say that a shutter went down my spine when I read your post.

[GrizzlyMan]

2. Agreed. There should be no key stunt.

But I hope you're not saying that the public doesn't need to know that this man has PTSD.

[chieftain]

12. My honest take on the PTSD situation--

McCain is already bringing his mental capacity into question on his own. There are ways to subtly push this. People in the media are already starting to ask questions about the state of his mind. That ball is just now beginning to roll. Look at Cafferty's recent piece on McCain's lack of intellectual curiosity, MoDo & Fineman's assertions that he's overplaying the POW card, etc. The concern for McCain's state of mind is growing.

So, with that in mind, what do you do next? I'm not sure, but I know the key-stunt isn't it. Get a strong vet like Jim Webb to come out and float it, subtly. Get it out there. Then, when further gaffes come, build on it. The gaffes will continue to come, that is one luxury we can count on. Draw it out slow and make it truly work AGAINST McCain.

Throw common sense out the window on this one. If we just come straight out and throw it in his face it will be a huge mistake. It'll bring out all the "dems hate america" bs and bring it to a new level. Suddenly things could shift from being about taking the chance on Obama to rallying around the wounded-patriot McCain.

I'm not saying any of this is perfect or that I have all the best ideas. I just think we're walking through a minefield on this one and if we want to do it we have to thread the needle very carefully.

[GrizzlyMan]

15. You make very good points

Initially, I saw the key stunt as a funny, something that could be our answer to the tire pressure gauges. But I have since come to believe it is a bad idea for the reasons you mentioned in the OP. I hope you are right about the drip drip drip of his mental state, but I also trust that you will understand I have a lack of faith in the media. I do hope you are right, and think you will be.

[chieftain]

40. I hope so too. Its a tricky proposition, but it can be done.

It just has to be done with extreme care.

[grannie4peace]

17. i like that

jim webb is a powerful speaker & a real leader!!!!!!!

[chieftain]

36. He is indeed! Thanks g4p!

[marshall]

209. Equivalent to waving a blue Gap dress and a cigar at Hillary

It is beneath us. Don't go there.

[zanne]

243. If someone could get hold of a doctor's report and leak it....

Yeah...I know it's sleazy, but Republicans bring out my dark side.

[KnaveRupe]

280. "Get a strong vet like Jim Webb to come out and float it, subtly. Get it out there."

A strong vet like Wes Freakin' Clark had the audacity to suggest that getting your plane shot out from under you didn't automatically qualify you to be leader of the free world, and he got crucified for it. And, in one of Obama's decisions with which I disagree, Wes got disavowed and shunned by his own party over it.

Either we're gonna play hardball, and jam that faux outrage back in their faces by calling them on it EVERY. SINGLE. TIME., or we are gonna play nice and try to squeak out a 50.1% vs. 49.9% victory.

Personally, I prefer the former.

That said, I think the key stunt is tacky. If our strategy is, however to bait them into displays of faux outrage so that we CAN call them on it, the key stunt works perfectly.

You know, kind of like how the Repukes send up race-baiting dog whistles all over the place so that when we address them, they can accuse US of "playing the race card".

Think chess, rather than checkers.

[grannie4peace]

284. it could have been the timing of response

i agreed with clark & felt the media & others took this out of context & blew it out of . the facts need to be presented in a structured way that the media doesn't have control over the statements.

[Life Long Dem]

47. The public needs to know about McSames house gaffe

It's not anger. It's something everybody should know about McSame. This is to better inform the people. And if it gets attention then it did it's job.

[chieftain]

51. Its getting a boat-load of attention already and will continue to

Biden's best line on Saturday was the "7 kitchen tables" joke. THAT is the way to do it. Thats how you make it stick. Variations on a long-running theme, not one big stunt that can be horribly, horribly misconstrued into something disastrous.

[The Wizard]

125. The disgutsing Purple Heart Band-Aids

didn't hurt Bush, but the Republicans own the media and didn't express any outrage over these vile scumbags.

[YDogg]

128. exactly

[kenfrequed]

132. Sadly there is a reason

We do not have a media echo-chamber noise machine as effective as theirs. It is unlikely we will ever have one as good.

But this key jangling thing is absurd. It isn't even a good stunt and it will backfire.

I usually despise concern trolling but this is the real deal. If we do this, in the push for McCain to define himself as a veteran and war hero, this will blow up in our faces badly. I cannot imagine who might have thought this would be a good idea.

Why not pass out McBucks instead or something to represent how the Neocons have destroyed our economy and continue to seek to do so.

[The Wizard]

154. How about circulating invitations to

a McCane house party? Guess which house.

[kenfrequed]

212. Heh

yeah...

The Key thing was actually sort of a good idea. Unfortunately McCain's people got wind of it and pushed Mc-inane to giving this quick sob story about keys making him all pstd. A bit of political jujitsu. Turn a story about how fat a cat he really is into 'those mean ole libruls are picking on a vet.'

Though I would have to ask how much Mc-insane has supported vets with Ptsd in the past? Where were his votes. It would be a worthwhile question to ask.

[The Wizard]

248. Has McCane been treated for PTSD? (NT)

[Overseas]

159. EVERYBODY KNOWS about the houses already now.

Even friends of mine that don't follow politics much.

[bjobotts]

217. Yes & it wil B a constant reminder to how out of touch the corporate McCain is

[bjobotts]

224. Dems aren't taking your advice...they know better. It's truth not swiftboat.

[bjobotts]

227. Unlike theKerry deal came right out of McCain's mouth.It's how he really is

[rucognizant]

176. Vwey WIse!

Don't forget how................the Wellstone funeral backfired BADLY!

[Naturyl]

3. Perfectly said. Thank you x 100. Here's some info people need to see:

Tombstoned right-wing troll promotes key-jangling idea, encouraging DU'ers to support it:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Plan to use keys as an attack on McCain discussed before house gaffe:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

This is a BAD idea. Disastrously BAD. Don't be a part of this, and don't let it happen.

[Waiting For Everyman]

30. If the idea's a plant, then how are you going to stop the RW from

going ahead and doing it themselves anyway?

And I think "Mr. & Mrs. TV Viewer" in America would think McCain would look pretty pathetic, if the media got all in a twist about something like that. Frankly, it would be absurd.

But whatever. I can't go anyway, so it's nothing to me, you all do what you like. But conventions are or used to be, full of all kinds of demonstrations. They even used to wear goofy hats and demonstrate up and down in the aisles, through the whole thing. It was intentionally a show, after all - a show of feelings/support about various issues/candidates.

Just my opinion... there's a tremendous lack of any sense of humor, and way too much paranoia.

Shoot... you don't begin to know the foolish-looking things we went and did out in public, to stop the VN war.

But whatever.

[EV_Ares]

252. Good response and yes paranoia or whatever is with a bunch of these people, eom.

[cali]

4. well said, mirrorrashes

I'm solidly with you.

[DrDan]

5. well said . . . .

this is such a childish suggestion.

Feel-good politics at its worse - with no regard for the potential consequences.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

6. Completely & utterly agree.

[last1standing]

7. Couldn't agree more

Thanks for saying exactly what needed to be said.

K&R!

[WeDidIt]

8. YEAH, becauser the DNC is ALL ABOUT being nice to John McCain

Give me a fucking break.

And I don't buy you I'mthe son BS either.

[cali]

13. no, it's about not giving McCain a fucking break. And the stupid, stupid

keys "idea", gives him a big fat one. duh.

[bjobotts]

218. Nonsense.Old man with no pants screaming but I have medals...medals

[bjobotts]

220. Constantly using POW diminishes it 'cause it doesn't relate to the issues

[bjobotts]

222. Voted against min wage but has multiple houses. $5mil rich? Out of touch

[A-Schwarzenegger]

14. It's not about "being nice." It's about a losing & idiotic tactic. PLUS,

it will undermine the Houses gaffe, which is a gold mine.
And I couldnt care less who the OP is or isnt.

[Naturyl]

18. For the thousandth time, this isn't about being nice to McSame.

It's about having the simple good sense not to hand the Repukes a deadly weapon to use against us on a silver platter.

How anyone still doesn't understand this is beyond me. Do you normally give your enemies loaded guns?

[chieftain]

28. Why would I lie about using my fathers account?

If you do a search for my previous posts as mirrorashes and chieftain's previous posts you will notice a significant difference in the writing style. I'm at home visiting before I go back to school for the fall, and my account info is stuck on my computer up in Chicago while I'm with my folks down here in Florida. The email address to recover my lost password is long dead, so I either get Skinner to help me get my account info back while I'm briefly here on vacation or I just wait until I get back home to my computer where all my info is saved and I can log back in. Given the nature of what I just posted, I decided not to wait. Sue me.

Seriously, of all the issues raised in this thread, you think I have something to gain by deflecting criticism away from one username to another. Odd.

[proud2BlibKansan]

152. I certainly wouldn't be pleased if my kid logged in on my DU account

Also if you are in college this is likely your first election. I have been at this for over 35 years and if this wasn't my first week of school (I am a teacher) I would be in Denver. So I will defer to my judgment which tells me this is a clever idea which will drive home the message that this man is so out of touch with the American people he doesn't even know how many houses he owns. No one except for a few misguided freepers will associate keys with PTSD. And there is no way his campaign will complain since that will cause America to find out their candidate is unstable.

Just think this through and you see it is a relatively harmless idea that will likely get zero media coverage anyway. You all are creating the drama here.

Now sit back and enjoy the convention.

[EV_Ares]

210. Absolutely proud2Blib. How many more elections does it take before some of the

people realize you don't just sit back and hope you haven't upset anybody. That is what has happened with this part time and time again. First of all I doubt that the keys will make a huge difference one way or the other but they certainly are not going to do the damage that some of these people are talking about. Man they are way out of touch. I have seen don't give the media anything to make a big deal about. The media is not our best friend and you can't walk on eggshells around them.

I am glad this is Barack Obama's party and they are not afraid to do what is necessary to win unlike in the past.

I don't know if they are going to jingle keys or not but regardless it is not going to lose the elections for us. There are a lot of other matters that will take precedence over the keys. Jingle - Jingle.

[chieftain]

254. I'm no kid, and this is most certainly not my first election.

And obviously I would not have done it if I didn't have the go-ahead already. I made my disclaimer right off the bat, so pick on my ideas if you will, but don't condescend to me like a child. I'm not one of your students.

[pollo poco]

268. not so fast

I'm starting school this September, and I'm the same age as Barack.
So much for superior "judgment".

[Island Blue]

9. Agree 100%. n/t

[Arkansas Granny]

10. Very well said.

[liberal N proud]

11. I agree that we should be able to stop at the houses

But every-time he uses "former POW" to cover his lack of ability, we need to rattle those keys just a little. It is a door that he opens when he wants to use POW to his advantage in the campaign.

[pnwmom]

138. No, we shouldn't rattle them then, either.

That would only be seen as mocking his service, which is something that would backfire hugely on us in the end.

[Warren Stupidity]

16. So the houses are off the table too?

Age, senitlity, dementia - off the table.
Miserable military record - off the table.
That recent affair - off the table.
Calling his wife a cunt - off the table.
Keating 5 - off the table.

and now his uncountable houses - off the table.

[Naturyl]

23. No, for crying out loud, the houses are not "off the table."

How did you read that into the OP? Did it say anywhere that the houses gaffe should be abandoned? Nope. What it said was that the gaffe shouldn't be ruined and turned into a a weapon against us by this foolish key-jangling scheme.

[No Elephants]

24. Nothing is off the table. Nothing. Did I mention "nothing?" It's how

you make your point, not the subject matter. I love the "one house, one spouse" bumper sticker, for example.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

27. Actually, this Stupid Key Rattling Scheme would knock the Houses gaffe off the table.

[chieftain]

31. Exactly. The rest of it is all fair game.

But it will all be meaningless if we go through with this because it will give them a shield to protect against ALL of it.

YOU are taking those things off the table by pursuing this god-awful stupid idea. It will blow up in all of our faces and we'll be trying to explain our way out of it for the next 2 months.

Brilliant, really.

edit: oops, haha, that "you" is directed towards the generic "key-rattling is a good idea" folk and not the "you" this post is actually in response to, although hopefully that was obvious enough

[redqueen]

86. Precisely. More people should learn to play chess.

REALLY not hard to see what their next move will be, should some sadly misguided dems start acting like republicans.

[Life Long Dem]

60. The only reason they didn't say "seven" was off the table was they were too slow!

Obama beat their asses! And this is just too too big to stick!!

[kenfrequed]

140. The hell with that.

Drop the stupid friggin rovian key-stunt and put all that other stuff right back on the damned table.

[BaronChocula]

207. you are correct, sir!!!

I don't understand this "let's retreat before they fight back" so-called strategy. McCain had a response to his house gaffe... days after it happened. That's a serious miscue and this guy wants to be president. Learn how to fight!!!; go for the opponents throat and stick to your message. That's if you want to win.

The rest of you could sit around and wait for his next gaffe.

[Chan790]

272. No, the key stunt is off the table...

because it's childish and immature. It wouldn't even be effective. For all the hubbub about the band-aid, they weren't even effective...most Americans had no idea what they were or that they even existed. That was a tempest among the political-active and the blogosphere. That's it. Other than pissing off a lot of DUers and giving the freeps something to gloat about, they changed nothing, informed nothing, achieved nothing.

There are smarter and more effective ways to hit John McCain on the fact that he's an out of touch senile mentally-ill (to say he has PTSD is to admit as much) sexist sleazy crooked old fool who failed at the family occupation.

In fact, we have to do almost nothing because it's more effective as a whisper campaign...I've been doing this all week. I just casually mention the houses thing or the class-rank thing or Keating-5 or the "c*nt" thing or the background of his affairs in a larger conversation and give it no context...always within a few days people come back and ask their worst fear:

"Is McCain not one of us?"(a common American)
"Is McCain out of touch?"
"Is McCain senile?" "stupid?"
"Is McCain a lifelong failure?"
"Is McCain a crook?" "a liar?"
"Does John McCain not respect women?"

The seeds of an idea planted and fertilized and left to blossom in the imagination are scarier and more-real than anything we can say about John McCain. More devastating to his electability than anything we can do to John McCain.

I mentioned that he called his wife a c&nt in passing to someone who later saw the arm-sling and came back already sold on the implication/assumption that McCain beats his wife. I just shrugged. I mean...he might; I have no idea. That's one more person though who, being a survivor of domestic violence, will not be voting McCain.

[Peacetrain]

19. You have made an excellent point

I hope everyone takes the time to read your entire op. Think before you speak. That band aid stunt at the republican campaign backfired on some of the older vets at the VFW who were outraged and hurt that their sacrifice was being made into a political stunt.

We have ALWAYS been better than that. ALWAYS.

You just reminded me of the long term outcome of that prank.

The press will never be in our corner on things like that.

[chieftain]

44. Thank you!

I'm pleased by the reaction to this thread. And I notice noone has even attempted to explain how this actually helps us. It can do us nothing but harm, and therefore must not be allowed to happen. We are better than this. This is one instance where we must not let our anger over the past 8 years of torment cloud our judgment on the big picture--winning.

[chimpymustgo]

20. Wow. One of the most intelligent posts I've read here in ages. Thanks for the sanity.

[chieftain]

Thank you!

I appreciate the kind words. I just hope the overall point will resonate.

[TheCowsCameHome]

21. Agreed, no keys, unfortunately

that won't stop the scum on the right from smearing Barack with out and out lies and personal attacks every chance they get.

[finch96]

22. you are exactly right.

Regardless of the intended message, this will be spun in a very negative way by the media. Say and think what you want about the msm, but the fact of the matter is that negative press like this, regardless of truth behind it, is never a good thing. This is just shooting ourselves in the foot.

[No DUplicitous DUpe]

87. Exactly! "This is just shooting ourselves in the foot."

And a warm welcome to DU!

I'm guessing you have lurked for a while?

[finch96]

155. Yeah, lurked for a long time.

Years, in fact. LOL. I've lurked since 2003. Now THAT (the primary, the '04 election) was interesting. Whew.

Thanks for the welcome.

[Orsino]

25. I don't see the danger that you do...

...but I agree that the key gimmick is nearly as childish as the Purple Heart Band-Aids.

There are much better ways to make McCain pay a price for his wealth. The convention should feature a slide show.

[rebel with a cause]

237. "childish" is exactly what this is.

It would have perhaps worked in a union hall years ago, but not in a venue covered by the mass media. Not with rove ready to spin it and make it a weapon against us. We have to be strong but careful, we have to fight back with wit and wisdom but not with unnecessary drama, and we have to follow the example Obama is giving us. Don't sink to their level, make them rise to ours. It can be done. At least I hope it can be.

[midnight]

26. Your perspective is very serious. But maybe worth exploring.

Why would we allow a man with so much privledge and coddling since his pow experience to be in public office. Let him go home to his many houses. And another issue worth exploring, not all pows have even one house. And another more important issue, why would a symbol of keys to denote a greedy man be anything more. Let's focus on the many houses of John McCain. If you want to tie in other emotional issues, please tie in how many homeless vets would love to have a key to use to go to into at least one house. Now that to me is a serious subject that should be getting all the light of day we can shed.

[ErinBerin84]

29. agreed. It would be embarassing.

[Naturyl]

32. This thread needs more K&R's.

We need to do whatever we can to increase the possibility that somebody who can do something to stop this hare-brained idea sees this thread. Reportedly, the SEIU is sending "truckloads" of keys/keyrings to the convention. The key-jangling disaster could happen very soon unless it is stopped.

Anyone who has contacts at the DNC or SEIU should also get in touch with them.

[chieftain]

46. Thank you too--it was yours and others posts who raised my alarm on this

if we're to consolidate the real pushback to one thread I'm happy to carry it and hope that we can get this kicked to the front page but I want you to know you, Wolsh and Cali in particular helped me frame my thought process on the subject.

[Naturyl]

52. Glad to know the headache was worth something.

If an OP as clear and effective as this one was to some degree influenced by my efforts, then they were worth making. At times those of us opposing this foolishness were heavily outnumbered and the beat-head-against-wall factor was high.

I'm glad other sensible and reasonable people have stepped forward to turn the tide in favor of sanity, for the time being.

[chieftain]

56. I could tell. I hadn't been following the whole thing from the beginning...

but when I dug in and started reading I was really blown away and frankly horrified by most of what I was seeing. It was indeed your posts as well as the seemingly few others (luckily, our #s seem to have grown if this thread is an indicator) that led to my post. So I tip my hat to you and hope we can build on this. People need a serious reality check before we make a mistake of egregious proportions.

[Naturyl]

59. It's been going on for several days.

The first thread was actually before the houses gaffe, when someone mentioned the Salon article that said McCain dislike jangling keys due to his imprisonment. Even then, people were suggesting intentional key-jangling. The next thread was posted by a confirmed and tombstoned right-wing troll who was promoting the key-jangling idea as a response to the houses gaffe and encouraging DU'ers to support it. I've pointed this out a bunch of times in subsequent threads with mixed results. Some people don't seem at all fazed by the fact that right-wingers were inviting us to do this. They don't seem willing to put 2 and 2 together and realize that the right wing knows a potential gold mine when they see one.

[chieftain]

64. people should know about his instability...

but the way to drive that point home is definitely not by taunting him like he was back in that prison. mccain in prison = mccain winning politically. mccain in washington = mccain losing politically. this is something we need to keep at the forefront of our tactics.

ah well--keep it up, and I'll do my best as well. We can kiss our headaches goodbye when we prevail in November.

[kenfrequed]

216. I understand but...

Before we get too far into panic mode you have to keep in mind that McCain only came out with this 'keys rattling makes me cuckoo' after his people found out about the great key jingle. They knew a physical demonstration of how McCain has multiple mansions contrasting with the credit crunch and evictions of most people was a powerful punch. So they sought to undercut it and kung fu the damned thing.

It really intereferes too much with their painting Obama as some kind of elitist.

I half agree with you, I just want to be sure you aren't concern-trolling about to respin ANY tactical demonstration into oblivion. I have seen quite a lot of that here as of late.

I wonder if plastic baby-toy keys would work?

Message- we care about McInsanes mental health when he didn't give a damn about the troops access to healthcare and benefits.

[Grinchie]

182. If it happens, it happens

The world is an amzing and interconnected place. We can't have Nanny's telling the world what to do all the time, so why worry about it?

[hexola]

33. Agree - This is so fucking stupid, I cant even believe we're talking about it...

[Undercurrent]

34. Agreed!

We have enough of a hard time getting our message out. We don't need some stunt that will most definitely be misinterpreted by the MSM to make it even harder. It will backfire big time. Just look what they did with something as innocent as a fist bump.

This key thing should be squashed now.

[enough]

35. Correct. It was a stupid idea from the beginning. Heavy handed and not interesting.

[WinkyDink]

37. In my defense, I never knew anything about his PTSD and keys. Nothing.

[sunnystarr]

251. If he has PTSD then who would want him as President??

Certainly not the hand I would want near that red button.

[tomg]

38. Excellent post. nt

[Marrah_G]

39. Great post- I agree completely- This is a loser tactic

If Obama's camp doesn't put a stop to this sort of crap they will end up losing votes over it.

[chieftain]

73. I have to believe they will mobilize to ensure this doesn't happen.

Obama and Axelrod will know a trap when they see one. My hope is they'll get the union guys on the line and tell them to turn those trucks around asap. I can't imagine them allowing this to happen unless they are caught completely unprepared.

[spartacuslives]

41. a whole lot of roofs

I see your point about the keys and confinement. How about making the houses point this way instead: arms raised overhead like making the 'A' in YMCA?

[chieftain]

43. That's certainly better... but...

I sort of believe the houses gaffe is best played by not overextending on it. Don't try too hard to bury him with it or it loses its power. It works best in our favor by being a ghost that haunts him for the rest of the campaign, like the "100 years in Iraq" did. That one stuck for a good long while. This one will continue to stick and keeping it as a simple punchline to be brought up repeatedly, without it going stale, is the best way to play it.

We can make funny little jokes about it. We can use it to bolster the "he's out of touch" argument. But if we decide this is the end-all checkmate moment of the election and decide to go all-in on it it could lose its momentum entirely.

We've got a really good thing here and the best thing to do is let it take its own natural course. Its a running joke, and a great one, but its not a stake through the heart. Not yet, at least. It fits a narrative that continues to grow. Lets not squash it.

Most of that was just me thinking about it in general, btw, and not necessarily a commentary on your idea. I appreciate anyone trying to figure out alternative ways of exploiting this to the keys. The keys are a disaster waiting to happen.

[renate]

135. you're right about the keys and about the houses too

We don't want the "ooh, he has a lot of houses" thing to become overused like his "POW" excuse. I think it certainly could lose its momentum that way.

[savistocate]

179. So well explained and analyzed..I think of Coach Boone

in Remember the Titans getting Math teacher analysis of opposing teams plays, after viewing their videos. Since I just watched it last night after avoiding it hundreds of xs. Denzel!!! and the teams white coach was great too.

Bet many have not put keys together with prison. As we couldn/t use a small doll with a mechanical mouth chattering, w/ 'songbird' tag on it huh..kiddin'

[TexasObserver]

42. The keys are fine.

Much ado about nothing. Again.

The keys are fine. Please stop acting as if it is in any way connected to McCain's Hanoi Hilton guards. Can you reel it back in a ways?

[chieftain]

45. Its not me you have to explain it to.

Please remember most of the rest of the country will view it through a very different prism than you and I do. The intention is not to connect it to Vietnam, but I believe there is a saying about a road to somewhere being paved with good intentions...

[TexasObserver]

49. And I believe your excess concern is completely unjustified.

Seriously, is this the first year you've ever paid attention to politics? Your sensitivities seem to be better suited to more gentle activities. I reject your logic, such that it is, and I reject your ridiculous reach to connect rattling keys to being Hanoi Hilton guards. That's abject absurdity.

[chieftain]

58. Personal insults now?

Well, if we're going to go there, I could just as easily say that your clear lack of foresight on this would suggest that you have no understanding of how the game of political pr framework is actually played.

I'm telling you you're walking towards a cliff--its up to you to decide if you're gonna keep on walking or not, but remember, you bring us all down with you when you fall.

[TexasObserver]

66. I should have known you'd play the victim next.

You've given me your opinion, and it is my opinion that you're eaten up by your own fears. Unlike you, this ain't my first rodeo. I'll go with my opinion, not yours. I know mine is based upon experience.

[chieftain]

70. You attack, I call you out on it, you whine that I'm playing the victim...

Its actually a rather logical progression, though a silly one for you to be acting pompous over. This is what happens when you start a fight with someone--you make them the victim. Not that I care what you think, I just think the juvenility of your responses undercuts your claims of experience. Go ahead thinking that I'm somehow worthy of ridicule for taking this seriously though. We'll see real fast how things turn out if this stunt actually happens.

So--rattle your keys, read my OP again, and know exactly how I feel about you.

[TexasObserver]

74. I'll be rattling them for both of us!!

I'll be laughing and thinking about you having a fit!

[chieftain]

76. Sorry, no, I'm good, but you go right ahead rattling your toy keys for all the experienced, mature

students of political defeat out there along with you.

[TexasObserver]

77. I will NEVER forgive you for NEVER forgiving me for rattling keys!

rattle rattle rattle

[chieftain]

78. You do realize you're just allowing me to bump my own thread repeatedly

while we both do our best to make you look like a fool, right? 'Cause I could do this for a long while yet.

[TexasObserver]

81. Oh no!! The dreaded "you know you're bumping my thread" gambit!

I know you're making your father look look silly by posting a thread title like this one.

You might want to think about whether he would approve of you running off at the mouth under his account name.

[chieftain]

82. Thanks for your concern about my family situation.

I called him and let him know I had this thread going. He said "go get 'em."

He's a good guy like that.

[TexasObserver]

112. I've got spurs that jingle jangle jingle! Are spurs OK for taunting McStumpy?

Or are they also on your personal "do not fly" list?

[endthewar]

102. Keep fighting the good fight TexasObserver!

[TexasObserver]

113. Shhhh! Play dead. They'll lose interest and move on!

I never cease to be amazed at what some people here find to be outraged about. Every day is a new experience in Chicken Little hyperventilating.

[endthewar]

118. Agreed. I usually post one of these pictures to shut them up.

Just from googling "drama queen":





I always edit out the last one after a few minutes in case they alert my post.

[chieftain]

121. Thats awfully kind how you feel the need to "shut people up"

Rather than alerting your post, I'd simply point out that you make yourself look like a jackass sitting at the kids table while the adults talk business.

[endthewar]

123. Did I use one of those pictures for you when we were talking?

Nope. You were acting a little bit like a drama queen, but I wait until people REALLY cross the drama queen line. If you would have tried to link Obama to Hitler or something really absurd, then I would have brought it out.