Know what? I still think Hillary was the better candidate. Still think she would have won in Nov.

[Skip Intro]

Still admire the hell out of that woman.

I do hope all you Obama attack dogs get your fill of bashing one of our party's brightest stars in the next few days. DU, per Skinner, won't tolerate it after 6/11.




spellcheck spellcheck spellcheck

[Olney Blue]

1. She's a great American, and I admire her too!

[jasmine621]

4. ditto....nt

[DJ13]

2. If she was the better candidate she wouldnt have lost to a 1st term Senator

:eyes:

[Skip Intro]

We'll see how that plays out in the months to come.

[merh]

33. You are the one that needs to pay heed to the time limit

I want you around until November so you can appreciate the win.

I hope you don't try to continue these type of doom and gloom Obama posts until then.

[Skip Intro]

44. people see what they want to see I guess. My post was not what you describe it to be.

It was a tribute to Hillary, and a response to the jumped the shark, and then jumped back over the shark, and then jumped the shark again attacks on Hillary Clinton.

yeah, I think she would have made a better candidate. I didn't slam Obama. I praised Hillary.

Do you have any other gear than outrage?

[merh]

63. you could have posted a tribute to hillary

without any reference to obama attack dogs, that would have been a nice thing to do and a change for you

[Skip Intro]

66. Well take alook at this forum.

Please. The slamming of Hillary has been nonstop since Feb. It continues tonight. I took the opportunity to make a point. Still, the OP was a tribute to a great lady, despised as she may be here.

[merh]

68. LOL, just like the slamming of Obama has been non stop

it was the primary season - you think hillary is the better candidate and others think Obama is the better candidate. You argue your points and others will challenge you - your facts may be what you accept but they aren't necessarily the truth. Post stuff that can be debunked and it will be debunked.

[Skip Intro]

69. What have you debunked?

on edit: btw, the slamming of Obama here has been nothing, no where close, to the attacks on Hillary.

An honest apparaisal of posts here confirms that.

[merh]

70. In this thread, nothing.

Posts about hillary, plenty.

I don't agree with you that she is the better candidate.

I don't agree that she is the sterling example of THE feminist candidate.

I don't believe her campaign or her life is something women should emulate.

I don't agree she is strong or a survivor, I think her campaign was run as a campaign of the desperate and entitled.

Would you like details?

[Skip Intro]

71. Well, that's your opinion, not a debunking of anything.

You are more than welcome to your opinion.

[merh]

74. Those are my opinions.

They are not examples of how I debunked the facts that others used to support their opinions which were opposite of my opinions. That is why I asked if you wanted details.

It is your opinion that Hillary is the better candidate. I don't agree. I also am not sure she would be able to win in November. I still believe the operation chaos was just a cover story for the real goal of the ROCers, they wanted HRC on the ticket because they know they have a better shot at beating her. Again, my opinion.

[roguevalley]

121. yes. what a fine and conciliatory and uniting op this was. not.

[emilyg]

11. We'll see in Nov. how much confidence America

has in a first term senator.

[mcctatas]

12. psssttt.....

it works both ways after 6/11....

:shrug:

[Chulanowa]

41. Gasp! How dare you insinuate the rules apply to them?!

Just who do you think you are? THEY ARE ABOVE THE LAW!

[TahitiNut]

72. They're Bush-League

:shrug:

[stillcool]

36. Some of us are going to do all we can...

to make sure Senator Obama is the next President of the United States. Some...not so much.

[slay]

62. BURN!!

Soeriously - that was a good burn.. :rofl:

[BigBearJohn]

75. Your statement disses Obama. He is MUCH MORE than a 1st term senator.

or NOBODY would be voting for him.
Better re-examine your premise.

[BeyondGeography]

3. Too bad she didn't know how to run a campaign

[tekisui]

5. It is good Democrat attacks won't be allowed.

Here's to Hillary! She is an amazingly strong person, she never failed to impress and capture my attention.

As this race is winding down, I am going to miss it. What an amazing time.

[anonymous171]

6. That's your opinion and I respect that.

:hi:

[Skip Intro]

37. you, YOU, just floored me

really, you did

of all people

wow

:hi:

[ossman]

7. how caould she win if she cant even pass VP vetting cause of Bubba? Nobody was gonna bring that up?

[StevieM]

56. Please. There is no merrit to that. It is simply a hateful report put out by the Obama campaign

Way to build party unity, Barack.

If McCain brought that up it would have failed. That's why Obama never wasted his time on it, even as he ran the most hateful campaign of personal destruction in American history.

Steve

[NRaleighLiberal]

8. Yes, she would have beat McCain, most likely... But...she was not the better candidate.

Still, we are all entitled to our opinions.

[mcctatas]

9. I think it's great that so many people feel positive about Hillary....

the only problem is that so often, those positive feelings were only expressed by bashing Barack. You do of course realize that the Obama bashing and linking to noquarter will also have to stop after 6/11, right?

[genna]

10. Mo' love

:nopity:

[Big Blue Marble]

13. Why do you find it necessary to jab Obama supporters?

As far as the better candidate, I hope you heard David Gergen praising Obama's command of the VP
flap tonight on CNN. He spoke highly of Obama's management style, his competence and his composure.

Gergen who has worked for four presidents, three of them being Republicans knows his stuff and
he was very impressed.

Just watch and enjoy the process. Obama is going to be the brightest star in the firmament.

[hfojvt]

79. not all Obama supporters

just us attack dogs who hate the Tsarina.

[Warren Stupidity]

14. OK. She fought hard and lost.

Now lets all fight together against the Republicand. What say you to that?

[BlueJac]

15. Quit dreaming and join in

[Teaser]

31. I think Skip has joined in

and no one should quit dreaming.

[emilyg]

16. I will always admire her.

[SwampG8r]

35. emily no one wants you to change

one tiny piece of your admiration for senator clinton
or your belief in her as the candidate you supported
you did your best for her
i know emily
i still have the welts to prove it

but there has to come a time when we go after the lowlife dirty bastard that wants us to send our children to iraq for 100 years
that time by skinners watch is 12 noon 6/11/2008

in my heart emily i hope hillary returns to work for the party through the GE
she has been a strong advocate for so many causes
and we need her advocacy as time goes by
i wish her all the best so she can give us her best in return
just like i do you

[newmajority]

17. Are you going to retire this "bizzaro world" persona on the 11th, Skip?

Just wondering......

[jgraz]

18. I still think Edwards has better policy ideas

And he was a better candidate than Obama back in January. Obama passed him up as he grew into the role of front-runner.

That doesn't mean that Edwards wasn't deserving of criticism when he fucked up. Same for Hillary and same for Obama. They are politicians and that makes them OUR employees. We have a duty to jump all over them for their bad behavior. Doing anything else is unpatriotic.

[RichardRay]

19. I like my guy better, I've got no issue with you still liking your pick.

I think she could have won in November, too. And I think Barack will do just fine :-).

[Yukari Yakumo]

20. Neither will he tolerate things like "you Obama attack dogs". {nt}

uguu

[gulfcoastliberal]

21. Too bad her sense of entitlement kept her from developing a coherent strategy.

But if a sense of entitlement is an admirable trait, admire away!

[StevieM]

57. She never had a sense of entitlement, that is just a hateful smear by the Obamites in order to

tear down our fine former first lady.

Obama tried to win on the issues in 2007 and failed miserably, so he resorted to hateful slanders like what you just did. You are a good Obamite.

Steve

[gulfcoastliberal]

59. Guess the Globe & Mail is staffed by "Obamites":

The cost of Clinton's narcissism

Her dreams of the White House denied, her once powerful campaign reduced to lobbying for a vice-presidential nomination on her opponent's ticket, Hillary Clinton may never lay legitimate claim to membership in a political dynasty. But Ms. Clinton, along with her husband and the loyal circle of advisers around her, succumbed to the form of hubris that has felled many a dynasty past: an overarching sense of entitlement to the trappings of power.

Look back at the media coverage of Ms. Clinton's campaign through to the end of 2007, and the same words - "inevitable," "unstoppable" - crop up again and again. Ms. Clinton, or at least the men and women running her campaign, seem to have spent too much time reading their own press clippings. They believed that her experience, her fundraising prowess, and above all else her stature in the Democratic Party assured her of victory. Democrats owed her, and her husband, for the party's only two-term hold on the White House since the 1960s. It was unthinkable that they would turn their backs on her in favour of a greenhorn such as Barack Obama.

Consequently, Ms. Clinton's campaign was outworked and outmanoeuvred by Mr. Obama's. Never could Ms. Clinton, who worked as tirelessly for the nomination as any candidate could, be personally accused of laziness. But her efforts were crippled by a lack of imagination and of foresight. Up against what proved to be the sleekest and most modern nomination campaign in history, her strategists banked on name recognition and 1990s nostalgia.

Emblematic of these failings were Ms. Clinton's fundraising efforts. Adjusting to a new reality in which campaign-finance legislation limits large donations, Mr. Obama recruited members of the high-tech industry to fashion a record-shattering online campaign that helped raised more than $100-million (U.S.) in small personal contributions of less than $200 alone. Ms. Clinton, confident in the network of affluent donors and fundraisers who had subsidized her husband's campaigns, made little effort to update her methods. The result was that, despite raising more money than any earlier nomination candidate, she was unable to compete with her opponent. Ms. Clinton, outspent by ever-increasing margins as the race wore on, was forced to personally finance the latter stages of her campaign and to lead off speeches with unseemly pleas for financial support.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20080604.ECLINTON04/TPStory/Comment

I understand; facts for Hillites have a definite anti-Clinton/pro-Obama bias.

[sandnsea]

22. Well I still think Kerry is the best candidate

So what.

[MercutioATC]

23. She'd have been great about 15 years ago...not now. She's old politics.

I don't so much disagree with what she says (most of it), but the way she says it...and what that represents.

20 years ago, a candidate could fabricate a story out of whole cloth (like the "sniper fire" incident) and get away with it. Because the media had a 10-15 day turnaround time on following up stories, it would have eventually been proven that Clinton lied, but most people would have moved on to other issues by then and she would have gained from the lie. Today, the turnaround is less than 24 hours. Apparently, she doesn't understand that, so she feels O.K. about making up stories that make her look good. That, to me, calls into question both her honesty and her grasp of our current situation.

That's just one example.

I'll say it again. 15 years ago, she may have been a "bright star". Today, she's out of touch.

[abburdlen]

24. I admire her as well

She's a great advocate for America and the Democratic Party.

I had issues with her campaign but never had serious issues with her.

[TK421]

25. Skip...I admire your loyalty, but it is over now

and I will always admire Hillary Clinton no matter what. We do have a nominee that we really need to focus our efforts on getting in the White House. He does have one hell of a battle ahead of him, and he could use some support.

You have been a very loyal Clinton supporter ( as I have ) and I know how you feel right now...I was disappointed as well....but we need to move on and beat our common enemy here. Please...we could use your voice, as well.....

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

26. A better candidate who...

1. Was crowned the presumptive nominee two years ago;
2. Had the entire Democratic Establishment behind her;
3. Banked over $100 million dollars;
4. Had the majority of superdelegates;
5. Benefitted from her husband's record;
6. Faced a political neophyte and first-time senator.

A better candidate who:

1. Should have been the presumptive nominee but ran an abysmal campaign;
2. Lost the entire Democratic Establishment, most of whom defected to the unknown upstart;
3. Is currently in debt as much as $20 million
4. Lost the majority of superdelegates who defected to the unknown upstart for whom she was supposed to beat;
5. Exploited only the good aspect of her husband's record and ran away from the bad;
6. Lost to a political neophyte and first-time senator.

Sure, she was the better candidate! :sarcasm:

[tabatha]

27. I don't think she knows (as opposed to thinks)

that she is a strong woman.

If she had, she would not have resorted to lying, and if she had taken the high road, she would have won.

The lying was what was unpalatable.

[DearAbby]

28. Being a Democrat, Yes Clinton would have won

I have to disagree with you on being the better candidate...proof being, she lost the primary, Obama won.

[Teaser]

29. That's cool.

.

[silverojo]

30. And Skinner won't accept any whining from Hillbots, either

So what's your point?

[faithfulcitizen]

32. I still think Clark was better than Kerry. We'll never know what would have happened.

I worked my heart out for Clark, and I voted for Kerry. It was my solemn duty to do so.

[Name removed]

34. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[guruoo]

51. Wrong.

"We understand that not everyone will be prepared to immediately put the primaries behind us.
There will be some jerks on the winning side who insist on gloating. And there will be some
sore losers on the other side who will want to keep attacking the nominee. Once we have a
presumptive nominee, those people will have one week to get it out of their systems."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x6285770

[Skip Intro]

53. The poster who started that subthread has been TS'd.

He said we'd see in five days. I said we could see tonight.

We saw tonight.

[guruoo]

54. Seems they've already begun to tighten up the ship n/t

[billyoc]

84. We'll see in five days.

[moriah]

52. Just great. Really great. Do you kick puppies, too?

I came to DU in primary season. I was very, very hopeful that once primary season was over I might actually see more reasoned and intellectual discussions, or at least a "Let's kick some Republican ass" mentality. I don't want to see a "let's kick our fellow Democrat's asses" mentality any longer.

If things had been the other way around, would YOU want to see Obama bashing while you were trying to wrap your brain around the idea that you had to vote for her to keep us from suffering under Republican rule?

It's going to be hard enough to unify this party without bashing a person that many people here on DU like and respect. Bashing Hillary is not going to do anything good except make you feel better. It's not going to help our party. It's not going to help keep McCain out of the White House.

Be the bigger person. Let's focus on unity.

(Of course, if you are one of those who would have voted for McCain if Hillary'd gotten the nomination, then this is wasted breath, and you are no better than the idiots at Hillaryis44 and hillaryclintonforum who are selling out their party in the name of blind hate.)

Feel free to bash Lieberman, though. He's already proven that he's not a Democrat.

(Edit: Glad to see the post I was responding to was removed. I sincerely hope there is no one else who feels the same way as that poster. But I'm leaving this here, for anyone else who feels the way that poster does to read. Because I'm serious here. We need to unify, and bashing our fellow Democrats is NOT the way to do it.)

[Bread and Circus]

38. Yes, and on June 11 you will have to stop posting crap like your OP...

btw your OP is insanely hypocritical.

[Skip Intro]

39. elaborate?

[Fly by night]

40. Still believe in the Easter Bunny too?

Then post in and rec this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x3394133

[hokies4ever]

42. I don't admire her race-baiting one bit

This campaign has brought out her true self.

[Skip Intro]

46. Yeah, Hillary's a racist. Bla, bla bla. Did you forget your smiley?

Here, have this one.

:rofl:

[hokies4ever]

50. Does Hillary love black people as much as you do?

:rofl:

[Bodhi BloodWave]

93. while it might be splitting hairs

You don't need to be a racist to use race-baiting(I'm not sure I'd go that far but i was disappointed with some of her comments in that area )

[sfam]

43. Are ya saying, "You won't have Hillary to kick around any more..."?

OK...I guess that's probably true. But she certainly did her share of kicking, as did her supporters. Such is life in primary-world. I'm sorry your candidate lost - that's never fun.

[bluestateguy]

45. HIllary may very well have won in November

but she lost the primaries and caucuses. She will not be the nominee.

[Honeycombe8]

47. She showed grit & tenacity, that's for sure. But I think she would've lost the GE.

I also distrust her and don't believe some of what she says. She never fully explained why she voted for the Iraq War. I'm convinced it was a political vote, and I'm horrified that someone would vote for people to die because of politics, rather than what is right or the best thing for the country.

She failed to win the nomination, even though she had double the money, a couple of hundred delegate lead over the others, a hand picked team from among dozens of experts, "experience," and a huge lead in the polls. Even with all of that, she made serious errors that caused her to lose. That is an indication of lack in the leadership department, IMO. Imagine if we'd been negotiating for something serious w/another country, and we were holding all the cards.....and she still would've lost the negotiation.

[RB TexLa]

48. I do too. I hope we can win in November, but I have my bumper sticker ready.

[Leftist Agitator]

49. "DU, per Skinner, won't tolerate it after 6/11."

Nor will DU, per Skinner, tolerate any of the Rightist BS that the Hillarites have been incessantly posting against Obama after 6/11.

Just so you know.

As it is, I'm expecting a purge of 75%+ of the die-hard Hillarites who refuse to admit that it's over even now on 6/11. I hope that you aren't among that number.

[hendo]

55. Sorry, but the better candidate won.

That doesn't mean that she also wouldn't have beat McCain in November. I am just glad that I don'thave to hold my nose when I vote democrat this year.

[Douglas Carpenter]

58. I think either one would most likely win in November

So do the financial markets:

?contractId=173055&intradeChart=true&transBackground=true&transBackground=true

Intrade Predictons Markets are predicting a 63.2% chance that the Democratic nominee will win the Presidency.


So does the broad consensus of Political Scientist:

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/political_commentary/commentary_by_alan_i_abramowitz/can_mccain_overcome_the_triple_whammy

"The Electoral Barometer has predicted the winner of the popular vote in 14 of the 15 presidential elections since World War II. There were five elections in which the Electoral Barometer was negative and the president's party lost the popular vote in all five of these elections: 1952, 1960, 1976, 1980, and 1992. There were ten elections in which the Electoral Barometer was positive, and the president's party won the popular vote in nine of these elections: 1948, 1956, 1964, 1972, 1984, 1988, 1996, 2000, and 2004. "

"An Electoral Barometer reading of -63 would predict a decisive defeat for the Republican presidential candidate. The only election since World War II with a score in this range was 1980. In that election Jimmy Carter suffered the worst defeat for an incumbent president since Herbert Hoover in 1932. The second lowest score, -50, occurred in 1952. That was the last election in which neither the incumbent president, Democrat Harry Truman, nor the incumbent vice-president appeared on the ballot. Nevertheless, the candidate trying to succeed Truman, Democrat Adlai Stevenson, lost in a landslide.

The current national political climate is one of the worst for the party in power since the end of World War II. No candidate running in such an unfavorable political environment – Republican or Democrat - has ever been successful. If John McCain manages to overcome the triple whammy of an unpopular president, a weak economy, and a second term election, it will be an upset of unprecedented magnitude.

Dr. Alan Abramowitz is the Alben W. Barkely Professor of Political Science at Emory University, and the author of Voice of the People: Elections and Voting Behavior in the United States."

[Mz Pip]

60. I liked Hillary

for a while at least. I just like Obama more. I really liked Biden and think he could have won in November. But it is what it is.

We have a nominee and it is past the time to speculate who would have been better at kicking McCain's butt in November. We need to work together to make sure Obama kicks McCain's butt in November.

[99th_Monkey]

61. "Hillary would have won in November" WTF? Are you in a time warp?

HINT: This is June 2008, 5 months BEFORE the Nov. 2008 General Election.

[Occam Bandage]

64. Noted.

[Lerkfish]

65. "you Obama attack dogs"

:crazy:

[Endangered Specie]

67. clocks running on you too, sweetie.

[Patchuli]

73. We want party unity

Maybe you shouldn't refer to Obama supporters as "attack dogs." After all, we're supposed to all be Democrats here.

[pnorman]

76. What we need here is a GD-P (WW) Forum, until all this wailing & whining dies down.

"WW" is of course, Wailing Wall" (boo-hoo!):nopity: :nopity: :nopity:

If the "Clinton-bashers" outnumber the "Obama-bashers 2 to 1 (even that high is debatable), consider the fact that DU membership seems to be close to 8 to 1 for Obama. And then make the necessary correction. {Sigh!) I was REALLY hoping that this sort of snarky reply wouldn't have been necessary!)

pnorman

[Beacool]

77. Hillary would have won in November.

Even on Tuesday she was polling better against McCain than Obama, despite everything that was thrown at her.


Will Obama win? Maybe, maybe not.....

[onetwo]

92. Hillary "polled better" than Obama throughout 2007...

...yet here we are.

[Beacool]

116. Yeah, to quote Rendell:

The lesser candidate won.

[onetwo]

125. Yet, she couldn't beat the "lesser candidate" even with her attack machine on full tilt...

...and Obama's turned off and collecting dust somewhere.

By what criteria is Clinton the superior candidate, anyway? Obama treated her way too kindly; apparently, HRC supporters think Clinton had little or no negatives since Obama didn't bring them up. The reality is that Obama didn't hit Hillary one-tenth as hard as he could've (and the Republicans would've). If she couldn't beat Obama with kid gloves on, how could anyone think she would be the one better equipped to deal with the GOP and their brass knuckles?

[goletian]

78. shes out. get with the program.

[quakerboy]

80. I still think that Kucinich was the better candidate

As to November, well, I was pretty sure he couldn't win the nomination, much less the general which made for some conflicted innards. I suppose that if he had won the nomination, I would have been a lot more optimistic about November.

Since we are sharing and all.

[hfojvt]

81. once again an empty OP of Hillary praise

Why do you admire her and what makes her one of our party's brightest stars?

There's nothing in your journal either.

As Senator's go, she is somewhere above Herb Kohl, but does not stand out like a Ted Kennedy, Robert Byrd or Russ Feingold. As a Presidential candidate I would rather have had any of the others running except Gravel and she might be a toss up with Richardson.

I am just not seeing much there to admire. Unless you like phonies. There is no accounting for taste.

[StevieM]

83. I see so much to admire and I have never loved her more (eom)

[hfojvt]

85. care to elaborate?

because you just sound like a lunatic.

30% of the country think Bush is a hero. You have every opportunity here to convince me you are not as deluded as they are.

[StevieM]

86. Your words demonstrate the hatefullness of the Obama movement, which is a national disgrace

unparalleled since the days of McCarthy.

First, all I said was that I was proud of Hillary and that I loved her. That is the sentiment of millions of Americans. If you are not one of them, then fine. But those are not the words of a lunatic.

I'll admit that my words above could be called the words of a lunatic. But I believe them to be true.

Hillary has much better numbers then Bush according to Rasmussen's latest polls.

Steve

[hfojvt]

89. Fail

As expected.

You could have said something positive about Hillary. Instead decided to say something negative not only about me, but about a supposed Obama movement that I am supposed to be part of. Sorry, I just supported Obama as an A in the ABCD formula - Anybody But Clinton (Democrat).

So lots of other people voted for her, that doesn't make your statement any less irrational. What has she done to make you proud of her or to have tons of affection for her?

Why is it so tough to answer? Couldn't you even point to McCamy's latest thread and paraphrase it - because she promises to help elect a Democrat, because she persisted through a barrage of unfair attacks from Olbermann et. al.

Okay, much of that thread is based on expected future behaviour, but at least it would be a start.

If I was hatful, I coulda just called you a name and been done with it, instead of giving you an opportunity to prove my first impression wrong.

[EFerrari]

90. It's really too bad that you can't enjoy a moment the whole world

is participating in. That's got to be tough.

[rodeodance]

82. i agree Skip Intro. She is one heck of a gal with strong policies.

[hayu_lol]

87. They each won half the Dem party...

After all the insults and slurs against her...many of us will not, under any circumstances, vote for the guy who perpetrated such outrageous hatred.

Some of you will reap what you sowed.

[billyoc]

94. Agreed, they'll serve her well at her daughter's hedge fund consultancy.

[Political Heretic]

88. If she acts like a jackass during the general you'll damn well be hearing about it here.

If she doesn't full throatedly support the democratic nominee, then DU doesn't support her. It's no different than how DU treats Joe or Zell.

Hopefully, that won't happen and she'll find some way to put her personal ambition and sense of fury over denied entitlement aside. But if not, then she deserves and will receive criticism.

[EFerrari]

91. It's fine if you esteem and admire Hillary Clinton.

You don't need a license or anything. And I hope things do chill out here even before Wednesday.

[bowens43]

95. who cares?

You're entitled to your opinion even if it is wrong.

[JVS]

96. Harsh criticism of Lieberman was allowed in 2004. I didn't get a memo saying HRC was to be...

treated any better. If you're expecting this place to become a Hillary love-fest, I think you'll be disappointed.

[Lerkfish]

97. although, TECHNICALLY, lieberman ran as a non-democrat

so the rules might differ on that.

[JVS]

101. You're thinking of 2006. In 2004 he had not broken with the party at all and was heartily disliked

He was a contender for the nomination in 2004

[Lerkfish]

102. ah, thanks. I stand corrected.

[babylonsister]

98. Your attitude won't be tolerated, which I believe was Skinner's point.

So have 'fun' while you can:

http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/fullscreen.html?mode=m&year=2008&month=6&day=11&hour=12&min=0&sec=0&p0=179

[onenote]

99. i would've supported her if she got the nomination

And I, too, wish that certain posters would stop launching threads that gloat or attack HRC. However, I also wish that certain HRC supporters would stop launching threads that suggest that declaring Obama the presumptive nominee is premature or otherwise try to delegitimatize his nomination with silly arguments about cherry-picked popular vote when any popular vote total based on a five month primary season is non-reflective of anything meaningful.

[quaker bill]

100. There is only one valid test of this

winning the nomination. This is the test designed to arrive at the answer to the question of who is the best candidate. It is a long and difficult test, as it should be. All the test questions are known in advance, and it is simply a matter of who has done the homework, can deliver the answers, and scores the highest. Any other notion outside of this is a self-serving delusion.

[MadHound]

103. If she was the better candidate, she would have won

Hell, she started out with a huge warchest, the most endorsements, and the presumption that she would be the nominee. Yet she squandered all of these advantages and lost. Her campaign plan, front load the primaries, deliver big on Super Tuesday, and cruise into the nomination, utterly failed, leaving her broke and floundering about for money, and more importantly a Plan B. She never fully recovered from that huge mistake, and lost in the end.

Part of being a good presidential candidate is knowing how to run a campaign effectively. She failed in that, badly. Therefore she really can't be called the better candidate, since she lost.

I'll be happy when the eleventh comes around also, then we won't have to listen to anymore whiny, divisive bullshit being put out by the sore losers.

[chemenger]

104. WOOF! WOOF! WOOF! GGGRRRRR!

WOOF! WOOF! WOOF! (then bites Skip Intro on his backside)

[chemenger]

105. Please explain this to me ... if you believe that HRC is the better candidate

then why did she assemble such a poor campaign staff? Why did she run such a poorly managed campaign? How is it that she (by all accounts the presumptive nominee back in January) lost out to Obama? Why did she have to resort to "throwing the kitchen sink" at Obama?

Why do you think that she would make a better presidential candidate (and President) than Obama (who assembled a first class campaign staff and kept his dignity while campaigning against her)?

[greguganus]

106. Lee Mercer would have been our nominee if he had had more money. n/t

[Independent-Voter]

107. Hillary who?

[Orsino]

108. She would have won in November, for sure.

The GOP is selling stale biscuits this year.

While I think Obama will do better for the country, I don't doubt that I could have voted for Clinton, and could even have cheered her on.

[against all enemies]

109. Know what? I still think Obama was the better candidate. He will win in Nov.

That's the post you should have made.

[lojasmo]

110. You're welcome to your opinion ....

And you even have a few more days to express it here.

[Mudoria]

111. I believe she would have won myself. If she had run a better

campaign in the early months and gotten rid of Penn in December she would probably be gearing up for a November run. But unfortunately that's not how they did things....

[NC_Nurse]

112. And your point is?

We all know this is over. How about giving it a rest?

[Mass]

113. Good Democrats are bashed everyday on DU. Why should it be different for her?

Not that I approve bashing of good Democrats in general.

[SeaLyons]

114. Spot On!!!!

IT WILL NOT BE TOLERATED.....GET IT????????????????

Hillary Clinton - America's heroic champion.

[OzarkDem]

115. I agree with you

My opinion of her hasn't changed.

[not_too_L8]

117. Hillary=good... Obama=best

[Tommy_Carcetti]

118. You're more than welcome to that opinion. But as a GREAT Democrat and a GREAT man once said:

"Go ahead, fall in love, be for somebody . . . But when the primary's over, let's fall in line and bring the White House back to our party."

Now that the primaries are over, Senator Obama, like it or not, is our best hope and our only hope for bringing back some of the respect and decency our country lost over the past 7 1/2 years.

[ampad]

119. Per Skinner

You ass won't be tolerated pass 6/11 as well so eat it up with your flaimbait threads. I'm sure you are one of those that goes into every thread demanding people stop discussing Hillary and her lack of class. What we have here is hypocrisy.

[book_worm]

120. Well that's your opinion, and I think Obama is the best candidate

and will win in November. So let's drink on it.

:toast:

[bain_sidhe]

122. Where did he say he won't tolerate Hillary bashing?

the only thing his original post says is that he won't tolerate Obama bashing.

I've asked this question three times now, and I still have no definitive response. Absent a response to a direct question, I can only conclude that the Hillary bashing will be allowed to continue.

[krkaufman]

123. She might've won in November, but so might Barack ...

... and opinions, and that's what they are, will differ on that even past the election, I expect.

But a strategically larger number of voters have chosen the vision set-out by Obama as where they'd like to see the Democratic Party go, and I very much look forward to our putting that vision forward between now and November -- and bringing it to reality starting in January.

[southernjockey]

124. We will unite

We will stand behind Obama sooner than later.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

126. I concur and I will ALWAYS admire and support Sen Hillary Rodham Clinton

and I also admire Obama

[workinclasszero]

127. Hillary's 08 campaign will go into the history books

as the worst run campaign of modern times I bet.

She had every advantage you could have against a virtually unknown rookie Senator. Every advantage.

Big money donors, huge amount of super delegates, name recognition, a popular ex-president at bat for her,Bill and Hill pretty much controlled the whole democratic party.

And yet..

Not only did she run a miserable, divisive, race baiting, Rovian campaign, with the help of Rush Limbaugh and Fox "news", she lost.

I believe American dodged a bullet with the massive failure of the Hillary 08 campaign. Hillary Rodham Clinton wasn't capable of running a decent hard fought campaign based on issues. She ran a Bush/Rove campaign based on fear, war and racism. Again, just like Bush.

America is sick to death of George Bush, the republicans, and all those who act the way they do. We do want change, its not just a campaign slogan as Hillary found out.

I thank God she lost. Hillary would have been a horrible president and would have governed in the same divide and conquer manner as Bush.

Good riddance to Hillary and Bill.