I'm an Obama supporter and today, good job Senator Clinton

[CreekDog]

Regardless of how I feel about how the primary campaign was run, her statement today about McCain and Iraq serve as reminders to me and everyone else that even when we Democrats are fighting each other, that we are ultimately on the same side and that if she were the apparent victor at this point instead of Obama, that I would be much happier voting for her than either not voting or voting for McCain.

Today's statement (from CNN):

Clinton: McCain's '2013′ speech like 'Mission Accomplished'
Posted: 11:25 AM ET

From CNN Political Producer Alexander Marquardt
Sen. Hillary Clinton speaks at a town hall meeting in Portland, Oregon, Friday

PORTLAND, Oregon (CNN) - At a Friday night town hall in Oregon, Senator Hillary Clinton criticized Senator John McCain for his speech predicting victory in Iraq by the end of his first term.

"It sounded a lot like 'Mission Accomplished,' only postponed into 2013," said Clinton, referring to President George Bush's declaration less than two months after the Iraq invasion that major combat was over. "From my perspective, it's just more of the same. It's a continuation of the Bush policies that have been failures."

She also went after Bush for comments he made in Jerusalem on Thursday when he took a shot at Democrats — and many argue Obama — saying, "some seem to believe we should negotiate with terrorists and radicals," drawing parallels with appeasing the Nazis in 1939.

"I am very offended by President Bush's remarks which seem to suggest that Democrats are the equivalent of Nazi appeasers," said Clinton. "That was way out of line and really outrageous and should be rejected out of hand."

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/05/17/clinton... /

[musicblind]

1. Nice post. I gave it a rec!

As this primary season comes to an end would should remember that in the end Hillary IS one of us, and Obama IS one of us, and we are all on the same team. It is US verses THEM and we shouldn't forget that. We may have different ideas of how to get to those goals, but we all have very similar goals.


*hug*

[Douglas Carpenter]

2. recommended..........best post all day!

[Forkboy]

3. Yup. It was nice to see all the Dems rally around this and stick it to Bush.

Their tactics are going to backfire, and those tactics are the only ones they know. They won't even try to adjust, and will get trampled in November.

[CreekDog]

5. Bush and McCain ganging up on Obama and Democrats to call call us "appeasers"

really reminded us all that the folks like Bush and McCain, who compare fellow Americans to friends of Hitler are the real enemies of all free people.

[eridani]

11. Hope we can keep it up--

--instead of fragmenting again like a ball of mercury dropped on the floor.

[DerekJ]

4. 5th Rec

[hokies4ever]

6. I'm waiting for Hillary to attack McCain/Bush

with the same passion as her, "Shame on you Barack Obama" ordeal.

[CreekDog]

8. i want her to be herself attacking them

and today was just fine.

no theatrics necessary, i find Hillary to be more persuasive when she is her understated and precise self.

[eridani]

12. Oh, come on. Her statement today was at least a start

We need to encourage more of that sort of thing and not piss all over it.

[hokies4ever]

23. You could tell that it was gut-wrenching for her

to actually say something decent about Obama.

[eridani]

32. I don't care how she feels about it. Only concerned about on-going good behavior n/t

[hokies4ever]

38. How she feels about it is important

because EVERYBODY will question the sincerity of her remarks considering what she has said about Obama during the primary season. If someone asks her if Obama has passed the commander-in-chief threshold and she gives an answer lacking in both passion and substance, it won't be helping the Democratic Party.

[Evergreen Emerald]

40. You have such a short memory

She was attacking Bush at the beginning of her campaign until Obama started attacking her.

YOu need to get your facts straight.

[Brundle_Fly]

7. I can kick this...

Rec too!

:peace:

[Hope And Change]

9. Kudos to Senator Clinton!K & R!

[anigbrowl]

10. Not to be critical, but...

am I the only person that finds the response a bit pollyanna-ish? I have no quarrel with the sentiment or indeed the delivery, it's just a bit flat. Ms. Browl and I don't think she's too hot in the rhetorical department.

[cornermouse]

13. So now Hillary is not the embodiment of all evil out to destroy

the world as we know it? She never was. You and others here, perceived her as being in the way of the ascension of Obama to his rightful place in the universe and "re-made" her into what you wanted her to be. The "faults" you were attributing to her were your own. Some day, in the probably not too distant future, you and others here are going to look back and be ashamed of what you've said and done.

[CreekDog]

14. i never did and most people here didnt think that

and some folks got so mad that they did say she was evil incarnate.

and some of you got so mad about Obama that you went overboard too.

[cornermouse]

15. Baloney.

It began when the DNC started pushing people out of the race before it even began back in December and January. It continued when those who liked Obama started showing the same zeal that you usually only see in pentecostal churches. And then there was the slashing and trashing of anyone who stood in Obama's way or whispered even the mildest criticism. It didn't matter who. I saw things written about Chelsea that I had previously only seen when Free Republic articles were posted here for ridicule or from the big mouth hard core right wingers on tv. When it was rumored that Elizabeth had stopped John Edwards from endorsing Obama the outrage and nastiness flew non-stop for at least a couple of days. And then there were all the "Edwards better get his rear in front of a microphone and endorse or else" posts.

My beliefs have never changed. Obama doesn't have enough experience on his resume' yet if I say it I can expect to be attacked and called racist. Contrary to what you think, the Rev. Wright thing will come up again. It will be used as a whip on republican and independent voters. Obama's ill-thought-out statement about rural voters will also be used on the right voters by the RNC. I've thought about it quite a bit. I don't think Obama will be able to win the G.E. I really don't.

And now, since I apparently have a chick that has just hatched out in the incubator, on to more important things.

[CreekDog]

17. when did i do the things you refer to?

i mean you were asking me and i said i didn't and you said "baloney" in response.

so let's start clarifying.

and by the way, i'm not Pentecostal anything, you might as well call me Jehovah's Witness before you call me Pentecostal.

[cornermouse]

25. I can clearly remember your name attached to some

highly inflammatory posts. For some reason, creekdog was a nom de plume that stuck in my head. And as far as pentecostal? You have mis-stated what I said. And I quote. "It continued when those who liked Obama started showing the same zeal that you usually only see in pentecostal churches." I stand by that statement.

[CreekDog]

28. find the quote now where my "name is attached..."

(on edit: i'm editing my post because i don't want to return to you the same kind of language you've foisted on all Obama supporters, albeit accusation without evidence)

[quickesst]

18. Fact....

"My beliefs have never changed. Obama doesn't have enough experience on his resume' yet if I say it I can expect to be attacked and called racist."

This has been the wind beneath the wings of support for Obama. Take away this trump card, and Obama would have been finished long ago, and for the very reason you state, not because of a group's ability to find a racist in an empty box. I find any positive remarks concerning Clinton from the O fans hollow in their sincerity, just as I find their offers of reconciliation for the "good of the Democratic Party" hollow. They will still hate the Clintons, they will still hold the faulty, and outrageous opinion the Clinton's are racists, and they will still display ridicule, and disdain for Clinton supporters. It will only be on hiatus until, and if, Obama wins the GE. I'll vote for the Dem nominee, but it will be because the alternative is unthinkable. I will harbor no illusions that Obama fans are sincere in their offers of reconciliation. It will be phony, and done only to secure the election for their chosen one. Expect a return to the norm that has dominated DU for the past few months shortly after November. It won't be any more pleasant for a Clinton supporter then, as it is now. Thanks.
quickesst

[CreekDog]

20. this is nonsense

i didn't support Obama until I was convinced that he was much more than a great speaker and much more than a victim.

[Life Long Dem]

35. I disagree with your view of experience.

Where does experience stand while in uncharted waters? That's where good judgment and a level headed person comes in such as Obama.

You have to ask yourself whether someone will be calm and level headed as JFK was with the Cuban missile crisis? Or do they start yelling off remarks about obliterating Iran if they think twice about building nukes?

I didn't see experience or good judgment come into play when Hillary sent Bush to war with Iraq. McSame may have better judgment than Hillary but I don't see that he would be level headed or calm in hot situations.

Having strength and showing it, is all good, but where would we be if JFK wasn't calm over a missile crisis situation?

I could see Obama is level headed and has great judgment. For anyone to stay cool headed and calm over Hillary throwing everything including the kitchen sink at him while he held back from a first round knockout on her, tells me everything I need to know about Obama and whether he can keep his cool and be calm in hot situations. Obama's judgment over recent issues is seen in his press conferences. Peace.

[sniffa]

24. Here's a nice thread by an Obama supporter

and some can't help but to insert themselves in it and crucify themselves.

Yes, we get it - those nails in your palms are being hammered relentlessly. On behalf of all Obama supporters, I apologize for making you do this to yourself.

[cornermouse]

26. Whatever.

[CreekDog]

29. editing this post too, i hate that in my anger at you that i shot back

the point of this thread has been demonstrated.

just because you come here and do the equivalent of providing particularly loud and particularly odious flatulence, i am not going to accuse you of anything except saying exactly what you have said here and now, which is all the accusation really needed to make you look worse than you probably realize that you do.

[DFW]

16. First off, I agree with the OP completely.

Second, I'd like to agree with a long-time Democratic activist and public
servant I met a couple of days ago (DNC, not DLC, as was surmised in another
thread), when he said that in this media age, we tend to "fall in love" with
candidates of "star quality," and then go crazy when they have trouble winning
the GE, where someone progressive but uncontroversial, like Sen. Chris Dodd,
would have sailed to a landslide victory in November.

Nonetheless, that is where we are today, and IF we are careful with how we
form our message, we should still win in November. I am not as pessimistic
as some that Obama will be a losing prospect, but I am not so confident as
to think he has it locked up. The same Republican spin machine that got us
Bush Lite twice is still intact, and the RNC not only has 5 times as much
money in the bank as the DNC, but they also have Fox Noise and National Hate
Radio out there doing their job for free. We need George Lakoff to spot verbal
attacks and help us counter them, and Howard Dean to continue the 50 State
Strategy ("no state left behind"). Most of all, we need to GOTV and NOT become
complacent when the nominee is chosen and all this infighting is history. The
election will not be over after the Denver convention, and anyone who thinks
otherwise is helping only Karl Rove and John McCain.

[CreekDog]

19. i think Obama won all those small states not due to star quality

but because he paid some attention to them, he didn't write them off, he said to those beleagured Democrats, hanging tough in red states, "I need you". Meanwhile, Hillary's campaign was telling them they were insignificant and not critical in November (ask our Senate and Congressional candidates if they agree). So then, big surprise, she starts losing those states even bigger than before.

the thing that Obama did was to tell us that if we want him to win, we have to do it, he can only do it if we provide the support, the volunteers, the resources.

Obama re-introduced "we" into a political debate filled with "you's" and "I's".

Tweety has only said two intelligent things in his life, here is one of them:

That all great politicians know that the way you build loyalty is not by doing things for people to gain loyalty, but by asking them to do things for you.

Damn straight and that's what Obama did. In a time when nobody believes a politician when they say what "I will do" all Obama really did was show that he was listening and that we held the reigns, he explained why he had to listen to us.

And when he could have gone totally negative and totally attacked --he just didn't, not because of any moral reason, but because it would've undermined his own message which he knew was key to his success.

[DFW]

21. yes and no

Perot made a big stir in 1992 with hie "this is not about me" line. It
worked for a while, but only up to a point. Obama had (and has) far better
strategists than Clinton did, that's a given. But his message, while delivered
by by the best political orator in a generation (star quality), still is general,
and needs to be fine-tuned in order to win the general election. It's nice that
he won primaries in many states with small Democratic minorities, but if the
Republican majorities in those states can't be reached, then it doesn't matter
how many of them he won in the primaries. The strategy for success in the primaries
must be replaced with a completely new and different strategy for the general election.

It might work, but the formula must be changed to adapt to the winner-take-all rules
of the general election. Otherwise, it won't matter how many primaries he won. If the
message doesn't connect with more than just us, then we go down.

[CreekDog]

22. those states sure as hell matters if the Dems show up and elect congresspeople

[DFW]

37. "Necessary but not sufficient," as they said on the SATs

Dems have to show up in such numbers as to give us a majority.
49% in States where we used to get 32% is encouraging, but not
enough. Get us 51% and THEN it sure as hell matters. We'll need
EVERY Hillary supporter AND every Obama supporter plus independents.
It can be done, but it's not a sure thing. I'm just glad it's not
impossible.

Like Dick Gregory used to say in his speeches (and MAN did he ever
give some great speeches), "you've got a big job ahead, a BIG job!"

[Straight Shooter]

30. Very nicely summarized and stated, DFW.

Obama may well morph into something unrecognizable to those drawn to his stage presence, his "charisma," as he shapeshifts to conform to the general populace and its "mainstream" preferences.

As for his oratory, it's a little too purple prose for me, a little too touchy-feely with buzz words and boilerplate rhetoric. Give me Calvin Coolidge's style anyday. The less said, the better.

Coolidge was both the most negative and remote of Presidents, and the most accessible. He once explained to Bernard Baruch why he often sat silently through interviews: "Well, Baruch, many times I say only 'yes' or 'no' to people. Even that is too much. It winds them up for twenty minutes more."

http://clinton4.nara.gov/WH/glimpse/presidents/html/cc3...

[DFW]

36. I don't mind his oratory as long as he backs it up with substance

If it's his oratory that gets him into office (I'm assuming
he is the nominee, here), that's all well and good, but it
must be followed up with the same competence shown in the
organizing of his campaign. We can't afford another Jimmy
Carter administration, well intentioned as it was, if it
leads to another Reagan. Reagan was an absolute disaster
for our country, I don't care how PC it is to mention his
name these days. I have to choke down the bile every time
I fly into Washington's airport wrongly saddled with Reagan's
name (to those of us who grew up near D.C., it will ALWAYS
be National Airport).

But the best intentions of mice and men, and all that. I'd
obviously prefer a get-nowhere Obama administration to a
do-damage McCain administration. But there is some major
damage control waiting to be done by the next administration,
and if the next president is not a Democrat, that damage will
not be repaired, but worsened. I will not be impressed if McCain
installs solar panels on the White House lawn if he appoints
another Supreme Court justice who thinks the Spanish Inquisition
was an idea with merit. If Obama gets elected, he has the chance
to follow through on his rhetoric, or get bogged down in it. He'll
need some very competent help if he's to follow through with it.
He was editor of the Harvard Law Review, so he's not lacking in
smarts. Neither was Carter. He has the chance to be great, just
as he has the chance to be mediocre, or be such a weak candidate
as to not be elected at all. The nomination is just the first
hurdle. The world will not be saved just because he is our nominee,
and I suspect he is a lot more aware of that than some of his more
vocal advocates--which, if true, is in itself grounds for optimism.

[Straight Shooter]

39. My understanding from listening to others is that Carter became hamstrung by his own arrogance.

In all fairness to Carter, though, he did not master the "silver tongue" bamboozling rhetoric as Reagan did. Also, the vile manipulation of Iran/Contra significantly added to Reagan's appeal. That was my first lesson in how absolutely wilfully ignorant the American electorate can be. I despise Reagan and I am halfway hoping to go to hell when I die so I can walk up to him and slug him for what he's done to America.*

I do think an Obama administration will be a series of one step forward, two steps back. I'm not looking for any change to occur, I'm just looking for a slower descent into the abyss.

I enjoy your comments. Thanks for posting!

*(Just kidding. I don't believe in hell.)

[KSinTX]

27. K&R

These are her rightful targets and opposition. Keep up the good work!

[TZ]

31. Very classy Creek Dog

You set a good example here in the cess pit of GDP. If more people were like you this forum would be an awesome place.

[CreekDog]

42. you're too kind

[DU GrovelBot]

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[sfaprog]

34. I'm sorry to point out the hyporcisy in all of this, but...

wasn't it Clinton who accused Obama of being nothing but words and speeches, and said that it was actions that should be the more determining factor? I think we all know how Clinton voted when the chips were on the table with Iraq. And if she regretted that vote, why did she also then push the Kyl/Lieberman phony run-up to war with Iran?

Actions speak louder than words. It's very easy politically to jump on the anti-Bush bandwagon these days. It was harder to stick with your conscience (so eloquently expressed by Leahy at the time) then, and she obviously failed, with disastrous results she now wants no part of.

[CreekDog]

41. it's far better than nothing

and part of uniting the party is seeing the common ground we have with people in the party that disagree with us.

and our common ground is that despite all that, we have more in common with Hillary and her supporters, much much more, than with McCain or with people who would like us all to stay home rather than vote.