Radio Lady: Hillary Clinton has been verbally lynched and some of the perpetrators are right here.

Hillary Clinton has been bled, drawn, and quartered... even assailed for her clothing.

I used the word "LYNCHED" last night on the DU. I'm changing that to VERBALLY LYNCHED and sticking to it. In order to defeat a candidate, the populace has come up with the most disagreeable and divisive arguments one could ever imagine. To repeat what I said in another thread, I hope the people here will agree with me that verbal lynching of Hillary Clinton has been mortifying to watch.

This goes right to the top of the journals of some of the best read DUers. People whom I believed had maintained their composure and their honest perception -- have been drawn in and have now exhibited about the most disgusting repartee I could imagine. I don't have to go to the Right Wing sites. We have the worst possible behavior -- short of REALLY LYNCHING -- either or both of them.

I thought former presidential races were ugly, but this is BY FAR the ugliest I have ever seen. If we were all in a room together, would people act this way, and call EITHER of the two frazzled participants on the things that were mentioned here over the months?

The Democratic Underground has only served to underscore the ugliness. I'm not sure what could have been done to ameliorate this race, but it's the first race I've viewed as a on-line participant. 2004 was pleasant compared to this.

Good luck to you, DU. Eventually, I will be uncoupled from this election -- and despite all of the good, understanding, and thoughtful people here, I am maintaining a reasonable distance from this place until after the summer.

Cordially,

Radio Lady in Oregon

has been unfairly attacked at times. But just was when people say "verbally raped," I think it is offensive to use a term which has a very specfic, horrific, historic meaning in this way.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Uh, she may not be a racist in her heart, but she is blowing the racist whistle.

But Mrs. Obama saying early in the campaign that Black Americans would "come home" wasn't? Now that they have "come home" and are voting in a virtual block, just what is that?

Remember when the GOP and the MSM, through the use of half truths and partial statements, turned Gore into a serial liar and exaggerator? Remember when Kerry was turned into a war criminal? And Max Cleland into a traitor? Remember those things? Now, by cherry picking words and phrases and extrapolating out of context, the Clintons have been turned into racists - by Democrats. I think you know this isn't true, but you're willing to borrow the racist charges to bolster your own candidate. Apparently, Senator Obama can't be good unless Senator Clinton is bad.
I wonder what admirable attribute of Sen. Obama's is going to be turned inside out and used against him. It should be interesting.

Given the Clinton's history, I actually assumed it was just clumsy phrasing but it sure as hell sounded racist.

I was horrified at the phrasing and embarrassed enough to rewind and watch it three times. And I don't care how or upon what basis anyone wants to defend it, it SOUNDED as if they were equating hard work and working class values exclusively to white people.

I realize Hillary is running short of cash, but it can't be that expensive to hire an intern with some college to vet the speeches.

It's ok to say 91% of blacks voted for Obama but it's not ok to say that white working Americans are voting for Clinton.

Stop race bating.

--presumably even idiocy.

because she has insulted them.

And I think you know it. However, people who said they were speaking for Black Americans told them she had said something insulting. For example, when she said that it took President Johnson and Martin Luther King together to push Civil Rights legislation through Congress, people who deemed themselves spokesmen started shrieking that they were insulted because Rev. King could not be referred to by a white person. And NOBODY told them they were full of crap. NOBODY told them that Rev. King belongs to all Americans. Now, THAT was insulting, and I haven't gotten over THAT!

why did Charles Rangel , a HRC supporter, call her out on it?

Obama "Race Memo" proves it.

that is why they voted for him. Can you blame them Black pride. They have been voting for the white guy too long. I just bope he doesn't do what so many black successful people do and forget the people that put him there. I remember so often when blacks have been pushed aside by blacks. Time to reach down and help them up. I hope he does. Time wil tell.

Obama is white. Black people have been voting for white folk for a long time.

Do you also remember when whites have pushed whites aside and refused to help them?

If Obama becomes POTUS, it will not be because of black Americans. The combined effort of Americans will put him there. The millions of Americans who are tired of the status quo.

I have black pride (a few other prides as well)but I feel it's an insult to assume my vote for Obama will be because of his African Father. BTW, I voted for John Edwards in our primary.

Geeesh

downhill from there. She even had people wondering about her reflections on the day MLK died (at the remembrance in Memphis). Had people wondering is this another sniper fire story. I voted for Bill, and was prepared to vote for Hillary..until her campaign discounted me.

The MSM? Fox News? Would you have noticed those comments if they had not been presented in a context designed to make them look questionable?

The Clintons have never discounted anyone. You have been misled, and not by Clinton.

Just checking, 'cause it's hard to tell here these days. An Obamite might very well write what you just wrote and actually mean it.

I bet not.

The Card Clinton Is Playing
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...

Someone else is not afraid to say it!





It's rare that a thread here makes me smile lately, but this one does. It almost makes up for the crap I read earlier today.

the supporters who are behind the "fucking whore", don't have a leg to stand on with the sexism charges. That's just the normal, everyday reference used for a woman. Got it. It's funny, not really, that I now view Obama fans in the same light I see hard-core Bush fans. They too sincerely(or not) believe their "leader" was the savior, though he too, did not have a background suggesting this to be true. Different clothes, same delusion. I keep wondering why it took so many supposedly intelligent people almost sixteen years to recognize the Clintons for the racists Obama fans percieve them to be, much less DU members who have been conversing with Hillary supporters for as many years, yet did not have the intelligence, nor wisdom to see the inherent racism in these people until now. That's because it didn't exist until Obama fans realized it would be their greatest weapon in this campaign. And they never stop reminding Clinton supporters every day, through their expressions of hatred, that they will not need their votes in the fall if Obama is the nominee. His fans, and the republicans who have set their own brand of racism, and disdain for anything liberal aside will be more than adequate to defeat McCain in November. Thanks.
quickesst

she has been unfairly 'assaulted' because she lost. Had she won, the primary would have been just fine. Barak Obama's sin is to beat Clinton. How dare he?

countless times here on DU.

Obama hasn't sinned by beating Clinton. But his supporters here have often been guilty of a discouraging level of sexism and misogyny.

Here's from an AP story over the weekend:
"One of four remaining undeclared SC Superdelegates, Wilber Lee Jeffcoat, has declared for Obama. He cites Clinton’s recent “hardworking white people” comment as one of the factors in his decision."
So, you folks can argue all you want about whether the comment was racist, or how racist it was, but the people who are deciding this election didn't like it.

I am sorry you see only one side of it.

If we were all in a room together, would people act this way, and call EITHER of the two frazzled participants on the things that were mentioned here over the months?

a fight might even break out and we will end up in total chaos, so,
remember that next time.

Distort, twist, hijack and then verbally lynch.

n/t

The answer is, in one of them, there is no lynching.

I realize it is meant metaphorically, and I suppose "lynching" is supposed to depict a mob-like action on a discussion board, meaning mostly that there are more people arguing for Obama than Clinton, and they are pretty strident about it.

This doesn't match your depiction-- which sounds more like a wrestling match. Perhaps a verbal full-nelson?

The idea of having Hillary Clinton as the presumptive nominee was highly flawed to begin with. The main problem was that a great many Democrats (that is to day, silent Democrats who didn't vote, who are now actually counted in the party) did not like the Bill Clinton presidency. Clinton won the first election with 42 percent of the vote. He won re-election mainly because Republicans put a poor candidate up against him: Bob Dole had lost his bid for the presidency three times already, and was older, not better in '96.

You, whoever you are, are making up a false argument. Are you a troll trying to stir things up here? You certainly aren't a sensible person.

I've seen vile crap from some folks here who say they support one or the other remaining Dem candidates, but comments on DU do not win/lose elections.

And the word "lynching" used in the context of a political campaign, minimizes the horror of real lynchings where real people died. You know better than to use such a loaded word in this context, or at least I thought you did. If Hillary is not on the ticket, she gets to return to the Senate and her houses in Georgetown and Westchester and lives on to enjoy the millions she and Bill have amassed since they left the White House. Her life is far from over.

And you compare that to real lynchings that have occurred even within your lifetime? Really?

still speak of the horror of those times...and of the lynching.

one group's suffering to negatively compare it with another.

My birth father perished in a concentration camp. My grandmother was beaten to death in front of the family. Three uncles shot to death. My infant brother killed.
I could blame all my failure on the past. I chose not to.

Under my bigoted exterior (as described in turgid prose by several very animated DUers here), there beats a heart of gold... really.

Your story sounds even worse than that of Anne Frank.

I wish you well for all the rest of your days.

Cordially,

Radio Lady in Oregon

its not like Hillary can't go home to one of her nice comfortable mansions
when this is over and sit and count her pots of gold.

Further, some Hillary supporters here seem to not know what a lyching is, they feel so much
pity for Hillary.

Clinton. They want her to lose her Senate seat and to be kicked out of the party. They hope that she is bankrupted by her campaign debts and that no one in the party or out comes up with a plan to pay off those debts. They want to make her a pariah in every way.

Anyone looking objectively at her Senate record, her hard hard work there, and the respect she has gained, even from Republicans, would know that she deserves better treatment than that. Whether you like it or not, this is lynch mob mentality.

... but it is lost amongst the "Hillary has been lynched" hyperbole.

To pine for rational discussion but at the same time use such loaded terminology is, literally, laughable.

If Joe lieberman can claim that McCain is the reform candidate, I suppose Radio Lady can claim that it has all be Barack's fault, and that the INEVITABLE ONE is totally fault free.

I don't condone this but she brings stuff like this on herself.. and you or I cant stop someone freedom of speech, so stop whining about t.

Is that what you are saying?

Cry about it when people respond harshly just screams lame.

I think "Saturday Night Live" did a pretty good job last night without our help.

it's happening from both sides-the ugliness...just take a break for a couple of days and come back we need you here-even this Obama supporter...shall I say this DEMOCRAT
SFJimmy

Ditto.

that would be me and the members of my home. I am a wife, woman, mother, stepmother, grandmother and stepgrandmother. I have been a lifelong Democrat (except for a vote for Republican William Weld for Governor in Massachusetts a long time ago).

I have my own battle scars in this gender and racist fight. Believe it or not, my Judiaism raised a great deal of hostility. (Oh, perhaps I'll get the argument that Jewish is not a race. Tell that to the people who sent me pictures of myself with a large nose and dollars in my fists.) Ironically, I NEVER earned as much as the men who were doing the same job for the same numbers of hours I did it.

See my OP for the places that hired me and where I fought tooth and nail to be "the first" of my gender to do what I did.

Gratefully, the owners of the stations where I worked demanded more decorum and civility than the MSM today -- and although there were BRUTAL verbal fights, I'm glad I got to do what I've done.

Cordially,

Radio Lady in Oregon

the holocaust against Clinton? the shoah against Clinton?

maybe because that would be shameful too?

Have you seen the Hillary cartoons posted here?

I can only hope that Hillary's life will be put back together in one piece and that Sen. Obama will be able to fight off the slurs and downright horrible comments and innuendoes from every corner. That will come about as soon as he is fully nominated and as surely as I am sitting here.

Ironically, Hillary's absence will only make it an even more creditable suggestion that there are vast RACIAL implications to this contest. I can foresee that the talk might then be WHITE AND BLACK, EXPERIENCE AND INEXPERIENCE, MILITARY RECORD OR NONE, OLD OR YOUNG. Perhaps GENDER will be absolved or resolved for a time (unless he chooses a female running mate -- or a lesbian --, or an older Hispanic with an Anglo name, or a guy who has military background but has never been elected for anything, or a guy who buys expensive haircuts whose wife wears the pants in the family but is dying of cancer, or a short guy with a funny name and a brilliant mind).

See what I mean?

Because it sorts of make light of the victims. And "Jewish" is not a race. Just because nazis tried to make it so it doesn't mean we should follow suit. People sending you pictures of what a "typical" Jew looks like doesn't make it a typical Jew. It is just ignorance.

Radio_Lady, I know you are upset because Clinton is being put down by the media but she does have some blame in the way she is conducting her campaign. I am not saying that her downfall is completely her fault but in the argument between "the media destroying Senator Clinton" vs. "Clinton doing damage to herself", the truth lies.

Just my two cents.

Take care, Radio_Lady! I hope to see you back.

A lynching of ONE man, or even hundreds over time, is different from six million massacred in a very few years. Not to mention the untold numbers of Gypsies, Catholics, Communists, and gays among the corpses in those vast mass graves.

Or perhaps it takes six million dead Jewish men, women, and children to equal the hanging of one black man in your mind. IS that your equivalent? Is that how you see it?

Is "lynching" another word we have to purge from the dictionary (along with 'fairytale,' 'tarbaby,' and how many others too delicate for Obama-loving ears?

Germany have to do with America?

This is fucking America, a place where your people don't get gassed or wiped out, but black people were being lynched and run out of whole counties.

there is an awful lot of anti-Semitism in America, whether YOU see it or not. There are synagogue attacks, and people gunned down -- and we can even count the occasional adulterous rabbi who kills a wife or two... Please don't argue with me on that one.

Really, this is starting to sound like one-upsmanship.

I hate that game.

I just have to say Sean Bell

watch it over and over agin and start the healing,

it's not about gender, and race, it's about the what the people need, who's best for the job
who's in touch with what America needs. No more games like a gas tax, we have been playing games far too long now
and its ended up in a WAR killing young americans Male and female, destroyed families on both sides of the plant,
we have a dollar thats not worth much, people are working longer hours, the ones who still have jobs, we need health care, we are all losing.
it's not about race, gender, and all the other things that you want to make it about. There have been many wrongs done all around the world for all people,
for example Haitian people have been dying a slow death for decades, people in africa the same, china, the middle east, europe and even here in america see how hard it is to make it out of the projects right here in urban cities in the US where people work long hours for little pay, and there kids go to school and barely learn how to read, the drop out rate is almost 50% ,
can you say PREDATORY LENDING. Almost every group has a story to tell, and the darker your skin tone, the deeper the scars

Unbelievable.

sensibility. At least I know my family and how they are put together.

I know little or nothing about you. However, nowhere did I exclude you from being an American. The flag reference was just meant to signify that I'm not moving to another country or planning to vote Republican. I am going to stay and fight for what I believe in, with or without Hillary.

But, of course, the more I try to support and explain what I said, the more nitpickers like you jump on.

Unbelievable.

Oh, well. I'm choosing to do this today.

Good bye and good luck,

Radio Lady Ellen

Twisted words?

Lynched?
Verbally-lynched?
Fly the flag for true americans... that would be me and members of my family?

Nowhere, and I mean nowhere, in my life is there room for despicable characters that toss around flame bait as you have done. My life is too short and getting shorter. No more time to waste on the likes of you.

Don't attack people, period. Also, please do not attack peoples' personal histories. The rules of DU say no attacks of the nature you have initiated are allowed. Democrats are better than what your posted words have shown. Thanks Radio Lady for your viewpoints and you words. They make sense to me.

All this is "verbal blows" anyway.

I'd be scared shitless to meet some of these people in an alley -- the way they talk.

They don't bring out the best in me, or in each other.

I'll try to do better tomorrow.

Call me a supporter of the wrong candidate, but I really truly think she would have made a great President. That's about all.

She probably would have. I support Obama, but you really couldn't have gone wrong between either of these two candidates. They are basically identical in what they want to do for the country. They have slightly different campaigning styles, but both seem to be good people.

Very thoughtful and interesting. Really much better than mine because he's thinking quite clearly -- I was really offended when I got home from the Democratic dinner last night and started to read this site.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Cheers, jjr5

...logical in theory, nonsensical in reality.

It's far too late for that kind of polyannish dreaming, but it makes good fodder for TV for awhile.

always wonder what the user of such language considers the characteristics of an American who is not a "true American." Obviously in such context "American" is used to connote more than mere nationality. Logically, if someone refers to "true Americans" it suggests that he/she believes there are "false Americans." So what to you constitutes the divide between "true Americans" and "false Americans?"

to his wife & John McCain. It's just another whistle, and I'm ashamed to see it used here. I think the o.p. visits rightwing hate sites more than she's willing to admit...she's adopted their language. I, for one, won't miss her one iota.

Visiting hate sites, including Free Republic et al
Adopting the language of the right wing people
Saying that my family is "true Americans" and excluding your family or yourself
Changing your view about the 120,000 other people that you WOULD miss more than an iota SHOULD they leave

Here's something you might remember:

Just because I don't believe something you DO believe -- it does not mean that I don't believe ANYTHING you believe.

Just common logic, which is missing from about 3/4 of the posts on this forum today.

Ta ta.

I'm willing to hear you out, and withhold my reservations about your credibility, but you really need to clear that up.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

:edited to add link, just in case you're ignoring poster #83

Somebody on the thread got it right... just a vain attempt at humor. Maybe mixed with some true dislike of Don Imus -- can't stand the guy for many of the same reasons I made that distasteful comment.

Too bad you weren't at the Washington County Democratic dinner last night, while I supported Obama against some hick who gave every wrong reason for Hillary's election. It was something like "maybe Bill will be able to knock some sense into her" with a wonderful variable like SPOUSAL ABUSE. He was a Bill Clinton supporter, mainly because the man wanted the super-sexuality he ascribed to Bill because of what... money? power? I have no cotton-pickin', chicken-pluckin' idea. (I did grow up in the South, son.)

Guess it's all in what you call debating style.

Nothing really profound. Right now, I'm trying to consider what to call Sen. Obama on this site -- BO doesn't make it. (Guess I'm revealing my age and a product we used to call MUM -- a deodorant -- that used "BODY ODOR" for those initials.)

Thanks for your comments and you can score me whatever you want on previous archival posts.

Cordially,

Radio Lady

because as one woman to another, you feel she has earned the right to the Presidency since she has had to fight so hard to get where she is today?

Not being sarcastic...it's an honest question.

because we believe she would be the best person for the presidency of the two remaining candidates.

That does NOT mean that we are the only "true Americans" or that we will not vote for Sen. Obama, should he win the race. We are a pledged couple (my husband is an elected committeeperson with the Washington County Democrats). We are hoping to defeat Sen. Gordon Smith (R) here, which in my mind, might just be a more important function of November's election.

This is an honest answer.

Cordially,

Radio Lady in Oregon

I'll be out with the horses by noon Monday!

www.forwardstride.org

Cheers!

RL in OR

-- moderated by its own people -- and called the Democratic Underground -- would achieve a higher purpose.

You don't have to tell me about ugly campaigns. My Jewish father was deeply involved in local Florida politics. I started passing out leaflets when I was eight years old (1947-48). I worked for a governor candidate when I was 13, then for Senators George Smathers and Sen. Claude Pepper. I covered the 1972 Florida primary for CBS and NBC as a journalism stringer. I was on the air at WEEI the day that Gov. Wallace was shot in a parking lot in Maryland. Did radio talk all though Watergate, the impeachment hearings, and the resignation.

This is worse.

It's fast. It's anonymous. It's MUCH uglier, IMHO. What we call journalism is slanted beyond belief. I don't have to convince you because you know what you know.

Cordially,

Radio Lady in Oregon

The internet allows instant and anonymous commentary. Easy to say to a computer screen what you might not say to a group of people.

I've 'lived online' since 1992, and this election campaign is no different from past ones. If you think DU gets nasty, look up 'usenet'.

He put together a Heathkit computer that year with two floppy disks!

I got trained in WordPerfect in 1983, and remember USENET pretty much at the very beginning. I posted for months at several ALT. forums, including ones on movies, science, biology, pharmacy and many Microsoft technology sites -- plus others too numerous to mention. Then I worked at Digital Equipment Corporation, Maynard, Massachusetts when Deja Vu was involved, and then in the segue to Google. I still participate at one volunteer Google site.

Sorry to disagree with your very well thought out opinion (!).

This is the very worst campaign I can remember, IMHO.

I hope you get the next one right. Thanks for posting.

Cordially,

Radio Lady in Oregon

RL do you remember the Humphrey/McCarthy campaign that culminated in the Chicago riots? That was far, far worse than this IMO. Clinton has brought on any unfair comments by her ugly attacks on Obama. Obama for the most part has played the gentleman. I think folks here at DU have become angry at, and feel deceived by, the Clintons. And rightly so IMO. Bob

So be it.

Ellen

This is a moderated forum - where many people actually pay directly to help keep it going. Theoretically, all of the users are here to promote democratic values and Democratic candidates.