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demwing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:37 PM
Original message
Are Americans Stupid?
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 12:45 PM by demwing2
First, when I write "we" here, its rhetorical. No offense, ok?

Are we Americans ignorant, willfully ignorant, mislead by a biased press, or just stupid?

There is so much going on in the world and in our country to which we just don't respond, especially during this election season!

Bush claiming he wants to be the "Peace President," people claiming Kerry is a waffler, or that we don't know enough about him, the whole now-you-see-it-now-you-don't with Bush's military records, stealing elections and etc, etc, etc, ad naseum! No wonder Howard Dean screamed!

To steal a phrase - "Where is the outrage?"

Are we being lied to, and that's why we are unaware?

Are we just covering our eyes because we don't want to know?

Are the conditions of our lives such that we just don't have time to figure it all out?

Or are Americans just too damned stupid to add it all up?

Someone please tell me that there's hope for the future, ok?
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prole_for_peace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yes...
I answered just from the subject line...maybe I should read your post....

Oh okay, still yes. It is like a country of stepford wives. Except for us.
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amber dog democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Yes
All that and more. I think while things are unraveling in general,
It does not mean there are not heroic and decent things happening all the time and everywhere.

We know who we are - and I take comfort in standing apart from the general climate dictated by the lowest common denominator. - fostered by political, cultural and corporate vested interests who would perfer you to remain uninformed and stupid.

A good place to begin is to avoid television.

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Terry_M Donating Member (559 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. I think part of the problem is that people may feel that they can't
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 12:43 PM by Terry_M
make a difference, and nothing significant will change for them, so why bother paying attention to politics...
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The Zanti Regent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 07:42 AM
Response to Reply #2
25. Millions are brainwashed by Churches
Millions (sadly including most of my family) are brainwashed by churches and thier right wing propaganda. Millions believe Jesus is coming to take them away in a week or 2.

You cannot engage in a battle of wits with unarmed opponents!
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meti57b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
3. There's no doubt that half the people are dumber than the other half. :))
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jono Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
5. Misled by a CORPORATE press
that uses those handy little prepackaged sound bites we call talking points, which can be repeated ad nauseum. Short messages play well in commercials - now that news rooms are run as profit centers, why wouldn't they want to sell news the same way?

America is safer, but we're not safe. :eyes:

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info being Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #5
28. and a corporate government, corporate education, corporate minds
The corporate mentality is incompatible with truth-seeking.
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fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
6. Yes
Willfully ignorant and proud of it.

I have friends that are engineering majors and even if they know about Laplace transforms, I still don't consider them very intelligent, because they are so ignorant about the world.



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NC_Nurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
7. People don't want to think about
complex issues. It is pretty discouraging sometimes to look at all we're up against in this world - environment, poverty, war, greed, and on and on...

We are kept busy running a rat race we'll never win and being swayed by the media who protects the interests of it's owners. It's easier to follow along with what they'd like you to think than to think for yourself. That way you can focus all your energy on yourself and your own family (and consuming, consuming, consuming!).
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
8. Not only stupid, but lazy. It would take energy and work to develop
an understanding of people outside of this country.
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Killarney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
9. Not Stupidity... Apathy
They just don't care.

They don't see how it affects them.

22 million single women didn't vote in 2000. WTF? I don't understand it. But we really need to reach people this year.
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luaneryder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. They don't until it does.
It seems to take a personal crisis to get through to people.
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CaTeacher Donating Member (983 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
10. yes we are stupid.
and the answer is all of the above (for the reasons why)
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Union Thug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
11. I think they are more victims of market propaganda...
...than being absolutely stupid. I'm reading Frank's book, "What's the matter with Kansas" and I think he sums up what happened to this country better than just about anyone else.
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TNMOM Donating Member (735 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
13. yes. willful ignorance.
Just spent a whole weekend with thuggy in-laws from two southern states. They refuse to watch F911 and the reason why they won't support Kerry is because "Democrats are immoral." The support for gay marriage and the Clinton scandal overshadows Bush's lies.

I tried, unsuccessfully, to bring them to the light, to engage them in a conversation about the corruption of Bush's regime, but to no avail. They just don't want to hear about Bush's fuck-ups. Period.

My brother-in-law is a thinker, so I think there's hope for him. But my mother-in-law just absorbs whatever RW bull is out there and circulates it with passion (you should see some of the literature she forwards to my husband.) One lives in N.C., the other lives in Tennessee.

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zulchzulu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
14. NASCAR Dads and Soccer Moms...
It's not that Americans are stupid.

It's that they are either too busy to have time to understand issues in the election other than soundbites and negative ads or that they are just too lazy or apathetic to figure it all out.

Granted, like Moore says, most Americans are actually liberal if you ask them about issues like protecting the environment, having affordable healthcare or finding the Iraq War being conducted wrong as well as corrupt with war profiteering. But they also have a habit on turning on Fox News and letting their psyche be bathed with neocon Bush shillisms. Then they flick it over to some time wasters like Bachelor Blah Blah Blah or Who Wants to Be A Deceptive Survivor... and then there's sports...
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Tom Rinaldo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 02:00 PM
Response to Original message
15. No, they just don't pay attention; which is REALLY dumb! n/t
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 02:19 PM by Tom Rinaldo
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Jade Fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
16. We have the priviledge to be stupid.....
Americans are woefully ignorant about the rest of the world, because we
are able to get away with it. The rest of the world can't get away with
ignoring us.

I am currently reading "The Republican Noise Machine" by David Brock.
The Right has perfected diseminating false information into the culture, and
pandering to American fears and self-absorption.

Brock says: Its the Media, stupid. (no offense intended)
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gulliver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
17. They want to make their own mistakes, like little kids.
Edited on Sun Jul-25-04 02:58 PM by gulliver
Having Bush as a president is kind of like having Eddie Haskell for a son-in-law. "He's not good enough for you, honey. He's an ass," you tell your daughter. But all you can really do is pay for the wedding and wait for the divorce.

Bush voters aren't stupid. They are generally honest and not unintelligent. They are also easily swayed by their emotions and prejudices, and they are irresponsible with their votes. But the bulk of evidence is now so heavily against Bush, that I think that even careless Republican moderates are starting to catch a whiff of sense.

Bush is a spastic, overspending, dimwitted neocon. He can't hide it this election cycle.
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Tosca Donating Member (540 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 03:04 PM
Response to Original message
18. The American collective coma

was jolted for a while after 9-11. "Gosh, why do they hate us?" and such. They were forced to look outside American borders for answers.

But the impulse has subsided now.

Maybe when gas sells for 4 bucks a gallon they'll wake up again.
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demwing Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Frogs in gradually boiling water
thats what we are.

It takes a jump in temperature to make us jump
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MoonRiver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
20. I believe you are either correct, or the polls are deliberately skewed.
I found it incredibly amazing that * has a 47% approval rating! :wtf: I know of nobody, even those who are going to vote for the bastard, who approve of how he's governed. Of course I don't hang with illiterate unwashed dittoheads. The Pukes I know are highly educated, and believe in their cause if not the pResident.
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George_Bonanza Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
21. Ignorant and complacent, but not stupid
It's impossible for 300 million people to be physically incapable of being intelligent than another 300 million people across the seas.

However, there are many Americans who are complacent in their status as the world's strongest power, and feel that they have no need to pay attention to those other weaker countries. America is also a country who prides itself as separate from the old European standards of class, culture, and aristocracy. It has degenerated into forms of anti-intellectualism (foreign travel and university degrees are viewed with suspicion and resent) and overt populism.

America is also held back by the Deep South. The population of Northeastern America (where they're thinking of legalizing gay marriage) is about 90 million. That's three times the population of Canada. And how different would their beliefs be, if NE America no longer had to deal with the South? Very similar. Is Seattle so different from Vancouver? Cleveland from Toronto?
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-25-04 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
22. yes, methinks there's something in the water supply
...the level of complacency and stupidity in this country is appalling. I am reminded of this every time I go to my local grocery store.

The dumbing down of this once great nation is what will doom us all.
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Sugarbleus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 02:49 AM
Response to Original message
23. I think some Americans are too busy to be informed, some are
just plain stupid, some are just intentionally mean and like it that way. The rest are pretty great folks. It's the good citizens, I believe, that hold this society together to the extent that it is held together...*sigh*

Keep the message out there and KEEP HOPE ALIVE..........

~~Peace~~
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arewenotdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 07:11 AM
Response to Original message
24. Of course.
How else do you explain the popularity of LaHaye's Left Behind novels about the Rapture?

We're talking drool-cup stooopid.




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Cats Against Frist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 08:37 AM
Response to Original message
26. I think everybody's right
1. Some people are stupid. Some people are ignorant. Some people are stupid and ignorant -- and this makes up a lot of people.

2. A public dialog -- media -- that NEVER EVER fosters an intelligent or rational discussion that goes against the "ra ra USA superiority narrative."

3. Religion -- churches who preach rapture, Left Behind, etc.

4. Consumerism

5. Apathy or inefficacy -- "my vote won't matter."

6. Celebrity/Star worship.

7. Government's quite purposeful efforts to keep people from voting, having their vote count, or assuring that whomever they do vote for is going to represent them -- disenfranchisement, creative gerrymandering, the electoral college, not making voting a holiday, lack of election reform, lack of IRV, etc.
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wildeyed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
27. Lazy and willfully ignorant.
Attitude seems to be, if I ignore the problems, then I don't have to act and I am too lazy to do anything.

I have many intelligent, educated friends who are too lazy to even read a newspaper a couple times a week. Not that the info received in the paper is all that accurate, but at least it's a starting point.

They choose a candidate based purely on impression, without ever bothering to look at their past record or accomplishments. If I hired employees for my business on that model, I would be out of business in a year.

Hope? Yes, I have hope. But we will have to work very very hard to rectify the problems. Can anyone say reform? If we don't get some serious energy going in that direction, we are screwed.
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info being Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
29. "Yes" to all your questions
Edited on Mon Jul-26-04 11:26 AM by info being
The problem isn't just propaganda, just apathy, just our educational system, but all of the above. We live in a Corporatocracy...where the corporation is the defacto government because it has the most power over people's lives, the most influence on government, and full control of the media.

Anybody who works in a corporation knows that truth-telling and free-thinking will get you in trouble. Those same sensibilities eminate through every aspect of our society. Our mindshare is controlled by corporate interests and so they control our minds.
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JPJones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
30. On average, yes, and B* is King of the Stupid n/t
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MISSDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. Uninformed and like it that way.
I read that polls show that some 80% still believe that Iraq was somehow responsible for September 11, 2001.
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Joe Fields Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-26-04 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
32. By and large Americans are inattentive.
In my opinion, collectively we would hold our own on an I.Q. test. But if stupidity is to be measured in part by how well informed we(collectively) are, concerning our leaders, as well as their policies and actions, then undoubtedly the majority of our nation is willfully stupid.
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