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Which Candidate Is Better For LGBT Issues? Hillary, IMO.

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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:28 PM
Original message
Which Candidate Is Better For LGBT Issues? Hillary, IMO.
To be fair, Obama's rating from Human Rights Campaign, a group that "provides a national voice on gay and lesbian issues", is just as high as Hillary Clinton's ( both got an 89% rating for the 2005-2006 period: http://votesmart.org/issue_rating_detail.php?r_id=3520 ).

So in fairness, it looks like Obama's voting record as a Senator is just as good as Hillary's. Still, what I've read in GLBT publications leads me to believe that Hillary is the candidate who is friendlier to the LGBT community.

According a March 5th piece in the Windy City Times, Obama "has not yet given a general interview to a gay publication during the presidential campaign; and his campaign turned down requests from the papers in Texas and Ohio."

The Windy Times also points out that even when Obama DOES answer questions about gay and lesbian topics, his answers are sometimes ambiguous, at best:

"Obama fielded a couple of questions during a town-hall meeting in Nelsonville, Ohio, repeating his support for LGBT people and urging greater respect for gay people in general as the Christian thing to do.

'Sometimes, particularly in the African-American communityand the church sometimes,' said Obama Sunday in a speech to a small college audience, 'I hear people saying things that I don't think are very Christian with respect to people who are gay and lesbian. I think everybody has the right to their own values, their own religion and their own practices, but I also know the Sermon on the Mount' says treat people as you want to be treated.'

The Sermon on the Mount, as described in the Bible, was reportedly given by Jesus and is seen by many Christians as a guide for how to live in order to please god. The sermon includes many passages familiar to Christians, such as Judge not that ye be not judged, although Obama did not explain what part of the sermon he was referring to. Obama referred to the sermon again when explaining why he believes gay civil unions should be recognized by the state, again in response to a question from the audience."

The Windy Times also points out that "the LGBT community expressed concern that his campaign's gospel tour of South Carolina included, on the bill, a performer well known for making hostile remarks about gays. The campaign did not pull the performer, Donnie McClurkin, from the program but Obama promised to work hard to build better relations between the African-American and LGBT communities."

Hillary on the other hand, seems to have a very POSITIVE record with the LGBT community. According to the Washington Blade: "It is Hillary who had a lesbian friend babysit for her daughter; the person holding her fathers hand when he died was a gay man. The relationships are long and deep. It is in Hillarys office that the fight against the Federal Marriage Amendment was coordinated." ( http://www.washblade.com/2008/3-14/view/columns/12198.c... )

In short, I recognize and commend Barack for putting together LGBT issues voting record that appears to be just as good as Hillary Clinton's, BUT I believe that Hillary is the better candidate on LGBT issues because of her more consistent and positive track record with the LGBT community.
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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
1. Worth reading - this has some substance to it.
And includes admirable quotes and info on both candidate's positions. Encouraging is: both have good stands, and are so much better than the repugs on the issue.
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #1
5. I Agree
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:33 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hillary has been setting up her 2008 campaign for 8 years and knew there would be some patching up
Edited on Sat Mar-15-08 03:33 PM by blm
to do because of Bill's constant pandering and rolling over to the RW on gay issues.

If Obama would have been thinking about his primary race for 8 years maybe he would have pursued a similar agenda, KNOWING there were some tough spots to deal with aforehand.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Horse Pucky - go play with your friends. eom
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Bill DIDN'T pander to the RW on gay issues during his term? When does your state of Denial vote?
And if you think Hillary only decided to run in Jan 2007, you really must see a doctor.
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
17. For DADT alone, her share of his "legacy" should make people wake up
and smell the coffee.
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Yes We Did Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. Obama wants to get rid of DADT & DOMA
Hillary, as far as I know does not.

I know she wants to change DADT, but keep it.

She has said nothing of getting rid of DOMA.

under Obama you will probably get more, just going by what we've already seen from the Clintons.
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cloudythescribbler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. details, details -- and who CARES which candidate is likelier to beat McCain, right? nt
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. Hillary DOES want to get rid of DADT, Actually
"She also did a 20-minute phone interview with the Houston Area Stonewall Democrats and, according to the group, Senator Clinton wholly committed to making immediate priorities of her administration such key issues as passing a completely inclusive ENDA, passing a completely inclusive Hate Crimes bill, and eliminating "'Don't Ask, Don't' Tell.'"

http://www.windycitymediagroup.com/gay/lesbian/news/ART...

It really my fault though for forgetting to post the link to my Windy Times story. Sorry about that.
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #19
33. you know wrong
She has repeatedly, over and over again, stated in clear, unambiguous language that she wishes to repeal DADT. It is DOMA she wishes to alter.
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ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:37 PM
Response to Original message
3. Kucinich is the best on LGBT rights.
Obama and Clinton are pretty much the same, it is just a matter of how fine do you want to split that hair.

Lets make it simple:

Clinton + Obama = GLBT =/= straights.

Kucinich = GLBT = straights.
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Probably True
I'm just talking about the current Democratic candidates, though.
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ZombieHorde Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. current Democratic candidates
Then no real difference.
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 06:22 PM
Response to Reply #8
37. I Disagree
I believe that the fact that Hillary answered questions from LGBT publications while Obama basically STONEWALLED them, is a SUBSTANTIAL difference.
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kwenu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:53 PM
Original message
REALLY?? Where was Hillary when her husband signed the DEFENSE OF MARRIAGE ACT?!!
Edited on Sat Mar-15-08 03:57 PM by kwenu
Does the LGBT community have selective memory? Suffer from amnesia maybe? Isn't that where she got her "on the job" training?
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 01:13 AM
Response to Original message
26. What?
She's supposed to successfully usurp the PRESIDENT?
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
9. Is Hillary distancing herself from "Don't Ask, Don't Tell"? She likes to ....
take credit as co-president to Bill.
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 01:12 AM
Response to Reply #9
25. YES SHE IS!
She has UNEQUIVOCALLY said that she will eliminate DADT.

"She also did a 20-minute phone interview with the Houston Area Stonewall Democrats and, according to the group, Senator Clinton wholly committed to making immediate priorities of her administration such key issues as passing a completely inclusive ENDA, passing a completely inclusive Hate Crimes bill, and eliminating Don't Ask, Don't' Tell."

http://www.windycitymediagroup.com/gay/lesbian/news/ART...
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Laughing Mirror Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
10. But what's Hillary's pastor's position on LGBT rights
That's what we want to know, don't we?

The National Black Justice Coalition lists Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Trinity United Church of Christ, Chicago
as one of the Black Leaders Who Support Marriage Equality.

http://www.nbjcoalition.org/about/supporters.html

So, what's Hillary's pastor's position on this issue?

Does anybody know?


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okasha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #10
24. Yep.
Edited on Sat Mar-15-08 08:49 PM by okasha
By Jacqueline L. Salmon
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, February 15, 2008; Page B02

* * * *
Foundry United Methodist Church, which Bill and Hillary Rodham Clinton attended when he was president, decided last month to support its senior pastor's decision to lead services that "recognize and honor" committed gay relationships. Foundry clergy, however, do not perform union ceremonies, the local bishop said.

* * *

Foundry's senior pastor, Dean Snyder, was traveling yesterday and was not available for comment, his office said. Snyder's Nov. 11 pastoral letter said he wanted to remain obedient to church law and that the worship services would not be "ceremonies that celebrate homosexual unions." Rather, his letter said, they would "include the worship of God and recognize and honor the commitment which has previously been made."

Foundry's Church Council endorsed Snyder's letter last month. Schol said yesterday that the services do not violate church law.

"Foundry Church is working hard at being faithful to the United Methodist Church," he said, adding that Foundry is "also a congregation that is seeking to minister to the broad community that it serves."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20...
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Laughing Mirror Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #24
27. That was the Clinton's church when he was president
Who is her pastor now, today, not 10 years ago?
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okasha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. She still attends Foundy while in Washington,
various others on the road. I don't know who was pastor at Foundry ten years ago; if you're interested, I'm sure you can look it up.

http://atheism.about.com/od/hillaryclintonreligion/tp/H...
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Laughing Mirror Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 02:25 AM
Response to Reply #32
40. Thank you
Edited on Mon Mar-17-08 02:29 AM by downstairsparts
I'm only interested in today, not ten years ago. It's too bad she can't make the leap to gay marriage, like her church wants to do.

from your link:

Hillary Clinton opposes legalizing gay marriage and regards this as being "very positive" because she supports civil unions for gay couples. Clinton thinks she supports "full equality" because she favors civil unions which would presumably have the same characteristics as marriage, so why not call it marriage? The only reason is to preserve it for heterosexuals, and thus preserve some bastion of heterosexual privilege in order to reassure them that they are superior to gays. Hillary Clinton may thus not consciously oppose gay rights and equality, but she also doesn't entirely favor it. She has made some movement in that direction, for example by supporting gays being able to serve in the military, but she has a long way to go.
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terrya Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
11. Neither one of them will do much for us as President
When you lower the bar of expectations as low as possible, you don't get disappointed.
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hulklogan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. In fact, it is entirely possible that neither one will do anything for us as President.
Sadly, I think it's time to lower the bar all the way to the floor.
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kwenu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Perhaps you should even consider digging a basement if you're supporting Hillary.
Edited on Sat Mar-15-08 04:23 PM by kwenu
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AGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
13. Hillary , she marched in gay pride parade, tell me when Obama is going.
Edited on Sat Mar-15-08 04:22 PM by AGirl
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kwenu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Obama and LGBT supporters
http://www.advocate.com/exclusive_detail_ektid52635.asp

List provided by the Obama campaign:

Jeanette Mott Oxford, Missouri state representative, District 59, St. Louis

Wilson Cruz, actor, Los Angeles

Kevin Jennings, founder and executive director, Gay, Lesbian, and Straight Education Network

Donna Rose, former board member of the Human Rights Campaign; former member of the Hillary Clinton for President LGBT Steering Committee; transgender activist

Jeremy Bishop, executive director, Pride at Work (AFL-CIO)

Ian Palmquist, executive director, Equality North Carolina; immediate past chair, Equality Federation

Jo Kenny, development director, Pride at Work (AFL-CIO)

Stephen Glassman, chairman, Pennsylvania Human Relations Commission

Hans Johnson, president of Progressive Victory

Craig Bowman, former executive director of National Youth Advocacy Coalition

Donna Cartwright, communications director, Pride at Work (AFL-CIO)

Perry Nelson, founder, Gateway Stonewall Democrats (St. Louis)

Ben Turner, cofounder and former cochair of the Capital Region Stonewall Democrats (Harrisburg, Pa.)

Robert Perez, public relations executive and former Washington press secretary for Kerry-Edwards

Judy Chambers, cofounder and former cochair of the Capital Region Stonewall Democrats (Harrisburg, Pa.)

Conrado Terrazas, political field director for SEIU 1000 (Calif.)

Lisa Hazirjian, visiting professor, Carnegie Mellon University (Pa.)

Gregg Gallo, National Stonewall Democrats board member (Wash.)

Anita Latch, Washington State Stonewall Democrats president

Jenny Durkan, Washington John Edwards for President state chair (2004 & 2008)

Krista Strothmann, Baltimore chapter of Pride at Work (AFL-CIO)

John Klenert, campaign board of the Gay and Lesbian Victory Fund and member of board of directors for DC Vote

Marti Abernathy, transgender advocate (Indiana)

Joe Darby, vice president, Pride at Work (AFL-CIO), Lansing, Mich.

Randall Ellis, former executive director of Lesbian/Gay Rights Lobby of Texas

Andres Duque, LGBT activist (N.Y.)

Gary Fitzsimmons, Dallas County district clerk (Texas)

Tim Downing, member of board of directors for Human Rights Campaign (Ohio)

Christina Ocasio, transgender activist; 2004 delegate to the DNC Convention (Texas)

Dyshaun Muhammad, former GLBT caucus chair, Young Democrats of America; former political chair of Twin Cities HRC Steering Committee (Minn.)

Pauline Park, chair, New York Association for Gender Rights Advocacy

Glen Maxey, former Texas state representative (first openly gay member)

Marti Bier, former field director for PFLAG

Doug Lakey, director of West Coast Office of Alliance for Justice; former development director for the Human Rights Campaign

Terry Penrod, member of board of directors for Human Rights Campaign (Ohio)

David Pena Jr., executive director, National Hispanic Business Association

John McClelland, president, Denton County Stonewall Democrats (Texas)

Joe Lacey, Dayton (Ohio) board of education member

Tony Ballis, president, Dayton (Ohio) Stonewall Democrats

Noel Alicea, LGBT activist (N.Y.)

(Organizations listed for identification purposes only.)
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AGirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. that's awsome, but Hillary still marched at gay pride parade.
Edited on Sat Mar-15-08 04:52 PM by AGirl
That's huge. I would be happy if Obama puts himself out there like that and if not why not?
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Laughing Mirror Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. So did Giuliani, and then he reversed his position on our issues
There'll be plenty of gay pride parades the candidates can march in this summer, if they remember to.
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JoFerret Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
18. Hillary. Beyond a shadow of a doubt
.
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TheDonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #18
36. care to explain this? Or just make hyperbolic statements for the sake of doing it
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NDambi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
22. "Which Candidate Is Better For LGBT Issues? Hillary"
Hmmmm..wonder why?
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JuneFiasco Donating Member (11 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 07:30 AM
Response to Original message
28. Yep
Amen
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kdpeters Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 10:41 AM
Response to Original message
29. Being roughly equal re:GLBT issues, I've decided for Obama on other issues
Iraq being far and away the most crucial issue to me this election.
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tishaLA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 10:43 AM
Response to Original message
30. I'd say they are almost the same
Hillary has better PR on it than Sen Obama, who admittedly did a terrible job with the McClurkin issue.
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Jamastiene Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 10:47 AM
Response to Original message
31. I'd say Hillary is better, definitely. n/t
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 03:47 PM
Response to Original message
34. thank you for a great thread
I tend to look for the record or for a personal connection on this issue. Clinton has both.
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #34
38. Thanks for the props.
I appreciate it!
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TheDonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 03:52 PM
Response to Original message
35. They are both roughly the same on this issue.
Neither is a grand slam for GLBT rights and anyone who tries to argue that one is over the other is lying and biased.
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Danzo Donating Member (362 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 12:20 AM
Response to Reply #35
39. I'm "LYING"? WTF?
No, I'm not "lying," I'm expressing my opinion. If you don't like it, why don't you just respectfully disagree with it?
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