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liberalmike27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 10:47 AM
Original message
So, Hillary Supporters
How many of you that voted, or plan to vote for Hillary have become pissed off with her deciding to support John Sydney McCan't over Obama, just in hopes that she might scrape out some chance to win, or to help McCain win so she can run again in four years?

I'm just wondering what it'll take for you to not vote for her, or keep supporting her. Is climbing in bed with our politican opponents (almost said enemies, but I'll try to be better than Republicans)enough for you to irritate you? Will you at least email her campaign and tell her to stop climbing into the boat with McCain, and stick to her own party?
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The Velveteen Ocelot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 10:51 AM
Response to Original message
1. Hillary wants to win the nomination. Period.
And she'll try to do it by crippling Obama so badly that the superdelegates figure they have to support her because after all the damage she's done to him he can't win the general election. She doesn't seem to care what she does to the party.

I used to defend her from the more extreme slams from the most rabid Obama supporters. Now I don't give a damn.
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liberalmike27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
2. Honestly
I think she is looking at the race this way. If she doesn't win, she wants McCain to win. This gives her another chance in 2012 to run, and she thinks she may get it right. Mathematically, she has very little chance, though I won't dismiss it entirely.

It's sad when you put yourself in front of the whole Democratic Party, as bad as we need a Democrat for president. I think Hillary getting the nod for the general, especially if it is Super D's that do it, will drive a lot of folks to the Green Party.
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Bucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 10:57 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. What pisses me off more is Clark getting in on the act.
I've always supported Clark in choosing a candidated I was opposed to. I thought he was classier than to leave a quote open enough to imply Obama isn't ready to CINC on day one. The accusation is bullshit and Clark used to be bullshit proof.
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SoCalDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Clark is on the Goodie Train.. he's angling for a cabinet post
:puke:
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SoFlaJet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
3. I saw 4 different threads yesterday Mikey
of Clinton supporters saying they were done with her for using those tactics...let me find a couple...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:02 AM
Response to Original message
5. I voted for Hillary, and I HAVE NOT HEARD HER ENDORSE
McCain.

Stating McCain has experience is a fact.

By chewing on this reinforce in the minds of Americans the fact.

This is a silly charge. Sometimes it is better to turn the page
on certain charges. Let them get off the radar.

Trying to twist this into Hilary endorsing McCain is a stretch.



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Spider Jerusalem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:05 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Actually, what she said was...
that SHE had experience, and McCain had experience, and Obama she wasn't so sure about. There's no way to read that except as an endorsement of a Republican over her Democratic opponent. Which is beyond the pale; you don't suggest that someone from the OTHER PARTY is more qualified than the person who may be your party's nominee.
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Kittycat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #7
12. She also said that She & McCain had crossed the CIC threshold, but Obama hadn't
That's an endorsement of McCain over obama.
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LostinVA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:08 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. Exactly -- good post
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liberalmike27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. She Prefers McCain
It is clear that she said she prefers McCain over Obama. That is the straw that breaks the camel's back, as far as most real democrats are concerned. If you can't see how the statement says that, you need to try to imagine a future campaign ad by McCain.

Hillary Clinton supports John McCain, saying he is better on national security, and has a lifetime of experience.

And what does she base her experience on? They both have about 7 years in politics, they are both lawyers? As far as I'm concerned, I find it more important to judge based on what their record shows they support, and I'd rather take a relatively unknown Obama over a democrat that has steadily demonstrated a continued support of American interventionism, or basically, the killing of foreigners for oil, or worse, economic ideas of how a country should be run.
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Justyce Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #5
16. Thank you... it's getting ridiculous around here. nt
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Windy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:32 AM
Response to Reply #5
17. so you condone her behavior? I question your moral compass. n/t
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:10 AM
Response to Original message
10. I voted for Clinton
and would happily do so again.

She didn't endorse McCain. That lie won't become true no matter how often you repeat it.
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Neshanic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
11. Ms. O explained it to me what she meant.
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Phillycat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:21 AM
Response to Original message
13. Since she has never and will not endorse/support John McCain,
your post is meaningless.
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
14. In The Context And In Relation To Strategy, I'm Perfectly Fine With It.
It has been exaggerated to the nth degree and I'm amazed at how much more weight people are giving it than it deserve, but at the end of the day it was a strategical statement and not one I find all that bad.

Right now her purpose is to win the nomination. To do so she has to show differences between her and Obama. Using the wet behind the ears tactic is something totally be expected. Using McCain to make the point even clearer was just a strategical move and a harmless one. At this point in the primary, it has no effect on the GE at all. Right now it's about the two of them, not them vs McCain. We can't forget that context. So using things against your opponent, even if it means minimally boosting up a future opponent, is perfectly fine. Because one of two things will occur:

1. She wins the nomination and the whole point is moot, and her strategy effective.

2. She loses, and Obama goes against McCain. McCain attempts to use such comments, but gets smacked down because obviously they didn't work the first time around, and he can just turn them around on John. Once the GE starts, then it's a whole different ballgame. If Obama is the victor, he will have many bragging rights to bring with him and all he has to do is laugh lightheartedly at any inference McCain would use towards that comment. So many here are trying to make it like this comment could be used so heavily against him in the GE and like it is such bad ammunition blah blah. But that isn't even close to reality. In reality, Obama could wipe that away in a heartbeat and if anything, it sets McCain up to be a fool, and can be ammunition FOR Obama, since he could easily embarrass John by responding correctly. No risk in the GE at all because of these comments. If anything, Obama can use them to his ADVANTAGE.

Think outside the box people, for real. This is just a relatively benign strategical statement when in the midst of a primary battle, that will have NO impact in the GE. Try and keep your heads on, ya know?
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lewis_in_fw Donating Member (75 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-08-08 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
15. The argument she makes: She is better in GE to counteract McCain who has loads of experience...
Sounds like a valid point.

You know, Obama doesn't have a lock yet on the nomination, so I'd suggest stopping this crap about her hurting the nominee. Let the rest of the voters decide (including Florida & Michigan)

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