Clinton supporters: you can't have it both ways. Which one applies?

[thesubstanceofdreams]

Two arguments often expressed by H.Clinton's supporters:

1) B. Clinton's years as a president were among the best for the country, H. Clinton was part of that, therefore we should vote for H. Clinton.
2) H. Clinton is running on her own experience, intelligence and abilities and B. Clinton is just another candidate's spouse like M. Obama.

Which one is a reason to vote for Clinton, and why?

[William769]

1. Often?

Coming from someone who's been here about a month. :rofl:

[thesubstanceofdreams]

2. Thanks for your bullying attempt.

What is your answer to my question?

[William769]

7. The anser is how do you know how often it is.

If you have only been here about a month?

[mckeown1128]

12. Many people (like me) lurk for two years before actually

getting a sign on name

[thesubstanceofdreams]

Ok, I restate my question. "often in the last month" n/t

[Marrah_G]

8. That wasn't a real question. It was a push-poll type question.

[Meshuga]

9. BTW, welcome to DU! n/t

[Meshuga]

6. I've been here since 2003 and I ask you the same question

Since it is a fair question.

[William769]

20. It's simple, she got experiance from both.

[Meshuga]

21. Fair enough. n/t

[Marrah_G]

3. Could you have worded that in a more biased way?

How about this:

Bill's years as President were among the best for the country, Hillary was part of that. Hillary is running on her own experience, intelligence and abilities.

Nothing like a moronic push-poll first thing in the morning.

Enjoy your stay at DU.

[thesubstanceofdreams]

10. May be it's just me, but I see a contradiction

Unless you're claiming that in fact it was Hillary running the country during Bill's years (as opposed to being just an effective first lady). But I respect your differing opinion :hi:

[Marrah_G]

18. I see no condradicton at all.

I suppose we just see this from very different angles. I dislike the type of questioning you are using. It's used alot in politics and frankly it is disingenuous.

[xultar]

4. Well me thinks Clinton supporters are different people and to some A applies and to others B

and thanks to Marrah_G a combination of both. WE don't lock step.

Remember or forget, you wouldn't know about the we don't lockstep since you've only been her a few weeks.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

5. I Think Logicians Call That The "Fallacy Of The Excluded Middle"

~

[Tom Rinaldo]

11. Part Of Hillary Clinton's experienc, part of Al Gore's experience, part of Bill Richardson's...

...experience also, was the time each of these people spent involved in the Clinton administration. Those 8 years are part of all of their lives and they all gained valuable experience during those 8 years.

[zabet]

13. I will try ...

1. She was a part, she had her own agenda
to take care of. Even though her Health-Care
plan failed then, it is telling that she had
the foresight to see a need before the average
person felt it financially.

2. Even though she was a sounding-board
and a confidant, she did not make the final
policy decisions, Bill did.

Both are reasons. Whether you see them as reasons
to vote for, or as reasons to vate against, are totally
up to the individual.

[thesubstanceofdreams]

19. Thanks for actually answering my question

Although I disagree in the details, I can see your point :hi:

[zabet]

26. Thanks!

Welcome to DU. :hi:

Nothing wrong with your questions
as they are very valid. If a person
cannot explain thier candidate, in
my eyes they have not done enough
research on ANY of the candidates.

[terrya]

14. I really don't care.

I'm a supporter of Hillary Clinton. Period.

These litmus tests for Clinton supporters around here are getting tedious. To put it mildly.

[MethuenProgressive]

15. Welcome back to DU. What was your old name?

Or do you still use it?

[Crooked Moon]

the two are not mutually exclusive.

it can be argued that ms. clinton's experience and instincts were enhanced by her years as first lady. there can be no argument that a former president poised to become first gentleman of the white house is an anomoly and, as such, is fraught with implications.

the two choices you pose are inextricably linked, in my view.

[William769]

16. It's simple, she got experiance from both.

Nothing is ever just black and white.

[demokatgurrl]

17. "B" for me

I loved Bill Clinton as President,and would vote for him tomorrow. However, I don't believe for one moment that by voting for Hillary Clinton I am putting him back in the White HOuse. And I don't believe for one minute that he, as someone here put it,"wears the pantsuits" and will stampede his way back to the Oval Office. Setting aside their complicated marital situation and her staying with him after his philandering (which is none of our goddamned business but which I also know is at the root of some people's hostility toward her), she is no milquetoast. When she is President, she, not he, will be President. In fact she'll probably give him an ambassadorship in a far-away place, like Africa, since he's there a lot anyway.

[MyNameGoesHere]

22. all of the above.

In fact they both apply.

[mondo joe]

23. That's easy: Hillary is running on her own, which includes her time as part of - but not

the President of - Bill Clinton's administration.

What a silly fallacious question.

[thesubstanceofdreams]

24. To summarize...

... you are essentially picking 2). You (Clinton supporters who graciously answered the question) are saying that Hillary gained valuable experience as a first lady, but the success of Bill's presidency is not as important as the experience she gained. In other words, she's running on her own merits and not his husband's.

Let me know if I'm getting this wrong.

[demokatgurrl]

28. That's certainly not what I said.

I don't count "first lady" experience as anything. In fact, I wish we'd get rid of the whole notion.
That must may happen if she wins, which is almost reason enough for me.

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Apollo11]

27. You got me! Good question!

I am not really a Hillary supporter but I have been very impressed with her recent debate performances and I think whoever wins the nomination we should all get behind the Democratic ticket.

I have also tried to defend Hillary against some of the more unfair attacks posted here on DU.

I just think Hillary is a very smart lady and I hate to see people being mean to her.

She has had to deal with personal attacks from the right-wing slime machine for more than 16 years.

So when I see people saying that Obama is perfect and we should all hate Hillary - I react against it.

I agree with you that Hillary's greatest weakness is the unanswered question of the extent to which she is running on the 8 years record of the Clinton-Gore adminstration.

I think she is saying that she is not Bill. She is her own person and her own candidate. But she has learned a lot from being "behind the scenes" and close to the center of the Clinton-Gore administration.

Hillary understands how government works. During the 1990s she was paying attention and she has learned from positive experiences (balancing the budget, bring peace to Ireland, etc.) and from negative experiences (trying to achieve universal healthcare, dealing with a GOP majority in Congress, etc.)

Since then Hillary has served 7 years in the US Senate. So she also has her own political track record.

OK so she voted for the IWR back in 2002, together with John Kerry, John Edwards, Chuck Hagel .....

Hindsight is 20-20. But back in 2002 we could not know for sure if Saddam had WMD or not.

[BOSSHOG]

29. Both are true statements

Why does a voter have to be pigeonholed into having just one reason for voting for a candidate? Its ludricrous to pick one or the other.