Mark Penn on Msnbc right now...talking about

[adabfree]

Cash contribution....

[H2O Man]

1. I like Senator Clinton,

but I think this fellow is a swine.

[Carolina]

11. and he's her campaign strategist...

birds of a feather

[flpoljunkie]

12. Remember it was Hillary who urged Bill to bring Dick Morris into the WH. Morris enlisted Mark Penn.

(Emphasis mine.)

Spinning Hillary Centrist

by ARI BERMAN

As Hillary Clinton charges toward the Democratic nomination for President, her campaign has a coterie of influential advisers. There's her husband, of course, widely regarded as one of the sharpest political strategists in the business. There's über-Washington insider and former head of the Democratic National Committee Terry McAuliffe. There are A-list policy wonks like former Treasury Secretary Bob Rubin. But perhaps the most important figure in the campaign is her pollster and chief strategist, Mark Penn, a combative workaholic. Penn is not yet a household name, but perhaps he should be. Inside Hillaryland, he has elaborately managed the centrist image Hillary has cultivated in the Senate. The campaign is polling constantly, and Penn's interpretation of the numbers will in large part decide her political direction.

Yet Penn is no ordinary pollster. Beyond his connections to the Clintons, he not only polls for America's biggest companies but also runs one of the world's premier PR agencies. This creates a dilemma for Hillary: Penn represents many of the interests whose influence candidate Clinton--in an attempt to appeal to an increasingly populist Democratic electorate--has vowed to curtail. Is what's good for Penn and his business good for Hillary's political career? And furthermore, can she convincingly claim to fight for the average American with Penn guiding strategy in her corner?

Despite the risks he poses, it's easy to figure out why Hillary clings to Penn. The Clintons (like the Bushes) put a premium on loyalty, and they credit Penn with saving Bill's presidency. After the 1994 election, Democrats had just lost both houses of Congress and Clinton was floundering in the polls. At the urging of his wife, Bill turned to Dick Morris, a controversial friend from their time in Arkansas. Morris knew Penn from his days as a pollster in New York and brought him into the White House. Morris decided what to poll and Penn polled it. They immediately pushed Clinton to the right, enacting the now-infamous strategy of "triangulation," which co-opted Republican policies like welfare reform and tax cuts and emphasized small-bore issues that supposedly cut across the ideological divide. "They were the ones who said 'Make the '96 election about nothing except V-Chips and school uniforms,'" says a former Clinton adviser. When Morris got caught with a call girl, Penn became the most important adviser in Clinton's second term. "In a White House where polling is virtually a religion," the Washington Post reported in 1996, "Penn is the high priest." He became known as the "most powerful man in Washington you've never heard of."

Penn, who had previously worked in the business world for companies like Texaco and Eli Lilly, brought his corporate ideology to the White House. After moving to Washington he aggressively expanded his polling firm, Penn, Schoen & Berland (PSB). It was said that Penn was the only person who could get Bill Clinton and Bill Gates on the same phone line. Penn's largest client was Microsoft, and he saw no contradiction between working for both the plaintiff and the defense in what was at the time the country's largest antitrust case. A variety of controversial clients enlisted PSB. The firm defended Procter and Gamble's Olestra from charges that it caused anal leakage, blamed Texaco's bankruptcy on greedy jurors and market-tested genetically modified foods for Monsanto. Penn invented the concept of "inoculation," in which corporations are shielded from scandal through clever advertising and marketing. Selling an image, companies realized, was as important as winning a legislative favor.

[Carolina]

15. Birds of a feather

enough said.

As I watched Penn, all I could think is if HRC hired him, I'll never hire her!

[Unsane]

2. This guy is VILE

[adabfree]

4. Yeah

You see him pushing the debates and side stepping the questions.

He's slippery..yuck

[ChairmanAgnostic]

3. does not answer the questions.

"I am working around the clock"
without saying whether he would cut his 4 mill. fee.

wow. She REFUSED to debate in her race in New York. Now, she is BEGGING for a debate. What an effin hypocrite.

[9119495]

5. He's disgusting...

It is guys like this that need to shut the hell up so we can all get behind Clinton if she is the nominee. Watching him, I begin to think I could never support her kind of politics...I need to remember that it is really HIS kind of politics not hers I most detest.

[Carolina]

17. but she hired him

and continues to use him so his and her politics must be in sync!

[9119495]

25. I know...

but I sort of see him like Obama's Donnie McClurken(sp?) in the Clinton campaign.

[K Gardner]

6. Penn lost the upper lip flop sweat but was REALLY having a bad hair day. I have GOT to

stop watching him on HDTV ! Scarryyyyy.....

And yeah, he's swine. Clearly, we see the spin that will be spewed all over this board and elsewhere today.

Waaaaa... poor Hillary.. mean old Barack has more money and won't debate her 24/7 so she can get free publicity. This debate shit is the oldest trick in the book. But we'll see 20 dozen threads on it here today, guaranteed.

[Apollo11]

9. "This debate shit is the oldest trick in the book."

Let me see if I understand the point you are making.

You don't see any point in having televised debates.

You would rather just have the candidates flying from city to city, delivering the same old stump speech to groups of already-decided supporters.

Me - I really appreciate the televised debates. I like to see how the candidates deal with questions and how they explain their positions. It helps me to compare the candidates on the issues.

[Independent-Voter]

16. What a crock of shit

Jesus Christ some of ya'll are fucking dense. They ALREADY DEBATED 18 TIMES! 10 More than in 2004. There are already more debates scheduled. Why the fuck are you asking for more debates at this time?!

[islandmkl]

18. you know something's up when

a candidate won't debate you when YOU want them to....oh, wait...that was HRC's stance up until recently. Forget the TV 'corporate' debates...those are mostly 'Hollywood Squares'. A debate is argue and answer. To call for expanded debates NOW reeks of nothing more than a tactic. State your case daily, let the people decide.

[Apollo11]

19. Most folks didn't watch those early debates.

Because too much time was being taken up by no-hope candidates like Chris Dodd.

Now folks are finally paying attention, we need more debates.

At least one more before March 4th. It's gotta be better than nothing.

PS - take a chill pill! :hi:

[K Gardner]

21. Free Air Time for Hillary. Pure and simple. Also, its their intent to try to

make Obama look like "he's afraid" if he doesn't bite. This has been used for at least the last 4 GEs in order to paint someone, usually a democrat, a "coward". It is now being used by a dem against a dem. Why am I not surprised it is Hillary and Mark Penn and surrogates who are doing it? Obama has the money, resources and desire to actually VISIT ALL THE STATES and talk to the people.. in person. The voters want this. Hillary is afraid of it.

[K Gardner]

20. Hillary... is that you?? Because somebody sure is spinning the hell out of what

I just said and that's kind of the same garbage you and your buddy Penn are doing with this faux debate issue. How many so far.. 13? All televised? But this is all about the voters, right? LOL.

[CoffeeCat]

23. It's not about "debates"...

At this point in time, Hillary is running low on funds and is unable to launch
a mass tv-ad buy. She needs the exposure.

That is her reason for asking for all of those debates. It's not about
enlightening you with more banter from a podium.

Obama is being smart and rebuffing her attempts to get free media coverage.

As he should.

I think you can learn more about a candidate when you see them in person. In the upcoming
states, most voters will have direct access to the candidates. It's possible to ask them
a question. I know Obama hangs around after his speeches.

In any case, Hillary shouldn't be making her lack of cash-flow---Obama's problem.

[Carolina]

14. I agree about the media hosted debates

so many seconds to respond debates... I zoned out on the last one.

Better to spend the time campaigning. The more people know Obama the better.

[pdxmom]

7. He gives me the creeps. I thought his argument about not cutting his

pay was weak. Sounded to me like he was saying "I'm working really, really hard, so I deserve every dime of that $4M."

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

8. Him and Wolfson, two guys that should never be in front of the cameras.

[underpants]

10. I looked him up the other day-this guy is a heart attack waiting to happen

[Leopolds Ghost]

24. Separated at Birth?

[Bluenorthwest]

13. Penn is skeevey

The behind the curtain folk in both camps are preventing me from picking a candidate to vote for. The two themselves I tend to like. It is the hired hands and spouses that keep ticking me off.

[Marie26]

27. Both campaign managers

are pretty skeevy - Axelrod & Penn both look & act like the worst stereotype of a sleazy lawyer.

[madrchsod]

22. no wonder gore fired his ass

it`s all about judgment and hillary has failed that test when she keeps this guy around...

[GalleryGod]

26. His Rubber Check?