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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:13 AM
Original message
Obama on single payer health care counters Hillary's attempt to distort
Edited on Tue Jan-22-08 11:15 AM by ProSense
Hillary's campaign attempts to distort:

UPDATE Now and Then: Sen. Obama on Single Payer Health Care

1/21/2008 9:42:37 PM

Tonight Obama said "I never said that we should try to go ahead and get single payer."

It was the AP who reported that Sen. Obama could have a pretty good debate with himself: If he wanted, the Barack Obama of today could have a pretty good debate with the Barack Obama of yesterday.

The fact is, Sen. Obama said he was a proponent of a single payer health care plan not just in principle but in practice:

So the challenge is, how do we get federal government to take care of this business? I happen to be a proponent of a single payer health care program. I see no reason why the United States of America the wealthiest country in the history of the world, spending 14% of its Gross National Product on health care cannot provide basic health insurance to everybody. And thats what Jim is talking about when he says everybody in, nobody out. A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And thats what Id like to see. And as all of you know, we may not get their (sic) immediately. Because firs (sic) we have to take back the white house, we have to take back the senate, we have to take back the house. (VIDEO: Obama remarks at AFL-CIO, 6/30/03)

Today, he opposes single payer health care, and attacks Sen. Clinton for proposing a plan that covers everyone.


(emphasis added)

Note that two of the links at Hillary's site do not work.

Obama's position:

Fact Check: Obama Consistent in His Position on Single Payer Health Care

January 21, 2008

Rhetoric: "Today, he opposes single payer health care, and attacks Sen. Clinton for proposing a plan that covers everyone"

Reality: Obama Has Consistently Said That If We Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System, But Now We Need To Build On The System We Have

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System.
The New Yorker wrote, "'If you're starting from scratch,' he says, 'then a single-payer system'-a government-managed system like Canada's, which disconnects health insurance from employment-'would probably make sense. But we've got all these legacy systems in place, and managing the transition, as well as adjusting the culture to a different system, would be difficult to pull off. So we may need a system that's not so disruptive that people feel like suddenly what they've known for most of their lives is thrown by the wayside.'" (New Yorker, 5/7/07)

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System. "At a roundtable with a handful of invited guests at Lindy's Diner in Keene, Obama said if he were starting from scratch, he would probably propose a single payer health care system, but because of existing infrastructure, he created a proposal to improve the current system." (Concord Monitor, 8/14/07)

If Obama Were Starting From Scratch, He Would Support A Single Payer System. Obama said, "Here's the bottom line. If I were designing a system from scratch I would probably set up a single-payer system...But we're not designing a system from scratch...And when we had a healthcare forum before I set up my healthcare plan here in Iowa there was a lot of resistance to a single-payer system. So what I believe is we should set up a series of choices....Over time it may be that we end up transitioning to such a system. For now, I just want to make sure every American is covered...I don't want to wait for that perfect system...The one thing you should ask about the candidates though is who's gonna have the capacity to actually deliver on the change?...I believe I've got a better capacity to break the gridlock and attract both Independents and Republicans to work together." (http://iowa.barackobama.com/page/community/tag/Ames )


Mandates Don't Lower Costs

January 21, 2008

MANDATES DON'T LOWER COSTS

Massachusetts Officials Concede Mandates Don't Lead To Universal Coverage.
"Jon M. Kingsdale, executive director of the Commonwealth Health Insurance Connector Authority, the agency that markets the subsidized insurance policies...acknowledged that their universal coverage plan is not likely to be universal anytime soon. 'There's good evidence,' Mr. Kingsdale said, 'whether it's buying auto insurance or wearing seat belts or motorcycle helmets, that mandates don't work 100 percent.'" (New York Times. 11/20/74)

One In Five Uninsured In Massachusetts Will Be Exempt From The Mandate, Individual Mandate Would Only Apply To "Those Who Can Afford The Premiums." The Boston Globe reported, "Interestingly, the Commonwealth Health Insurance Connector Authority, the bureaucrats in charge of implementing the plan, decided that the universal individual mandate does not apply to everyone, but rather only those who can afford the premiums. Therefore, nearly one in five of the currently uninsured will be exempt from the law." (Boston Globe, 5/15/07)


OBAMA COVERS EVERYONE UNDER HIS PLAN

Washington Post: "It Could Be A Struggle For Clinton To Find Someone Who Wants Health Insurance But Doesn't Qualify Under The Obama Plan, Because It's Not Clear Such A Person Exists."
The Washington Post reported, "For people who want to get health insurance and make an effort to do so, Clinton and Obama have almost exactly the same plan It could be a struggle for Clinton to find someone who wants health insurance but doesn't qualify under the Obama plan, because it's not clear such a person exists." (Washington Post, 11/28/07)


MORE PEOPLE WOULD COMPLY WITH OBAMA'S PLAN

Antos: Obama's "Health Care Plan Could Actually Have A Better Compliance Rate" Than Hillary's.
The New York Times reported, "Mr. Obama's health plan could actually have a better compliance rate. The 15 million who would supposedly be left out equal about 5 percent of the population a smaller portion than are going without auto insurance, said Joseph Antos, a health policy expert at the American Enterprise Institute, a nonpartisan group." (New York Times, 12/5/07)

Reich: Obama's Health Care Plan Would Cover "More People" Than Hillary's. "I've compared the two plans in detail. Both of them are big advances over what we have now. But in my view Obama's would insure more people, not fewer, than HRC's. That's because Obama's puts more money up front and contains sufficient subsidies to insure everyone who's likely to need help including all children and young adults up to 25 years oldIn short: They're both advances, but O's is the better of the two. HRC has no grounds for alleging that O's would leave out 15 million people." (Robert Reich, 12/3/07)

CLINTON PLAN WILL NOT INCLUDE EVERYONE

Clinton Campaign Health Care Adviser: Clinton's Health Care Plan Will Not Include Everybody.
"MIT economics professor Jonathan Gruber, one of Clinton's health care advisersacknowledges that the Clinton plan will not include everybody. 'Any system that does not have a single payer will not have 100 per cent coverage,' he told me, when I reached him after the Las Vegas debate. 'But you can come very close.'" (Washington Post Fact Checker, 11/19/07)

Clinton's Plan Could Leave Out As Many As 4.5 Million People. The Washington Post wrote, "The system proposed by Clinton is more analagous to the government-subsidized private insurance system in the Netherlands, where roughly one and a half per cent of the population is estimated to fall through the cracks." One and a half percent of the US population is 4.5 million people. (Washington Post Fact Checker, 11/19/07; US Census, accessed 12/1/07)

Harvard Program On Public Opinion And Health And Social Policy's Robert Blendon: Clinton's Health Care Plan Isn't Going To Cover Everybody. "Robert Blendon, director of the Harvard Program on Public Opinion and Health and Social Policy (said that) 'At the end of the dayit's not going to be everybody.'" (FactCheck.org, 11/16/07)

Urban Institute's John Holohan: Clinton's Plan Won't Eliminate The Problem Of Uninsured Altogether. John Holohan, the author of a study conducted at the Urban Institute, a Washington-based think tank, does not believe that either the Clinton or the Obama plan will eliminate the problem of the uninsured altogether. "We would all be very happy if we got down to one and a half per cent," he said. (Washington Post Fact Checker, 11/19/07)



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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
1. ...Obama said "I never said that we should try to go ahead and get single payer."
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Inuca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. What part of
IF WE WERE STARTING FROM SCRATCH is not clear?
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Quote from the debate:
Now, it's fine for us to have a debate about how the best way to get there is, but to suggest somehow that I'm not interested in having anybody covered, or to suggest, as Hillary just did, that I was in favor of single payer -- I never said that we should try to go ahead and get single payer. What I said was that if I were starting from scratch, if we didn't have a system in which employers had typically provided health care, I would probably go with a single-payer system.

link
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ljm2002 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:35 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. So Obama is arguing...
...that, since our system is already in place, we cannot dismantle it and DO THE RIGHT THING? The thing that ALL other advanced nations do -- and get better results for less money?

Now that is what I call a compelling position. Not.

On the other hand -- it's not just Obama, it's all three of the front runners. Not one of them supports the real solution to our health care woes.

Oh well -- take what we can get, I guess. Of the three, I'll take Edwards, who is simply the most progressive across the board of the three of them.

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Here
Barack Obama and Health Care (includes independent analyses of the three candidates' plans)
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
4. Kick! n/t
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rinsd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
5. IOW, Obama does not support single payer.
If we started from scratch?

What kind of lame ass excuse is that.

At least Edwards & Clinton's plans have possible bridges to single payer.

Obama's does not.
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no name no slogan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
7. Both Obama's and Clinton's plans are Nixon-esque
It's a sad day when the "major" Democratic presidential candidates in 2008 are running on a health care plan that's like the one Nixon proposed-- in 1974.

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jan-22-08 05:35 PM
Response to Original message
9. Kick! n/t
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eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 05:09 AM
Response to Original message
10. Get real. None of the front runners want single payer
Only Kucinich does.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 07:36 PM
Response to Original message
11. Kick! n/t
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KennedyGuy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 07:36 PM
Response to Original message
12. depends on what the meaning of single payer is...
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-23-08 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
13. Mandates w/ competing insurance plans do lower costs
Make the private insurers compete w/ government plans like Medicare, etc. and you'll see some lower costs.

Mandates w/o competition or oversight on pricing among private insurers only is like corporate welfare.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 08:53 AM
Response to Original message
14. Kick! n/t
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agdlp Donating Member (363 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-24-08 08:57 AM
Response to Original message
15. Obama 2003 words: Single payer health care plan, universal health care plan, thats what i like to se
I happen to be a proponent of a singel payer universal helth care plan.you know the reacon why?
United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world,
spending 14 %, 14 % of its gross national product on health care canot provide
basic healt ensurance to everybody. Thats whats Jims talking about, he says..everyobody in, nobody out.
Single payer health care plan, universal health care plan, thats what i like to see.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=32maPZg_Ukc
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