The Big story coming out of SC is Hillary's complete collapse among blacks and other non-whites

[Joe the Revelator]

Its quite amazing. She's alienated everyone who isn't white. She's quickly becoming the Ron Paul of Democratic Party race relations.

[Joe the Revelator]

1. She's pulling 19% among blacks and 14% among "other races"

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/pdf/PPP_SC_Release_011308.pdf

You can't win a GE this way.

[Colobo]

2. LOL! Good post!

[jlake]

3. And with 19% of whites, Obama will have a tough time too.

[Joe the Revelator]

4. He never held the support of SC's white voters. He is leading with woman though....that should worry

Hillary.

[jlake]

5. It does not matter if he ever held the lead.... people keep telling me that

Obama transcends race, and clearly he does not.

[AX10]

7. True.

[Joe the Revelator]

9. Where did you get this talking point?

Against two white candidates he's pulling 20% of the white vote in the south. I'd say thats pretty damn good. The real worry is why Hillary has lost most of her support among non-whites.

[jlake]

17. Um, that has been a talking point from the Obama supporters. As the case for his electibility

people claim he 'transcends race" and "can carry the south in the GE" And no, I do not think 19% of whites is good, nor do I think 19% of blacks for Hillary is good.

[loveangelc]

11. does Hillary transcend sex?

[jlake]

22. Yes, and that has not been a big selling point of her campaign.

Unlike Obama claiming to transcend race.

[loveangelc]

26. yes it has.

she has made the fact that she is a woman an issue many times. she brings up the fact that she will be the first female president all the time. obama never seems to do that.

[jlake]

27. Well, I would hope that Obama doesn't bring up that he would be the first female president because

even his most ardent supporters would question that.

Obama claims he can transcend race and win the South in the GE. These polls show that is wrong.
Hillary may bring up the historical nature of becoming the first female president, but she does not claim to "transcend gender" the way Obama does race.

[loveangelc]

29. when has he said exactly "I transcend race?"

the fact that he is biracial in a way is transcending in itself.

[jlake]

31. It has been the media storyline and heavily used by the campaign

and his supporters on DU.... doubt that he has specifically proclaimed " I transcend race"
Just google "Obama transcend race" "Obama transcending race" .... a pattern emerges.

[Bread and Circus]

16. he has tried to transcend race, but the Clintons are making damn

sure he doesn't by reminding everyone he's black (at least every other day it seems). Granted, they are doing this through surrogates, but it's there.

And no the Clintons are not racist, just crafty (although ethically bereft).

[jlake]

18. If the Clinton's have managed that....what would the GOP accomplish with Blatant, open and hostile

racism 24/7. NOT the mere distortions and exagerations put out by Obama and his surrogates.

[Bread and Circus]

23. point well taken but now that you admit Clinton's wrongdoing then

you must really want to reconsider ardently supporting someone with a lack of core ethical principles.

But I do appreciate the admission (tacit as it may be).

[jlake]

25. No, As my post said:

"NOT the mere distortions and exagerations put out by Obama and his surrogates."

The fairy tale thing really gets me.... it is ABSOLUTELY 100% Clear what Bill was talking about.... and to try to spin that is shameful.

[Bread and Circus]

28. Like I said, I appreciate the tacit admission. You didn't come out

and say it, but it's there. The "if you think what Hill and Bill are doing is bad, just wait till you see what the Republicans do to him" threat is not a coincidence.

You are what some might call an apologist.

And I read Bill Clinton's words regarding his "fairy tale" statement and no, they weren't racially colored. However, I did read them in context and it's part of their meme that "Obama has no substance".

It seems to me Obama's legal career and Senate career are comparable to Hillary's. This makes the "fairy tale" statement out of line imo. It's the "say anything to get elected" politics people are tired of.

BTW, Hillary failed her D.C. Bar exam before she went to Arkansas with Bill and became a corporate lawyer, working for Walmart and Tyson foods, so meditate on those "years of experience".

[jlake]

30. It was not any admission, and I am not an apologist.....I have several issues with

the Clintons and DO NOT defend "pardon-gate" etc.

The point was "IF YOU THINK" ... Not that I agree they have done anything wrong/racially motivated.

The fairy tale was completely about his anti-Iraq war stance....and I agree with Bill 100% on that (one of the few times I do agree with him 100% in fact)

I do think Obama is short on substance and has not proven himself to the public yet.

[Barack_America]

21. Unless Edwards' white supporters would break towards Obama.

That's the big question.

[jlake]

24. If 100% switched to Obama, he would still fall well short of Hillary.

[smalll]

6. This isn't the Lounge; do they allow copycat threads here? /nt

[Joe the Revelator]

8. I'm sorry it didn't fit into the way you wanted the debate to be framed.

nt

[Occam Bandage]

10. Absolutely. She is becoming the candidate of white liberal females only.

Unfortunately for her campaign, other voting blocs exist, too. It'll be a McCain landslide.

[dkf]

12. All I know is the Clinton's stinky tactics against Howard Dean alienated

me for life.

She needs to be careful about pissing off blacks because if they get as offended as I did, they are never coming back.

[Bread and Circus]

19. I've been wondering how former Dean supporters feel about Clinton..

considering how Dean has been treated by the Clintonites (McAuliffe, Carville).

It seems to me that he ran as the anti-DLC and they didn't like that. Especially given that he was ardently anti Iraq war and Clinton has in her actions been pro Iraq war (and yes, I'm aware of her rhetoric but when people die it's the actions that count).

[gateley]

13. Wow - The BIG story --

her COMPLETE collapse. It's AMAZING! She's alienated EVERYONE who isn't white. The RON PAUL of the Democratic Party. :eyes:

Sincerely,
not a Hillary supporter, and even I find this beneath you.

[Joe the Revelator]

15. It was a response to a thread equally full of hubris and hyperbole

Maybe I should have made that more clear.

[gateley]

20. I should have known better than to jump in -- I've been steering clear but

you caught me right at the time I just couldn't take one more subject line like this. Lucky you. :7

[depakid]

14. LOL. I reckon I'll wait and see how the results turn out

before making any sage pronouncements....