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SaveElmer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:52 AM
Original message
Obama backer, WY Dem.Chairman uses Lewinsky affair to trash Hillary...

The Democratic Party chairman in Wyoming is predicting that Democratic candidates throughout the Rocky Mountain region will be damaged if his party selects Hillary Clinton for president.

"Every Democratic candidate in Wyoming will be painted with that same liberal, big-government brush. We will also be the target of the locker room jokes that rightfully belong to Bill Clinton," John Millin wrote in a letter to The Denver Post.

"While I don't agree with this view of Mrs. Clinton, I have to accept that this is the truth. It has become the dirty little secret in the Democratic Party," he wrote. "Westerners have an independent, libertarian spirit and Democrats can make Republicans pay a heavy price for years of pandering to the social conservatives. None of this will happen if Hillary wins the nomination."

...

The Clinton campaign dismissed Millin's comments as the work of a surrogate for a rival candidate, Sen. Barack Obama. The Democratic National Committee and the state Democratic spokesman in Wyoming hastened to point out that the party is neutral in the primary campaign and that Millin's opinions are his own. Wyoming Gov. Dave Freudenthal, a Democrat, declined to comment. Millin is a superdelegate who has thrown his support to Obama.

"Hillary Clinton's been a change agent for 35 years, and she's the only candidate who's taken on the Republican attack machine and won," campaign spokesman Isaac Baker said. "That's why poll after poll shows her beating the Republican candidates in a general-election matchup."

Larry Drake, a Denver volunteer for Clinton and a Vietnam War combat veteran, characterized Obama as a onetime advocate of handgun bans. "We believe in gun rights in the West," he said. "If this guy thinks Obama is more electable than Hillary, I'd like to know why."


http://www.denverpost.com/breakingnews/ci_7716742

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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
1. good
why set up for a loss? it's stupid.

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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. Do you hold the same opinion concerning BHO's admitted cocaine use?
I didn't think so.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #5
10. didn't think so
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #10
21. Why? His cocaine use will be broght up.
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Franc_Lee Donating Member (287 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #5
69. Bush Gore drug use was never brought up, Obama's will be dealt with
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dbackjon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #1
6. Why do you assume it is a loss?
Clinton can beat the Republicans.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #6
15. no she can't
it'll be a fucking nightmare. her against the perfect opponent, then she barely gets in, and we lose the congress and senate.

that's not a good win to have.
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dbackjon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #15
20. I think you underestimate Clinton
And overestimate the public's love of Rethugs.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #20
32. i think some people are following a false idol
and feeding off their own hype.

no matter who wins, it's going to be knock-down bloody knuckles, brawl. she'll be bad for the party. she may win if she has the right opponent, but she'll have a hostile congress.

hopefully, i won't have to live through that. the past 7 years are bad enough.

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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #15
24. is there ANYTHING you candidate or his campaign could do or say that would be a problem for you?
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 12:02 PM by MNDemNY
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #24
38. sure there is
if Christopher Dodd were to murder someone, i'd drop my support.

happy now?

didn't think so.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:09 PM
Original message
Really, it would require murder? A conviction, or just an indictment?
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 12:09 PM by MNDemNY
That is an incredibly silly view.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
48. obviously, i was being coy
but then again, you think i support Obama, so i don't care about your opinion since it's coming from a preset, or dishonest angle.
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #48
56. You support Dodd?
Saweet! I thought he was awesome in last nights debate actually I think he has been awesome in every debate and lord knows he has authored some great legislation!

Kudos to you for not jumping on a bandwagon and supporting the candidate you like the best!
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #56
59. i think he's great
i'm torn though - i'm more ideally matched with DK, but Dodd is close. if he's still alive and kicking on Super-Duper Tuesday, he's getting my vote. i know DK will stay till the end, so i can vote for him if Dodd's fire fighters don't pull off a miracle in Iowa.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #48
57. You make big leaps with out knowing anything.
I can assume that you are anti Hillary from your numerous other posts.But, it is irrelevant. What is my pre set dishonest angle? What is your pre set dishonest angle?
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #15
39. lol!
are you bound and determined to demonstrate your political ignorance with each post in this thread? No, we don't lose Congress (btw, Congess is both the House and the Senate) And you might consider retiring your cheapo crystal ball. You've been suckered.

:rofl:
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #39
46. are you bound and determined
to lay out the personal attacks?

:rofl:
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emilyg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
51. Yes. She can.
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sniffa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #51
52. no she can't
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
2. A bit of a stretch dont you think?
Locker room jokes about Bill = "trashing Hillary"? Come on.
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dbackjon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #2
12. No different
People know what he is refering to. The Reich-wing smear machine has firmly implanted it in everyone's head.
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #12
27. Right.
As if anyone on the planet has forgotten. Please.
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TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #2
18. Keep reading...
"While I don't agree with this view of Mrs. Clinton, I have to accept that this is the truth. It has become the dirty little secret in the Democratic Party," he wrote."

The discussion is obviously about Hillary, not Bill.
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Colobo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #2
19. A bit of a stretch? A lot, you mean... Elmer can do better than this.
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #19
63. Now we find out this guy isnt even part of the Obama campaign!
Geebus! :banghead:
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
3. Obamanation will turn this to a smear on BHO.
Illogical? Yes, but they will do it anyway. Disagree, you are a racist or, worse yet a freeper troll.
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dbackjon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
4. The Obama campaign needs to fire him immediately
Every Obama supporter needs to call the Obama campaign NOW and demand his resignation.


Every Obama supporter on DU needs to post a thread condemning the negativity of the Obama campaign, since this obviously was a statement that Obama wanted one of his supporters to make, and thus supports it 100%
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
8. You see this the same as planting the idea that Obama was a drug dealer?
really?
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #8
13. On many levels, yes, absolutely.
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dbackjon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. Yup
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. How so?
Bill *DID* have an affair... and then he lied about it. Fact vs Fiction.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #22
30. Obama DID use cocaine. It WILL be an issue.
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #30
44. I agree that the cocaine use will probably be an issue... however,
Shaheens planting of the seed that he was a drug dealer is incredibly low. This Obama guy isnt planting the seed of anything, as I see it. The affairs will be brought up... this is to be expected.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #44
50. He merely pointed out the questions that WILL be asked.
No slur there.
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #50
60. Will?
Did the repubs accuse Bill Clinton or Al Gore of being drug dealers? What basis is there to know what *will* be asked?

Would it also be fair to say that due to Bills affairs the Repubs *will* accuse Hillary of being somehow involved them? Of course not. If this guy had said something like that, then Id see it as the same. He didnt as far as I can tell.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #22
45. Of course it's the same thing
and it does not speak well of people at all when they condemn one and not the other.
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bunnies Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #45
53. I just dont see it that way...
Is someone making things up about Bill and Im not seeing it? Are they rolling out character damaging hypothesis that have no basis in fact? Thats how I see what the Clinton camp did to Obama... and I just dont see it here.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. No, it would be OK to allow him to resign.
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DURHAM D Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:00 PM
Original message
Does this mean that Obama will need to fly around the country
until he can catch up with Hillary and offer his personal apology to her? Isn't that the right thing to do?

Come on Barakanoids - you have been overwrought about any slight to your candidate from volunteers and supporters. You know what your guy should do if he is a stand up guy. Call the office - demand he act like a man instead of a boy.
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
28. The Obama campaign can't fire him.
He is not employed by the Obama campaign.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
29. Yeah, just like all the Clinton supporters DEMANDED that Shaheen be fired.
Oh wait...they didn't. :eyes:
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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
34. Fire him? I don't think he works for the campaign in any capacity. I read it and the
only connection I saw was that he is a super-delegate who supports Obama. He works for the state DNC, I believe.

Did I miss some official capacity within the campaign?

I think the Obama campaign should say he doesn't speak for the campaign but it doesn't appear that he said he did.
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beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #4
54. No way. Nothing outrageous about this remark. Plus the Hillary supporters
have made their bed -- that Hillary is not responsible for her campaign -- so they must lie in it. They can no longer attack Obama supporters or campaign workers for what they say, since they so quickly dismissed what Hillary's national and NH co-chair had to say, as being 100% independent from Hillary.
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Adelante Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #4
55. Fire him from what? Resign from what?
The guy's an obvious asshole for saying this, but he is not a co-chair of the Obama campaign as Shaheen was of the Clinton's New Hampshire campaign. He is not a volunteer coordinator as those in Iowa. He has no official position whatever with the Obama campaign. He is an endorser. He is an asshole. If we are to get rid of all asshole endorsers who go negative, there may not be many left for any candidate.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
7. Bill had an affair with Lewinsky when he was a teenager or when he was in the White House?
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 11:58 AM by blm
I can't seem to remember which or which one would be more relevant.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #7
16. Tripe.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #7
17. Yes, the Obama people don't smear and slime.
Pure whited sepulchers, they are.
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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:00 PM
Response to Reply #17
23. Ya, the whole walk on water thing.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
11. What a sleazy schmuck. Obama must be proud.
Or is he still cruising on that cocaine high?
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Bullet1987 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #11
25. Is he a higher up in the Obama campaign like Shaheen was
for Clinton?
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #25
37. He's not employed by the campaign
He is the Democratic Party Chairman who, incidentally, supports Obama. I presume, it would be the National Party who would be empowered with asking him to step down.
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maddiejoan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
26. This is nothing new
This is exactly what Obama (not a surrogate) is saying when he talks about Hillary's "baggage" wink wink.

Nobody calls Obama on it though. "Cos he's soooo dreamy.
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Bullet1987 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #26
33. He's not even part of the Obama campaign...
he just supports him. How can people compare this to Shaheen?
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maddiejoan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #33
42. Is Obama higher up in the campaign
Then Shaheen?

Because Obama does "wink wink" references to the camera on this all the time.

She has "baggage". What do you think he means?
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
31. Well that was stupid
True, but incredibly stupid for this guy to do this. Wyoming is also not New Hampshire and this Millin guy is not Billy Shaheen.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:05 PM
Response to Original message
35. I think this is wrong, especially considering the antics of the rethugs
the past few years. Why not target them?

As for your highlighting the gun issue, I'm all for handgun bans myself.

And when mentioning Lewinsky, which wasn't done in the article, you forgot Flowers, Jones, et al. I like Bill, but his indiscretions did damage our party and opinions of it, that can't be denied.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
36. Is this guy working in Obama's campaign?
Says he's the Dem Party chair, not an Obama staffer.
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Luminous Animal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #36
40. No.
His negative opinion is no different than the barrage of negative opinions expressed on this board.
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Bullet1987 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:08 PM
Response to Reply #36
43. No...he doesn't work for the Obama campaign
That's why I think Katz said SaveElmer was stretching...
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
41. Um, this guy was not a member of Obama's campaign at all -- he's the Dem Party chairman of Wyoming
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 12:09 PM by ClarkUSA
He was speaking for himself, despite Hillaryworld spin and lies.

However, Bill Shaheen was THE NATIONAL CO-CHAIRMAN OF THE CLINTON CAMPAIGN.
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maddiejoan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #41
47. Uhm
Billy Shaheen was a co-chair of NH campaign.
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mrreowwr_kittty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #47
64. self delete
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 12:52 PM by thecatburgler
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TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #41
58. He isn't a national co-chairman. The original AP story misidentified him.
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 12:24 PM by TwilightZone
He's a co-chair in NH.

Edit: clarification
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maddiejoan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #58
61. Not even
He was "a" co-chair. Not "the" co-chair
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TwilightZone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. Agreed.
Co-chair, of course, assumes that he's one of at least two.
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beachmom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
49. And? I don't see anything outrageous in what he said. It was pretty mild.
Plus, you have made it abundantly clear that candidates aren't responsible for what others say in their campaign. Of course, this guy isn't in the Obama campaign, and unlike the Incident, is not a co-chair for Obama either for a state or nationally. Looks like he is an Obama backer, and I do think what supporters say do reflect on the candidate. He stated something that EVERYONE knows, and did not continue by smearing in Fox News Question Mark style Bill or Hillary.
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Forkboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 01:20 PM
Response to Original message
65. What a yarn ball of a quote. And Hillary supporters were calling Obama a baby? Oy vey.
This guy, unlike Shaheen, doesn't even work for the campaign. And that's a hell of a lot tamer than trying to push a drug use story. You Hillary supporters are showing all the signs of a classic meltdown, and this kind of desperation to find some petty shit to counter the Shaheen nonsense is so weak and transparent that I find it hard to believe that anyone other than a Hillary groupie will find anything here.

If you find someone actually in the Obama campaign that actually says something beyond the yarn ball of a quote you have here let me know and I'll speak up about it. Fair enough?
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meowomon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
66. I think it is fair.
It is one of the major reasons I wouldn't vote for Hillary. Any woman that would put up with an unfaithful man is not the kind of woman I want running this country. She should have booted him out and run on her own merit instead of his coattail.
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Scriptor Ignotus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
67. and another Obama hit piece falls apart
add it to the list. (damn, that list is getting long...)
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Phunktified Donating Member (50 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
68. Obama yesterday, Obama today
http://primaryblue.blogspot.com/2007/12/on-negative-cam...
On negative campaigning

Team Obama yesterday:

Axelrod said Obama "takes her at her word" but said Obama "also made it clear that campaigns have to send a message from the top down that negative campaigning...is not something to be celebrated and embraced."

Team Obama today:

"Every Democratic candidate in Wyoming will be painted with that same liberal, big-government brush. We will also be the target of the locker room jokes that rightfully belong to Bill Clinton," John Millin wrote in a letter to The Denver Post.

"While I don't agree with this view of Mrs. Clinton, I have to accept that this is the truth. It has become the dirty little secret in the Democratic Party," he wrote.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
70. Geeesh. Get a hold of yourselves, people.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-14-07 02:28 PM
Response to Original message
71. Was he "wondering " whether Bill was still whoring around behind Hillary's back?
Edited on Fri Dec-14-07 02:29 PM by ClarkUSA
Hmmm?
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