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flashl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 04:59 PM
Original message
What do you think? FL dems switch to GOP to vote primary
A Call for Floridians to Join Me: Switch to GOP!

I read Orlando Sentinels Democratic columnist Scott Maxwell todayand it inspired me to answer his call for me and my fellow Floridians to join the GOP!

Maybe I should explain before I lose my TU..

First, unless youve been living in the cave with Bin Laden, you know that the DNC has voted to take away the votes of all Florida Democrats. Why? Because the GOP-controlled state legislature voted to move the primary from late March to January 29.

(After the Supreme Court took our right to vote away, we are a tad sensitive about things like that.)

I know Dean is upset that us Dems here think we should have at least as much clout as South Carolina, the most GOP state in the union, and the right, white states of Iowa and NH, but the answer should be a better primary system, like a regional or national primary-NOT to disenfranchise the voters of an important state by taking ALL of our delegates away.


But Den didnt stop there. Dean strong-armed the candidates to agree not to campaign here to really stick it to Florida. AND LEST YOU THINK this is all about principle, the DNC says its perfectly acceptable to take as much campaign money as they want from the state. Nice.

The GOP, seeing the internal strife and backlash, decided to cut their delegates by 50%.

So Floridians are faced with a choicehave our vote count some, or have our vote count for nothing.

The solution is simple: GO to your election supervisors and switch your party registration for the upcoming GOP primary!

Vote for the GOP candidate you can at least stand, OR, vote for the GOP candidate you think will MOST LIKELY BE DEFEATED by the Dem candidate (thats my plan). At least youll be making a difference.

Since the top-tier candidates agreed to not campaign here but take our moneyIm not too keen on voting for any of them in the Dem primary. And it wouldnt count anyway.

AFTER the primary, switch back to being a Democrat. This is not only legal, according to state elections supervisors, this is a movement that they are currently experiencing. You can switch as much as you want.

If enough Floridians do this, this will make our point, our vote will count for something, and then we can go to work to doing what we should be doing in the first place: Working with the DNC to stop the GOP from winning the states 27 electoral votes!!!

If the DNC would wise up and target the GOP instead of their own foot soldiers in a major, swing state , (for the crime of wanting a say in our next leader), we might just pull off 2008. My fellow activists have worked their tail off to require paper ballots for 2008, to get good people to run, and to fight the GOP machine here. I hate having to fight my own party leadership-especially one that promised they would "count every vote."

Im switching my affiliation tomorrow, and then back to Dem the day after the primary. If you live in Florida I invite you to join me.



Things are getting weird in Florida!

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daninthemoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
1. It does bother me to see florida's dems invalidated once again,
this time by dean et al. Living here in Oklahoma, I also feel marginalized, but at least it's not officially sanctioned. I think you've come up with at least a partial answer to still have some voting power there, though. I say go for it. I just hope this whole thing doesn't turn off too many posible swing voters there.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
14. Ah, so you believe the "Dean stole your vote" thingy?
The Florida Democrats knew you would, so they employed that technique.

It really worked well.

They broke the rules, and they say Dean did it. Amazing how gullible folks are.

Amazing and sad.
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daninthemoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 06:42 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Ok, I'm not in florida, so PLEASE forgive my "gullibility" So, who
are "they", and what do they have to do with Hilary? Enlighten me.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #15
22. The Florida Dems have the media on their side. No one else has been defending the DNC
So I have been writing about it since it happpened. There are a lot of facets to the issues. But to me it is a pure and simple power play to keep the power out of the hands of anyone but the nominee. It never worried me before that the Nominee is in control all aspects of the party when they are chosen. But it disturbs me very much now.

I know who the power players in Florida are for, and those delegates will be restored anyway.

I hope that this outrageous move ny Florida will make some people think twice about why it happened in conjunction with Michigan.

The people are easy to fool when the media tells one side, and when the state party starts it out as propaganda.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Enough of this. Florida Democrats now threaten Dean and the DNC with a "voting rights probe".
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

The "appropriate legal official" to "investigate" Dean and the DNC...is...Gonzales.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Nelson: "I will lead the delegates to Denver whether or not the DNC plans to let them in."
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Two summaries of the DNC committee ruling about Florida.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Florida sowed the seeds of a propaganda war against the DNC.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Proof. Vindication. Both Florida parties did it for "relevance." From March.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

The latest Florida propaganda tactic here about attacking the DNC...local email.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Florida's Geller joked about his amendment: "sarcasm and audible laughter in chamber"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

One Florida county is saying there will be further bloodshed. Much argument here today.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Florida Democratic Party website building anger toward the DNC
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Democratic activist sues over loss of Florida delegates
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

"Dean was conciliatory and offered DNC help for the state"..hour long phone call
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Gelber admits they did not fight the GOP about the primary.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

"Primary bully Florida ought to be ashamed"...four articles catch on to Florida's primary ploy.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Bill Nelson today will file a bill for regional primaries...but first he had to get your attention
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Bill Nelson today: "DNC penalties unacceptable, unacceptable, unacceptable"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

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tkmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
21. Dean didn't take anybody's vote
The Florida Dems did. They broke the rules, rules they AGREED to, and now they are being held accountable. There is no choice really. If Florida is allowed to ignore the primary schedule than EVERY state will ignore it. There will be a mad race to go first, and it will be utter chaos.

The Florida Democratic leadership could correct this, even now, if they choose. Instead they are engaging in a nasty party civil war, and at a time when Democrats need to stand united against the Repubs more so than ever.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:08 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hopefully cooler heads will prevail and a compromise will be reached!
The DNC has foolishly decided to punish the Democratic voters in Florida and Michigan showing the world that voter disenfranchisement is not a GOP monopoly.

Hopefully cooler heads will prevail and a compromise will be reached!

Remember, there are more electoral votes in Florida and Michigan than in the ethanol peddling state of Iowa.
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kdmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
3. If they don't get this fixed
I plan to switch to GOP and write in someone horrible for President.. say.. Donald Rumsfield, or something like that.

What we need is a plan to vote in the GOP primary for the same person, so that all of Florida's Dems will send delegates to the GOP convention for John Ashcroft or Donald Rumsfield.

But we have to all be in it together, or it won't work.
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seasat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. How about Tom Tancredo?
He'd make a spectacularly horrible choice for the Repugs ... especially here in Florida. I like Maxwell's idea. I might consider it.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:18 PM
Response to Original message
5. I can not believe the DNC is being blamed for following rules..
that bring automatic sanctions.

So I am gathering this is planned by Florida Democrats and the media to effectively destroy the DNC, Dean, and state parties he is building up. And turn it all over the to nominee who will be Clinton.

Hail Hillary and her super power Dems here.

But I tried:

Enough of this. Florida Democrats now threaten Dean and the DNC with a "voting rights probe".
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

The "appropriate legal official" to "investigate" Dean and the DNC...is...Gonzales.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Nelson: "I will lead the delegates to Denver whether or not the DNC plans to let them in."
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Two summaries of the DNC committee ruling about Florida.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Florida sowed the seeds of a propaganda war against the DNC.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Proof. Vindication. Both Florida parties did it for "relevance." From March.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

The latest Florida propaganda tactic here about attacking the DNC...local email.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Florida's Geller joked about his amendment: "sarcasm and audible laughter in chamber"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

One Florida county is saying there will be further bloodshed. Much argument here today.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Florida Democratic Party website building anger toward the DNC
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Democratic activist sues over loss of Florida delegates
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

"Dean was conciliatory and offered DNC help for the state"..hour long phone call
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Gelber admits they did not fight the GOP about the primary.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

"Primary bully Florida ought to be ashamed"...four articles catch on to Florida's primary ploy.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Bill Nelson today will file a bill for regional primaries...but first he had to get your attention
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

Bill Nelson today: "DNC penalties unacceptable, unacceptable, unacceptable"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/...

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
6. This will be Hillary's party by Feb.
Hope you enjoy it.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. And it will be your fault for supporting the disenfranchisement of Florida and Michigan Democrats
I got to give Hillary credit for recognizing that a compromise is necessary, and that draconian measures are counterproductive.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. Florida decided 2000.
More clout than I ever want to see anyone have again.
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whopis01 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-10-07 09:33 PM
Response to Reply #7
32. That is such a slanted point of view
Florida did not have any more clout than any other state in the 2000 election (at least not any more than is proportional to its population).

3 electoral votes switching hands would have changed the outcome. There is no state in the union that has less than 3 electoral votes. Each and every state decided the outcome. Florida was just the last vote to be counted. If New Hampshire had gone for Gore, then the vote in Florida would have had no consequence whatsoever.

There were plenty of problems with the voting in Florida, but in now way did Florida get to single handedly decide 2000. It just voted last.

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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:37 PM
Response to Original message
8. I think that is a great idea. the republicans have been doing it for years (voting in our primaries)
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. I think it is bad idea to blame the one who followed rules...
and side with the state leaders who admit now to not following them.

Kind of sad to see it going down this way.

This is Bill Nelson's power play.
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robinlynne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. you have it backwards. The poster is suggesting voting repub becuase of what florida is doing.
I love howard Dean,. no criticisms there.
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Dinosaur Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-13-07 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #9
33. The "Rules" aren't written by Political Parties. Ever heard of, um, the CONSTITUTION?
Excuse me for thinking that I'm an American citizen. I live in Florida, so I'm just supposed to hand over money to whatever politician slums by entering my state, and I'm supposed to pay my taxes to support adventures in Iraq while shutting up about issues like the impact of undocumented workers on my state's schools and hospitals -- not to mention out of work contractors under bid by those hiring undocumenteds. But here's one thing everyone seems delighted to forget: voting rights don't flow from the benevolent dictators who are paid to run political parties. They come from the Constitution. And a political party that decides its going to keep a whole state from sitting at the table and picking a nominee is violating that document as much as a President who assumes authority to use 'signing statements' instead of a veto to disregard a law he disagrees with.

Here's another thing: it ain't national political parties that pay the cost of elections in each state. It's the voters of that state. You don't want our votes? Maybe we don't need to pay our taxes for "YOUR" election, since it sure won't be MY election - I'm just a second class citizen who doesn't get to play with the BIG IMPORTANT KIDS and pick a nominee or contribute my ideas to a platform.

I was a lifelong Dem. I'm now registering as an Independent. I hated what Ralph Nader did - now, I hope he or someone else of national stature runs as an independent so I can vote for them. Far as I'm concerned, whatever Dem you BIG and IMPORTANTS nominate won't be any more interested in my state's issues than the Meat-head running things now.

You differ from George W in degree, not kind. All of you are about "My way or the Highway". So, bye, bye, I'm hitting the High Road. Oh, and tell your sweetie pie honey bunchie-poo Deanie Weenie to stop e-mailing me for money. NO VOTE? NO MONEY!!!!
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ellenfl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 05:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. why change back? you can vote for anyone you want
in the general elections and screw with the repug candidates in all future primaries.

ellen fl
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 06:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. Vote for Ron Paul in the Repiglickin' Primary
He is less likely to win than most of the others, and less of a disaster than the others if he does.
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Labors of Hercules Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. Need to vote for the worst "frontrunner"... I'd say McCain for sure.
With all his campaign fuckups, He has no chance in hell of winning the GE.
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #17
27. My Strategy is Damage Control. Ron Paul Would do the Least Damage if He Wins
History shows us clearly that whomever the Repiglickins nominate, however incompetent and Wingnut, has a pretty good chance of "winning".

Look at the last 2 Presidential elections!

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flashl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 06:04 PM
Response to Original message
12. I am puzzled ...
I can understand the argument that Florida is making today and if they were indeed concern, then, why didn't Florida Dems make this argument last year after the schedule was announced. It is the timing that is puzzling.
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KaptBunnyPants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-10-07 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #12
28. Because then they couldn't pretend to be victims.
nm
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Dinosaur Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-13-07 10:53 PM
Response to Reply #28
34. Can't wait till your state needs something
We have long memories here in 'NonState of Florida'. We know who our friends are. We know who our enemies are. Anyone who disses the Constitution and says our right to vote flows from the Great God Political Party is our enemy. Next time you need support for something you want - go talk to your friends the Repugnicans. They love the way you're throwing Florida Dems under the bus.
You play right into their hands. Maybe they'll give you a few crumbs from the Big Kids table. I honestly couldn't imagine a way that the DNC could throw 2008 away, but now I know. Just discard a state. Oh, not Michigan, that's also changing the date of their primary. Just Florida, cause they're only a bunch of cows to milk for money to use for ads in other states.

Get your money from your Repugnican 'friends'. This dairy is closed.
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gnvresident Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:06 PM
Response to Original message
18. a little clarification
I guess I need to do more research but I thought there was still going to be a Democratic Primary in Florida. How can the Republicans have a Primary but not the Democrats? I personally want to use my vote to endorse Edwards in the Democratic Primary but if I can't vote for him I guess I will switch to Republican and vote in their Primary. Probably for Ron Paul and then switch back. If this is all true all Florida Democrats need to band together quickly and vote for Ron Paul. I don't think he could win but he is not too awful of a choice if does win.
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tkmorris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #18
20. The plan as of now is that there will be a primary
The trouble is that it won't mean anything. The winner of the Democratic primary, as it stands now, will not receive any delegates to the Democratic convention.
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flashl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #18
24. Florida Dem have options
From MadFloridian Journal:"Dean was conciliatory and offered DNC help for the state"..hour long phone call"

DNC members Jon Ausman and Allan Katz of Tallahassee and Janee Murphy of Tampa said Dean was conciliatory and offered DNC help for the state to find a way of picking delegates after Feb. 5 that would still offer maximum participation for the party rank-and-file.

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illinoisprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:15 PM
Response to Original message
19. Here is the just the right republican to vote for.....lol
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democratsin08 Donating Member (312 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
23. dems may be throwing florida away
this has me worried.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 07:59 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. Then blame the Florida Dems.
.
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Dinosaur Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-13-07 10:57 PM
Response to Reply #23
35. You should be worried
There are a lot of angry soon-to-be ex-Dems in Florida. All that stuff about 'counting every vote' - I guess that wasn't really true, was it? If a good independent shows up, she or he has my vote. I was a lifelong Dem; I'm registering Independent now. No Party hack has the right to tell me my Constitutional rights are gone because of the state I live in.
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gnvresident Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-09-07 09:02 PM
Response to Original message
26. All Florida Democrats should do this!!
I have decided this is a very worthwhile idea and I think all Democrats in Florida should do this. If we vote for Ron Paul and he does indeed win the nomination and on the sad chance the election too he would by far be the best choice for President out of all the Republicans. He used to be a Libertarian and would be so much better than Mitt, Fred or Rudy. Of course since I have been a registered Democrat since I turned 18 and went to get my voter id card it will feel somewhat like treason but this is most definately a good idea. Just imagine if every registered Democrat in the state of Florida switched party affiliation over this and we all voted for Ron Paul.
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FloridaJudy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-10-07 03:11 AM
Response to Original message
29. I'm seriously thinking about doing this
Unfortunately, my late mother's ghost is boxing my ears shouting "No child of mine would ever register as a Republican!"

I'll need a very large clothespin to follow through.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-10-07 06:24 AM
Response to Original message
30. I don't vote in Democratic local elections because the Florida Dems
almost never field a Democrat in my area. You think things are getting weird in Florida? Imagine how everybody else would feel in Florida if they understood just how incredibly corrupt the pillars of our community are.
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rateyes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-10-07 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
31. That's bullshit...
Howard Dean didn't take away Florida's delegates. Florida gave them away by not abiding by the rules they SUPPORTED in the first place. Florida is not any more important than Georgia or anybody else. Play by the rules, or get penalized. Nothing more fair than that.
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Dinosaur Donating Member (4 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-13-07 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #31
36. Rules or Constitution?
Please let me know when the voting rights given to all Americans were revised to say that they can only be used if in concert with
'rules' adopted by political parties. Someone forgot to send me that memo. I noticed that Michigan must not have gotten that memo, either, because their Governor signed a bill to allow their primary to move. Funny - no one seems to be taking away their right to sit at the table with the big kids.

No vote? Don't come here anymore with your big hands open for our money. Get your money from your friends the Rove-publicans. They couldn't have bought better publicity for their party than the cannabalistic act you just pulled on us.

Play by the rules? This isn't a game. Either we have a Constitution or we don't. Which is it - rule by law, or rule by Party Hack? What a great example we set for anyone else in the world looking to see what 'freedom' means. What's next - we all have to wear veils when we go vote, or else Party Hacks get to beat us up?

See you around the voting booth when I vote for an Independent, and take as many of my other ex-Dem friends and coworkers with me as I can. You're just sooooooooooooo 'fair'. Can't wait till some other state wants something from Florida. Answer won't be 'no', it'll be 'HAIL' NO....
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