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Here is the transcript in it's entirety. Audio is also available at securingamerica.com
Ed Schultz: Joining us on the program right now is General Wesley Clark, who was a Vietnam vet. In February, with one month into his command, he was shot four times by a Vietcong soldier with an AK-47. Clark was the Commander of A Company, First Battalion, 16th Infantry of the First Infantry Division in January of 1970. General Clark, great to have you back on the program.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Ed, I'm so happy to be with you.
Ed Schultz: You know, this museum where we're broadcasting from today is really been an eye-opener for many of us as we've done this for a number of years here. I think this is the, the fifth year that they have honored the Vietnam veterans. So many veterans have a hard time really talking about the experiences that they went through, and I think as a country, we've got to hear from these folks. H-how do, how do you deal with, with all of that and your experiences that you've gone through, General?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, personally, it took me a long time to really come to terms with what I'd been through. I, i-it's a matter of emotionally processing what's happened, what your role in it was. When people go through combat operations, they come out of it with a mixture of fear and anxiety and guilt and, and shame and anger, and all of these things get stirred up with some horrible images, typically. And it takes a while for someone to process that emotionally.
Ed Schultz: We, as a country, have got to understand that. Do you think we do?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Probably not. But I- i-it's, it's- What we really need is we, we need the professionals to understand it, and we need the resources behind it. The war in Iraq is different than the war was in Vietnam. In Vietnam, except for a few isolated cases, we were on the offensive. When I got shot, I was on a patrol. I was searching for the enemy. He just happened to see me before I saw him. But that's not the case with most of the casualties that occur in Iraq. These are caused by improvised explosive devices, for the most part. They're horrible, maiming wounds. It's not a matter of firing back. It's not a, quote, the sort of "man to man" conflict. This is just, it's murder, and people who have lived in that environment day after day and gone through it come back with some pretty significant emotional reactions. I, I'll give you an example. A friend of mine who is a Major was out in Iraq for a year. He was working very closely at brigade level, and he was going out to the site of every major incident that occurred in the brigade area. So, he saw a lot of terrible things, and he knew, he told me he knew emotionally every time he left the gate of the compound that he was liable not to come back. And it, he told me it took him months after he got home to sleep through the night. Now, that's quite a load for someone to acknowledge as a Major, somebody who's been in the military for 15 years, whose lived, eat, breathed, slept, thought, dreamed about duty, honor, country and service. Can you imagine how it effects our young soldiers to live like that?
Ed Schultz: Unbelievable. General Wesley Clark with us here on the Ed Scultz Show. During his 34 years of service in the United States Army, he rose to the rank of Four-Star General as NATO Supreme Allied Commander. General Clark, about Iraq, we've lost 103 brave man and women in the month of April. April is now one of the deadliest of the war for United States Forces. I-is this just a product of the escalation or the surge? Y-your thoughts on the continued increase in toll of soldiers that we're taking?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, partly it's the fact that there are more soldiers there, and they're doing more. They're more exposed, and so they get hit both in direct combat and through these improvised explosive devices. But it also says that although the administration is certainly looking for signs of progress, there's still an awful lot of work to be done, and we're not really sure whether there's progress or not.
Ed Schultz: Would you advise the President to do what he's doing right now? Would you advise this escalation?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, what I would advise the President is that you cannot win this militarily. You must win it politically. It, it, it seems that he's unable to create the political dynamic for success. I notice he's threatened to veto any bill that has any, puts any pressure on Maliki. Well, if the Congress and the American people really believe that the administration was working to put the best structure in place politically to resolve this political problem in Iraq, then the Congress probably wouldn't be putting it in legislation. But-
Ed Schultz: You-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: -the Congress and the American people have no faith in the President's policy. We love our soldiers, but even the Generals will tell you the military's only one part of the solution. It cannot be won militarily. It has to be won politically, and that requires obviously something different than what we're doing right now.
Ed Schultz: Wha-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Otherwise, we'd have won it.
Ed Schultz: W-what do you think's going to happen, General? Where do you think this is going to go, and, and how much pressure is this putting on our Commanders right now?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, it's putting a lot of pressure on the Commanders. I think where it's going to go is, we're going to continue to bring more troops in. We're going to continue to have more casualties. We're going to continue to stress the United States Armed Forces. This is a plan by the administration to get through the election cycle without having to make a major change in policy.
Ed Schultz: So, you think-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: It's possible that maybe, somehow these political factions in Baghdad would reach some kind of an agreement and that they would stop fighting each other. On the other hand, it's not clear that we have a strategy that's working to make them do that. So, the military is a sufficient- sorry, it's a necessary, but not sufficient part of the solution. I think we got great military leaders over there. I'm very proud of our troops. It's just that they're not being given the support from Washington that they need.
Ed Schultz: And what would that support be, sir?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Much more assistance to Ryan Crocker and the American Embassy there in dealing with the Iraqi factions, lots more political officers, regional political affairs chiefs, a, a civilianization effort for what we're trying to do with military forces over there, and at the same time opening up a real dialog with iran and Syria.
Ed Schultz: General Wesley Clark here on the Ed Schultz Show, appreciate your time so much, General. But I, I, I want to b-broach this subject with you, if I may, about the will of the Iraqi people. Are you personally convinced that they're willing to go through this. There are so many polls that have been taken saying that the Iraqis want us out of there. How do we-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, I think-
Ed Schultz: How do we as Americans judge all that?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I think what we, we got into a something we should never have gotten into. Now we have to extract ourselves from it in a way that does the least amount of damage possible. There's no doubt there are hard feelings by the Iraqis. After all, most of them were leading ordinary lives before the United States came in and disrupted everything. Most of them weren't political. Most of them weren't members of the Ba'athist Party. Most of them were just doing what people everywhere do. They try to raise their families, they try to hold a job. They try to improve their life. They try to keep their faith. That, that's what they were doing, and we turned their world upside down. So, yeah, there's a lot of unhappiness over there. That doesn't necessarily mean we should simply turn our backs and leave immediately, but it does mean we need to use not only military power, but also diplomacy and our best civilian political leadership on the ground in Iraq to help them find a, an answer to the civil and sectarian conflict there.
Ed Schultz: General Clark, are you any closer to making a decision about running for President?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Oh, I'm not- I, I haven't said I'm not going to run. I'm really enjoying where I am in the business community. I'm thinking about running every day, and you know, I, I, I think there- I just can't say anything more, Ed, right now.
Ed Schultz: I appreciate that. I just want you to know we get e-mail all the time wanting to know if you are going to run. So-
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well good!
Ed Schultz: (laughs out loud)
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: I'm glad to hear that.
Ed Schultz: (laughs more)
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: That's encouraging.
Ed Schultz: General Clark, always a pleasure, I appreciate your time today, and I know the folks that are, are out here in this neck of the woods who are paying tribute this week to the Vietnam veterans at this museum certainly appreciate you taking the time with us.
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Thank you, Ed. It's good to be with you and with your listeners.
Ed Schultz: Thank you, Sir. General Wesley Clark here on the Ed Schultz Show.
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