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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:43 PM
Original message
Edwards response to Coulter's comments - at Huffington Post
Edited on Sat Mar-03-07 03:43 PM by applegrove
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
1. Not enogh
he needs to bring her down to the carpet and challenge her on what she said and how HER FOLLOWERS laughed

in other words, this speech needs to be made fun off... the war room model most be used across the board by ALL candidates... yesterday it was Edwards, today Clinton. see a pattern folks?
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. I AGREE! That's NOT stong enough at all!
They criticized Hillary for coming on too hard against that Hollywood producer Gaffen?, but THAT'S exactly what all our candidates have to do! Responses have to be FAST and TOUGH link a quick dropkick to the.....

Everyone should have learned that from the Kerry campaign!
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #4
19. There's one big, fat, difference with
Edited on Sat Mar-03-07 04:22 PM by zidzi
that~! Geffen was telling the truth and fucking coulter wouldn't know the truth if it smacked her upside her challenged head.
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:56 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. Technically that doesn't matter! every Dem candidate must
respond to EVERY derogatory remark with a FAST & TOUGH response!

I LIKE Edwards, buthe's way to nice to succeed in this political assination ring. That surprises metoo, because he's an attorney, and a very successful one! I would have thought he would be the best candidate at comeback responses.
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Cha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. I see your point but it "matters"
to me.
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #4
28. Absolutely not enough. John has to call his own press conference Monday.
Just letting his campaign manager send out e-mails asking for contributions and letting Elizabeth post a far-too civil and polite critique on his blog doesn't cut it.

The Repukes are using Coulter and her statement as a test baloon - testing Edwards to see if he pulls a John Kerry and hides from this kind of Swift Boating, because they want to destroy Edwards' campaign early, and if Edwards doesn't come out in a press conference Monday and pound this Coulter witch into the sand, his goose is cooked, and they'll do it again and again.

Why? Because he's the only serious threat to Barack and Hillary among the Democratic contenders right now, and these Repukes believe anyone they run can beat Barack because he's black and Hillary because she's a woman.
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-04-07 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #28
37. Edwards' campaign manager gets the idea,
because he states in his e-mail: "Do we sit back, or do we fight back?
I say we fight."

The problem is his solution ("raising Coulter cash") doesn't address the problem publicly - only among his own contributors.

John Edwards needs to do a major press conference Monday. Turning the other cheek publicly these days against the RNC slime machine is a certain formula for failure.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hrmm....
while I understand WHY he responded this way, I'm not sure turning this attack into a fundraiser is the best approach.
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Ninga Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. To state it simply ... "MONEY TALKS" .............. period. n/t
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. It works.
The Dean campaign and the DNC have done it very effectively.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. oh I agree
it works to raise money. No question.

My concern is whether or not that should be the way in which he responds.

Maybe as part of a larger response, I could understand it better. But all I see is "she insulted me! Send $$". It doesn't really address the problem, nor does it do much to actually hurt Coulter.
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Ninga Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Well, I agree. Coulter, is.......an GOP operative sucking at the teat of notoriety.
I am more than sure she is used by Conservatives the same way they use toilet paper.

She is a mess, and a sad character. She does not hold a respectable job and to the best of my knowledge, has not served those less fortunate, nor worked to advance the human cause, but only to kneel before the conservative gods......willing to service them.
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. makes things kinda crass in my book.
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venable Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:59 PM
Original message
gee, that's a surprise.
n/t
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. I agree. Though I understand turning lemons into lemonaid..it doesn't
rebuke Ann Coulter enough somehow.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
8. Here's Elizabeth Edwards' response. Good one.
http://blog.johnedwards.com/story/2007/3/3/133240/0355

The site is very slow today, lots of traffic.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
9. The bully is loathed. The bullied is loathed more. GOPers know this.
That's why "swift boating" works for them. The public stands back and looks for the offended to do something. If they don't, they will lean toward the bully, if for no other reason than the faux strength and robustness they portray. It is important that not only Edwards react (and that is the proper word), but that all of us do the same. For myself, I am writing the major news outlets to let them know I will no longer countenance their exposing Coulter's hate-on and will no longer view their "news" if Coulter is an invited guest to "balance" out perspectives.
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
17. I agree. Edwards should have taken a swipe at her. Called her a twit or something.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 03:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. umm..
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Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:01 PM
Response to Original message
12. Why would he acknowledge her?
Why do WE keep acknowledging her.

Wanna hurt her?

Ignore her.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. Typical of Democratic Party policy. Don't enable her or GOP. (n/t)
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Swift boaters, Kerry ignored them
what did that do?
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Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Actually, he didn't ignore them.
The media just didn't choose to report on what he did do.

But, that's neither here nor there - they were of a different feather than Ann.

Ann just seeks attention, alone. The Swiftboaters, fwiw, thought they were actually doing something meaningful.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:40 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. Swift boaters knew exactly what they were doing. They succeeded.
Ann Coulter knows exactly what she is doing. Will she succeed? If ignored she is enabled. Her's is part of a major tried-and-true campaign by the PACS and goon squads of the GOP far right: bully and smear their opposition and hope, nay, expect progressives to take a pseudo-intellectual stand that they "are above the fray." The public sees this as weakness, even acceptance, of the right wing's new appellation. Rove et al is not a genius. He just keeps doing what works.

Kerry responded: slow and late when the iron was well-cooled and the RW frame was tempered and hammered into place. From there on out it was "he said-she said" for the media, exactly what the GOP wanted.
This very on-line debate is also what they expect from progressives. Perfect.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. Where was the Democratic Party?
They should have been out front and center on this. But, it easy to blame the victim instead of the party that failed him by not showing outrage and appearing on EVERY talk show to condemn this.

The ENTIRE party let the candidate down and they know it.
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SteveM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. I agree, but it's SOP for the Democratic Party: Cow down, let it blow over.
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Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. I just saw a comeback that was fantastic.
Edited on Sat Mar-03-07 05:25 PM by Clark2008
KingofNewOrleans, a DU poster, said, in reference to who won the CPAC straw poll: "John Edwards? I hear there's alot of repressed homosexuality at these CPAC things. I could see the CPACers fantasizing that Edwards would be gay."

That's how you beat them at their game. You don't let them see you get your dander up - you don't try to factualize things (swingers and wingers don't listen long enough to hear any facts) - you don't try to rationalize. You pop 'em back with something THEY would perceive as a cutdown.

Much better than letting us get Ann Coulter all up in our faces. (Which would be pretty yucky, if you ask me!)

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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. No he didn't ignore them
Swift Liars: Kerry-Edwards Campaign Response


April 14, 2004 - The website for SBVT was registered under the name of Lewis Waterman, the information technology manager for Gannon International, a St. Louis company that has diversified interests, including in Vietnam. (1) (note - Gannon International does not appear to have any relationship to Jeff Gannon/Guckert, the fake reporter.)

May 3, 2004 - "Kerry campaign announced a major advertising push to introduce 'John Kerry's lifetime of service and strength to the American people.' Kerry's four month Vietnam experience figures prominently in the ads." (2)

May 4, 2004 - The Swift Liars, beginning their lies by calling themselves "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth", went public at a news conference organized by Merrie Spaeth at the National Press Club. (1)

May 4, 2004 - "The Kerry campaign held a press conference directly after the "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" event...The campaign provided an information package which raised significant questions about 'Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.' " (3)


May 4, 2004 - Aug. 5, 2004 - No public activity by Swift Liars (?) Wikipedia entry (7) notes "When the press conference garnered little attention, the organization decided to produce television advertisements." (Ed. note - were there any public info or announcements, other than talk on blogs? Was there anything going on publicly? Did the campaign have reason to foresee what was coming - note that they must have, see the reactions to each ad).

Jul. 26, 2004 - Jul. 29, 2004 - Democratic National Convention held in Boston. John Kerry's military experience is highlighted.

Aug. 5, 2004 - The Swift Liars' first television ad began airing a one-minute television spot in three states. (7)

Aug. 5, 2004 - "the General Counsels to the DNC and the Kerry-Edwards 2004 campaign faxed a letter to station managers at the relevant stations stating that the ad is 'an inflammatory, outrageous lie" and requesting that they "act immediately to prevent broadcast of this advertisement and deny any future sale of time. " ' " (4)

Aug. 10, 2004 - Democracy 21, The Campaign Legal Center and The Center for Responsive Politics filed a complaint with the Federal Election Commission (FEC) charging that the Swift Liars were illegally raising and spending soft money on ads to influence the 2004 presidential elections. (4)

Aug. 17, 2004 - the campaign held a press conference at which Gen. Wesley Clark (ret.), Adm. Stansfield Turner (ret.), and several swift boat veterans rebutted the charges. (4)

Aug. 19, 2004 - the Kerry-Edwards campaign announced its own ad "Rassmann." (4)

Aug. 20, 2004 - The Swift Liars' second television ad began airing. This ad selectively excerpted Kerry's statements to the SFRC on 4/22/1971. (7)

Aug. 22, 2004 - the Kerry-Edwards campaign announced another ad "Issues" which addressed the Swift Boat group's attacks.

Aug. 25, 2004 - The Kerry-Edwards campaign ... dispatched former Sen. Max Cleland and Jim Rassmann, to Bush's ranch in Crawford, Texas to deliver to the President a letter signed by Democratic Senators who are veterans. (The letter was not accepted.) (4)

Aug. 26, 2004 - The Swift Liars' third television ad began airing. This ad attacked Kerry's claim to have been in Cambodia in 1968. (7)

August 26, 2004 - Mary Beth Cahill sends letter to Ken Mehlman detailing the "Web of Connections" between the Swift Liars and the Bush Administration, and demanding that Bush denounce the smear campaign. (5)

August 26, 2004 - Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW) submits FOIA request "with the White House asking it to detail its contacts with individuals connected to Swift Boat Veterans for Truth (SBVT)." (6)

Aug. 27, 2004 - The DNC ran a full page ad in the Aug. 27, 2004 New York Times terming the Swift Boat campaign a smear. (4)

Aug. 31, 2004 - - The Swift Liars' fourth television ad began airing. This ad attacked Kerry's participation in the medal-throwing protest on 4/23/1971. (7)

References:
* (1) SourceWatch article on SBVT

* (2) (2004) Democracy in Action / Eric M. Appleman, Democracy in Action / Eric M. Appleman

* (3) (2004) Democracy in Action / Eric M. Appleman, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth: Kerry Campaign Response

* (4) (Sept. 8, 2004) Eric M. Appleman (apparently) Some Responses to the "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" Ad

* (5) August 26, 2004 letter from Mary Beth Cahill to Ken Mehlman

* (6) Press Release (US Newswire): CREW FOIAs White House Contacts with Swift Boat Veterans Group

* (7) Wikipedia entry, Swift Vets and POWs for Truth






MH1 - This topic is to create a timeline of the response of the K/E04 campaign to the Swift Liars' smears. There is an RW-encouraged myth that K/E04 "didn't respond." As the timeline, once completed, will show, that is not true. Effectiveness of the response may be debated - that is subjective - the purpose of this thread is to collect the facts of the events.





On Aug. 19, 2004 Kerry himself responded directly in a speech to the International Association of Firefighters' Convention in Boston. (from prepared remarks)
...And more than thirty years ago, I learned an important lesson—when you're under attack, the best thing to do is turn your boat into the attacker. That's what I intend to do today.

Over the last week or so, a group called Swift Boat Veterans for Truth has been attacking me. Of course, this group isn’t interested in the truth – and they're not telling the truth. They didn't even exist until I won the nomination for president.

But here's what you really need to know about them. They're funded by hundreds of thousands of dollars from a Republican contributor out of Texas. They're a front for the Bush campaign. And the fact that the President won't denounce what they’re up to tells you everything you need to know—he wants them to do his dirty work.

Thirty years ago, official Navy reports documented my service in Vietnam and awarded me the Silver Star, the Bronze Star and three Purple Hearts. Thirty years ago, this was the plain truth. It still is. And I still carry the shrapnel in my leg from a wound in Vietnam.

As firefighters you risk your lives everyday. You know what it’s like to see the truth in the moment. You're proud of what you’ve done—and so am I.

Of course, the President keeps telling people he would never question my service to our country. Instead, he watches as a Republican-funded attack group does just that. Well, if he wants to have a debate about our service in Vietnam, here is my answer: "Bring it on."

I'm not going to let anyone question my commitment to defending America—then, now, or ever. And I'm not going to let anyone attack the sacrifice and courage of the men who saw battle with me.

And let me make this commitment today: their lies about my record will not stop me from fighting for jobs, health care, and our security – the issues that really matter to the American people...





Kerry defends war record
Aug. 19: John Kerry responds directly to attacks on his Vietnam military service Thursday, accusing President Bush of relying on front groups to challenge his war record.

http://video.msn.com/v/us/v.htm?g=40a0d9b1-0386-41ef-bc...





May 4, 2004. The Kerry campaign held a press conference directly after the "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" event. (Above are, r-l, Wade Sanders, Del Sandusky and Drew Whitlow). Senior Advisor Michael Meehan said, "The Nixon White House attempted to do this to Kerry, and the Bush folks are following the same plan." "We're not going to let them make false claims about Kerry and go unanswered," Meehan said. He said his first instinct was to hold a press conference with an empty room where veterans could testify to their time spent in the military with George W. Bush and Dick Cheney.

The campaign provided an information package which raised significant questions about "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth." Spaeth Communications, which hosted the event, "is a Republican headed firm from Texas which has contributed to Bush's campaign and has very close ties to the Bush Administration." Lead organizer John O'Neill, a Republican from Texas, "was a pawn of the Nixon White House in 1971." Further some of the people now speaking against Kerry had praised him in their evaluation reports in Vietnam.

John Dibble, who served on a swift boat in 1970, after Kerry had left, was one of the veterans at the Kerry event. He said of Kerry's anti-war activities that at the time, "I didn't like what he was doing." In retrospect, however, Dibble said, "I probably should have been doing the same thing...probably more of us should have been doing that." He said that might have meant fewer names on the Vietnam Memorial and that Kerry's anti-war activities were "a very gutsy thing to do."

http://www.gwu.edu/~action/2004/interestg/swift050404c....






Kerry campaign's quick response to Swift boat vets
By Marie Horrigan
UPI Deputy Americas Editor
Washington, DC, Aug. 5 (UPI) -- The campaign for Democratic Party presidential nominee Sen. John Kerry of Massachusetts issued an exhaustively researched and extensively sourced 36-page refutation Thursday of allegations Kerry lied about events during his service in Vietnam, including how and why he received medals, and had fled the scene of a battle.

http://washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20040805-012143...






Kerry: Bush lets attack ads do 'dirty work'
McClellan points out criticism by anti-Bush group
Friday, August 20, 2004 Posted: 2:37 PM EDT (1837 GMT)
BOSTON, Massachusetts (CNN) -- Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry accused President Bush on Thursday of letting front groups "do his dirty work" in questioning his military service during the Vietnam War.

"The president keeps telling people he would never question my service to our country. Instead, he watches as a Republican-funded attack group does just that," Kerry told a firefighters' union conference in his hometown of Boston.

"Well, if he wants to have a debate about our service in Vietnam, here is my answer: Bring it on."

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/08/19/kerry.attacka... /





http://www.johnkerry.com/petition/oldtricks.php





August 5, 2004

VIA FACSIMILE

Re: Swift Boat Veterans for Truth

Dear Station Manager:

We are counsel to the Democratic National Committee and John Kerry, respectively. It has been brought to our attention that a group calling itself "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" has bought time, or may seek to buy time, on your station to air an advertisement that attacks Senator Kerry. The advertisement contains statements by men who purport to have served on Senator Kerry's SWIFT Boat in Vietnam, and one statement by a man pretending to be the doctor who treated Senator Kerry for one of his injuries. In fact, not a single one of the men who pretend to have served with Senator Kerry was actually a crewmate of Senator Kerry's and the man pretending to be his doctor was not. The entire advertisement, therefore is an inflammatory, outrageous lie.

"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" styles itself as a group of individuals who personally served with John Kerry in the United States Navy in the Vietnam War. In truth the group is a sham organization spearheaded by a Texas corporate media consultant. It has been financed largely with funds from a Houston homebuilder. See Slater, Dallas Morning News, July 23, 2004.

In this group's advertisement, twelve men appear to make statements about Senator Kerry's service in Vietnam. Not a single one of these men served on either of Senator Kerry's two SWIFT Boats (PCF 44 & PCF94).

Further, the "doctor" who appears in the ad, Louis Letson, was not a crewmate of Senator Kerry's and was not the doctor who actually signed Senator Kerry's sick call sheet. In fact, another physician actually signed Senator Kerry's sick call sheet. Letson is not listed on any document as having treated Senator Kerry after the December 2, 1968 firefight. Moreover, according to news accounts, Letson did not record his "memories" of that incident until after Senator Kerry became a candidate for President in 2003. (National Review Online, May 4, 2004).

The statements made by the phony "crewmates" and "doctor" who appear in the advertisement are also totally, demonstrably and unequivocally false, and libelous. In parrticular, the advertisement charges that Senator Kerry "lied to get his Bronze Star." Just as falsely, it states that "he lied before the Senate." These are serious allegations of actual crimes -- specifically, of lying to the United States Government in the conduct of its official business. The events for which the Senator was awarded the Bronze Star have been documented repeatedly and in detail and are set out in the official citation signed by the Secretary of the Navy and the Commander of U.S. Forces in Vietnam. And yet these reckless charges of criminal conduct are offered without support or authentication, by fake "witnesses" speaking on behalf of a phony organization.

Your station is not obligated to accept this advertisement for broadcast nor is it required to account in any way for its decision to reject such an advertisement. Columbia Broadcasting System v. Democratic National Committee, 412 U.S. 94 (1973), You Can't Afford Dodd Committee, 81 FCC2d 579 (1980). The so-called "Swift Boat Veterans" organization is not a federal candidate or candidate committee. Repeated efforts by organizations that are not candidate committees to obtain a private right of access have been consistently rejected by the FCC. See e.g., National Conservative Political Action Committee, 89 FCC2d 626 (1982).

Thus, your station my freely refuse this advertisement. Because your station has this freedom, and because it is not a "use" of your facilities by a clearly identified candidate, your station is responsible for the false and libelous charges made by this sponsor.

Moreover, as a licensee, you have an overriding duty "to protect the public from false, misleading or deceptive advertising." Licensee Responsibility With Respect to the Broadcast of False, Misleading or Deceptive Advertising, 74 F.C.D.2d 623 (1961). Your station normally must take "reasonable steps" to satisfy itself "as to the reliability and reputation of every prospective advertiser." In re Complaint by Consumers Assocation of District of Columbia, 32 F.C.C.2d 400, 405 (1971).

Under these circumstances, your station may not responsibly air this advertisement. We request that your station act immmediately to prevent broadcasts of this advertisement and deny andy future sale of time. Knowing that the advertisement is false, and possessing the legal authority to refuse to run it, your station should exercise that authority in the public interest.


Please contact us promptly at either of the phone numbers below to advise us regarding the status of this advertisement.

Sincerely yours,
Marc Elias
Perkins Coie
607 14th Street, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20005


General Counsel
Kerry-Edwards 2004 Joseph Sandler
Sandler, Reiff & Young
50 E Street, S.E. #300
Washington, D.C. 20003


General Counsel
Democratic National Committee


http://www.gwu.edu/~action/2004/ads04/dem080504ltrswift...






From the transcript of the Aug. 5, 2004 White House Press Briefing with Scott McClellan:

Q Do you -- does the President repudiate this 527 ad that calls Kerry a liar on Vietnam?

MR. McCLELLAN: The President deplores all the unregulated soft money activity. We have been very clear in stating that, you know, we will not -- and we have not and we will not question Senator Kerry's service in Vietnam. I think that this is another example of the problem with the unregulated soft money activity that is going on. The President thought he put an end -- or the President thought he got rid of this kind of unregulated soft money when he signed the bipartisan campaign finance reforms into law. And, you know, the President has been on the receiving end of more than $62 million in negative attacks from shadowy groups.

* * *

In the days after the release of the ad a host of major newspapers published editorials condemning it including the Arizona Republic ("Campaign Non-Starter," August 6), Los Angeles Times ("It's Not All Fair Game," August 6), Plain Dealer ("Ad Says Kerry Lied; Record Says Otherwise," August 8), St. Petersburg Times ("An Ugly Attack," August 9), Las Vegas Sun ("Ad's Smear Should Be Condemned," August 9), Oregonian ("Now It Gets Nasty," August 11), and Washington Post ("Swift Boat Smears," August 12).

* * *

On Aug. 10, 2004 Democracy 21, the Campaign Legal Center and the Center for Responsive Politics filed a complaint with the Federal Election Commission (FEC) charging that Swift Boat Veterans for Truth is illegally raising and spending soft money on ads to influence the 2004 presidential elections.

* * *

From the transcript of Bush's Aug. 12, 2004 appearance on CNN'S Larry King Live:


KING: In view of that, do you think that it's fair, for the record, John Kerry's service record, to be an issue at all? I know that Senator McCain...
G. BUSH: You know, I think it is an issue, because he views it as honorable service, and so do I. I mean...
KING: Oh, so it is. But, I mean, Senator McCain has asked to be condemned, the attack on his service. What do you say to that?
G. BUSH: Well, I say they ought to get rid of all those 527s, independent expenditures that have flooded the airwaves.
There have been millions of dollars spent up until this point in time. I signed a law that I thought would get rid of
those, and I called on the senator to -- let's just get anybody who feels like they got to run to not do so.
KING: Do you condemn the statements made about his...
G. BUSH: Well, I haven't seen the ad, but what I do condemn is these unregulated, soft-money expenditures by very wealthy people, and they've said some bad things about me. I guess they're saying bad things about him. And what I think we ought to do is not have them on the air. I think there ought to be full disclosure. The campaign funding law I signed I thought was going to get rid of that. But evidently the Federal Election Commission had a different view...

Kerry spokesman Chad Clanton's response to Bush's Aug. 12, 2004 appearance:
"Tonight President Bush called Kerry's service in Vietnam 'noble.' But in the same breath refused to heed Senator McCain's call to condemn the dirty work being done by the 'Swift Boat Vets for Bush.' Once again, the President side-stepped responsibility and refused to do the right thing. His credibility is running out as fast as his time in the White House."

* * *

On Aug. 17, 2004 the campaign held a press conference at which Gen. Wesley Clark (ret.), Adm. Stansfield Turner (ret.), and several swift boat veterans rebutted the charges.

* * *

DNC Chairman Terry McAuliffe issued a statement on Aug. 18, 2004:

"By saying nothing at all George W. Bush is a complicit contributor to the slanderous, lie-filled attack ads that have been launched on John Kerry on Bush's behalf. Instead of stepping up and taking the high road, George Bush's response has been evasion, avoidance, everything but disavowal.

"Larry King asked George Bush to 'condemn' it. He refused. Reporters asked the President's Press Secretary if he'd 'repudiate' it. He ducked. They can try to blame it on the rules or whoever else they want, but the blame belongs squarely on the Republicans. They wrote it. They produced it. They placed it. They paid for it. And now it is time for George W. Bush to stand up and say, 'enough.'

"This is not debate, Mr. President, and this unfounded attack on Senator Kerry has crossed the line of decency. I call on you today to condemn this ad, the men who put their lies behind it, and the donors who paid for it. It's time."

http://www.gwu.edu/~action/2004/ads04/swiftadresponse.h...





Altercation Book Club: Lapdogs by Eric Boehlert
Relatively early on in the August coverage of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth story, ABC's Nightline devoted an entire episode to the allegations and reported, "The Kerry campaign calls the charges wrong, offensive and politically motivated. And points to Naval records that seemingly contradict the charges." (Emphasis added.) Seemingly? A more accurate phrasing would have been that Navy records "completely" or "thoroughly" contradicted the Swifty. In late August, CNN's scrawl across the bottom of the screen read, "Several Vietnam veterans are backing Kerry's version of events." Again, a more factual phrasing would have been "Crewmembers have always backed Kerry's version of events." But that would have meant not only having to stand up a well-funded Republican campaign attack machine, but also casting doubt on television news' hottest political story of the summer.

When the discussion did occasionally turn to the facts behind the Swift Boat allegations, reporters and pundits seemed too spooked to address the obvious—that the charges made no sense and there was little credible evidence to support them.. Substituting as host of "Meet the Press," Andrea Mitchell on Aug. 15 pressed Boston Globe reporter Anne Kornblut about the facts surrounding Kerry's combat service: "Well, Anne, you've covered him for many years, John Kerry. What is the truth of his record?" Instead of mentioning some of the glaring inconsistencies in the Swifties' allegation, such as George Elliott and Adrian Lonsdale 's embarrassing flip-flops, Kornblut ducked the question, suggesting the truth was "subjective": "The truth of his record, the criticism that's coming from the Swift Boat ads, is that he betrayed his fellow veterans. Well, that's a subjective question, that he came back from the war and then protested it. So, I mean, that is truly something that's subjective." Ten days later Kornblut scored a sit-down interview with O'Neill. In her 1,200-word story she politely declined to press O'Neill about a single factual inconsistency surrounding the Swifties' allegations, thereby keeping her Globe readers in the dark about the Swift Boat farce. (It was not until Bush was safely re-elected that that Kornblut, appearing on MSNBC, conceded the Swift Boast ads were clearly inaccurate.)

Hosting an Aug. 28 discussion on CNBC with Newsweek's Jon Meacham and Time's Jay Carney, NBC's Tim Russert finally, after weeks of overheated Swifty coverage, got around to asking the pertinent question: "Based on everything you have heard, seen, reported, in terms of the actual charges, the content of the book, is there any validity to any of it?" Carney conceded the charges did not have any validity, but did it oh, so gently: "I think it's hard to say that any one of them is by any standard that we measure these things has been substantiated." Apparently Carney forgot to pass the word along to editors at Time magazine, which is read by significantly more news consumers than Russert's weekly cable chat show on CNBC. Because it wasn't until its Sept. 20 2004 issue, well after the Swift Boat controversy had peaked, that the Time news team managed enough courage to tentatively announce the charges levied against Kerry and his combat service were "reckless and unfair." (Better late than never; Time's competitor Newsweek waited until after the election to report the Swift Boat charges were "misleading," but "very effective.") But even then, Time didn't hold the Swifties responsible for their "reckless and unfair" charges. Instead, Time celebrated them. Typing up an election postscript in November, Time toasted the Swift Boat's O'Neill as one of the campaign's "Winners," while remaining dutifully silent about the group's fraudulent charges.

That kind of Beltway media group self-censorship was evident throughout the Swift Boat story, as the perimeters of acceptable reporting were quickly established. Witness the MSM reaction to Wayne Langhofer, Jim Russell and Robert Lambert. All three men served with Kerry in Vietnam and all three men were witnesses to the disputed March 13, 1969 event in which Kerry rescued Green Beret Jim Rassmann, winning a Bronze Star and his third Purple Heart. The Swifties, after 35 years of silence, insisted Kerry did nothing special that day, and that he certainly did not come under enemy fire when he plucked Rassmann out of the drink. Therefore, Kerry did not deserve his honors.

It's true every person on Kerry's boat, along with the thankful Rassmann, insisted they were under fire, and so did the official Navy citation for Kerry's Bronze Star. Still, Swifties held to their unlikely story, and the press pretended to be confused about the stand-off. Then during the last week in August three more eyewitnesses, all backing the Navy's version of events that there had been hostile gun fire, stepped forward. They were Langhofer, Russell and Lambert.

Russell wrote an indignant letter to his local Telluride Daily Planet to dispute the Swifties' claim: "Forever pictured in my mind since that day over 30 years ago John Kerry bending over his boat picking up one of the rangers that we were ferrying from out of the water. All the time we were taking small arms fire from the beach; although because of our fusillade into the jungle, I don't think it was very accurate, thank God. Anyone who doesn't think that we were being fired upon must have been on a different river."

The number of times Russell was subsequently mentioned on CNN: 1. On Fox News: 1. MSNBC: 0. ABC: 1. On CBS: 0. On NBC: 0.

Like Russell, Langhofer also remembered strong enemy gunfire that day. An Aug. 22 article in the Washington Post laid out the details: "Until now, eyewitness evidence supporting Kerry's version had come only from his own crewmen. But yesterday, The Post independently contacted a participant who has not spoken out so far in favor of either camp who remembers coming under enemy fire. “There was a lot of firing going on, and it came from both sides of the river,” said Wayne D. Langhofer, who manned a machine gun aboard PCF-43, the boat that was directly behind Kerry’s. Langhofer said he distinctly remembered the “clack, clack, clack” of enemy AK-47s, as well as muzzle flashes from the riverbanks." (For some strange reason the Post buried its Langhofer scoop in the 50th paragraph of the story.)

The number of times Langhofer was subsequently mentioned on CNN: 0. On Fox News: 0. On MSNBC: 0. On ABC: 0. CBS: 0. NBC: 0.

As for Lambert, The Nation magazine uncovered the official citation for the Bronze Medal he won that same day and it too reported the flotilla of five U.S. boats "came under small-arms and automatic weapons fire from the river banks."

The number of times Lambert was mentioned on. On Fox News: 1. On CNN: 0. On MSNBC: 0. ABC: 1 On CBS: 0. On NBC: 0.

Additionally, the Washington Post's Michael Dobbs, who served as the paper's point person on the Swifty scandal, was asked during an Aug. 30, 2004, online chat with readers why the paper hadn't reported more aggressively on the public statements of Langhofer, Russell and Lambert. Dobbs insisted, "I hope to return to this subject at some point to update readers." But he never did. Post readers, who were deluged with Swifty reporting, received just the sketchiest of facts about Langhofer, Russell and Lambert.

If that doesn't represent a concerted effort by the press to look the other way, than what does?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12799378/#060518
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applegrove Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. Because a race is on, Edwards is a public person and a response was expected.
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madmunchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #12
30. DUH!!!!!!! Too bad most people, like the DEMS, don't get this
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jhrobbins Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-04-07 12:16 AM
Response to Reply #12
35. Exactly! (even though it is difficult to do sometimes)
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muntrv Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 05:11 PM
Response to Original message
24. We need to swift boat coulter and all her ilk.
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benny05 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
29. It is simple, to the point
Edited on Sat Mar-03-07 08:33 PM by benny05
You forget where he is tomorrow:

Speaking about civil rights at Berkeley..http://www.johnedwards.com/events/

Please quit ragging on him. He's doing his job fine and has a fine partner, Elizabeth, at home, stoking the fires as great support. If anyone understands hate messages, it is Elizabeth.

From Saving Graces, p 252-3:

Grand Junction, CO

On a bench outside the airport gates sat a man, perhaps in his 60's, his hair thinning, the color of his faded jacket and the color of his weathered skin nearly the same, and on his lap he held a handmade sign, maybe 12 by 18 inches, and on the sign a single word, plainly printed: FATSO (emphasis, EE).

skip a couple of para's to page 253:

The sign I realized, was meant for me. It was a thrust of ugliness and meanness, designed to throw me off. The man had made the sign, driven to the airport, parked and sat on that bench for who knows how long, waiting for me to come by, so that I would read his sign, so I would see that someone, a plain old man, called me Fatso.

If you didn't understand John, or even grasp what Elizabeth said, read further here, again quoting from her book:

--there were 3 Secret Service agents and my little team, more than the usual load. "Did you see that guy?" I could tell 2 things from the way the Secret Service had responded: they had hoped I hadn't seen it, and they were mad."

I think I understand how John and Elizabeth operate. They have to "shrug" this off, but as Elizabeth and John say, this talk has no place in our society at large.

Let's create our own way.



John, One Corps of Scranton, Elizabeth, and kids after winterizing a home in PA, on Energy Conservation Action Day, January 27th, 2007






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benny05 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 11:37 PM
Response to Reply #29
34. Gosh, about the kids
Emma Claire looks like JRE, and Jack looks like his momma.

Great family to have in the WH.
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Evergreen Emerald Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
31. I did not realize Cheney and Romney were in the audience.
Edited on Sat Mar-03-07 09:46 PM by Evergreen Emerald
The reaction by the audience was laughter and applause.

Why hasn't the democratic party (and the press) call on them to condemn that statement? If roles were reversed...
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Zensea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 10:41 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Get your facts straight before you complain
Edited on Sat Mar-03-07 10:46 PM by Zensea
Howard Dean's response (on the Democratic party website)

http://www.democrats.org/a/2007/03/dean_blasts_ann.php

"There is no place in political discourse for this kind of hate-filled and bigoted comments. While Democrats and Republicans may disagree on the issues, we should all be able to agree that this kind of vile rhetoric is out of bounds. The American people want a serious, thoughtful debate of the issues. Republicans -- including the Republican presidential candidates who shared the podium with Ann Coulter today -- should denounce her hateful remarks."

And obviously, the Republicans know Coulter screwed up --

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/04/us/politics/04coulter.html?_r=1&oref=slogin&pagewanted=print

WASHINGTON, March 3 — Three of the leading Republican presidential candidates on Saturday denounced one of their party’s best-known conservative commentators for using an antigay epithet when discussing a Democratic presidential contender at a gathering of conservatives here.

Speaking at the Conservative Political Action Conference before an overflow crowd on Friday, Ms. Coulter said

Mr. Cheney was not at the event on Friday.

Of the major Republican candidates, only Mr. McCain did not attend,

Mr. Romney preceded Ms. Coulter at the event and mentioned that she was speaking later — he jokingly referred to her as a “moderate.” But he was not in the room when she spoke, Mr. Madden said.
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Evergreen Emerald Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-04-07 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #32
36. yikes!
Edited on Sun Mar-04-07 02:45 AM by Evergreen Emerald
What a response from you! Too much coffee?

I got if from the story: "Coulter's attack was no accident. It happened on national television at one of the year's biggest conservative conferences. Dick Cheney and most of the Republican candidates were in the audience. She was even introduced by Mitt Romney."

I am so glad the democrats responded, and I hope they hold all of those republicans who were there responsible. (Perhaps they responded because of my post).
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Zensea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-04-07 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #36
38. Not too much coffee, too many posters jumping the gun
... within 24 hours already all these complaints about methods of response without even giving the events time to develop.
To be fair, your take on things is not bad, you kind of caught the fire of my "ire" regarding a lot of other posts I read -- so I was being unfair to you.
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benny05 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-03-07 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. Cheney was not there
So they say, and that Romney was not in the room.

Hoo-lah!:bounce:
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