David Irving: Jews should ask themselves why they are hated

[Behind the Aegis]

Holocaust denier David Irving on Friday said Jews should ask themselves why they have been hated throughout history.

"They should ask themselves the question, 'Why have they been so hated for 3000 years that there has been pogrom after pogrom in country after country?', said Irving, speaking at a press conference he convened in England on Friday, a day after he was released from an Austrian prison.

Irving, who was sentenced to three years in prison for denying the Holocaust, was released last week after his appeal was granted.

Asked if he sees himself as anti-Semitic, Irving said, "No, I like to think I am not."

But immediately following his answer, Irving expressed his support for Mel Gibson's comments that "The Jews are responsible for all the wars in the world."


more...

[DoYouEverWonder]

1. Oy ve!

Doesn't this belong in the I/P forum?

[Jim Sagle]

3. No. It's not about Israel or Palestine.

[Behind the Aegis]

4. Why?

Why does this need to be in I/P? It has nothing to do with I/P.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

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[Behind the Aegis]

9. those are threads...

...by your own admission, about Israel. This article is about JEWS. The word "Israel" only appears in the article as a location of an organization that has spoken out against Irving. However, it seems you are conflating.

[DoYouEverWonder]

11. When did Auchwitz

become Israel?

I said the thread in question had nothing to do with Israel.

[Behind the Aegis]

12. Take it up with the mods.

I didn't see what you posted or what the thread was about. If it was about Israel, then it stands to reason as to why it was moved, but as I have said, this thread has nothing to do with Israel, the I/P situation, or anything other than a Holocaust revisionist spouting anti-Semitic remarks. The bigger question is why you feel the need to make this a thread about Israel or I/P or declare an article that is about anti-Semitism be moved to another forum?

[DoYouEverWonder]

15. I thought we

weren't allowed to post threads about anti-semitism either? At least, that is what I've been informed by the mods.

[Behind the Aegis]

16. That is news to me.

I have never heard that "rule" before, and have seen multiple posts about anti-Semitism, as well as other types of bigotry and racism.

[Lithos]

27. No, it does not

Not at this time.

Lithos
DU Moderator

[babylonsister]

2. That's a lot of hate (or bigotry) for one person to hold. nt

[Behind the Aegis]

5. And sadly, there are way too many that are like him.

You'd think their hate would consume them, but all it seems to do is poison the world at large.

[angry_chuck]

17. hate destorys the hater

not the hated. It takes a sad individual to hold all that hate and hopefully he will collapse under the weight of it.

[rockymountaindem]

6. Well, he answered his own question with that last statement

Jews are hated because we're constantly blamed for things that aren't our fault. Now the ball is back in Irving's court to explain why he and his ilk feel the compulsive need to blame all their problems on us, right? Not like he'll have any real answers...

Happy Hanukkah, Irving :sarcasm:

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

7. Better that David Irving ask

why so many cultures espouse and encourage hatred against minority groups-Jews, African Americans, etc. etc.

[NJCher]

10. that research already exists

Maybe someone should bring it to Mr. Irving's attention.




Cher

[WCGreen]

13. It wasn't until they killed our lord and savior....

That everyone started to hate the Jews....

:sarcasm:

They have been the scapegoat even since the Romans took out the Temple ca 70 ACE...

And it really didn't get going until the Christians took over the Roman Empire around 320 ACE and started killing all the infidels....

[question everything]

43. Ah! But would there be Christianity

had Jesus not been killed?

[Mend]

14. when Dr. Einstein asked Dr. Freud the question about hate,

Dr. Freud said it was because people have reptilian brains at the core, with sex and aggression being the two parts. He said hate comes when the sex part is small or supressed....sounds possible to me. Make love, not war.

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

18. As a militantly secular jew…

nevermind, don't want to piss anyone off

[Joe Chi Minh]

19. I think it's much more important for him to ask himself why his own

daughter hates him. She gave her reasons - and very compelling ones they were - in a UK newspaper.

His brother, too, if my memory serves me, also fell out with him long ago. Even as a child, he said, his brother expressed admiration for the German planes flying overhead. Weird.

I just wanted to check that out, so Googled "David Irving daughter".

The first item - from the Sydney Jewish News - was sufficient corroboration! Are these first few sentences, hilarious or what?

"Survivor hired Irving's daughter

BRITISH Holocaust revisionist David Irving, banned from entering Australia since 1993, was reported recently to be savouring the irony that his daughter, Beatrice Irving, is an Australian citizen and public servant.

But he might not be so enthused to learn that she was given her first job in the Queensland Public Service by a Jew who is not only an ordained rabbi, but a Holocaust survivor. (Irving is currently suing Holocaust denial expert Deborah Lipstadt and Penguin Books in London for libel.)"

[jpgray]

20. Might as well have rape victims ask themselves why they were assaulted

The responsibility for any soul-searching belongs to the perpetrator in this case, not the victim. As if someone could somehow be "asking" for genocide.

[alfredo]

21. It's because no matter how hard people try to kill them, they

survive and thrive.


"They Tried To Kill Us. We Survived. Let's Eat."

[Igel]

22. He should realize that it's much more profitable--assuming

a certain level of forthrightness and honesty from one's interlocutor--to ask the people doing the hating why they hate.

Unfortunately, those hating seldom give all their reasons. They usually give those that they think are most likely to garner the support of by-standers ... so that they gain allies against the object of their hate.

I've been on the receiving end of some malice in my time, and seldom did searching my soul reveal any great insight into the innermost thoughts of another person. And seldom did they answer my questions in any serious way. But it was still a great deal more helpful than asking myself to tell me their motives.

[rpannier]

23. Geeee....

It's so fortunate that this piece of garbage is out of prison to spread his message of racism, anti-semtism and bile during this blessed season.

The spirit of adolf sh*tler lives on in this cretin.

[IndianaGreen]

24. I am sorry I went to the link provided

'Why have they been so hated for 3000 years that there has been pogrom after pogrom in country after country?'

His comment about the color of his Rolls-Royce would have been sufficient for me.

There are anti-Semites that would hate us no matter our views on the Israel-Palestine conflict, or the bombing of Lebanon.

However, notwithstanding the likes of Mssers Irving, Duke, and Gibson, and others like them, it is also true that Israel's policies have done a lot of harm to the way that Israel and all Jews in general are perceived by people with no prior history of anti-Semitism.

To answer Irving's question: we have been hated for 3000 years because of people like him, not because of anything we have done.

[madrchsod]

26. i do not get the 3000 years bit-am i missing something?

for the first 1000 years was`t it tribal warfare among the semite tribes and maybe the philistines? if i`m correct their biggest problem was with Egypt,which had problems with many different tribes. the jews may have been disliked but not hated in the context of the last 2000 years of roman christian hatred.

[madrchsod]

25. if it was`t for the jews

who would dave hate? oh wait a minute the muslims/arabs. well maybe not the arabs since they fight the jews but maybe if they kill each other then americans will in the future be a pure aryan race, oh shit, i forgot about the dam mexicans and the asians...shit it must be really hard work to hate everyone in the world that isn`t like dave and his friends.
3000 years? i did`t think dave was that dumb but i guess he is

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

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[AlienGirl]

29. What do Jews do that looks threatening?

[Misskittycat]

30. We eat bagels. n/t

[Karenina]

34. w/ lox and cream cheese, knishes

(I LOVE HOT mustard) and homemade chicken soup cures EVERYTHING that ails ya. I haven't had corned beef of rye for a decade... :cry:

[karynnj]

31. Basing this whole harangue on

who 2 Jewish authors thank in their acknowledgments is strange in and of itself. Could it be that many people thanked are people in their social circle. I assume that if I were to do the same taking the works of a Southern author a "disproportionate" number of Southerners would be included especially if the books included some southern culture, history or experiences. The same could be said for a black author or a Norwegian author.

As a Jew, I have a real problem with your comments. Substitute your own ethnic group in the last paragraph and have should get an idea of why what you said is hurtful and offensive.

[DaveinMD]

36. wow

defending bigotry on DU. Impressive.

[Behind the Aegis]

41. A verbose way of blaming the victim. n/t

[rockymountaindem]

44. You're full of it

Jews make no claim to superiority over others. Anti-Semites just make that up to justify their opinions.

[cali]

46. Irving poses an important question?

Only if you're a cookie cutter copy of his hate. Which you seem to be. There's so much wrong with your bizarre and ugly little missive, that it's not worth taking the time to refute.

[fujiyama]

47. What utter complete BS

Irving is just a holocaust denying ass hole.

People have hated Jews, not because of some supposed sense of superiority you believe they have, but because people generally need a scapegoat when things go bad for them. Jews were a convenient target, because they were successful.

[jen4clark]

32. Many won't "get" this --

maybe some will.

This is from Kryon:

It's been explained many times. The Jews hold a place in the Akashic Record of the earth that is a "core" energy. Yes, all are special in their own way; however, the Jews are specialists on this planet in a way that should be obvious if you look at all of Human history. It has nothing to do with compassion or universal love. Think of it as universal accounting.

No other group has the attributes of a "race" without being one (according to anthropologists). No other group has seen civilization try to eliminate them repeatedly over the centuries, no matter if they were slaves or in modern times sitting in their own country. They're a group that has a core energy to civilization itself. "As go the Jews, so goes the world" is a correct statement, and believe me, you shouldn't envy this position, for it carries with it such seeds of responsibility that the load is heavier for them.

If interested read Kyron's Message to the Jews from October 2005. If you're not interested, don't go there.

[k_jerome]

33. apparently he misspoke. David Duke likes to use the term zionist. More acceptable. nt.

[Name removed]

35. Deleted message

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[DaveinMD]

37. yes

because all Jews are Likud. Give me a break. Lots of antisemitism on DU. Quite sad.

[Clark2008]

38. Well, my husband's Jewish and hates the Likud Party - is he

anti-Semitic? Hardly.

You can argue that the person DID lump all Jews into the Lukid Party camp and that was wrong of that poster to do so, but being against the Lukid Party does not make one anti-Semitic, so you jumped to a conclusion, yourself.

[DaveinMD]

39. I am Jewish and anti-Likud

I was responding to the post blaming all Jews for the ills of the policies of Likud.

[Behind the Aegis]

40. false conclusion....

"60 years ago the Jews were the victims....now they have become the aggressors?"

Do you not see a problem with that statement? It is called "conflating." The same way people do not want to be called anti-Semites for criticizing Israel, those who do should not confuse "Israelis" with "Jews" or one will run the risk of being correctly labeled an anti-Semite.

[cali]

45. You're

simply a garden variety fill-in-the-blank. Jews have used up all their brownie points? Check. Conflate Israels and Jews? Check. Blame Israe/Jews for all that's wrong with U.S foreign policy? Check. You have firmly aligned yourself with the contemptible Mr. Irving. I think there are certain websites that would make a fine home for you.

[Name removed]

49. Deleted message

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[cali]

50. Keep spouting ignorant

ugly crap, and I'll keep calling you on it.

All the crap about Jews annointing themselves as the Chosen and thus can't be criticized is nonsense. No, I'm not going to explain basic theology to you. You've got the resources to find the truth you say you hunger for. David Irving? Tons about the unsavory Mr. Irving on the internet. You aligned yourself with someone no less reprehensible than any hater by legitimizing his revolting question. And by the way, criticizing a group of people, be it blacks or hispanics or jews, as if they were one homogenous lump all holding the same opinions and acting in the same way, is antithetical to the most basic tenets of liberalism.

Criticizing Israeli policies is completely legitimate. Criticizing Jews is as a group is not, anymore the criticizing Muslims as a group is legitimate.

And just what issues do you think "anti-semitic phobias" are being used to distract from? What is the rational discussion that you want to see develop?

[LeftishBrit]

51. The Jews do not = Israel, let alone the Likud

I'm a British Jew who loathes the Likud and similar groups, and thinks that American policies on the Middle East are biased against the Palestinians - and I find your comments quite offensive. It's like justifying prejudice against ALL Americans on the grounds that Bush is an American, and was elected President. In fact worse, since prejudice against Jews has been going on long before the United States even existed.

There was serious anti-semitism long before the creation of the state of Israel, let alone the rise to power of the right-wing political parties there - so that, whatever one thinks of current Israeli government policies, one canNOT blame anti-semitism on these policies.

[THUNDER HANDS]

42. personally, i think it's our extremely large penis size

the reason we do circumcision is to make all you gentiles feel better about yourselves. :P

[leesa]

48. Sounds like Mr Irving is using the same 'persecution complex' thinking

that he thinks Jews have exploited post-holocaust. Have Jews been hated for 3000 years? I doubt it. They have had all sorts of successful societies and relationships.
I am glad he was released though. No one should be jailed for denying the Holocaust. Scoff at him, laugh him out of town, whatever, but jail someone for an opinion?

[rucky]

52. I see he's had a lot of time to reflect in prison.

Maybe he'll write about his Kampf?