How much would you pay for Starbucks?

[BL611]

Ok look I'm not "pro starbucks", but it is worth pointing out that starbucks coffee is plenty expensive as it is, and they do offer fair trade coffee (although they do not promote it) in most stores for a higher price. Starbucks is certainly anti union, but they do at least offer their employee's (even part time ones) health care and fairly decent benefits. The question is if starbucks was to sell fair trade coffee (and for a bonus question pay their employee's somewhere in the $10-12 living wage range) would you be willing to pay pretty close to $10 for a cup of coffee? Again I'm not saying this to urge everybody to give three cheers for starbucks, but we on the left are going to have to offer an alternative to the current neo-liberal model rather than just whine about it and that includes asking ourselves the tough questions and coming up with some answers.

[Selatius]

1. No

They destroyed many coffee growers by buying up land in Latin America and purposely overproducing in order to drive down the price of coffee beans. Many coffee growers were ruined by the glut. However, the price of starbucks coffee at the counter did not see any significant depreciation at all if there was even any. Greater profit margins through the destruction of labor is no good.

[BL611]

8. "Greater profit margins through the destruction of labor is no good."

Agreed, but even without rising profit margins it would be impossible to use fair trade coffee and pay workers $12 an hour without a substantial increase in price.

[OneBlueSky]

2. never been to a Starbucks . . . and don't plan to . . .

the coffee at my local diner is just fine . . . an a whole lot cheaper . . .

[demosincebirth]

17. Exactly.

[tkmorris]

3. You make an assumption I disagree with

Do you really believe that Starbucks would need to charge anything like $10 for a cup of coffee in order to pay their employees decently and use fair trade coffee beans? I don't.

And another thing. Stop propagating the idea that liberals do little more than whine. It's just plain false.

[BL611]

6. Care to state why you don't?

If production costs and wages nearly double why do think prices wouldn't double with it. Do you have any info on starbucks' user costs to profits ratio that supports that? By simply saying I don't like the question rather than answering it you're doing a lot more to propagate that notion than I am.

[tkmorris]

10. Here's why

Because the prices they charge are almost certainly not based on their production costs in the first place. Starbucks charges as much as the market will bear, and not one penny less.

Furthermore, Starbucks' production costs would do nothing like double simply by using fair traded coffee. What percentage of that $5 cup of coffee is actually the cost of the coffee do you think? I don't know exactly how much Starbucks pays for coffee beans but even assuming they use an expensive grade it is almost certainly less than 25 cents. They could pay twice as much for the beans and still not impact the cost significantly.

Wages are of course a different matter, but I don't know what the average Starbucks employee is paid so it is difficult to address that. It is a rather safe bet however that they could pay employees a decent wage (for a coffee house remember) and still make a decent profit.

And for the record, I didn't say I didn't like your question. I said you made assumptions which I felt were faulty.

[lumberjack_jeff]

18. Exactly. They don't have cost-based pricing.

Their pricing is considered value-based, in which the faux-sophisticated atmosphere and cute barristas are part of the "value".

AM-PM has coffee for $1. My kitchen has it for about a dime.

[Mojambo]

4. Don't drink coffee

Never cared for it.

It's a good thing, I could never afford a coffee habit.

[Captain Hilts]

14. It's the same price as a soda and cheaper than hot chocolate.

You buy the Gucci versions - lattes, capuccinos, etc. - then it gets expensive.

[flobee1]

5. nope

I took the amount I paid for starbucks for a month and bought myself a espresso maker.
I now make my own stuff, and it tastes better because I'm not paying 8 dollars for 2 ounces of coffee!

[BL611]

7. Thats fair but

thats not going to lead to barista's making a living wage is it? I admit I admire and envy you making your own coffee, but there's always going to be a large market for coffee shops. I admit I frequent starbucks a decent amount, and its not because I love Starbucks' coffee so much (or even coffee in general), but because its a much nicer environment for me to do work in than my stuffy apt.

[tularetom]

9. I don't think I could afford it

They have like 50 bazillion Starbucks in the world and each one is worth probably a million bucks. Maybe I could afford to buy the shitter at one Starbucks but I don't know what I'd do with it so I think I'll pass. And I wouldn't pay four bits for their coffee, the only reason I ever patronized the joint was it was the only wireless zone around here for a long time.

[Jed Dilligan]

11. A lot of places have "fair trade" coffee that doesn't cost more

than Starbucks. Are they lying, or is the premise of the OP bogus?

I wouldn't be willing to pay a nickel for Starbucks coffee, because it smells like burnt armpit hair!

[Thickasabrick]

12. I just pay $5.00 now at Starbucks - and that's a 4 shot latte. I

don't have a problem paying whatever it is but I don't see it going to $10.00 for awhile. Whatever the price....I'll still go there.

[NOLADEM]

13. This is a BULLSHIT question

It would not require $10 a cup prices for $10/hr wages unless the moron you hire can only make one or two cups of coffee an hour.

Bullshit argument. There is no choice to be made. You can have a reasonably priced product and well paid staff.

Starbucks already pays close to what you postulate would result in $10 coffee. Their product is overpriced for a cup of brown water with two teaspoons of milk in it, but hey, good for them.


The question is not if a company can be profitable with while paying fair wages. They can. Successful companies all over have found it to be so. The question should be 'How can we get more companies to pay better wages' because that is what is good for the economy. Realistic wages that allow consumer spending to fuel the economy at a sustainable rate.

Driving wages down in search of cheap prices is a dead end road to take. Soon, you have a country of people who cannot afford even the cheap shit you now sell.

A story:
Caesar Chavez was walking through a Ford plant and was being taunted by Ford about the automation and robotic assemblers on the floor of the plant and Ford quippeed " I would like to see you get one of these to join a union." Chavez shot back "I would like to see you get one of them to buy a car".

[transeo]

15. No, Charbucks coffee sucks

So over roasted and nasty. Blech.

[DemBones DemBones]

22. Agreed. nt

[Joe Bacon]

25. It's undrinkable

I cannot drink Starbucks, it's too bitter. It tastes like the beans have lighter fluid squirted on them before they're roasted.

[lindisfarne]

16. Why should it cost $10/cup? There are organic coffee shops which pay

their employees a $10/12/hour living wage where I can get a cup of coffee for under $2.

[sandnsea]

19. Oregon minimum wage: $7.50

Starbucks is $1.75 for the house coffee. So I don't know what the hell you're talking about.

[Radical Activist]

20. I'll keep going to locally owned places anyway. n/t

[Clark2008]

21. I have never paid a dime for it - had one once, a friend bought

it for me. I didn't see what was so special. I make better coffee in my kitchen.

[1932]

23. I think the difference would be made up in lower pay for execs rather than

higher prices for coffee.

What's the average CEO:labor salary ratio today? 330:1, up from 30:1 30 years ago? I think you'd see that ratio drop before you'd see Starbucks raise their prices by a muliple of 4.

[1932]

24. I think the difference would be made up in lower pay for execs rather than

higher prices for coffee.

What's the average CEO:labor salary ratio today? 330:1, up from 30:1 30 years ago? I think you'd see that ratio drop before you'd see Starbucks raise their prices by a muliple of 4.

[Skittles]

26. nothing - f***ing nasty coffee

BAD aftertaste

[MadHound]

27. Given the volume that Starbucks does

I seriously doubt that the price hike would be $6-$7.00. In fact it would probably fall into a range somewhere between fifty cents and a dollar a cup. If I liked Starbucks, I would pay the price.

We have a local coffee shop shop that deals in fair trade beans, and it stays quite competitive. It charges somewhere between $3-$4 dollars a cup.

[Vinca]

28. No. People who can't afford health insurance

don't buy $10 a cup coffee.

[Freddie Stubbs]

29. Absolutley not

I don't like the taset of coffee.

[grizmaster]

30. What proof do you have

that paying a fair wage/price for their coffee will translate into a $10 cup of coffee?

[JeffR]

31. Starbucks coffee smells like cat pee

yuck

[BreweryYardRat]

32. Not more than a dollar over the current price.

Frappucinos are damn good, but there's a limit.

And the same goes for everything else.

[philosophie_en_rose]

33. Nothing. I'd rather support other coffee shops.

Starbucks coffee tastes like burnt toast.