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What would you do if YOU were Joe Lieberman?

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:18 PM
Original message
Poll question: What would you do if YOU were Joe Lieberman?
Lieberman disgusts me more and more, but I wonder if it's easier said than done when it comes to actually packing your bags and moving on.

So, if you were Lieberman...and your job was on the line...and the polls told you that you could keep your Senate seat in CT if you ran as an Independent in a 3 way race.....

Would you take one for the party and give up your Senate seat to Lamont, or worse yet to a repuke, even though you know you could have a great chance of winning a 3 way race as an Independent?

Would you feel obligated to retain that Senate seat that the polls are telling you could be yours in a 3 way race as long as you run?

Would you feel like you let yourself and your family down by NOT running in a 3 way race that you would stand a good chance of winning? Would it make yourself feel like a quitter?

If your career was on the line like his is, would you do whatever it takes to keep it going....like what Lieberman is doing now?

To answer my own question, I know for a fact that if the majority of people who originally hired me let me know that they didn't want me anymore, I'd move on and take up another career. I think Joe should, too, but then again, I'm not him and it ain't really happening to me.

How about you? If you were in his shoes, would you move on or would you fight for your job?

Sorry, polls are turned off at Level 3.

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Xipe Totec Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. If I was him, I'd reconsider my position on Iraq n/t
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:32 PM
Response to Reply #1
8. It'll be interesting to see if he does alter it one way or the other
when he campaigns as an Independent. He sure was beating the war drums today on the Sunday morning news show. Sounded like a bitter loser.
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LincolnMcGrath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hurray for the latest attempt to "not really" campaign for Joe on DU.
:puke:

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:36 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Deleted message
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I_Make_Mistakes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. Honestly, he talks about reconciliation and he is the one who has
split the party. He says he would caucus with the Dems., but why would the Dems. want to caucus with him. He is so full of himself, he can't see the trees from the forest.

And, one who has heard the Gore is a bore from Repub friends (he did come off stiff, I voted for him and would again with much more enthusiasm with the looser and un-stiffened Gore), Lieberman is quite un charismatic and stiffer than a rock.

I ponder, when so many of my college professors (academic backgrounds only) tried to teach me to make a difference in the REAL world, lacking REAL world experience themselves, how would they have any knowledge of REAL world skills. I think Joe has been long in the Senate, and really doesn't command the REAL world experience of NED.

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:44 PM
Response to Reply #2
21. Funny how it only took you seconds to try and mischaracterize my thread
Why am I not surprised. You obviously have nothing better to do.
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LincolnMcGrath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Let us examine your own words, shall we mtnsnake?


and the polls told you that you could keep your Senate seat....even though you know you could have a great chance of winning....the polls are telling you could be yours....race that you would stand a good chance of winning....or would you fight for your job....especially since the polls are saying I could win

Seems fair and balanced to me. :eyes:



Again I have to ask, how many different ways can y'all come up with to not actually support the guy running against the Democrat ? You obviously have nothing better to do.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 05:55 AM
Response to Reply #23
31. Only you, Lincoln, could waste so much time by trying to portray threads
as something they're not.

I'm well aware from past experience how you'd love to draw me into some elitist debate about whether or not this thread is "fair and balanced". Sorry, I'm not taking the bait because I know for a fact that this is as fair and balanced as I could make it, but knock yourself out.

You need a good hobby!

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LincolnMcGrath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #31
34. I need a hobby? I'm not the one who is "not actually" campaigning
for the candidate running against the only Democrat on the ballot in ct.

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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #31
38. YOU should listen. I agree with Lincoln.
Somebody is protesting too much...
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kaygore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
3. I happen to have integrity. Lieberman has none. I would move on.
Or, if I were really desperate, I would at least run as a Republican since that is who is actually giving him money, support, and votes.

But, then, Joe is merely an arrogant opportunist!
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
13. DING DING DING! Kaygore, you're our grand prize winner!
I happen to have integrity. Lieberman has none.

That's what makes this a bit of a trick question--are we talking about what Joe WOULD do, or OUGHT TO? If I were Joe, I'd go Republican to keep my job. But I'd do it because I'd have too much integrity to run as a "backwashed" Democrat!

:crazy:
rocknation
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kaygore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:29 PM
Response to Original message
4. If Lieberman is really a Democrat as he says he is then he needs
to start criticizing Bush and Cheney...not Rumsfeld! What a wuz!
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:30 PM
Response to Original message
6. Deleted message
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LincolnMcGrath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:37 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Nice pot shot at the ONLY Democrat running in Ct.
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #11
39. I don't expect anything more from dolstein.
Same shit, different asshole...
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:40 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. That's an honest and well thought out answer, as is similarly
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 09:50 PM by mtnsnake
stated by poster #7.

It's a harder call to make when it involves our own career, that's for sure. Just the same, I wouldn't want to work where I wasn't wanted by the people who originally made it all happen for me.
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metamorph Donating Member (16 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. There are more Repukes and Indies combined
in Connecticut than there are Democrats. It was support from Indies and disaffected Repukes that put Loserman in the Senate in 1988. If he wins this time it'll be the same combo, plus support from the Democrats who didn't and won't vote for Lamont, that puts him over the top.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 06:22 AM
Response to Reply #18
32. NH is interesting too where I think there are more registered Republicans
than Democrats
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dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:14 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. Actually, many of the people who originally made it happen for Joe
supported him in the primary (after all, he got 48% of the vote), and many of these people are still sticking by him.
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Nozebro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:30 PM
Response to Original message
7. At THIS juncture, if I were to suddenly become JL, or if my advice was

sought by him, I'd do exactly what he's doing. If I sought my advice, I'd tell him the same thing. Politics is a tough profession and only the strong survive.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
10. The thing is, we're not Joe Lieberman
He thinks he is 100% right and that the security of his constituents and the country are at stake. He truly believes in what he's doing. I honestly don't know what I'd do if I were a sitting Senator for 20 years and really thought my primary opponent sucked the big one and would be horrible for the country. That's the position people have to put themselves in, the position of truly believing they're saving the country if they run. What would they do then??
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:47 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. Exactly
Well said, sandnsea

As much as so many of us don't like the guy, it's gotta be a lot tougher call if you're actually experiencing it yourself and the pollsters are telling you that you'd probably win if you run as an Ind.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. I still think he should quit though
You just don't take the benefits of some business or political structure and then play these kinds of games when things don't go your way. I can understand why he's doing what he's doing, I just think he's dead wrong.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Same here, sandnsea
He's pretty stubborn.
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dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 10:38 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. With all due respect, Lieberman's given as much as he's gotten
Edited on Sun Aug-20-06 10:41 PM by dolstein
Lieberman has represented the state of Connecticut as a Democrat in one capacity or another for nearly 40 years. During that time, he has actively campaigned for other Democrats and raised millions of dollars for other candidates and Democratic Party organizations. He knocked off a three-term Republican senator in 1988, which is no easy task. Like it or not, he worked as hard as anyone (other than Gore himself) in 2000 to make Al Gore the next President of the United States. And, despite what you've read around here, he's been a reliable Democratic vote the vast majority of the time -- far more reliable than many other Democrats who don't get nearly as much grief from the left-wing as he does.

As the polls currently show, Joe Lieberman doesn't exactly need the support of the Democratic Party to get re-elected. He didn't have to seek the party's nomination, and frankly, he'd probably have been better off if he didn't. While many people view his actions has completely self-serving, one could make a plausible argument that he sought the nomination not for selfish reasons but because he genuinely believed it would have been better for the Democratic Party if he ran as a Democrat than as an independent. Obviously many officials agreed which him, which is why they all backed Lieberman in the primary.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 02:37 AM
Response to Reply #20
29. That's a fair point
He has probably done a lot for the party over the years, fundraising and such, particularly in CT. Still, he's no Bill or Hil, he hasn't contributed to any sort of national face of a popular Democratic Party whatsoever. I'd still say he's benefited from the party infinitely more than the party benefited from him.

I also don't think his votes are the bulk of the problem. He's sort of the opposite of Biden. Biden sounds good a lot more often than Lieberman, but folds when you need the vote. Lieberman may be more dependable on the vote, but he just doesn't get the political climate we're in with these Republicans. I get the impression that he doesn't understand what is at stake for people out here with these Republican policies and Supremes, he doesn't get how much people are suffering. He doesn't understand that their goal is to undo the last 100 years, all of it. If he did, there's no way he wouldn't be filibustering those judicial nominations and the like. Joe is a northeastern Democrat who is popular in his state, there's absolutely no reason for him not to take a stronger stand against this horrible right wing agenda, that's why he gets more grief than red state Dems.

He ran as a Democrat because he never believed he'd lose, it had nothing to do with what he thought would be good for the party. But now he does need to think about that, and he continues to do the exact things that caused him to lose the primary - bad mouthing Democrats and siding with Republicans when he knows good and well that convincing the voters to vote against Republicans is key to regaining Congress. He's out of touch, he needs to accept it, and he needs to go.
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CrushTheDLC Donating Member (448 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Aug-20-06 11:26 PM
Response to Original message
22. If I was Joe, I'd kill myself.
I've never been any good at lying, and Joe, who used to be known as "Mr Morality" - deservedly or not - now finds himself in a situation where he has to LIE and kiss more right wing ass than usual in order to betray the party he still claims loyalty to (even though he refuses to accept that party's choice)
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 12:09 AM
Response to Original message
24. The point is that it is no longer his job. He's been fired.
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dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. Excuse me, but under Connecticut law, primary voters
do not have the power to fire an incumbent, even one who actively seeks their support.

I'd also like to point out that Lieberman was "hired" as U.S. senator not only by Democratic voters in Connecticut, but also by large numbers of independents and Republicans.

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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #26
36. But As A Democrat, Mr. Dolstein
His leading concern must be the Democratic voters of his state. They system depends on a good deal of raw partisanship for its effective functioning, pious noises and civics classes notwithstanding. In a very real and important sense, those who vote for a Party's candidate without being members of that party do not really count in the calculation of who he is to be loyal to.
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dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. That's one philosophy of governance
but it's hardly the only legitimate one. One could reasonably take the position that an elected official owes an even higher duty to their state or to their country than they owe to their party.

According to view you describe, the handful of Southern senators who refused to sign the Southern manifesto were not acting as enlightened statemen but were instead betraying the (all white) political parties who sent them to Washington and to whom they owed their sole allegiance.

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martymar64 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #26
37. You believe Repubs should determine who the Dems run?
It's sure sounds like you believe that the Republicans should get a say in who the Democratic Party nominates.

Are you saying that? Be honest now.

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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #37
41. That's EXACTLY what Dolstein believes.
"only fighting for democracy after all..."
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dolstein Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #37
44. I believe that principles of democracy dictate that the majority
Edited on Mon Aug-21-06 06:24 PM by dolstein
of voters should not be denied the opportunity to vote for the candidate of their choice. If a majority of voters in Connecticut want to send Lieberman back to the U.S. Senate, they should be allowed that opportunity. Their voting choices shouldn't be dictated to them by a minority of the voters.

It's the same thing with legislation. How many bills that are capable of garnering majority support on the floor get killed by committes that are stacked in favor of the minority viewpoint? Party primaries can work in much the same way.

I prefer open primaries along the lines of what you have in Lousiana, where candidates from all parties appear on the same ballot and, if no candidate gets 50%, you have a run off between the top two vote getters. I think it would be even better if you had an instant runoff system where voters rank the candidates.
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TankLV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 03:44 PM
Response to Reply #26
40. Tell us all again how much he is a "true" Democrat. We can't wait.
On the other hand, we've heard enough bullshit...
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tyedyeto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 12:14 AM
Response to Original message
25. I would make a concession speech and retire gracefully. n/t
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loyalsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 02:02 AM
Response to Original message
27. If......
I were Lieberman and believed in the underlying premise that party politics is an internal Democracy, I would accept defeat and move on.

If, however I were the existing Lieberman, and I had had it in mind to count the entire population as my constituency for the purposes of determining whether or not I should run at all, I would have left the party BEFORE the primary.

I would have more respect for him, despite continued disagreement, if he would have left long ago.

As far as a career, the reason for elections is that we have an opportunity to review their job performance. I am a true believer in the principle that our elected officials are constantly under review.
Elected office is not a position in which a person is entitled to job security.
I personally would not expect that, and would assume that there is always a possibility of losing an election and expect that I may need to move on at some point.
If I were Lieberman and able to maintain my own perspective, I would explore other options.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 02:24 AM
Response to Original message
28. Joementum really has nowhere to turn.
He's been rejected by the Democrats and probably would never consider becoming the Republican candidate as I have no doubt he is being courted. His otherwise liberal voting record makes that not very likely. I think he has yet to fully digest and make peace with his fate which was already determined in the primary. He will probably continue to be nudged by Democrats to "search his soul" (a la HRC). Lamont has to continue building support so that the polls don't give Lieberman any excuse to stay in the race and risk become a pariah as his final legacy.
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symbolman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 04:47 AM
Response to Original message
30. I'd pull Cheney/Rove's hand OUT of my Ass - new Flash about Joe
Here's my latest work all about Joe LIEberman's ridiculous run as a "Party of One", which reminds me of "Army of One" (which gives ME a mental image of a guy stuck under fire in a foxhole, looking around and saying, "WHERE the hell IS EVERYBODY!!") :) -- Makes about as much sense in a marketing vein. Party of One, Translates into "Party of NONE" when it involved LIEberman, might as well be saying, "Party of ME", eh?

This flash also incorporates the fact that the Terror Lockdown on Liquids, etc came so close on the heels of Joe's Smackdown by Lamont as to not be considered credible - even today they are confirming that people will walk FREE because they don't have the evidence to hold them, let alone that there were NO Explosives in their possession, they hadn't even made reservations, etc, etc..

Meanwhile they talk about charging a PREGNANT woman for having some water, and a face wipe - this flash addresses those concerns as well, the fact that WE are being used as PUPPETS in a The Politics of Terror.

Remember, a republican said they'd ride this last nonThreat all the way into November. Let's prove them wrong.. Let's VOTE for Lamont, as we all know this last Primary was a referendum on Bush and his faked "war". The Nerve of LIEberman to shit all over the Democrats. It's like using a girlfriend to get you through medical school and then snatching up the Trophy Wife once you've graduated. How can we ever trust this Puppet again?

One of my best Flash works ever, and to the Tune of "Masters of War" by Mr Bob Dylan, and no truer words were spoken in our time.

Have a look at:

http://web.takebackthemedia.com/geeklog/public_html/sta...

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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
33. You could easily reframe the question...
.. to be "do I have integrity or not"? Or "am I in this for the good of the country/company/whatever, or for myself"?

Lieberman has made it abundantly clear, it's about HIM. HIS needs are more important than anything.

That said, I think that he is revealing himself to be the typical "me-me-me" politician, and that is going to sink in a lot of voters' heads. Despite the current polling, I don't think he is going to win.

We'll see.
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alvarezadams Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
35. He should join the GOP
And try to revive the "Rockefeller Republicans"... even if they would be too liberal for him.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 06:14 PM
Response to Original message
43. Seppuku.
Edited on Mon Aug-21-06 06:15 PM by RUMMYisFROSTED
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Sir Jeffrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 09:04 PM
Response to Reply #43
46. Seconded nt
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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 08:50 PM
Response to Original message
45. Lecture circuit, baby!
You get to keep the soapbox, take in some cash, and have a more laid back lifestyle than that of a U.S. Senator.
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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Aug-21-06 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
47. I would do the honorable thing and commit seppuku, or "hari-kiri"
Ritual suicide is the only way to preserve honor, if as Lieberman, I had brought shame and disgrace by being an enabler for Bush.
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Ken Burch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Aug-24-06 02:21 AM
Response to Original message
48. I'd have myself castrated, lobotomized and sent into exile.
(Any chance we can have all that done to him anyway?)
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