I watched the entire CSK funeral twice. Sen Clinton should not have spoken

[Stinky The Clown]

I am as outraged as anyone at the hypocritical BULLSHIT coming out of the Three Monkey Media regarding the supposed politicization of Mrs. King's funeral.

Message to the media ... the Kings WERE political. As someone else here on DU said ..... would you be outraged at a comedian's funeral if jokes were told? To say nothing of the obvious politicization of St. Ronnie's funeral. Media whores .... fuck thyselves.

But I digress ...... What I will call the headliner part of the program .... Joe Lowery and The Four Presidents ....... is what has everyone's tongue a-waggin'.

Preznit Fruit Loops was his usual awful self.

Father Of Fruitloops was clueless about Black people and it showed.

President Carter was wonderful. His words, obviously aimed squarely at Prez PissyPantz, were eloquent and moving. And completely appropriate.

Big Dawg brought the house down. As only Big Dawg can ...... and even scolded the locals in the audience to take care of the King Center. And even **that** got an ovation.

And then there was Mrs. Clinton. Please understand. I like Hillary. I really do and want her to stay in the Senate. But her words yesterday were just plain wrong. Not her words, actually, just her temerity in deigning to crash the party, as it were, on Bill's ticket. And then there was her vocal cadence ...... she even, to my ear, at least, tried to speak like a Black preacher .... just a bit .... seemed to think better of it and went back to her normal Chicago accent.

Mrs. Clinton ........ please .... I say this out of love and respect ..... don't do this kind of thing again. It is beneath you, serves no good purpose, and makes you look petty, cloying ..... and .... well .... small.

And for the right wing who already hate you viscerally, it amplifies the target they've painted on your backside.

[applegrove]

1. Seems like it is swifboat Hillary week. If she wasn't the greatest

speaker - who really is surprised?

:popcorn:

[JuniperLea]

2. Hmmm...

I didn't notice anything like that at all. In fact, I thought she was unusually apropos.


I sit on the Hillary fence and would critique her in this regard if I could... but, no. Sorry. Didn't see that.

[incapsulated]

3. Hillary!

:popcorn:

[rsmith6621]

4. Read My Signature........

.....I believe it with all my heart......she doesnt deserve any entertaining for 2008....

[RubyDuby in GA]

5. "she even, to my ear, at least, tried to speak like a Black preacher"

Just like last month when she spoke at the church in Harlem.
She really is a poor speaker. I'll give her the fact that no one can follow the Big Dog. No one, but still, she really is a horrible public speaker. And I agree that she shouldn't have been up there speaking.

[karynnj]

16. She was actually better than usual

I saw her Rosa Parks and RFK memorials speeches where she was not very good at all. She is better at political speeches - but she's not the natural Bill is. (Though I prefer the Kerry Rosa Parks' speech to either of the Clinton's. He incidently made a joke that they would want him to attempt to emmulate the preacher who really had everyone going earlier in the service. He then gave a very beautiful eulogy speaking in his normal Massachusettes voice.)

[SharonAnn]

37. She's a very good speaker, especially when compared to the preznit.

[AbbyR]

47. My dog is a very good speaker compared to the president...

I didn't hear Hillary, so I can't comment about that, but I'm SO tired of the president of this country being such an idiot. He's an embarrassment.

[Withywindle]

6. I would assume that the King family invited her to speak, no?

I seriously doubt she "crashed the party."

[DURHAM D]

13. Exactly. The thing I really want to know is if Bush crashed the

party.

He was not invited to the January 2004 celebration at the King Center but he asked to come - the family felt pressured to let him attend. He placed a wreath on MLK's grave and then went to a fund raiser. Pretty sure the purpose of the wreath placement was so the taxpayers could foot the bill for his trip to Georgia to raise money.

No reason to think he was invited this time - probably just insisted on being there. No doubt he had a $5,000 a handshake party in Atlanta after the funeral so we could, once again, foot the bill.

This Hillary discussion is a distraction. Please stop it or I will be suspicious of your real agenda.

[KSLeftyMom]

43. that was my thought too

I believe she and Mrs. King were friends. Not best buddies, but political friends. She probably wanted to speak.

I like Hillary. Mostly because she pisses off the right so much. :-)

[WatchWhatISay]

7. I have deep respect for her also, but I hope Chris Matthews is wrong

about her being the obvious frontrunner for '08 Dem nomination. I think that is a Republicans wet dream and will not work for us any time soon. I only know one person who thinks she's the best we've got (suprisingly, a male).

I agree with you Husb2Sparkly, I like her right there in the Senate.

[endarkenment]

9. Please don't listen to tweety.

Please boycott that asshat. Please don't entice others to give him ratings by relating the bullshit from his mouth-orifice.

[Cha]

26. tweety knows shit about

anything..he's part of the problem.

The fascist media and press are pushing it and trying to mold the landscape just like they've been getting away with forever. Maybe the American Public will finally wake the fuck up.

[endarkenment]

8. Hillary not my choice but her speaking was just fine.

The thing about funerals is that it is up to the family who gets to speak and who doesn't and last I heard they were just fine with both of the Clintons.

But if you want to slam behavior at a funeral, take a look at just about any of the pictures of that little creep and his hideous wifey. That is how NOT to behave at a funeral.

[0007]

30. I agree!

[AtomicKitten]

10. Hillary was First Lady for 8 years for crissakes.

not a great speaker, but I don't think she was "crashing the party"

[BeyondGeography]

11. I agree, she was a crashing bore

The effect or her when-will-she-get-to-the-point performance was made all the worse by following The Natural, aka her husband. She's actually capable of much better, but someone forgot to give her a plan for yesterday's speech.

[TheDebbieDee]

12. I heard Hillary use her "preacher" diction..........

at an Iowa Democratic fundraiser in September or October of 2003 so this is nothing new to me. She basically emceed in a tent in the middle of a muddy Iowa pasture on a cold rainy day and introduced all the Democratic candidates (Kerry, Edwards, Dean and a few others that I can't recall).

Hillary was electric. Using her Preacher diction and mannerisms, she whipped the crowd into a frenzy. She was electrifying and I wondered then why she wasn't a candidate.

In my humble opinion, only Big Dawg himself and perhaps John Edward can do a better job than she of speaking to a crowd.

If Hillary decides to make a run for the Presidency in 08, she'll need to be able to attract the attention of people whose attention is not easily held, and Hillary will fit this bill!

[Debi]

23. I don't remember Hillary being at the Harkin Steak Fry

in 2003

http://www.drakedems.com/photos/2003-2004.html

However, she did Emcee the Iowa Democratic Party Jefferson Jackson Day Dinner in 2003

http://www.iowapresidentialpolitics.com/archive/shuppyjeffjackdinner.html

(All the candidates prepared the intro that Hillary gave for them at the JJ Dinner - I don't remember her giving a speech before the intros)

[Clark2008]

36. Hillary whipped a crowd into a frenzy?

I've heard her give speeches. I don't dislike her, but I think she has the warmth of a tepid washcloth. I can't see her, somehow, whipping anything into a frenzy (with the expection of cookie dough - JOKE!!!).

[TallahasseeGrannie]

14. I'm not convinced she is the best candidate for us

but I really like her demeanor...her appearance. She has a pleasant, intelligent face and I see humor there as well. Great, great face.

I'm always going on about faces...I paint portraits so I notice. But that is one great face.

And I think that's why Babs didn't go. Her face? Not so great anymore. Used to be nice. Scary now. Greatly advanced age will do that.

[DURHAM D]

24. Did you catch the shot of Laura either yawning or fixing

a locked jaw right after Hillary finished speaking. Ran my Tivo back a couple of times to try and figure out what the heck she was doing. Looked really stupid. Does botox slip ?

[TallahasseeGrannie]

25. I noticed that both she and GWB

got visibly tired. I'm not going to crawl all over them for it, though, because if I had a national camera on me for three minutes I'd have a stroke and die. And I can't sit still, either. Gosh, it must have been a nightmare to be so 100 percent on camera. I am glad I don't have that job. What kind of person LIKES that kind of thing? I can't begin to imagine.

[meegbear]

15. I though we were only supposed to hate the DLC this week ...

would somebody PM me a syllabus?

[Stinky The Clown]

18. This wasn't a hate thread .........

.... it was a personal commentary on a single event.

The impressions were mine and reman mine and I stand by them.

I also stand by what else I said in the original post. I love Hilary and want her to stay right there in the Senate representing the citizens of New York.

[dusmcj]

17. spouse of an honored guest, and earned her own creds.

The gaspassers and blowhards who are pontificating about the funeral have forgotten that it's a _private_ affair and that the family can invite whomever it damn well pleases and do whatever it damn well wants - Buffalo Wings, margaritas and party hats all round to celebrate the Departed's passing to a better place if that's what they want. I expect that the White House at least wasn't averse to attending, but if so they did it as guests of a private ceremony - the persons on whom the events centered were the Kings, not the President just because he attended - they set the tone, not he, and instead he was a guest. Hence there was nothing inappropriate about the drubbing he came in for from the other speakers.

By the same token, the Clintons were also guests at this private affair. Both of them. Certainly Mr. Clinton has genuine personal relationships with many leaders of the black community and is revered by large segments of it. Which certainly Mr. Bush Sr. for example cannot say. So that first he was invited as a friend, rather than a head of state. Which is certainly the capacity in which the Bushes were invited (and Laura came along based first on protocol under my line of reasoning). Hence no Babs. By contrast, the Clintons being there first as friends were of course both welcome, and beyond that, Hillary has carried load for progressive causes to an extent beyond challenge. Both before the White House, in it, and now in the Senate. She has more than earned her creds; if only we had more like her. We owe BOTH her and her husband a deep debt of gratitude; they have been embodying service to the American public in a way which is rare today.

[Neil Lisst]

19. It's the family's call, end of story. They get to choose.

Bottom line is this: It's up to the family to decide, and if they wanted her to speak, that's fine by me.

She's not a good speaker, and when she says "our Lord" not even Bill believes it, but it's the family's call as to who speaks.

[Tsiyu]

41. Unlike the **'s, I believe Hillary

actually attends church services regularly, FWIW

[MODemocrat]

20. The right wingers have already used Hillary for a doormat for 14 years

Why would they like her any better if she hadn't spoken at the funeral? Who cares what those dirty-mouthed fascists think? They'd just better get used to it. It beats me why so many people hate women in high positions. It reeks so much of schauvinism. B-)

[bucklebone]

40. do you think people hate women in high positions??

I don't think so. I know that there are some idiots out there, but if she's the best and the brightest for the position, then so be it.

[Bluerthanblue]

21. I don't necessiarily

agree with you for the reasons you cited-

However, it would have been good to see anyone try and follow The 'big dog'-

She is unfairly disliked by people for reasons no one can really put their finger
on, and while that is incredibly frustrating, it is reality.
I don't see her as having any hope of election as president-
And her words didn't offend me, or move me- I was too busy digesting the poigniant words
of her husband- he even joked about her being a 'good lookin woman' at her age, he is just
so real, warts and all- that is something i'd sure like to see more of-

People who can just 'be'- and not put on airs, love-em or hate em.

Hillary seems to be 'playing' her cards too close to the middle for my own personal comfort level,
siding with moderates where I want her to speak out boldly- But I can't dis- her.

She gets enough of that just by breathing- and I can't figure out why.

[guidod]

22. So, tell me if I'm wrong...

...You're asking somebody to stand down at someones funeral? Is everything political to you?

[Catchawave]

27. I like Hillary too. ..but

she shoulda gone first. Bill's always a hard act to follow, and she should have known better.

[formernaderite]

39. she should NEVER Follow Clinton...who reminded me

why I voted for him in the first place...the man can speak...

Of course I also think She should NEVER run for President. I just can't stand legacy elections.

[NoPasaran]

28. I thought Hillary speaking was fine

But it was inappropriate of her to eat that puppy.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

29. I like her, I admire her, and I would vote for another Clinton era.

I didn't care for the constant head bobbing while her husband spoke, though. No real reason; I just don't like it.

[beaconess]

31. She was invited by the King children to speak - who are we to say

she should not have?

[tishaLA]

32. In a way, it was a huge success as much as a failure

I think the delivery of it was terrible and, I have to confess, I have always been allergic to her voice. It has that midwestern nasality I cannot stand, although I find east coast Jewish nasality--the kind I grew up with--comforting. So that's purely subjective.

Here's why it was a success, though: she eulogized CSK as a version of herself. She knew her husband was a prince bound for greatness, to the decision to be with him was difficult. She stood beside and behind him as he fought the good fight. Then, when his time was over, she took his legacy and allowed it to expand, grew into her own, and found her own voice.

On the one hand, she was talking about CSK, but on the other hand, she was delivering a brilliantly narcissistic speech about herself. It's called "signifying" in African American culture--talking about one thing while really talking about another.

[Joey Liberal]

33. I agree, Hillary should not have spoken

Hillary should not have spoken. For one thing, it's nearly impossible for anyone to follow up after the Big Dog speaks. It sort of ruined the moment. Her speech wa boring.

[Libby2]

35. Who are you to say she should not have spoken?

It is none of our business who spoke.

[Joey Liberal]

38. I have a right to an opinion

If you don't like it, too bad.

[Totally Committed]

34. "Not her words, actually,

just her temerity in deigning to crash the party, as it were, on Bill's ticket."

If she decides to run... this is her "in" card and her unfair advantage, imo. I think it's the only reason she's staying married to him. Can you imagine??? -- Implicit or explicit endorsement from a former POTUS. Really, really unfair... and as gauche a move as she's ever made to date.

TC

[Catchawave]

42. Her speech was fine, shouldn't have followed Bill

Just a tough act to follow !

[KSLeftyMom]

44. NOONE should ever follow Bill

He's just too damn good of a speaker.

[ClassWarrior]

45. So which King child are you?

NGU.

[laugle]

46. I missed Hillary's speech, but it was worth it just to see her

and Laura Bush SNEAR at each other.

Boy, old Laura looked as though she wanted to choke Hillary!!