Spying on non-citizens in the U.S. is legal without a warrent.

[jseankil]

Take some time and pour over this.


http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/usc_sup_01_50_10_36_20_I.html

[Lerkfish]

1. requires registration. besides, what doest that have to do with anything?

this issue is circumventing existing laws to spy on american citizens.

[jseankil]

2. I did not know if it was confirmed that the persons spied on were citizens

of the U.S. Has that been confirmed? Or are they foreigners visiting here? Want the ducks to line up in a row, that's all.

[ellenfl]

3. definitely citizens. that part has not been repudiated by

the admin. i would LOVE to see a list of victims.

ellen fl

[jseankil]

5. Well if they are U.S citizens then I'd say Bush is in a world of hurt. /nm

/nm

[ellenfl]

11. one can only hope . . . eom

[meganmonkey]

4. Please post some text

particularly since the site requires registration.

Thanks.

[kerry-is-my-prez]

6. These were citizens - Quakers, PETA, environmentalists, blogs, libraries.

THAT'S what they're upset about....

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wildflower]

9. "The press can carry our water for only so long"? n/t

[kath]

14. There is NO good evidence that the National Guard memos were NOT

authentic.

[bluenctocome]

18. No good evidence because you don't agree with it? n/t

[bluenctocome]

8. Just found another Exec Order

He is one from Carter authorizing electronic surveillance without a warrant. This is going down hill quicker than I thought.

http://www.fas.org/irp/offdocs/eo12139.htm

[Connie_Corleone]

10. Check your facts:

What Clinton actually signed:

Section 1. Pursuant to section 302(a)(1) <50 U.S.C. 1822(a)> of the Act, the Attorney General is authorized to approve physical searches, without a court order, to acquire foreign intelligence information for periods of up to one year, if the Attorney General makes the certifications required by that section.


What Carter’s executive order actually says:

1-101. Pursuant to Section 102(a)(1) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 (50 U.S.C. 1802(a)), the Attorney General is authorized to approve electronic surveillance to acquire foreign intelligence information without a court order, but only if the Attorney General makes the certifications required by that Section.

http://thinkprogress.org/2005/12/20/drudge-fact-check/

[bluenctocome]

17. What Carter signed

The link I provided was to the Executive Order. The trick is to find the text of Section 102(a)(1) of (50 U.S.C 1802(a)).

I haven't tried to find text of Law but here is what Clinton's Assoc. Attorney General said in the Chicago Trib. By virtue of it being on Drudge does not make it true nor does the fact that it shows up on one of our websites. Of course, his opinion does not make it true either. Only a court of law can make that determination. However, Mr. Schmidt sites 4 appeals courts upholding the Pres' authority. And he has no dog in the fight. If anything he would be supporting our point of view.

I'm not lobbying for * was right. I'm just warning everyone not to get too far out on this limb. Every time we rush to judgment the facts have turned against us and we look stupid. I would love to get him but let's keep our powder dry until we know all the facts of history regarding past presidents, court rulings and constitutional interpretation.



http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/chi-0512210142dec21,0,3553632.story?coll=chi-newsopinioncommentary-hed

[montana500]

12. FOREIGN surveillance

nm

[MrDale]

13. here's a neo con reply i just recieved

your continued allegations of law-breaking rests solely on the fact that the president authorized wiretaps without first getting the approval of the court established under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978.

there has been on president then or since has ever conceded that that Act trumped a President\\\'s power to make exceptions to FISA, i.e. HE DOESNT NEED THE WARRANT FROM THE COURT if national security required it.

FISA established a process by which certain wiretaps in the context of the Cold War could be approved, not a limit on what wiretaps could ever be allowed.

The courts have all agree, most recently in a Sealed Case, the 2002 opinion by the special panel of appellate judges established to hear FISA appeals. In its per curiam opinion,

the court noted that in a previous FISA case (U.S. v. Truong), a federal \\\"court, as did all the other courts to have decided the issue

[imax2268]

16. Yes...check your facts...

(Quote)He is one from Carter authorizing electronic surveillance without a warrant. This is going down hill quicker than I thought.(quote)



that's a right wing talking point...

[Lerkfish]

19. Mmmmm...pizza!

:)

[CJCRANE]

15. Then that invalidates what Cheney said

about not being able to spy on the 9-11 hijackers.

i.e. they could've easily spied on them within the law at the time.