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sweetm2475 Donating Member (523 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:18 AM
Original message
Plamegate Experts.....PLEASE HELP!!! I'm a little confused.......
Ok, I have a really dumb question and I should already know the answer but with everything I have read about the CIA leak story, I just don't totally get one thing....If Fitzgerald is the hardcore, straight up, by the book, by the rules, pay attention to details prosecutor that everyone says he is (and I am not trying to dispute that, I've read nothing to tell me otherwise), but my question is, How did he end up getting chosen to prosecute this case? I understand about Ashcroft being pressured to recuse himself and Fitzgerald subsequently being chosen to take over the case, but does anyone know how he was chosen? It just doesn't make any sense to me that the Bush Administration would allow something like this to happen. I know it wasn't really up to them but has that ever stopped them before??? Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, I'm eagerly awaiting Fitzmas just like I'm sure the rest of you are and nothing would satisfy my dark side more than watching every last one of these bastards get tarred and feathered, it's just that I worry about getting my hopes up too high, and Fitzgerald being too good to be true, and my gut instinct just tells me that the Busheviks we all know never would have allowed this to happen and that is what makes the whole thing hard to trust. I'm not saying what I think is right or wrong, God knows I hope I'm wrong and it isn't too good to be true, just looking for a little insight from others who have been following the story more closely and probably know more than I do. Thanks everyone and once again, sorry if this question seems like a dumb one, just want to know if maybe anyone else has been wondering the same thing, or even has an explanation.

:shrug:
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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
1. Kick
I'm pretty curious myself.
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
2. Great question
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mrcheerful Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:23 AM
Response to Original message
3. Because bushco
thought they could get their way and Fritz wouldn't dig to deep ot yo long. Thats the failing aspect of repukes, they keep forgetting that not all are blinded by their light.
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:24 AM
Response to Original message
4. Ashcroft's asst. named Fitz, and if I recall, they were college buddies,
or roommates. I can't recall the name of the Asst. AG right now, but it was a respected friend thing.
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Jack from Charlotte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #4
21. His name is Comey.....
And from all accounts he's a Justice Deportment pro. Not a political scumbag/hack like AWOL/Morons other appointees. When Ashcroft recused himself of the "investigation" that left Comey to appoint a special prosecutor. Comey chose Fitz, who is the Northern District of Illinois Federal prosecute. Comey and Fitz set the terms of the Special Prosecutes Office which is.... Fitz has complete power and no one can fire him.

Fitz prosecuted the Gov of Illinois, Ryan on corruption charges.

Comey has since left Justice for private practice, I think.

By all accounts Fitz is a straight arrow, non political workaholic.
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thinkingwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
5. I'm not an expert
Hopefully one of the experts will come along and clean up what I'm about to summarize for you.

Basically, as I understand it, when Ashcroft finally caved to pressure to recuse himself, the decision to select a special prosecutor was left to the next in line, and the next in line picked somebody he knew and trusted--Fitzgerald.

In other words...America got lucky, because Fitzgerald knew the right person, or the right person knew Fitzgerald.

Sorry I can't remember the name of the guy who selected Fitzgerald offhand and don't have time to search through threads. If you want more information, search through old Plame threads--they are FULL of this and other important info.
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crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #5
10. James Comey
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 11:30 AM by crispini
The thing is that most people don't realize that James Comey was only in his position a scant two or three months at the time Ashcroft recused himself. So he was by no means part of the "establishment" at the AG's office, IMO -- he just had not had time to become part of the system. that's just my opinion.

So, Ashcroft recuses himself, the task falls to a relative unknown newbie at Justice, who, wanting to do the best job possible, appoints his college roomate and old friend, Fitzgerald, whom he knows to be a man with a white hat.

Interestingly enough, Comey has since resigned from Justice to go "back to work" in the private sector. However, Comey was never IN the private sector. He was in the prosecutor's office in NY.

Comey, btw, was the guy who prosected Martha Stewart. Now isn't THAT interesting.
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thinkingwoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. thanks!
wow, your post two things I wasn't aware of before today (well, 3 if you include his name, but I'm HORRIBLE with names :eyes: )

1. That Comey was only there a short short time before making the critical appointment, and

2. That he is the guy who prosecuted Martha Stewart!

Thanks a bunch for posting! :hi:
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rainidame Donating Member (46 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks, I was just about to post the same question and
decided to browse yours first. I fear all of this will only be so that they can say, "see, we investigated really well, and we found no foul play." BUT I have to say that if they do that now, with all the recent "leaks," it seems as though they will face a pretty tough propaganda job.
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Duer 157099 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
7. I too was wondering
and the answer I gave myself (with no research, just speculation) was that at that time they were SO utterly awash in hubris that they bet the house, thinking they'd never lose.

I hope that's the case, and not the other nefarious scenarios.
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npincus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
8. article about Fitz's appointment: Dec 31, 2003
Edited on Wed Oct-19-05 11:27 AM by npincus
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/09/30/national/main...

his appointment was met with sketpicism by Dems. this doesn't exactly anwer your question about process- I will see what else I can dig up.

I can only say the Dems and GOP have underestimated Fitz's autonomy and integrity- he is not siding with political parties, he is siding with facts.
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
9. I wish people would call this WHgate or WMDgate. Plamegate leaves
us stuck with the revenge game which appears trivial for people who are not savvy about the real reasons behind the ENTIRE story.

We make it easy for unknowing people and spinner-propagandists to to flick it off with smirks if we stay at the level of Wilson-Plame. They were at the kick off point. The game has spread.

It involves everything from Brewster-Jennings to Judith Miller to MSM involvement in the case for war, forged documents, plus the illegalities of it all.
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. I like "Traitorgate."
Has a nice ring to it and it cuts to the core of what it's about.
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mzmolly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
11. They made a political mistake.
Even evil people F-up.
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npincus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
12. GREAT stuff about Fitzgerald, Read this:
http://www.dailyhowler.com/dh072505.html

VON DREHLE: Fitzgerald is the son of Irish immigrants"fresh off the boat," in the words of John Goggins, a prominent corporate lawyer in New York who has known Fitzgerald since high school. He grew up in the Flatbush neighborhood of Brooklyn and won a scholarship to Regis High School in Manhattan, a highly competitive Jesuit academy.

He worked his way through Amherst College, cleaning the school's restrooms and painting walls. In summers, the math and economics major earned more tuition money as a school janitor and part-time doorman in some of the same Upper East Side luxury buildings where his father had worked as a doorman for years.

Fitzgerald got his fill of rich and powerful people that way, Goggins said.

"He had numerous funny anecdotes about being treated shabbily by residents who didn't realize this was a Phi Beta Kappa from Amherst, and later a Harvard Law School student, holding the door." According to his friends, Fitzgerald never resented the slights, but he also made it clear that he was never going to seek the approval of such people.

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wryter2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-20-05 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #12
23. Awesome
Thanks! Wow, we really lucked out with Fitz. I hope he stays safe. :tinfoilhat:
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crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:33 AM
Response to Original message
13. Here is the thread where I did some digging on Fitz
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

and it has some links to info on James Comey.
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Bethany Rockafella Donating Member (916 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
14. I think because he prosecuted a couple of high profile Democrats,
it's the reson Republicans didn't try and thwart his appointment.
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npincus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
15. Your answer is here, provided by Deputy Atty Gen Comey:
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/scripts/printer_friendly.p...

The scope and breadth the investigation would assume was not known at the time of Fitz's appointment, announce Dec. 30, 2003.


-----------------------------------------------------

On December 30, Deputy Attorney General Comey held a press conference to announce that Ashcroft had removed himself from the investigation. Comey said that the investigation would instead be headed by Fitzgerald. Of note to me, was Comey's comment that "this has come together really in the last week" -- meaning, apparently, the week of December 22-26 -- the Christmas holiday week during which the FBI raised the prospect of a grand jury.

As Comey explained, given Fitzgerald's U.S. Attorney status -- which will be continuing concurrent with his "special counsel" status -- there will be no interruption in the investigation. Comey noted that if Fitzgerald "needs to issue a subpoena involving the media, for example, or if he wants to grant immunity to somebody," he will not have to obtain approval of the Justice Department. (The reference to the media certainly hints at subpoenaing Novak's phone records, or calling him before the grand jury -- again suggesting progress in the inquiry.)

On January 2, NBC News reported that the FBI was focusing on the White House as the probable source of the leak. It also reported that the FBI had asked White House staffers "to sign a form releasing reporters from any promises of confidentiality they may have made to their sources."

Not only does none of this activity indicate an investigation that is being scuttled, but it clearly implies something noteworthy has happened in the investigation.
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joeprogressive Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:03 PM
Response to Original message
18. name one decision Bush has made that was correct
this is very consistent with his numerous blunders
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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
19. ------CHICAGO ---------
Ashcroft recusing himself is mentioned above but I think that the jurisdiction on this determined that it had to be someone from the US attorney's office in Chicago. Novak writes for the Chicago Sun-Times so the crime* would have been committed in Chicago thus setting the jursidiction.

I THINK that is part of why it ended up being Fitz.
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
20. Fitz worked under Comey
when Comey was USDA for the Southern District of NY. By all accounts Comey is/was a professional and not a political hack. Here's a great article on Fitz:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A55560-20...

James B. Comey, deputy attorney general and unofficial president-for-life of the Pat Fitzgerald Booster Club, says no high-profile prosecutor ever provided less evidence that he was "doing something wacky."

"What's been interesting is seeing the media accounts and the columnists portray him as some sort of runaway prosecutor. That makes me smile," says Comey, who is largely responsible for Fitzgerald getting the Plame assignment. "Because there is no prosecutor who is less of a runaway than this guy."

snip-----------


"I called Louis Freeh and said, 'Who's the best assistant U.S. attorney you know of in the country?' He said, 'Patrick Fitzgerald in the Southern District of New York.' " The senator then called Mary Jo White, who ran the New York office. Same question. Same answer.

At the time, Patrick Fitzgerald was trying suspects in the 1998 bombings of the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania. He thought the call from a senatorial aide was a practical joke by one of his buddies. But as soon as their interview was over, the senator knew he had his man.

"I thought, 'He is the original Untouchable,' " Peter Fitzgerald says. "You could just see it in his eyes that he was a straight shooter. There were no levers that anyone had over him. He had no desire to become a partner in a private law firm. He has no interest in electoral politics. He wanted to be a prosecutor."
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No Exit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-19-05 08:02 PM
Response to Original message
22. Bush was a "C" student
A dumbass. A dork. A flunkie. A mental midget.

That's all.
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