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Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 02:08 PM
Original message
Let's get something straight ..........
I was a very early poster about the Roberts nomination announcement once it was made ....... here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
...... here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
...... and here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

I said what I said, and I'll own it.

But don't for a second see it as an endorsement of Roberts. Some here have postulated that those who see this as I do are somehow endorsing Roberts ... or at least saying he's not so bad.

I don't see it that way. I see him as being as bad as anything we could have forseen. I believe he is a man who can overturn Roe. I don't know that he will ... and neither do you. But he surely *could*.

In the days and weeks to come, many of us will change or moderate our views. Indeed, mine is already moderating. Not changing ...... but moderating.

I still believe ...... the RW put out this nomination early to distract from all the other crap.

I still believe ...... they **want** us to scream bloody blue murder about it so we can again assume our place as 'obstructionists'.

I still believe ...... they can accomplish this (paint us as obstructionists) and that has a HUGE potential to damage our chances in the deadly critical 06 midterms.

I still believe ...... that even if we got as many Dem senators as humanly possible to see things exactly our way we will still lose the vote on Roberts' confirmation. In view of this .......

I still believe ...... if we try to filibuster we not only lose on Roberts, but we'll lose the future ability to filibuster.

So where have I moderated?

I had earlier posited that we should just do nothing and then just quietly vote 'no' on Roberts, just as a symbolic thing, really, since we're likely to lose anyhow.

I now believe we should be tough in our vetting process with Roberts. We should ask the very tough questions and demand answers. We **can** paint him as an extremist - or at least raise enough doubt that he will be damaged ..... and by extension, so will idiot son be damaged. I now believe, after reading other posts here and giving things more thought, that an *effective* questioning of Roberts has a great potential to turn some public opinion our way. Surely there are Bush voters/supporters who will get cold feet at the prospect of giving up their reproductive rights.

But I would advise against being too shrill. (Yes, 'shrill' is their word .... but you know what I mean.) We can surely manage to get our views out without appearing to be anything but reasonable.

As we should not be shrill, so should we not become a one issue chorus. There are many issues that are out there now. Each of them smells badly for idiot son. Keep them *all* high on the national radar screen.

But in the end, be ready to lose on Roberts. I can honestly see no way on God's green earth we can win in the Senate. There are too many Repubs and, sadly, to many squishy Dems for our side to win the day.

I wish it were otherwise, but it simply isn't. I'm just hoping we can make the best of a bad situation. Use Roberts as ammunition to the greatest extent possible, but be ready to move on when the inevitable takes place.
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politicaholic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. Unfortunately, as much as I hope you're wrong...
you're probably going to be right.

I personally would trade the Rove firing for the right person on the supreme court, but that's just me and my pesky "rational logic". :think:
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eleny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 02:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. "Obstructionists" vs "Filibuster Killers"
I think if we lost the fillibuster over a good fight to preserve a woman's right to privacy, they will look terrible for the '06 election. My 2.
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Stinky The Clown Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I'm not sure if we agree or not ........
Hi eleny :hi:

I read your post a couple of times and can't tell if you agree with me or not. I'm going to leap and assume you don't and further assume you'd like to see us go the mattresses with a filibuster and then suffer the nuclear option. (Note: I could be wrong in interpreting your post.)

I've thought about that, too. I think if we go for broke on this guy - who has already gotten endorsements or at least acceptance from some lon our side - we just waste it. It will be a one news cycle grandstand ..... or maybe two or three ..... and that's it. He's there and we lose, quite literally, our ONLY remaining power.

I'd rather safe that one last bullet for the Rehnquist seat.

Obviously this is a debatable issue and my mind remains open. But nothing I can see right now makes me move off my original position on this point.
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eleny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jul-20-05 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Your interpretation is right
Since this guy has a written record of saying that Roe should be overturned, then who should we use the filibuster for? What's going to be worse? Sorry to use my own nuclear option on you here - but I guess women have a different perspective.

Husb - this is the one. There will be no worse. From overturning Roe, they will then move on to make birth control illegal. Roberts is the first step on the slippery slope and he's the banana peel laying in the road.
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