John Kerry on the Terrorist Bombings in London

[kerrygoddess]

Statement from Senator John Kerry on the Terrorist Bombings in London
7 July 2005



“Cold blooded killers will not for a moment stop the critical work of the G-8 nations in our commitment to end poverty around the globe.”

John Kerry is in Boston this week for the New England BRAC hearing.

LightUpTheDarkness has received the following advance copy of a statement issued today by Senator John Kerry in response to the terrorist bombing in London:

"Every American heart feels for the British people and the families of those killed and injured in today's horrific terrorist bombings in London. As a country which has also experienced tragedy at the hands of cowardly killers and which keeps faith with the special alliance Prime Minister Tony Blair reaffirmed on September 11th, our thoughts and prayers are with you.

"In addition to words of condolence and condemnation, America should offer every assistance to Great Britain in dealing with the aftermath of this tragedy and in hunting down and destroying those responsible. We must reaffirm that cold blooded killers will not for a moment stop the critical work of the G-8 nations in showing the world the strength of our shared values and our commitment to ending poverty around the globe. The terrorists should hear from all of us today: the future belongs not to fear, but to freedom. We must also be vigilant here at home to take every step needed to complete the unfinished work of homeland security, strengthening our port security, rail security, protecting chemical plants, and securing loose nuclear materials abroad. While these attacks remind us that the fight is far from over, they also strengthen our resolve to stand together for the right of free people to live in a peaceful world."

http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/default.asp?view...

[Pachamama]

1. My President speaks.....

...sigh....

[Meldread]

2. Giving Bush a free pass.

What about shifting the focus back onto the issues at hand? He's letting Bush have a free pass.

[Mass]

6. So we should not express our sympathy to British people?

Sure, we need to continue on the other issues as well, but what is wrong with a statement of sympathy?

[Meldread]

13. Nothing.

Stating our sympathy for the British people is an obvious thing to do, but at the same time we should also do our damnest to frame the debate around WHY those attacks happened. If we let Bush frame the debate then we might as well go lay down while he screws us over... again.

It's politics plain and simple. Kerry goes out there and gives a speech that is basically a "we feel so sorry for you," well of course we do -- we feel sorry for anyone who gets attacked like this. However, you can be damned certain that Bush does not and is on the phone with Karl Rove right now cooking up some spin he can put on it for a boost in poll numbers and to knock Plamegate out of the media's mind. It is our moral responsibility to redirect the focus back to Bush and his failing policies which are directly responsible for the attack.

Why not use his time to say something of substance, instead of dribbling out things that are an obvious given?

[second edition]

24. There is a lot of substance in this response, you have to read it

to find it though. One thing he mentions is our unpreparedness in case of attack here and how we still have a long way to go to ensure our security in the US. These are things Bush has not addressed and has not acted upon.

[Meldread]

29. Yes, but...

Yes, but the fact of the matter is that most Americans aren't going to pick up on that or care. It also doesn't even address the issues at hand. It's Senate speak.

[second edition]

31. I happen to think most americans can surmise we aren't as safe

and secure as we should be. This very issue has been getting more attention lately from the press.

[kerrygoddess]

34. WTF? He does not even mention Bush!

Maybe you don't care, but plently of of people do and plenty of people appreciate what Kerry says.

If you have a gripe about Kerry, do us all a favor and save it for another day. Today is not the day, when hundreds have injured, scores killed, have some common decency please.

[politicasista]

47. Amen sista

[Meldread]

50. Nothing to do with Kerry.

My comments have nothing to do with Kerry per-say, but rather the responce the "leadership", a group in which Kerry seems to think he is a part of, not acting their appropriate role.

What we are seeing is more of the same. More of the same thing that hasn't worked and won't work. You'll see that I am correct in the coming days and weeks.

[LittleClarkie]

69. Not today you're not

Maybe tomorrow.

Bush and Rove may be poised to politicize this event as they did 9/11.

However, today is not the day for that. Today is for an expression of sympathy.

Have you ever considered that what you're asking for from our leaders would very likely turn most people off.

Not to mention, from seeing just this bit of his statement, I can tell the hawk in him is on full alert again. He's spent too much time sounding the alarm on terrorism (since 1997 at least), and too much time studying it (since BCCI at least), not to get mighty peeved when another attack happens.

If people would have heeded his warnings back in 1997, maybe we wouldn't BE in this predicament now. But it seemed first Clinton and then Bush just ignored the signs for the most part.

[ChiciB1]

75. I Agree That Today IS NOT The Day To Start Attacking....

We MUST sympathize and be thankful that it wasn't worse.

Having said THAT... in the coming days and weeks, I HOPE that some WAY, some HOW, and some ONE is going to be BIG enough and BRAVE enough to take on "the corrupt ones" and stuff it down their GULLETS!!!

If it's prayers that are needed then pray like hell! I don't want to hear anymore of this stuff, well we needed to "fight the good fight" from those in Congress. NOW is the time for them to STAND UP and be counted AND to do THE CORRECT THING!!! Not the RIGHT thing!!!

Again, I feel so much sorrow that this happened again, but actually it never ended. Too many lives have already been lost. Too, too many!!! VIOLENCE BEGETS VIOLENCE!!!!

[LittleClarkie]

78. It has been said, and I know it has by Kerry

the first debate comes to mind. And I'm sure there were other instances.

I remember him saying that we are LESS safe now because of Bush. Bush has done nothing but waste time and make matters worse.

[ChiciB1]

80. You ARE Correct....

But it NEEDS to be said over and over and over! And it needs to be said as EMPHATICALLY and as LOUD as possible now! We need to Bang that Drum, Clang the Symbols and Blow the Horns long and hard.

Today, let's pray and mourn yet more dead and dying HUMAN Beings! Yes, they are human beings!! Seems this got lost when WAR was SOLD to the gullible!

I started a thread not long ago about a movie called "The Girl In The Cafe", it was about the G8 Summit strangely enough. One of the lines spoken by Gina (Kelly) when asked whose baby it was, her reply was "does it matter whose baby"? I just can't forget that line.

BTW, as I said before, if you get a chance to see the movie.... do it!

[Mairead]

54. "have some common decency"

Oh? It's not okay to criticise another substanceless speech? Since when?

[theboss]

63. It's not a speech

It's a statement on a tragedy.

[Mairead]

73. It's as empty as one of his speeches, so

I'm not sure what's gained by drawing a fine distinction.

[theboss]

79. So he should be Galloway and use the bodies as a grandstand

That's real leadership.

[Mairead]

86. Substance or silence. Anything else lacks integrity

But that's Kerry's forté -- fine-sounding equivocation; form without substance. I know because I live in Mass and until '02 voted faithfully for that Drückeberger.

[kerrygoddess]

102. Do you think you are the only from MA with an opinion

Because you are not when it comes to Kerry. I lived in MA for 33 years, and 15 years later living in CA, I STILL SUPPORT HIM.

I won't even speculate what you would call substance, but I will speculate that your using this thread for bashing is very, very sad.

Even after people have said it is uncalled for under the circumstances you continue.

[Mairead]

153. "Even after people have said it is uncalled for under the circumstances"

That's because I make it a rule these days never to let other people do my thinking for me.

[LittleClarkie]

89. Did you ever really listen to one of his speeches

Esp. once he got pissed off, they got quite good, actually. The New York University speech, for example.

Or did your eyes tend to glaze over when he spoke, regardless?

[Mairead]

154. No, I don't even listen to DK's. But I used to read the Kerry transcripts.

Be sure to let me know the first time Kerry starts really raising hell and demanding that the action of the money pump in the USA be reversed. But you'll excuse me, I hope, for not trying to hold my breath til it happens.

[jillan]

131. Are you referring to John Kerry? Or * ?

ALL Kerry has been saying for the last 2 years is that * has done nothing to make us safer. Our borders, our ports, nuclear sites around the world. Over and over, like a broken record. But today he expressed his sympathy to a nation that was attacked.

So I'm confused by your post, because this was a thread about what Kerry said today. And Kerry has been framing that we are not safer for as long as I've been listening. And I have been listening.

[JRob]

7. exactly!!!!

The guys in Boston (rather then the G8) because he has no capacity to come right out and say it...

[kerrygoddess]

36. Yes he did -

“Cold blooded killers will not for a moment stop the critical work of the G-8 nations in our commitment to end poverty around the globe.”

[JRob]

53. and this has what to do with G8?

[kestrel91316]

12. Out of simple respect for the dead .............

and our friends the Brits in this dark hour, I think a ONE DAY reprieve from going after Bush is not inappropriate on Kerry's part. He, unlike Bush, is a true gentleman.

[Meldread]

27. What's more important being a gentleman...

What's more important being a gentleman or defeating evil? It's the equivalent of marching an army into gunfire to maintain some mythical level of "honor". You might have "honor", but you're still dead.

[Mass]

51. You talk like Bush

Bush also want to defeat evil, probably not the same you do, but this is still the same language and this makes me wary.

There are ways to fight that are as efficient and avoid that we cross the dangerous line and become what our ennemy are. This is as true when we fight Bush than when we fight the terrorists.

[Meldread]

55. Do you deny then, that Bush is evil?

Do you deny then, that Bush is evil?

Calling him evil is just stating a fact. He is no more or no less evil than OBL or Saddam. Evil is evil.

Bush is responsible, if only indirectly, for the terrorist attacks that have occurred today, as they are a direct result of his failing foreign policies. Policies put into place to rape the United States government and is not only costing us billions upon billions of dollars of tax payer money (most of which goes to his criminal buddies), but also in thousands of American lives. That does not even go to mention the countless number of innocent Iraqi's who have been killed.

If that isn't evil, then I don't know what evil is, calling him evil is a simple statement of fact.

[Mass]

56. I agree with all you say

but, evil having religious connotations for me, I do not use it. There must be other terms to use.

BTW, just noting that there are more than American lives taken by Bush policies (Iraqi lives among others). If this war had cost no American lives, it still would be wrong.

[Meldread]

57. Yes, I use the word because...

Yes, I use the word because it does have a moral/"religious" meaning. I cannot think of any other way to describe him. Corrupt? Yes. Manipulative? Yes. Criminal? Yes. Bigoted? Yes. However, those are all the symptoms of the root: the man is evil.

By the way, I did mention the Iraqi's: "That does not even go to mention the countless number of innocent Iraqi's who have been killed."

[Mass]

58. Sorry, I miss the line.

[LittleClarkie]

70. So would you imitate someone you consider evil?

by politicizing the dead?

[Meldread]

94. At this point...

...the ends justify the means. We have nothing more left to lose.

And before you say we will lose our dignity, let me point out that we've already lost that as well. We lost our dignity when we let Bush attack Iraq and didn't stand up to him. Democrats lost their dignity when they rolled over for Bush, that makes them harbor some amount of the responsibility for what is happening.

[tk2kewl]

59. Exactly. This happened thanks to the INCOMPETENCE AND LIES

of bushCo!

[mzmolly]

82. He brought up the need to strengthen national security at home.

Don't think that's a free pass personally.

I think sometimes the truth has to be delicate, but the truth is in the statement made by Kerry.

[Carla in Ca]

101. I agree...but not today.

He said all that needed to be said today.

[paineinthearse]

114. "What about shifting the focus back onto the issues at hand?"

Amen! There are other small metters at hand, such as Plamegate, DSM, the illegal war, torture in the gulags, globalization, unemployment, etc etc etc.

Senator Kerry, express your condolences, and let's get back to matters at hand.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

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[JRob]

62. It's a Metaphor... and your insult diminishes the misconceived sentiment

of your later point. More importantly it diminishes the point that the politicians that we presume to support our best interest lack the conviction and courage to stand up for us.

[Der Blaue Engel]

68. My "insult" was meant to be sarcasm...hence the rolling eyes

We happen to disagree about Kerry, which is fine, but I'm still very tired of this metaphor. I wish people would stop using it.

[JRob]

87. for you, I will stop using it...

[Der Blaue Engel]

99. LOL

Thanks, JRob

[impeachthescoundrel]

4. My president also

[pstans]

5. Do you think Kerry knows he really won?

He has kind of taken the role of the leader of the shadow government. Releasing statements like these. Makes me wish the votes were counted. For all of his faults, he would have been 142 times better than the bubbling Bu$h.

[JRob]

10. regardless of my previous posts in this thread, I have to agree

with you on that point... But he's his own worst enemy.

[ginnyinWI]

67. I think he does

And I see this as another example of being a shadow or moral leader. He knows how many of us voted for him. And he well knows that there is a huge leadership vacuum in the country today, with that amoral simpleton in the WH.

They stole Ohio, at minimum. The more I hear about it, the more convinced I am. And I keep thinking about what he would be doing differently than the shrub as events like these unfold. I'm really glad he made the statement, although not many are likely to hear about it.

[RethugAssKicker]

8. IMO, the attacks against

London is retalation against the war in IRAQ. I believe even those responsible stated this. It is not because they oppose ending world poverty, although I'm sure they took advantage of the G-8 gathering for maximum effect.

We need to look at this world in a much more sane, rational approach to truly put an end to this nightmare.

[JRob]

11. yeah, why does he (or anyone) think it's about G8?

Keep your eye on the ball people.

[lojasmo]

23. Kerry dropped the ball on this one.....

No surprise. Kerry once again fails to point out Bush's lies, and their reprocussions.

[kerrygoddess]

37. This is about London!

No suprise that even in the wake of tragedy people here complain!

[Meldread]

52. What would you have preferred?

That we put aside our differences with Bush and assume a united front, knowing full well that Bush's failed policies are to blame for the tragedy and will result in many more?

Most people are not so gullible. The politics involved in this has very little if anything to do about London and everything to do about politics and failed foreign policies.

If Democrats cannot play the game, then they might as well give up and just let the religious fanatics and the neocons take over. Silence is consent.

[lojasmo]

61. No, this is about Iraq.

If people don't understand that, they need some edumacation.

[Imagevision]

156. Kerry says things sometimes that bring up memories of the Skull & Bones

thing. They all take a vow to never cross one another, next thinf we'll hear is Kerry saying he fully supports the President.

[LittleClarkie]

157. Only if you don't know him

He mentions the unfinished business of national security. Bush is wasting time, and isn't even doing anything to make us safer.

I wonder what happened to that vow when he went after Poppy in the 90s.

I really do expect more critical thinking on our side. Is that so WRONG?

[TayTay]

9. And he heard from his daughter?

Vanessa is an MD studying in London. I should think that she was called into work.

Any word on if she has checked in and is okay?

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

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[politicasista]

48. I want to know too.

[Clarkie1]

148. delete...wrong thread. n/t

[RethugAssKicker]

14. A military response is not the answer

John Kerry, is basically backing Bush, whether he realizes it or not. The speech/response was essentially political and does not progressively address this ""TERROR"" situation.

[Mass]

16. I was not the time

This is a statement of support to English people, not a damned political statement for DUers to feel good about.

Sad day, indeed, both in the real world and on DU.

[second edition]

28. Absolutely correct!!!

We need to exercise some tack here people. Thank you for your post!

[politicasista]

46. Well said Mass

Something about Kerry issuing a statement rather than their favorite brings out the bashness in them. Love it when we eat our own in these dangerous times.

[second edition]

30. Yes it does, by mentioning that we are not secure here at home.

Bush has dropped the ball on those issues that would really make us safer. He may suggest military action, but he has a better and more thought out plan then Bush ever did.

[Name removed]

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[TayTay]

18. ANd I thought this was a good response

that sent a message of support to the people of London and a strong message that terrorism should be fought sanely by taking the right precautions.

If I didn't say that my head would explode.

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

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[Totally Committed]

22. Mass...

you don't think this sounds a lot like a statement of support for The Bush/Blair Iraq policy (which he voted to support, and never disavowed, btw)? You really don't?

I admit it openly, I do have my problems with Kerry, but even if I didn't, my gut reaction, I fervently believe, would have been the same.

Maybe I have been driven over the edge where he's concerned.... dunno.

TC

Edited for spelling only.

[TayTay]

26. There is a difference

Kerry managed to put 'ending poverty in the world' and doing practical (and non-violent) things to secure ports, cities and people from terrorist attacks.

No mention of war. Lots of mentions of things to do that prevent violence and the effect of violence on the innocence.

I think that's different from *.

[second edition]

32. I agree! n/t

[politicasista]

49. he/she is just mad that his/her favorite didn't put out the statement

As long as it's anyone but Kerry it's all good for some people. I care what he and other good Dems have to say. Too bad some don't do the same.

[1956]

25. What a bunch of BS!

You obviously don't know much about our rightful prez!

[second edition]

20. I think this is excellent in that it points out what Bush hasn't done

to make us more secure here in the US and also mentions that the work towards a more secure US is far from completed. He also brings up a possible correlation between the G8 summit and the attacks, as if the terrorists were trying to disrupt and put and end to the talks. Notice he didn't mention specific terrorist organizations, the final determination on who actually did this is still not entirely confirmed. No one is familiar with the so called group claiming responsibility for this attack. And, finally, he suggests we not let fear rule the day. Today is not a good day to come out and directly attack Bush on his handling of the war on terror, this will come in a day or two from the dems.

[Mass]

21. He also totally ignore Bush in this statement

which is good as he could difficultly tell that his policies led to this mess in such a statement to the British people.

[Jacobin]

33. He voted to enable an illegal invasion

We are being counter-attacked.

Exactly who is he blaming? Why the people we attacked, of course.

[ladeuxiemevoiture]

71. That's exactly what I thought when I saw Kerry made a statement

eom

[welshTerrier2]

35. Kerry should tell the truth about the G8

let's not get side-tracked here ... i have no problem whatsoever with Kerry's comments on the tragic use of terrorism against innocent civilians ... Kerry is right to condemn this action ...

but did he really need to applaud the "critical work of the G-8 nations in showing the world the strength of our shared values and our commitment to ending poverty around the globe??????" ... the G8 nations, led primarily by the US, have acted as nothing less than global imperialists ... again, led by the US, we sell our death weapons to the highest bidders with no remorse ... we pollute ... we occupy ... we dump our unsafe products on third world countries ... we destabilize in the name of democracy and freedom and the result is rarely if ever anything beyond raw, corporate exploitation ...

sorry to all my good friends who appreciate Senator Kerry's remarks on the tragedy in the UK but the Senator is dead wrong when he suggests the G8 nations are the good guys ... here's an excerpt on the G8 from Wikipedia:

source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G-7#Criticism_of_the_Group

Criticism of the Group

Since the agenda of G8 is usually about controversial global issues, critics often refer to the G8 as an unofficial "world government". The annual summits are often the focus of anti-globalization movement protests, notably at the 27th G8 summit in Genoa in 2001.

Critics assert that members of G8 are responsible for global issues such as global warming due to carbon dioxide emission, poverty in Africa and developing countries due to debt crisis and unfair trading policy, AIDS problem due to strict medicine patent policy and other problems that related to globalization.

Pressure has also been put on G8 leaders to take responsibility to combat problems they are accused of creating. Bob Geldof organized Live 8, global awareness concerts on July 2 and July 6 in 2005, to encourage G8 leaders to "Make Poverty History". Organizers have also proposed that G8 member nations adjust their national budgets to allow for .7% to go towards foreign aid as outlined in Agenda 21 of the Rio de Janeiro Earth Summit in 1992. The concerts were timed to coincide with the 31st G8 summit.

[kerrygoddess]

38. Maybe we can focus on the work of the One Campaign

to make the G8 accountable and the terrorist attacks in London and those who are suffering rather bitching about what Kerry says.

He acknowledged that good CAN come from G8, possibly and second expressed sympathy and outrage for the attacks in London.

Simple to the point and clearly the right thing to do.

[TayTay]

39. Plus, the focus was on debt reduction

which is vital to helping poorer nations climb out of poverty. The rich nations of the world do have moral obligations to help the poor. The G8 hasn't done enough, but taking the focus off of them or ignoring their responsibility to the poor of the world doens't help.

[Tinoire]

74. You don't for one moment think they are going to reduce Africa's debt

do you?

Oh non... What they are lustfully planning to do is make "an offer to settle" that will go along the simple lines of "you fork over your resources and we will reduce your paper debt".

Yes indeed, the rich nations of the world have a moral obligation to help the poor but it is not an obligation they have any intention of honestly meeting.

[TayTay]

129. If you believe that

then why are you here? Why do you show up? You must believe in something that isn't totally cyncial, cuz otherwise, why bother.

So, what makes you show up when you believe that all actions are futile and that the massive pushes across the globe to relieve debt in third countries will always come to naught. (Which by the way is not true. There has been debt forgiveness in the past and will be again.)

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

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[kerrygoddess]

103. Wow... this is sad...

while millions of people are working to working to draw attention to what the G8 can do to end poverty, and Kerry acknowledges that, you think it is wrong to end poverty I guess?

Tell that to Nelson Mandela, won't you? Tell that to the Dalai Lama and the Pope. Tell that to Bono and Bob Geldorf.

People are trying to make something good come from the G8 Summit. Screaming at people isn't always the answer. Showing them what they CAN do is far better.

Kerry gets that. Bono gets that. Bob Geldorf ges that.

[Name removed]

117. Deleted message

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[LittleClarkie]

118. self edit

self edit

[welshTerrier2]

122. see my response to this point you made elsewhere in this thread

it seems to me that certain DU'ers refuse to allow any disagreement with their deity, John Kerry ... any criticism is met with ad hominem attacks and speculation about my motives ...

rarely is there any response that actually discusses the issues i, or others, have raised ... this is not the John Kerry forum ... i have NOT attacked John Kerry ... my criticisms are limited to the narrow statement he made today about the G8 ...

can people disagree with me? um, i guess so if threads like this are any indication ... the problem i have with these "the wonderful things Kerry said" threads is that opposing views are immediately attacked by the usual attack dogs ...

when Kerry does or says good things, i acknowledge them ... the black or white you referred to in your other post seems to be coming from those to whom Kerry can do no wrong ...

[LittleClarkie]

125. I see it on both sides, frankly, and I did delete the above comment

because I thought it was unfair and that I'd better expressed myself in the other thread.

I don't think the man is perfect. Mostly when I jump in, I just try to make sure his views are presented fairly, for good or ill, as with my comment that perhaps rather than refusing to acknowledge what you see as truth, he rather sees things differently.

I know enough about him to know when he means something and isn't playing politics. Whether I agree or not, the "hunt and destroy" portion of his comments were what he actually thinks.

[paineinthearse]

116. The One Campaign?

Would that have been the Presidential campaign of 2004?

[LittleClarkie]

72. What did Nicholas Kristoff say about Bush though

that he'd actually sent more money to Africa than Clinton did? And this from a liberal columnist? What was up with that? Did Clinton send so little that anything Bush sends looks better by comparison?

[politicasista]

83. Yawn

Love it when we eat our own.

[Name removed]

95. Deleted message

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[Mass]

97. As it seems fairly obvious that the date of the attacks was chosen

because of the G8 opening, it seems to me that stating the announced goal of the G8 in opposition to this act seems better politics than ignoring it (or attacking the G8 in the statement as some here have seemed to suggest).

I have no illusions on what the G8 will achieve on these issues, but I think that Kerry and Dean were right to introduce it in their statement. Today was not the day for big attacks on the capitalist world, it was a day to say our solidarity with Londonians (not that I believe Dean or Kerry or any US pol would attack the capitalist world).

[welshTerrier2]

98. ahhhh, "better politics" ...

now we are in agreement ... in the short-term, i agree that the statements included, at least in part, a political assessment (i think an incorrect one, btw) rather than telling the American people the truth ...

and i also would have had no problem with any statement that condemned the terrorist attacks in London ... you'll not find me condoning the taking of innocent civilian lives ...

but statements that go further to defend and even compliment the actions of western imperialist nations are based on lies ... perhaps these lies are seen as politically expedient ... i'm afraid for far too many, that is indeed the case ...

but imperialism is a genuine evil that causes many people around the world to suffer and puts our own country at very grave risk ... real leaders, not just people playing politics, would value that reality and would speak out regularly and forcefully against it ... the terrorist killings in London were wrong and the exploitation by the G8 of poorer countries is ALSO WRONG ... condeming one without condemning the other does a disservice to us all and it makes for bad politics too ...

comments about imperialism need not have been made today such that it might have distracted from a forceful condemnation of the terrorist acts ... but as you correctly surmised, we will never hear such talk coming from either Dean or Kerry ... perhaps they don't agree with the views I have about US imperialism or perhaps they just decided speaking out would not make for good politics ... whatever their reasons, the US continues to exploit and occupy and global terrorism continues to grow ...

[kerrygoddess]

104. You already said this. Why are you repeating? To attack?

Evidently that's why you are in this thread to attack Kerry.

[Name removed]

110. Deleted message

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[LittleClarkie]

113. Or perhaps he just doesn't see the world in the same way you do

there is room for a difference of opinion, isn't there. That grey area that is neither black nor white?

[welshTerrier2]

119. i agree, LittleClarkie ...

here is what i wrote on this very point in another thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

"comments about imperialism need not have been made today such that it might have distracted from a forceful condemnation of the terrorist acts ... but as you correctly surmised, we will never hear such talk coming from either Dean or Kerry ... perhaps they don't agree with the views I have about US imperialism or perhaps they just decided speaking out would not make for good politics ... whatever their reasons, the US continues to exploit and occupy and global terrorism continues to grow ..."

[Mr.Green93]

41. Kerry has the moral authority to call for Peace Talks

Kerry played a leading role in the Paris Peace Talks. He now has the opportunity to step forward and call for negotiations with the leaders of radical Islam. Now is the time for a Leader to step forward.

[theboss]

64. What do the leaders of radical Islam want?

I mean, their starting point would be a radical Islamic, Pan-Arabic empire and the disappearance of Israel, wouldn't it?

[Mr.Green93]

65. We won't know for sure

until someone gets them to the peace table.

[theboss]

66. My second question: who are they?

I can't imagine a peace table with Bin Laden and Zarqawi on one side.

My third question: who do they represent exactly? The majority of Muslims seem to condemn them.

This to me sounds like the FBI having a peace conference with the Gambinos.

[confludemocrat]

120. A man with squandered stature, now pining for another chance to run

He emulates Bush rhetorically and it reeks of pandering and opportunism, and seems more concerned with his political viability. Where is a prepare-for-peace version of Churchill (who was let's be ready for war)--a notable who will stand alone if he has to and demand that a new departure be undertaken? Kerry will no longer be taken seriously as a Prez contender, he is irreversibly compromised so why not take his moderate stature and use it for some good, not for a buckled-down better version of Bush's approach, which is the root of so much evil right now. Is there anyone out there?

[LittleClarkie]

124. I wildly disagree with that assessment

For one thing, Bush copies Kerry, or at least covertly takes his advice.

Kerry needn't ape Monkeyboy. He's one of the go-to guys for foreign policy for a reason. He doesn't have to pretend to know what's going on in the world. He actually does.

He will not use his stature to do what you say, because he actually believes what he's saying, for good or ill. It's not political posturing.

He sees a fight that needs winning. He has seen it since 1997 at least (that I can find, anyway). A few days before 9/11 he was speechifying about terrorism on the Senate floor. What was Bush Co doing at that same time? Star Wars.

Read his book on international crime some time. Then remember what he said during the campaign about how we were wasting time in Iraq, that we needed to be finishing the job in Afghanistan. He's a Pottery Barn guy ala Powell, as were most of our candidates this last election including Dean. He wanted inspectors in Iraq to hold Saddam accountable for the agreement that ended the first Iraq War. Nothing more. We would not be in Iraq now if he'd been president.

He knows more about national security than Bush will EVER know. But he wouldn't have to go to war to stop it. He'd be shutting down their finances. He'd be making sure Russia's nuclear arsenal wasn't falling into the wrong hands. He probably would be using more covert operatives. And he certainly wouldn't have let Bin Laden go in Tora Bora.

He's not following Bush. Bush is following him. And looking like a Chimp doing it.

[seabeyond]

42. you mean focus on terrorist, instead of killing iraqi's. what a concept

good idea. something new

[DearAbby]

43. My Heart goes to those British families that are suffering today

I don't know what to believe. But those that suffer, are often the innocent. My Heart goes to them today.

[TankLV]

44. Good statement. Solid. To the point. No extra fluff and pandering.

[politicasista]

45. Thanks KG!

[ClarkUSA]

76. George Galloway's take is spot-on, as usual

He says:

We extend our condolences to those who have lost their lives today and our heartfelt sympathy to all those who have been injured by the bombs in London.
No one can condone acts of violence aimed at working people going about their daily lives. They have not been a party to, nor are they responsible for, the decisions of their government. They are entirely innocent and we condemn those who have killed or injured them.

The loss of innocent lives, whether in this country or Iraq, is precisely the result of a world that has become a less safe and peaceful place in recent years.
We have worked without rest to remove the causes of such violence from our world. We argued, as did the Security Services in this country, that the attacks on Afghanistan and Iraq would increase the threat of terrorist attack in Britain. Tragically Londoners have now paid the price of the government ignoring such warnings.

We urge the government to remove people in this country from harms way, as the Spanish government acted to remove its people from harm, by ending the occupation of Iraq and by turning its full attention to the development of a real solution to the wider conflicts in the Middle East.

Only then will the innocents here and abroad be able to enjoy a life free of the threat of needless violence.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/7/7/1247/56592

[confludemocrat]

108. Now theres a statement worth something (n/t)

[Eloriel]

77. Even worse than I feared. Kerry just gets more and more irrelevent

“Cold blooded killers will not for a moment stop the critical work of the G-8 nations in our commitment to end poverty around the globe.”

Oh, yeah. *I* believe the G8 will make a real difference in poverty; sure I do. Got a bridge you want me to look at, John?

I sure am sick of you carrying water for Bush, not to mention all the rest of the monied elite.

Just more empty words, these a little emptier than most. Too bad we can't block certain subject matter from even tempting us to open the threads.

[Mass]

81. I guess that this and Dean's statement should be critcized as well

I guess the rest of the world is wrong and a few DUers only are right, if I have to believe some people here.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050707/ap_on_re_eu/britain...

U.N. Condemns London Terror Strikes

By NICK WADHAMS, Associated Press Writer 44 minutes ago

UNITED NATIONS - Just hours after a series of explosions in London, the
U.N. Security Council voted unanimously Thursday to condemn the terrorist attacks and vowed to bring those responsible to justice.

Secretary-General
Kofi Annan echoed that sentiment.

"These vicious acts have cut us all to the core, for they are an attack on humanity itself," Annan said in a statement. "Today, the world stands shoulder to shoulder with the British people."

A resolution approved by the council condemned "without reservation the terrorist attacks in London ... and regards any act of terrorism as a threat to peace and security." It urged all states to cooperate in finding and bringing to justice the perpetrators and expressed the council's "utmost determination to combat terrorism."

The council expressed sympathy for the victims of the four blasts that rocked London earlier Thursday. Police said at least 37 people were killed in the explosions and hundreds injured.


...

Several ambassadors expressed their support for Britain and denounced the attacks.

"No cause can justify the killing of civilians," Algeria's Ambassador Abdallah Baali said. "It's obvious that these people want to distract the attention of the international community from the real problems and we can only reject such acts."

[welshTerrier2]

88. are DU'ers condoning these terrorist attacks?

i haven't seen those posts ...

here's the problem i have with both Kerry's and Dean's statements ...

neither statement acknowledges the role the US and other western nations have in contributing to increased terrorism ... Kerry's "happy talk" about the commitment of the G8 to alleviating poverty is nonsense ... to deny that the US, Britain, Russia (as a component of the old Soviet Union) and others are not imperialist nations whose actions lead to terrorism, and increased poverty, is absurd ... and Dean's remarks were not much better ...

for the US to build military bases all over the world; for the US to prop-up dictators like Saddam Hussein, Mubarek and the Saudi royal family; for the US to destroy Iraq's infrastructure and refuse to help Iraq rebuild and for the US to exploit weak economies by blackmailing other nations with the cooperation of the World Bank is unconscionable ... it DOES NOT JUSTIFY terrorism against innocent civilians and both Kerry and Dean were absolutely right to condemn the London attacks ... but they were also wrong to not shed light on the terrorism exported by the US and other G8 nations ... but of course, that wouldn't be the politically expedient position to take ...

before you run screaming into the night that nothing justifies the killing of innocent civilians, please understand that I TOTALLY AGREE ... what we have here are TWO WRONGS; NOT ONE ...

and that is where the play-it-safe Democrats are wrong ... they continue to refuse to tell the American people the truth about our own nation's imperialistic conduct ... and until they do, they will not be standing up for the truth and they will not be leading this country and the world away from this darkness ... and until they fight to stop the wrongful actions of their own government, the very worldwide terrorism they deplore will continue to grow ... it will take more than condemning one wrong to solve the problem; it will take fighting against BOTH WRONGS ...

[politicasista]

84. Hey where all the other Dem statements?

I know Kerry, Dean, and Reid have all released statements, but where are the others? Oh I guess we are too busy complaining about what Kerry said, so let's just give the rest of the guys free passes.

[Mass]

85. Actually, Dean's thread is surprisingly empty.

as if nobody cared what he says.

[LeahD]

138. Barbara Boxer was on the radio with Ed Schultz today.

She and Kerry are on the same page. She said much, much more has to be done to protect our subways, rail yards, chemical factories, nuclear power plants, etc. She said the Senate passed one bill that never made it out of the House and that there are bills now that are stalled in committee.

Edit for grammar....

[LittleClarkie]

139. That's three of them on the same page then

Dean, Kerry and Boxer.

I wonder if they're doing the "talking points" thing, or if they just all happen to agree.

[LeahD]

140. I think they're sending a unified message.

Boxer is frustrated and angry that there are gaping holes in this country's security plan.

[LittleClarkie]

141. And still the Republicans are the only one who can keep us safe

What a crock.

Which brings me back to Rove and his crack about liberals. What kind of poetic justice awaits ol Karl, do you think?

[LeahD]

146. Handcuffs would work for me.

Throw in some understanding? NOT.

Therapy might be good though.

[politicasista]

144. Thanks Leah

As always, she rocks too!

[LeahD]

147. Yes, she doesn't mince words and tells it like it is. n/t

[fedupinBushcountry]

145. Yes and they need to keep it up

My son got mugged in the subway in N.Y. about 15 months ago. 5 guys attacked him, with a knife at his throat, they cut his wallet out of his pants,luckily he did not try to stop them, he had his rent money in his wallet, he is a waiter and bartender.

When he called me, I was livid. He said there was no cameras around and no cops either. He called the police station and they told him to come into the station and report it. HOMELAND SECURITY, I say bullshit.

Thank God he wasn't hurt, just a slight cut on his throat from the knife, and thank God he acted calmly, and realized money isn't worth my life. But where the hell was this so called Security in the subways of the city that was attacked. As you can tell it still makes me angry, not just for what happened to my son, but if this could happen to him, what else could happen in the wee hours of the morning in the subways of N.Y.

So they up Security for a terrorist alert, like the terrorist are always going to tell us exactly when they will attack us next, or with this administration, would they just let it happen again for ratings.

[LittleClarkie]

90. for purposes of comparison

"I join all Americans today in offering my condolences to the victims of today's vicious terrorist attacks in London. Our thoughts and prayers are with the victims, their friends and their families. We remain steadfast in our commitment to defeating those who threaten our freedom and values. At a time when world leaders were working together to help make our world a better place, these terrorists were plotting to disrupt that effort by killing and injuring innocent people. We will continue to stand with our allies around the world to defeat terrorism and protect our liberty and freedom."

compared to

"In addition to words of condolence and condemnation, America should offer every assistance to Great Britain in dealing with the aftermath of this tragedy and in hunting down and destroying those responsible. We must reaffirm that cold blooded killers will not for a moment stop the critical work of the G-8 nations in showing the world the strength of our shared values and our commitment to ending poverty around the globe. The terrorists should hear from all of us today: the future belongs not to fear, but to freedom. We must also be vigilant here at home to take every step needed to complete the unfinished work of homeland security, strengthening our port security, rail security, protecting chemical plants, and securing loose nuclear materials abroad. While these attacks remind us that the fight is far from over, they also strengthen our resolve to stand together for the right of free people to live in a peaceful world."

Not all that much different. So is Dean wasting an opportunity too?

[Mass]

91. I have major problems with none of these statements

Would have had worded some things differently? Probably?

Is that enough that I have the imperious need to state what I disagree with rather than my agreement? Clearly not.

Now, if you really want to be outraged, go on msnbc and look at McCain's interview. I have real problem there.

[Meldread]

96. Yes.

I supported Dean in the Primaries and for Chair, and I say yes. I call a spade a spade no matter who it is.

[confludemocrat]

112. Dean wins this comparison, no bluster.

and gratuitous multiple use of coward and cold blooded as well as the use of destroy, it's as if he's still got the same 2004 consultants feeding him this stuff. And what's the deal with throwing the G8 in there?

[LittleClarkie]

115. No it's as if he believes this stuff

for good or ill.

Read "A New War" and you'll see what I mean. Agree or disagree, he means what he says, in exactly the terms he's using.

Not pandering, just more of a hawk than some are comfortable with.

[wisteria]

92. I love this statement! It offers sympathy, concern and

pointedly references what we still have not accomplished to secure our safety here in the US. An attack on Bush's leadership without mentioning his directly. Good for Kerry!

[Name removed]

93. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[zulchzulu]

100. Why didn't Kerry stop the terrorists before they attacked this morning?

What's wrong with him. Surely he could have stopped them!

It's his fault!

[kerrygoddess]

106. Oh my!

Look here he is...

[Name removed]

105. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kerrygoddess]

107. Hmmm... It's a statement not a speech. N/T

[LittleClarkie]

111. Was Kerry the deciding vote or something?

Must have been. I never hear about any of the other votes. It MUST be all his fault.

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, I wonder what part of "Wrong war, wrong time, wrong place" our friend doesn't get. Yeah, our Johnny just about in lockstep with ol' Chimpy there. Ayep.

[txindy]

142. It must be!

Zing! LittleClarkie, you took the words right off of my fingertips. (Note to self: Must. Type. Faster.)



I thought the statement by Senator Kerry excellent, myself.

[zulchzulu]

121. The convoluted misrepresentation of Kerry's vote brought to you by...

Ah...nothing like a childish Kerry bash to break up the sweet evening.

Note: Kerry and others (including Dean) agreed that the UN was to continue looking for WMDs and that was was to be as a LAST resort...but it appears some people just can't digest facts.... ewwww....facts.....bad....

[LittleClarkie]

127. Facts with a spoonful of Dean is so much more tasty

than facts with a spoonful of Kerry. Eww, Kerry. Ptwi!

Nevermind that they both said almost the same damn thing today. Nevermind that I've had to defend Dean against his own supporters who couldn't figure out that Dean never changed his stance on the war, they just weren't paying attention. Nevermind that they both would have supported Biden/Lugar.

[undeterred]

109. thanks for posting this kerrygoddess

At least Kerry makes me feel proud of something about America.

[zulchzulu]

123. Absolutely!

Without her, perhaps we'd hear the usual "Where's Kerry? Blah blah blah, etc., etc., etc."

[undeterred]

130. Every time I see Bush come on televsion and say something

stupid I feel so sad that we do not have this intelligent man of integrity to lead this country... I felt especially sad today.

[Name removed]

126. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LittleClarkie]

128. What the flying fuck are you talking about

And surely, if you were EVER a supporter of the man, you know EXACTY what he meant by that statement, however badly he expressed it.

What terror aid to London? The least you can do if you're going to pull out that old chestnut is to have it make sense. Otherwise you're kinda just saying it to say it. Sorry, I'm going to have to vote you off the island.

[zulchzulu]

132. It's OK, LC...some people just never can figure it out

It's good some people only have teeny pea shooters to aim in their circular firing squad in their little mind.

[PretzelWarrior]

135. just venting. still hacked that his tortured language

and ineffectual campaign and publicist staff caused him to lose Ohio.

[zulchzulu]

136. Um...he didn't lose Ohio...

You knew that though...

http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=393&row=1

[PretzelWarrior]

137. um. yeah he did. in your parallel universe he didn't

but according to the final count he did. so unless you can prove otherwise and get somebody impeached or whatever, you have a pyhrric victory at best with your little Greg Palast link.

[txindy]

143. Funny, but I thought it was the long lines at the polls, broken machines

at those polls and voter intimidation - all in Democratic precincts - that did it. You know, people in line in a cold rain until 1am. People obviously waiting that long to vote for Moreofthesameplease. Things like that. My God, who knew it was really Kerry's word choices and PR people?! Where the hell have I been?!

I have GOT to get out of this parallel universe.

[laugle]

133. I don't think stopping the G-8 summit is

what the terrorists had in mind! Just maybe, they want us to get the f--k out of IRAQ!!!!!!

[LittleClarkie]

134. Or the Brits the fuck out of Iraq

it being in Britain and all.

[Clarkie1]

149. Good statement.

It would have been better if he added that the solution to terrorism requires cooperation with police and intelligence agencies around the globe, not the military. Overall, though, it was a good, succinct statement and echoes what most other Democrats are saying.

[kerrygoddess]

150. It was a statement of sympathy and compassion

Not a plan of action.

[Clarkie1]

152. Appropriately, it was primarily that, but not entirely.

"We must also be vigilant here at home to take every step needed to complete the unfinished work of homeland security, strengthening our port security, rail security, protecting chemical plants, and securing loose nuclear materials abroad."

[LittleClarkie]

155. A subtle dig

but a dig nonetheless.

And we are wasting time. Because Bush is not only a bad man, he's and his are incompetent to boot.

[second edition]

151. I went back and read it again today and I like it even more.

This statement received no airplay or write-ups except on the blogs, I think I am going to e-mail it to some friends who I know would not have an opportunity to read it otherwise.

[Independent_Liberal]

158. Cool!

I wanted to hear Kerry's thoughts on this. Thanks for posting.