Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

A repost of mine from the other day. Will Pitt and Dean agree on a lot.

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 12:01 PM
Original message
A repost of mine from the other day. Will Pitt and Dean agree on a lot.
I posted this in GD the other day because of all the attacks here on Dean for what he has always clearly said. Will agreed with me basically on this post. It is time to stop attacking Dean for this war for which our congress voted.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"I believe Howard Dean and Will Pitt agree on a lot of things about getting
out of Iraq. Both are taking responsible approaches to this issue. I
have often said my opinion wavers day to day on this issue. I am glad to
see some are sort of on the same page. Most days I feel we should leave, but we have destroyed their infrastructure badly. I think of how we felt after 3 hurricane eyes hit us...lost, devastated, no infrastructure as we knew it. Then I rethink.

Here is something Howard Dean said in 2003 about getting out of Iraq. His words were almost two years ago, so some things are different. Let's concentrate on the similar tones of responsibility.

Agree or disagree, but be honest!
This is a man speaking from conscience.

http://www.blogforamerica.com/archives/001116.html

Wednesday, August 20, 2003
"We Cannot Afford to Fail"
BURLINGTON--Governor Howard Dean issued this statement on Iraq:

"Since last April, I have been calling on President Bush to internationalize
the reconstruction effort in Iraq. I repeat that call today.

"Expert after expert has returned from Iraq stating that the window of
opportunity is closing faster than anyone expected and that our chance to
successfully stabilize and rebuild the country is quickly passing. Despite
this, the Bush Administration refuses to seek a UN mandate so that our
historic allies and friends can join us in this effort and speed up the
reconstruction process.

"I call on the Bush Administration to take the following steps to encourage
our proven allies and friends, including France, Germany, India, and Turkey
to join us in Iraq and to accelerate the reconstruction process. We must:

* Work with the UN to build the largest coalition possible to help us
succeed in Iraq;
* Make clear our intention to share decision-making on security and
reconstruction issues in Iraq with those countries and international
institutions that join the international coalition;

* Prioritize restoring law and order and the resumption of electricity,
water, and sanitation services -- they are fundamental to success in all
other areas;

* Focus on developing Iraqi capacity to undertake key functions as soon as
possible;

* Decentralize the operations of the Coalition Authority and make money more
forthcoming and flexible;

* Employ the sizable number of available Iraqis with short term public works
projects and get state-run enterprises up and running, even if they must be
downsized and privatized later;

* Push for UN oversight of the successor to the Oil for Food program;

* Award reconstruction contracts to the best US or foreign bidder in a
transparent and open process.

"Yesterday's bombing of the UN headquarters in Iraq appears to have been an
effort to dissuade other members of the international community from
assisting us. It is vital to our chances of success that the Bush
Administration redouble its efforts to internationalize the military and
civilian presence and to speed up the stabilization and rebuilding process.
We cannot afford to fail."
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

And here is a post from Will Pitt from Sunday. Very responsible ideas, thinking of the Iraqis and that we not leave them in the devastation we caused.
"Some ideas:

* End the Houston-based contracting of work in Iraq and open the doors to Iraqi companies and workers. The believers in privatization here should practice what they preach and allow Iraqis to make money off the work and repairs needing to be done. As funds flow into the Iraqi economy, burgeoning and reconstituted private companies can take it upon themselves to make sure the lights work, the roads are paved, the water is running, and the trash is picked up. Once upon a time, Iraq was the most modern and industrialized nation in that region, filled with highly educated workers who know how to run a country. The Iraqi people must be allowed to run their country once again, and must be paid well for their work by Iraqi employers not beholden to profit margins in the United States.

* Arrange for the creation of a base of operations outside of Iraq where an Iraqi National Guard and police force can be trained to take over the security of their country. The old Christian canon states that whenever two or three people are gathered together to pray, Jesus is with them. In Iraq, whenever two or three people are gathered together to sign up for the army or the police, a suicide bomber is there with them to deal death. Establishing a place away from the violence where Iraqis can be prepared and armed for the work needed to gain control of the country will ultimately allow American forces to back away from policing the country, something that has been the chief aggravating factor among that populace. Doing this away from the violence will allow Iraqis to sign up for this work without fear of being blown sideways out a recruiting station.

* Until the infrastructure is repaired and security forces are assembled, steps must be taken to achieve stability without an American face on the action. Work in good faith with both the United Nations and the Arab League to assemble a large security force comprised of people from the region. Care must be taken to avoid any pitfalls regarding potential ethnic and religious friction between the Iraqi people and these Arab security forces, but this can be managed. Once Iraqi infrastructure is restored and a security and police force is in place, the Arab forces can begin a phased withdrawal. Meanwhile, American forces can be removed en masse.

* Practice what has been preached about bringing democracy to that nation. Democracy is not the installation of some bastardized Vichy government managed by remote control from Washington. The Iraqi people will never accept such a government, and the violence and chaos will never end. Provide security by way of the aforementioned steps and let the people decide how their country will be governed. The recent farce of an election did not achieve this; almost all of the candidates were anonymous because they feared assassination, and large swaths of the populace did not participate because they saw it as the sham it was. Let the government be formed as it will, and prepare for the diplomatic ramifications.

* A vital element to the process will be the establishment of a set timetable for withdrawal. Timetables are dangerous; if they are not met, rage is the inevitable result. Yet the changes required of our status in Iraq need date markers and deadlines to push the process along, and the Iraqi people need to know exactly when their country will be their own again."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/031405Z.shtml




Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Capn Sunshine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 12:17 PM
Response to Original message
1. Despite what some want to believe,
Gov. Dean has been consistent about this issue from day one.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DoveTurnedHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Absolutely Correct
Edited on Thu Apr-28-05 12:19 PM by DoveTurnedHawk
He always said we can't just cut and run now that Bush made the colossal blunder of invading in the first place.

It was only Kucinich (and I believe Sharpton) who advocated for an immediate withdrawal.

Personally, I support Dr. Dean's position (shared by many others, including Clark, Kerry and Edwards, although the latter two have the misfortune of voting for the IWR).

DTH
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Correct.
:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. And they are using the DFA forums to attack him.
The Greens and the PDA folks. I think it is out of control.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bloom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 12:26 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. It's funny that Pitt is working for PDA since he seems to be at odds...
PDA Seeks Action on Iraq Withdrawal


Last week, DNC Chairman Howard Dean stated that the United States must remain militarily engaged in Iraq. "Now that we're there, we're there and we can't get out," Dean told an audience of nearly 1,000 at the Minneapolis Convention Center on Wednesday, April 20th, as reported in the Minneapolis Star-Tribune. "The president has created an enormous security problem for the United States where none existed before. But I hope the president is incredibly successful with his policy now that he's there."


Potential Security Threats
Chairman Dean cited three potential threats to American security that, in his opinion, require a continued American presence in that nation. The threats he enumerated were that an American withdrawal could open the door for a fundamentalist Shiite theocracy which could be worse than that which currently controls Iran; could precipitate the creation of an independent Kurdistan in the north and destabilize the neighboring Kurdish regions of Turkey, Iran, and Syria; and could cause Iraq to become an operational base for terrorist organizations in the fashion of pre-war Afghanistan.


Threats Self-created?
Clearly, these are well-reasoned concerns that cannot and must not be dismissed out of hand. The Bush administration's catastrophic Iraq policy, beginning with their wide-ranging disinformation campaign regarding weapons of mass destruction, to their wildly inaccurate belief that American invasion forces would be welcomed with open arms, to their ham-fisted and massively corrupt handling of the occupation, has created the threats we now face.


Simply put, Iraq was not a hotbed of terrorism and threats to American security until the invasion and occupation. We were told Iraq was a threat to us, which was a lie. The invasion and occupation, which was supposed to destroy those threats, has in fact created those threats where they did not exist before. This reality, and the threats to our security that have been created by Bush's disastrous policies, cannot be ignored.


Other Credible Options
We at Progressive Democrats of America (PDA) do not agree with Chairman Dean's assessment of the situation....There are other options besides 'Remain indefinitely' and 'Withdraw immediately.'



http://www.pdamerica.org /

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
melnjones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-01-05 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #1
9. That's been what I've seen as well. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Eloriel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-28-05 11:02 PM
Response to Original message
6. At it again, eh?
Trying to keep everyone honest, foster understanding and enlightenment, improve communications.

I can't think what thanks you'll get for your trouble.

Except from me: :toast:

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ChiciB1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-01-05 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Well, I'll Kick It
I agree with madfloridian, even though I posted at her other threads. One of which I got into a little trouble.

Dean has a way about him and as I recall, we here at DU were for the most part supporting his nomination to head the party.

Stay United!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-01-05 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. In August 2003
Dean was "anti-war". Kerry was supposedly "stay the course" warmonger. Neither one has changed what they said between then and now. Because they were ALWAYS on the exact same page. As was Clark and most of the rest of the Dem Party. Even now, you look at Lynn Woolsey's actual Iraq plan, and it is EXACTLY THE SAME as Dean, Kerry & Clark, despite the fact that she calls it a withdrawal plan. Kucinich supported getting inspectors into Iraq, but never said how he would do that. UN in, US out, had the exact same details as every other Dem plan.

The difference has always been between the Lieberman types who supported military regime change in Iraq as policy; vs those who supported a measured approach. A vote and a sound byte does not explore the full intent and consequences of any one of these people. During the primary, I always thought most people would come to differentiate campaign rhetoric from truth. Sadly, that still hasn't happened.

What also hasn't happened is a coherent strategy to confront Bush's bullshit "freedom is on the march" as a silver bullet to end terrorism. Some have tried:

http://www.lightupthedarkness.org/blog/default.asp?view=plink&id=770
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-01-05 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Yes, maam, whatever you say.
Not going to argue.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 19th 2024, 06:34 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC