Casey WILL LOSE to Santorum

[Hippo_Tron]

Somebody pro-choice must run against him, here's why. Pennsylvania is a BLUE state, it's NOT a red state. The pro-life constituency in Pennsylvania is not up for grabs, Santorum is like Jesus Christ to them (no pun intended). We need to get the pro-choice constituency out to vote and we need to get them out to vote in mass numbers against this asshole who represents them in the US Senate. Casey can't do that if he is pro-life. We need to paint Santorum like the insane religious fundie that he is so that we can get OUR base out to vote.

I'm not suggesting that pro-lifers aren't welcome in the Democratic party, I'm suggesting that Santorum MUST and I mean MUST go before he has a shot at the White House. We MUST defeat him in 2006 and I fear that Bob Casesy just can't do that.

[EVDebs]

1. Whew, I'd hate to see Casey LOSE to Santorum eom

[Hippo_Tron]

2. DAMNIT I need to stop writing these things too fast

[leyton]

3. It's not blue by some humongous margin - only by two points.

Pennsylvania clearly has a conservative streak - it has two Republican Senators and even some of its Democrats, like Governor Casey, are pro-life. Don't assume that because it's "blue" that it is Massachusetts. Santorum must indeed be defeated, and we shouldn't throw away the guy who's already several points ahead of the incumbent in favor of an unknown who may go down in flames.

PS - Governor Casey's election is proof that pro-life Democrats can win in Pennsylvania. Maybe the pro-choice bloc in Pennsylvania is not as powerful or necessary as you think.

[meow2u3]

15. The pro-choice bloc in PA is most powerful in Philly and its suburbs

eom

[EVDebs]

21. Let's hope they choose birth control ! The Plan B hypocrisy has to be

exposed for what it is, don't you think ?

[w4rma]

4. Focus on the Rhode Island primary instead, imho. (nt)

[Hippo_Tron]

7. Sorry but Santorum is 100x more dangerous than Chafee

He MUST be defeated.

[w4rma]

11. Casey will beat Santorum. So you don't need to focus on that primary.

Focus on the Rhode Island primary instead.

[woosh]

50. 50 state strategy

the dems have the activist base now to focus on more than one or two contests.

[iwantmycountryback]

23. That's what they're saying

Try to nominate the pro-choice Matt Brown instead of the anti-choice Langevin because if Chafee ends up beating Brown, it's not so bad. However, it's not worth a dirty primary to beat Casey. Casey seems to be very popular and Kerry only got 51% of the vote in PA anyway, so this is not a blue state in the terms of New York or Massachussets. Casey appears to be very liberal on other issues and focusing on 1 issue is not wise.

[WI_DEM]

5. not necessarily

Everyone already knows the Casey family has been pro-life, yet apparently Bob Casey doesn't make it a big part of his campaign and isn't in favor of overturning Roe. What it does do is neutralize Santorum's pro-life support, while I would guess that most pro-choice folks if given a choice between Bob and Rick, would vote for Bob Casey.
p.s.
most early polls show that Casey is ahead of Santorum and would be the strongest candidate. They also show that Santorum doesn't do as well with pro-lifers when Casey is the candidate, while Casey does about as well as say, Hafer among pro-choice folks vs. Rick Santorum.

[CANDO]

6. His pro-life father won two terms as Governor.

I think Casey will draw many people who are pro-life and normally republican but are absolutely fed up with the economic agenda of * and the republican congress. Skyrocketing deficit spending, everything pro-corporate/anti-consumer, as well as messing with Social Security will be the down fall of republican congressional control. This may be a blue state for the last few Presidential elections, but our congressional delegation is solidly red.

[saltpoint]

8. Would prefer a deep bluepro-choice Dem for ANY race --

-- in any state, but in this one instance, my revulsion at Santorum is so great that I'd support Jim Jones if he ran against him.

Santorum is a monster in a suit.

[annabanana]

9. Doesn't Pa have a labor base?

Does the fact that Santorum's pals in D.C. have given away the store to the people who've off shored all the good jobs in the state bother anyone there? And that each and every school teacher probably pays more in taxes than G.E.?

Aren't their downtowns suffering from the nearby WallMart, who's workers have to use taxpayer-funded food stamps to keep body and soul together?

Pa SHOULD be royally blue.

[Fovea]

13. And it would be, IMO

if we had been half so loyal to labor as labor has been to the party.

[CANDO]

18. Depends where in the state labor is based.

Big city labor is solidly Democratic. Central PA based Teamster Freight drivers are more Republican backers because "libruls want their guns"! Sad reality, but that's what the NRA has them believing. And they gladly tell you that many a Democratic lawmaker has planted a six inch blade in the back of labor in the past, which is also sad but true. Jimmy Carter with his deregulation on up to Bubba giving us NAFTA with a little help from a Republican Congress, there isn't much to counter these facts with.

[annabanana]

25. But the Republican Party has been SO MUCH worse..

and demonstrably so..

[msanthrope]

42. You got it--but Casey has stong ties to the central state labor base...

He also is pro-sportmanship, pro-hunting, without being anti-gun control. It's a weird stance, but it works here....

[IronLionZion]

43. that's an excellent stance

because you don't need an AK-47 to hunt deer. A lot of Democrats are pro-hunting, including Wes Clark, John Kerry, and Howard Dean. Regulated hunting is actually good to keep animals from starving to death from overpopulation.

[msanthrope]

44. HIs gun stance works here---

Strict regulation of handgun sales, and other non-hunting guns, combined with pro-sportsman, pro-hunter policies. Casey's father made it very clear to PA hunters---you want to go blow up Bambi, I won't interfere, but I've got to have certain laws that make it difficult for drug-dealers and the like to have concealed handguns.

[CANDO]

46. They laughed at Kerry's Goose hunt.

I'm a staunch Democratic voting Teamster born and raised in Lycoming County. There is no compromise with these people on the issue of guns. They TOTALLY buy into Wayne LaPierre's version of gun rights. And these hicks from the middle of the state are really pissed off because the deer herd has been successfully culled to more manageable numbers. They fully expect to walk into the woods and be surrounded by big bucks, and now that they actually have to "hunt" for their game, they are fired up. So their old argument for hunting, that it is needed to keep the deer from eating themselves into starvation seems lost because now they seem to have succeeded and they don't like it. Dr. Gary Alt, the game biologist who has tinkered with the bag limits to bring the herd under control, has recently retired because of the uproar. He was guilty of being successful. I'm very skeptical that these people will ever go for a "pro-hunting" Democrat.

[Coastie for Truth]

10. I will be moving BACK to Pennsyvania

and taking up residence in my sister-in-law's house, and getting a PA driver's license, and registering to vote in PA, and I will vote against Santorum -- then I will move back here to California.

I'm a Lawrence - Shapp - Caliguiri - Wofford Democrat at heart

Pennsylvania Casey's are like Massachusetts Kennedy's or Indiana Bayhs, or (yeccccch :( ) Florida and Texas Bushes

Santorum? :puke:

[Northern Perspective]

12. May be really important to frame it as "anti-choice" rather than

"pro-life". I am pro-choice, not anti-life.

[No Mandate Here.]

14. Come ON, everyone!

CAN'T YOU SEE THAT single issue politics IS WHAT GOT US HERE, AND THAT EVERY TIME SOMEONE SAYS THAT THEY CAN'T VOTE FOR THIS GUY OR WILL VOTE FOR THAT WOMAN BECAUSE OF A SINGLE ISSUE LIKE ABORTION OR GUN CONTROL, THE REthug DIVIDERS WILL HAVE WON AGAIN???

Sorry for shouting. Caps lock stayed on, and I decided to leave it as is. That's how strongly I feel about this.

Sanatorium will lose BECAUSE CAsey has this stance. One person will not change the course that radically.

Relax. This seat must be won. We must back the most electable candidate, even if we do NOT agree 100%

Ask yourself. Is there anyone with whom you truly agree 100%? Even your spouse or S.O.? Really???

[lastliberalintexas]

16. Are you high?

"Sanatorium will lose BECAUSE CAsey has this stance."

You really think the anti-choicers will be registering Dem and voting for us just because we have an anti-choice candidate? Wow. There must be a different breed of anti-choicers in the North than those we have to deal with in the South.


But I also see that you're another male willing to toss my rights aside for supposed victory. And you're willing to give up what right for the cause?

[dsc]

17. Yes

and the polls bear it out (they are sited in this thread)

[IronLionZion]

37. anti-choicers vote Repub, but PRO-LIFERS will vote Dem

Lots of Catholics in PA that like all things liberal except abortion. seriously, Health care and SS and all that are winning issues.

Come on, Casey is not going to take away your rights...but Santorum might. and then he'll take your job away, and your health care, and your Social Security, and civil rights, and ruin us all to make a quick buck for his corporate buddies. Remember that PRick is the asshole in this election.

Oh, and feel free to vote for the other Democrat, Chuck Pennachio, he's pro-choice. http://www.chuck2006.com better yet, help spread the word about his candidacy

[No Mandate Here.]

45. Thanks, Iron Lion,

We Somerset County people know a bit about just how rabid Sanatorium's sheep are. Frothing at the mouth most of the time, aren't they?

One Casey is FAR better than one Sanatorium.

[kodi]

19. i think you are right

i grew up in pennsylvania and here's why:

pennsylvania is simply alabama with pittsburgh and the delaware valley on the ends.

regardless of the large progressive blocks in the sububan counties in the valley there are many democrats and liberal republicans there who will not vote for casey.

many democrats will resist voting for an anti-abortion candidate regardless of party, and liberal republicans (yes, they exist in the delaware valley) will have to chose between an anti-abortion democrat or an anti-abortion republican.

the democrats usually have to sweep the southeastern part of the state by 15-20% to overcome the rednecks who live in the middle of the state, and i do not believe casey will garner that level of support from philly and pittsburgh.

i think if casey runs a lot of democrats will stay home on election day.

barb hafner is a better chose, even though she recently switched from the GOP to the democratic party.

[CatholicEdHead]

20. Problem is with the assumption here that pro-choice = pro-abortion

that is why this is Santorum's achilies heal. While much of the rethoric says pro-choice = pro-abortion, we all know that is not the case realistically.

You can be "pro-life" and not think that overturning Roe vs Wade will magically mean no abortions will ever happen again.

[Dr Fate]

22. It's true- swing voters will go for the man who "Says what he means"

DEMS need to learn to stick to their guns, and in an agressive manner.

[DaveinMD]

24. Casey

will win the votes of economically liberal, social conservatives in western PA. He won't win the fundies, but the the blue collar catholic vote is his to take.

[autorank]

32. And that would give him a bigger margin than Kerry had...he wins.

Any Democrat is pro choice because any Democrat, as in real Democrat, will NOT appoint right wing judges. Simple as that.

I'd love to see Santorum get a good ass whupping. Kerry won Philly 80-20 but Allegheny County 53-47 (I recall). If Case can take Pittsburgh and environs better than that, he'll wipe the floor with Little Ricky.

Casey, you go!

[LittleClarkie]

26. Why is he a pro-life stance on legs

surely there's more to this guy than his stand on abortion. Is he an activist on the subject? Is he actively trying to get rid of Roe v Wade?

What else does this guy stand for? Surely I'm not the only one around who isn't a one-issue voter.

[tishaLA]

28. He's not pro-life. He's anti-choice

He supports the death penalty. What kinda pro-lifer is that?

[autorank]

33. Oh, good Lard. Be careful not to introduce intellectual honesty into

the debate.

Whenever I hear people run their mouths on this issue, I'll make the statement:

If you're for legal abortion, you must be for the death penalty.

If you for outlawing abortion, you must be against the death penalty.

Those two points are iron clad (well not really, but they sound that way and most people don't have a come back...).

Casey is consistent on the pro life side, however, in as much as he supports progressive social programs...helping living people live. Most "pro-choice" ers could care less about the living and focus all their energy on the mumbo jumbo of pushing "life" back to fertilization.

Question: If you think about intercourse and don't have it, are you aborting a life? In certain religious doctrine, "the thought is the deed."

[Al-CIAda]

38. the thought is the deed

yes, good point -and it is so in Christianity as well. 'Impure thoughts' and all...

But before that is addressed, I can't wait till they outlaw wacking off, you know, that is aborting your 'seed' and such. I say we should introduce a law that chops ones hands off for choking the chicken.

[More Than A Feeling]

40. When I say that I get:

"Theres a big difference between executing criminals and killing innocent children"

[autorank]

51. It's all life! And they can be "forgiven." Yikes, what a world.

[GOPBasher]

27. You make good points, but I think Casey can

really get many of those blue-collar, "Reagan Democrats" that are socially a little more conservative, but not necessarily nutcases like Santorum. I think that would a close election.

[dorktv]

29. does anyone have footage of Santorum having sex with a gay

male dog?

[Hippo_Tron]

30. We could forge it

That would be hillarious.

[Freddie Stubbs]

31. No

[IronLionZion]

35. I think PRick was the bottom in that relationship

and is a gay male dog worse than a straight female dog? :silly:

[IronLionZion]

34. There is a pro-choice candidate in this race

Do you turkeys seriously not know about Chuck Pennachio?

Check out his website: http://www.chuck2006.com

Actually, I don't blame you for not knowing. The MSM and our own Democratic establishment is pretending he doesn't exist. Even then, his presence is known on the progressive internet community. I first heard about him on Raw Story. And he's a member of Howard Dean's group, DFA.

Google him, the first link is my DU thread about him. http://tinyurl.com/5ebub

And please spread the word about him. It's important for pro-choicers to know they still have a choice in the primary, then we can all unite to defeat Santorum in the general election no matter who the Democrat is.

No whining about his chances of winning please. Any Democrat can win if we support him.

[hopein08]

36. Maybe Santorum will get connected to the GOP memo...

that the MSM has picked up on about GOP talking points on how the Schiavo thing could be good. I think that whole thing definitely smells about his handiwork.

Anyone regarding abortion, did you ever realize that Pennsylvania is backward when it comes to political party/abortion stance...

Pro-choice Republicans====John Heinz, Arlen Specter, Tom Ridge

Pro-life Democrats====Bob Casey, Sr., Bob Casey, Jr.

In effect, Santorum and his pro-life stance is almost an anomaly in Pennsylvania politics. Maybe that can give some hope.

In addition, I think that Santorum and Casey having the same stance on this divisive issue will negate it somewhat and they can concentrate on something else that would give Casey the edge.

[salin]

39. So why would the pro-choice constituency vote for Santorum?

Or want him to be elected over Casey? Look, I don't like my dem senator much (who has presidential aspirations and has moved further to the right in order to pursue those_ - but we came out to elect him over the alternative. He isn't quite pro-life - but often votes that way. He not only voted for the war - he went to the rose garden with bush to promote the irc before the vote... he continued to insist there were wmds months after david kay said there were no wmds and there had not been wmds (eg the "they were moved" meme). However- the alternative was worse, and we now all see the damage a repub controlled congress has.

Even without the abortion issue Santorum can be painted as an insane religious fundie - he has given plenty of evidence of it over the years.

I don't have a favorite candidate in PA - and I want to see Santorum gone. I just don't think that you made your case in this post.

[msanthrope]

41. Hippo, do you actually live here?

'Cause I do, in Philly.

Like James Carville said, "Pennsylvania is Philadelphia on one side, Harrisburg on the other, and Tennessee in between."

He was right. Look, Casey will beat Santorum because he is pro-life, and a Dem. You are discounting a very, very conservative Democratic base here. I've spoken to bunches of conservative Dems who are overjoyed at this choice.

There isn't another candidate who will beat Santorum. There just isn't. Sorry.

[IronLionZion]

47. oh, and that "loser" just won more votes than any candidate in PA history

in 2004. His state treasurer election was the biggest landslide ever.

His stance on abortion actually makes it a moot issue for this election. He can focus on jobs, health care, social security, and that to completely destroy Santorum. It's going to be nasty and expensive with the GOP pulling all kinds of unethical shit to help their golden boy. You gotta respect anyone who with the stomach to challenge Santorum. In fact, his life may be in danger.

[Wilms]

48. .

[IronLionZion]

49. good point!

:P