What is up with me today...It seems we'd rather fight against ourselves

[xultar]

than against Bush.

We have a great opportunity. Yesterday was a GREAT DAY. Why is it that everyone is throwing in the towel. WE knew that the election wasn't going to be overturned. But when I logged on this morning all I saw was, I'm leaving the party, the Dems will no longer get my vote, don't vote in 2006 that'll show'em, etc.

WTF is up with that people. Snap out of it. Any post that had positive overtones went unread. Any post that looked forward had no replies. So we can't look forward?

WE have a guy who was paid by * to sell NCLB we shoulda been all over that with some media blasts and discussion, yet all I saw was how awful the Democrats are, they'll never be able to count on my vote.

So take some time to reevaluate where your head is. If you're gonna play in this sandbox we need to be about constructive things not destructive things.

NOW SUCK IT UP PEOPLE!!!!! and get to work!

[dmkinsey]

1. I'm totally with you xult

All these negative waves are really hurtin' my head.

[NewInNewJ.]

2. Well,

We just had a guy, Chuck Shumer say on CNN that he will vote for Gonzales for Attn. General. That makes me fighting mad.

[xultar]

6. He's afraid of looking like a racist. I can understand his thinking though

I disagree.

He's in a tough spot. Is it tougher to vote for him than look like a racist to your constituents? Cuz you know that's how the thugs will play it.

[NewInNewJ.]

11. I can't see it that way.

I can't imagine voting for a torturer, no matter what nationality he is.

[Zhade]

9. He'll vote for a guy who endorses torture?

A guy who believes the president (well, just THIS - illegitimate - one) has the right to overrule Congress whenever he wants?

And people wonder why I'm going Green.

[xultar]

13. While I agree with you the BFFE is good they aren't going to allow

one of their minions to say it out right. IT will be VERY difficult to pin that on him the way he wrote it.

Though we know he did what * told him to do Gonzales is a party to the torture.

He almost can't not vote for him because he doesn't want to be painted a racist.

[Zhade]

15. The fact that Gonzalez wouldn't answer Lindsey Graham's questions...

(specifically, about b*sh's "right" to overrule international law) ought to tell people everything they need to know.

Of course he'd be painted as a racist. It's half the reason Gonzalez is up for the job - just like Clarence Thomas, he's an ethnic pawn who loves playing the position.

[xultar]

16. Agreed! n/t

[leanin_green]

26. All this warm, fuzzy shit is great, except for one thing.

A lot of us progressives are beginning to wake-up to the fact that everything from now on is different. What can you do when you don't have the vote? These asses on the Hill aren't going to be afraid of what we can do because we no longer have the power to remove them. So, we're pissed and we want to discuss it with those we have like minds with. This inability of the left to handle anger and the language that comes with it is exactly why the right tore us a new asshole. Politics is about power. Power is a nasty game that can still be played with above board tactics. We can't shy away from a fight, even within our own ranks. Democrats have historically torn each other apart, only to come together again, strengthened and energized by the fight. Let's have this dialog. Many of us feel this way now, but that may change if some kind of agreed upon plan of action can be used to create critical mass. But first we have to acknowledge the fact that the political landscape is no longer the way we have known it in the past. Wake-up all you dreamers, you sleepy souls longing for what was. It's time to awaken and stir up the rest of those who still sleep and dream of America.

[cry baby]

27. I heard him say that he didn't know how he would vote. n/t

[Jo March]

3. And if you want to GET TO WORK, check out this link!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=262387&mesg_id=262387&page=

We have compiled a list of action items in broad categories to choose from. If you want to work to stop election fraud, then come on over and grab a task!

Thanks, xultar! :yourock:

[xultar]

7. I'm on it baby. I'm wit u to baby!

:yourock:

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[xultar]

14. I'm going to try this one from the list...

*Develop a clear and consistent message to deliver to our elected Officials (EO)

[Jo March]

18. We need it because we want to get our stuff read

A consistent and clear message gets them interested. A "fraud packet" gives them the information that they need.

:)

We are moving forward!

[NYCGirl]

4. Perhaps you shouldn't start threads calling out "Hillary Haters" NT

[xultar]

8. Well when you see a duck do you say cat? Buhwawawawa! I was wrong

I know.
But I had to call'em like I saw'em.

[cestpaspossible]

5. Defeatism can become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

And it's a game I refuse to play.

[xultar]

10. Alright...then help me help us pick out a logo for the revolution....

lookie for the thread in DU. O K? I have a few questions that need answers.

[mngreen]

20. I feel the same.

Let's focus on bashing the republicans. Any ideas to start with?

[xultar]

29. Well I'd like to start with trying to find a symbol for our revolution.

I'd like to be able to Identify my people when I'm out. That is the first thing that needs to happen. WE need to come out from the underground.

[mngreen]

31. How to identify our people?

Do you have any good ideas to do that?
To speak out against Bush, I've got an idea to start with. Let's start discussions about whether Bush is a true pro-lifer, a true Christian, a true conservative. Apparently, he is none of these to me. By initiating discussions on these issues, we may be able to wake up the true pro-lifers, the Christians, and the conservatives. As a result, we may be able to swing some of them to our side. What do you think?

[newyawker99]

34. Hi cestpaspossible!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[greenohio]

12. Good post.

Ahh, a little more sanity here on DU.

[jandrok]

17. Now THAT'S why I joined this forum....

Gloom and doom ain't where I'm from. There IS a brighter tomorrow. Good post.

[Lexingtonian]

19. yep, the dopey are out in force these days

Actually, they're mostly just weary of the fight.

Fighting other Democrats is easier- well, far less risky in any case. (They might actually upset a Republican by using fighting words.) Plus, in fighting with Democrats they can pretend to themselves that louder screams substitute for action, for good arguments, and for achieving genuine internal agreement. And its autotherapeutic. Or something. The technical diagnosis is 'hysteria'.

I'm very annoyed too that all the constructive and thoughtful posts get ignored, too. There isn't that much the Party has to do, as I see it, to regain a majority. But the primary psychological need around here seems to be about wallowing in selfpity while bemoaning a powerlessness that isn't new. And indulging in that warrant-deficient selfrighteousness that is most exactly what pisses off the swing voters and liberal-ish Republicans as the sign that the Party is still unregenerate, full of sloth and arrogation.

So it's all part of the Democratic Party's renewal process. But boy, if it were a movie I'd walk out of it for the next little while.

[AnnInLa]

21. Yes, I love DU, and

found that this board absolutely saved my sanity during the year leading up to the election....I live, surrounded by red, and needed to "reach out and touch" some blue daily. And, the word Democratic means everyone gets to express their own opinions, forcefully, if they feel the need to be forceful and argumentative.

But, I have joined some local Dem message boards where we are more united and more positive, and not so critical of others' opinions. It's like night and day, visiting those boards, then visiting this one. I still come get my DU fix daily, but this board often makes me depressed because of the disunity and disrespect. So, find some other liberal message boards that tend to be more positive, and stay "balanced" with your message boards. IMHO

[mngreen]

22. Let's focus on bashing the republicans

Aren't we democrats bashed enough by the Republicans? They have the psychological upper hand right now, the masters of criticism and ridicule. Though most of it is false, that doesn't matter because just enough of the public believes it to vote Republicans into office. First example: Republicans very effectively use the "big-spending liberal" label on Democrats, saying Democrats will pick the pockets of the taxpayers if elected, even though the recent Republican presidents have been much worse overspenders. They just spend it on different things than Democrats. Second example: The most visible goals of Republicans are based on intolerance, greed, and military force. These are directly against the teachings of Christianity, yet they often call Democrats "god-haters". In light of the ease with which Republicans are able to deceive and manipulate voters, do we need to bash each other more ourselves? We are all different individuals who have strong opinions and unique personalities. We are different in a lot of ways such as choice of words, ways of expressing our opinions, ideas of making this country great, etc. Somtimes we may get onto each others nerves. But what we do have in common is that we have at our heart a concern for others. And the ideology of concern for others was defeated by the ideology of self interest in this election. It is frustrating to all of us. But pointing fingers at each other won't help us win four years later. To win, we need everyone of us. So please unite and work together. Put our focus on the Republicans, on their ideology of self interest. Make it one of our goals to undermine the ideology of self interest for the next four years. By doing so, I believe we may be able to capture some moderate conservatives because they do share many of the same ideologies as us.

[Gman]

23. Xultar, I'm not real sure how many people that start this stuff

are actually Democrats and how many are long term, hidden disruptors/trolls. Too many of us take the bait and start fighting.

And, by the way, how've you been, Sistah Xultar?!

[xultar]

25. Yo Gman! Where ya been? You know that flame bait is so hard for us

to pass up. I've given in on more than one occasion/

How have I been? In a single word perplexed. In multiple words I'm @ a cross road. Part of me wants to hang in there as much as I can before I am able to legally reside in Canada. The other part wants to chuck all this shit and just watch the carnage from a far.

But I can't. I used to do stand-up back in the day. I had a really good friend who really BOMBED one night. I mean he really stunk up the joint. I couldn't watch him bomb so badly. So I left. HE got mad at me because he just thought I left him there and didn't support him. I have tried to remember that lesson today. I don't wanna leave and not support my people, but DAMN-IT TO BETSY they just piss me off so much I wanna take a cast iron frying pan and smack'em all upside the head.

They'd much rather destroy each other and announce it than beat the enemy. I don't know. Trying to stay and help and support is getting harder and harder to do.

Luckily you are here Gman! That really brightened my evening! :pals:

[cry baby]

28. Xultar, I applaud you for asking the hard questions, then sticking

around to discuss it. Many posters ask a hard question and then never return to the discussion. :toast:

[Gman]

30. A lot of us were around when Nixon was a real life elected president

Fortunately, the Democrats controlled Congress then, but a lot of us talked of leaving then when Nixon was reelected.

Keep the faith, sistah! The pendulum has swung as far to the right as the American people will tolerate. It's about to start swinging back.

:pals:!

[Kahuna]

32. Ding ding ding!!!! I've been thinking the same thing...

about long term hidden disruptors/trolls.

[janx]

33. That happens OFTEN.

But never the less, people who feel the need to react do so.

[hansolsen]

35. Many of the same people who couldn't get mad about the war in Iraq, now

can't get mad at the bungled headed leaders who led us astray.

It is not defeatism to call a spade a spade. There is a battle on for the heart and soul of the Democratic Party. Depending on who wins many people will either be leaving or declaring victory over Democrats who stand with Bush on the war.