In hindsight, what do you think of the "Dean scream"??

[kentuck]

The media depicted it as an "unstable" act and not worthy of a presidential candidate. If Dean were to run again, do you think it would not be revived and run over and over again? How were they able to "destroy" Dean's candidacy because of a simple yell?

[no_hypocrisy]

1. It's grown on me. I like it now as it shows Dean's unharnessed enthusiasm

[shraby]

2. Every time they ran it they dissed him as well.

What I saw was a man cheering his team on to bigger and better things. I wasn't a Dean fan but I saw what they did to him and there was no excuse for it. The plain and simple truth is, it was orchestrated to end his campaign.

[sendero]

79. I say this..

... as an early Dean fan who actually sent him money.

"If your enemy has guns do not hand them bullets".

The scream was no big deal but he should have known better.

That said, I'd love to see Dean as DNC head, because I think he can do the most good there. I'm not certain he will ever be able to run a successful presidential campaign, and that is not a slam on him as much as it is a slam on America.

[surfermaw]

3. I was for Edwards...and Dean ...like the scream,

Frankly I thought, he was rallying his troops, thought nothing of it in fact , I like his pushing his supporters, CNN did Dean, in. Think it was a planned thing, to have the mike too close or too loud what ever

[Triana]

4. "they" own the media...I think it was rediculously overhyped...

...and over-reacted to by both media and thus, the public.

I'd rather have had Dean than Kerry but...THEIR media destroyed Dean, just as they destroyed Kerry.

The US Media = "Public Enemy #1"

[The Flaming Red Head]

5. Im as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore

Go Dean!!!!! Go!

[w13rd0]

6. It wasn't just the scream...

...it was also his taped comments on the caucus process. That I think hurt him in Iowa and it's pride in its "first in the nation" status. Also, there were the comments on media consolidation on Hardball that I think really ruffled some corpowhore feathers. The scream was just one part of a takedown that involved the media, and those that wanted to stop Dean. It's too bad he didn't have something in his resume that made him "unassailable" like other candidates </sarcasm>.

[auntAgonist]

7. I liked his enthusiasm.

The media squashed it, tried to make him look out of control. Everytime they talked about it they turned it around to look bad. WE aren't supposed to be enthusiastic. We are to be clones, sheeple, follow the leader, don't ask questions, the shrub knows best .... NOT! ! ! !

[AllyCat]

8. Thought he was framed.

I was not a Dean supporter, but I thought the media was awful to him. What I heard was they played the audio from his mic only and the audience was screaming too. Supposedly, if you were there, it didn't sound out of order in the slightest. But the media hopped all over that.

The media will replay that over and over again if he decides to run again unless we can get them to report the truth and report it in a fair light. Which I doubt they will...:mad:

[WindRavenX]

67. he was framed

I too was not a Dean supporter, but he came to my college and spoke about this very incident. Apparently, this wasn't anything out of the ordinary, and the media decided to flood the airways in an attempt to make him look bad.
Quite sad.

[bklyncowgirl]

96. ABC news played the version with the crowd noise--sounded very different

Someone from ABC interviewed Dean and his wife during the time they were in full damage control mode. She later investigated what Dean told her about the microphones filtering out the crowd and found out that it was true.

ABC news played the speed with the crowd in the background and it sounded like an enthusiastic politician pumping up an excited crowd--nothing strange about it.

Of course this was played after the New Hampshire primary--after it was too late to change anything and Kerry was well on his way to the nomination.

[Lerkfish]

103. I agree: he was framed.

I was not originally a dean supporter, either, but I had just started to like him after seeing an interview with him and his wife, then the scream, and it was all over with....He was assassinated politically. The scream never bothered me, but I saw after its endless repetition that even other dems I knew started dissing him. I didn' t undertand it at the time, but I do now:

any lie repeated often enough becomes perceived as truth.

[cally]

9. The media overplayed it

and made it out to be crazy when it was not. He was rallying his volunteers in a loud room.

I think it was indicative of a problem with Dean's campaign. He was focusing on keeping his volunteers motivated and instead he needed to focus more on voters.

[grilled onions]

10. It energized

The entire party seems at times far too laid back,too "casper milq-toast" and the "scream" was like the start of a new phase, a new life to the party. His energy was contagious and we needed it. All of a sudden younger voters were starting to pay attention. It's a shame the entire "soundbite" was turned into something negative by the media.

[madfloridian]

11. Glad he's making money on it....in your face, media.

I hear he is getting paid a lot for his Yahoo ad. Good for him, I say.

[blm]

12. An overblown nonstory by the media to keep control of public perception

of Dean and even the other Democrats. They used it to keep Kerry and Edwards hard work and performances in Iowa marginalized, as well.

[flyingfysh]

13. it was an artifact of a directional microphone

It was a very noisy room, and in the situation was not out of place at all. The media used a directional microphone to try to create a situation to make him look bad. The people who were with him there hadn't thought that anything in particular had happened.

[MADem]

109. Diane Sawyer did a good piece on it

Too bad no one saw it. It showed, very clearly, what Dean sounded like from the perspective of the crowd. You could barely hear him, they were yelling so loud.

I couldn't figure out what the big deal was...I knew that the sound was not right the first time I saw it. Then, as they kept showing it, I figured the lamestream media had gotten marching orders to tombstone that particular strong candidate....he was getting tooo popular....

[Ducks In A Row]

14. I think the media are whores for the GOP

[Trillo]

15. By playing on people's prejudices and trained judgement.

I always saw Dean as passionate in his arguments, and what the MSM made a big deal of was his raw passion at that one moment. A moment taken out of context.

What happens to any of us when all the passion is gone?

[lynintenn]

16. I thought when it happened

this is it for this guy. He looked rather mad.
Being an ER nurse I thought I would hate to have this guy in the ER when I was working.
Having said that, I respect Howard Dean and think the dem party owes he and Wes Clark a lot.

[CAcyclist]

34. self-delete

[DireStrike]

17. I love it!

Not sure how it would play into a campaign though.

He's been quite resourceful in using it in his radio ads.

[James T. Kirk]

18. I thought it was silly then and I still think so now.

Did he think it would help him get elected? It was bizarre.

[The Flaming Red Head]

20. But Capn if his scream reaches a certain decibal it'll fix the anti-matter

core and shoot us right back to the early Clinton years.


(I'm sorry, I'm kind of silly myself tonight.)

[Pastiche423]

25. Huh?

[The Flaming Red Head]

33. Are you from Arkansas?

I get that a lot here.

[James T. Kirk]

74. Buh?

[necso]

19. I have wondered how the media got

the "feed" from his "noise cancelling" microphone as opposed to another "feed", like a combined ("mixed") one including crowd noise (as I remember it, anyway). Why did the media even have access to that particular feed, at least without "adjustment"? It was rather like having access to one input from a studio recording of a song -- something almost certain to make the "song" sound bad.

If you have to deal with a hostile media, you must be especially careful.

So who "screwed up"?

[dogtag]

29. Yep, the media was literally lying in wait...looking for

something to exploit. Dean gave them a gift when he forgot for the moment that he wasn't just speaking to his supporters in a loud and very crowded room.

I heard it in 'real' time and it wasn't nearly as crazy sounding as when they amped up his mic and replayed it over and over and over.

[necso]

42. Yeah,

but how did they get that particular feed?

Who was controlling the "mixer" (or whatever)?

This wasn't Dean's job. What was he supposed to do -- whisper?

And the media is lying in wait for everybody on our side who makes a "mistake" -- or has one made for him.

But I would like to know the details.

And I grow to like Dean more and more.

[bklyncowgirl]

98. Note for candidates--always sound check!

Could have been a conspiracy but then again those things happen. To give them the benefit of a doubt it could have been the media was expecting a standard concession speech. Instead they got Howard in full cry and without the crowd in the background to put it in context, he looked like a madman.

I remember a Hillary Clinton event in which the DJ played the wrong Billy Joel tune. Instead of "New York State of Mind" wafting through the air as the future Senator from New York walked truimphantly onstage, someone played "Captain Jack", a song about a 21 year old stoner chick best known for the immortal line "your sisters gone now, she's on a date, you just sit at home and masturbate"

Deliberate sabatoge was suspected but never proved.

[blackangrydem]

21. Reinforces that he is a passionate guy. I don't think it will hurt him.

[madfloridian]

22. What did you think of the Carville egg on the face?

Just wondering.

[Warpy]

23. I saw the video shot from out in the room

and knew Dean was getting pilloried by the media, who were aided by cherrypicked video that made it look like he was in a small, empty room and an isolation mike that cut out all the crowd noise, which was considerable.

I know this was overplayed the very day after he'd announced plans to bust up (ta da) the MEDIA MONOPOLIES!

To say Dean was treated unfairly is a gross mischaracterization of what the major media did to him. His character was assassinated.

We all lost because of it. It's yet another reason my television is adamantly OFF during the "news" hour. Not one second of my time is going to be wasted on propaganda and the advertisers who support it.

[NYCGirl]

55. Here's the video in Quicktime.

http://www.valuejudgment.org/vid/theSpeech_.mov

[Stinky The Clown]

24. Yeah, they'll revive it if he runs again

The scream, to me, was ......... well ........ nothing. Red meat for the troops. Perfectly okay. A "who the fuck cares" event.

But the media (fuckwads that they are) will replay it ad nauseum cuz it serves their purposes. ("We were right then and by gawd, we're right now.")

Sadly ... no ... tragically, "The Scream" is Dr. Dean's "I invented the Internet" or Kerry's "Flip Flopper".

What pisses me off, however, is not so much that they play the same thing over and over, its that they only play over and over what hurts **our** side. When Chimpus Khan does any of the hundreds of similar things he's done, its just cute ... endearing .... something done a real man-o-the-people.

Angry Clown to Media: Fuck You, Bozos.

[Placebo]

26. Howard Dean is too divisive to ever win.

I've read so much of what he's written since the primaries, and while I agree with a lot of it, there's also so much of it that ridicules those of faith and who don't agree with him. He acts like a messiah for Democrats everywhere, and there are so many quotes from things he's said or written to come back and bite him on the ass, coupled with the 'Dean Scream'...

It ain't happenin' No President Dean.

[madfloridian]

59. Are you having fun yet?

Everytime I start to post there you are attacking Dean again.

[Cheswick2.0]

95. ridicules those of faith?

that is a ridiculous statement. Now you're just making shit up. Why would he ridicule people of faith when he is one?

[against all enemies]

27. Not that big of a deal, but the media blew it out of proportion.

The Mission Accomplished "scream" was much worse but the media didn't give a damn about that.

[RafterMan]

28. Sorry, I don't see the media conspiracy

I saw it happen live on C-SPAN, and the whole speech was just wacky.

They were apparently carrying the feed from a local Iowa station and when they cut back to the two local anchors who both looked terribly embarrassed for the guy. One said, "Governor Dean, obviously somewhat fatigued tonight..."

Well, in the midwest "fatigued" is a polite lie-word to excuse someone who is behaving like a drunken ass. They weren't overplaying it, they were downplaying it. But they were pretty stunned by the performance and so was I.

[Raiden]

37. That's bull and you know it!

I saw the speech on c-span as well, and Dean was feeding off the energy of the crowd. When the media showed his scream in nonstop rotation for a week afterward, not once did they show the audience. The audience was screaming and jumping and waving their flags and signs and Dean's yell was completely in place. But when the media showed it, only he could be heard and he looked like an idiot. It was dirty and unfair and the pundits had a field day with it. A five second clip, showed in non-stop rotation, destroyed Dean's candidacy, and you're telling me you don't see the conspiracy?!

[RafterMan]

40. It's not bull

If they had show the whole speech instead of just the clip it would have been even worse for him.

I watched the speech and said "Dean's finished" long before he even got to the scream. And I was right.

[madfloridian]

Let's analyze that.

He still has a very large group of supporters at DFA. I believe the list is well over half a million now. Local organizations going in nearly every state with meet-ups and local groups organizing with other groups. Ours is trying to partner with a peace group here and with gay community which is having to fight the Southern Baptist Churches here.

So, how is he finished? He was on the road during the primaries and still is about 6 days a week. Finished? In what way?

[RafterMan]

73. Sigh.

His race was finished. That was what was issue at the time, obviously. And it was.

[Raiden]

30. I watched the speech on C-span

Right after his loss in Iowa, I was destroyed. I had wholeheartedly supported Dean and it looked certain that he would win the primaries. But the 'liberal' media couldn't allow him to win, not after he went on Hardball and said that he would go after the corporate media if he became president. The media leaked his negative comments about the Iowa caucases a week before Iowa. It was a very dirty trick. His campaign did everything to try and consolidate a win in Iowa but the clip, along with the media coverage of Kerry surge, drained him of his momentum and cost him Iowa. After his loss became apparent, I was absolutely destroyed. After a little over a year of supporting Dean, everything was shattered. I knew that Dean couldn't win the primaries now. I watched the speech on C-span. He gave an awesome, inspiring speech with his wife Judy and Iowa senator Tom Harkin at his side (of course, the media didn't cover his great speech). Right after his speech, the audience was screaming and Dean could barely be heard. Then, feeding off the energy of the cheering crowd, he gave his enthusiastic "yeeeeeargh!" It was just what his supporters needed at that point. It was also just what I needed. The next morning, CNN, MSNBC, and FOX are showing the now infamous scream in nonstop rotation. It didn't even sound the same. The audience couldn't be heard at all. Dean's candidacy was finished in one swoop. He sounded like a psychotic, bumbling idiot. Dean was quite simply the victim of an unfair and dirty media assassination. KKKarl Rove feared him and put him in his place.

[Freddie Stubbs]

83. The media 'leaked' his negative comments?

Isn't the media supposed to report these things? If they had at on some juicy quote that Bush had said everyone her at DU would be screaming about a coverup.

[LittleClarkie]

89. What were his negative comments on the Iowa Caucus?

I wasn't quite awake yet at that point in the campaign. What did he say?

[lojasmo]

99. Here's what happened

Dean said that he would reinstate the fairness doctrine....The media giants freaked out.

A few weeks before Iowa, they dug up the 7 month old quote about confederate flag/pickup truck/gun rack guys being better represented by the Democratic party...The media and Dean's competitors all spun it to shit.

Then shortly after that, they dug up TWO YEAR OLD footage of dean participitating in a round table discussion about the caucus system. Dean said that it made it hard for people to participate in the electoral process, but it got spun in iowa as an anti-iowa caucus screed, and it got lots of media attention and negative press.

Then the scream Played SIX HUNDRED TIMES nationally in the weeks between IA and NH, with the "Unstable" spin. Dean then lost NH, and was done.

It was a hatchet job, plain and simple.

[LittleClarkie]

111. True. It was Hatchet Job 101

And it wasn't going to get any better from the looks of it. As soon as it was obvious who the front-runner was, the GOP started in with their ad campaign on Kerry.

By the time he was done fending off Edwards and Clark and whoever was left in the primary process, he'd already been labeled a flip/flopper by the Bush Campaign. And it only got worse from there. They dug up a quote from 1971, for pete's sake, that said Kerry would let the UN decide things.

I know I remember how our local conservative radio went after Dean. Mark Belling said he wished Dean would have lasted a bit longer, but he seemed convinced the meltdown was coming sooner or later. I remember Mark was salvating at the thought of Dean running against Bush. He figured that would be easy. He was actively afraid of Edwards though, saying he was Kennedy-like and therefore could win.

Rush I didn't tune into until I heard him say somewhat admiringly that at least Dean was a true liberal. Rush seemed to be saying that alot of the others "liberals" only pretend to be. That doesn't seem to bare out though when I hear that Dean's record in Vermont was fairly conservative.

Eh, I still maintain that whoever the frontrunner turned out to be, they were going down like a two dollar hooker. They got Dean early.

[CAcyclist]

31. It's no big deal

I thought that when I heard it on CSpan and I continue to think that now. People who think it means anything are either lying, stupid or easily led.

[RafterMan]

38. Those of us who saw it live and thought it meant something

may all be "lying, stupid and easily led", but we were also right.

[CAcyclist]

41. Dean was assasinated as someone else astutely pointed out

and those who bought into the media spin all share in the blame in my mind.

If you continue to allow the corporate media to dictate to you what your thoughts are and which candidates you are allowed to consider serious candidates, then don't complain when life gets a lot harder here.

[RafterMan]

44. How can you call it "buying the media spin"

when I reached those conclusions *while he was still speaking*? Where was the spin then?

Assassinated. Spare me the drama. Suicide is more like it.

[Name removed]

47. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[chocolateeater]

58. The spin was in the feed

that made it seem that Dean and his "scream" was so much louder than the other people in the room. According to what I have seen, the people who were actually there didn't think it was crazy, because it was so loud in the room and he had to shout loudly just to be heard above the other people there. If you look at the reactions of the people behind him on the stage, including Senator Harkin, there is no indication they thought he was crazy.

[NYCGirl]

60. Here's a video of it taken in the room:

http://www.valuejudgment.org/vid/theSpeech_.mov

[chocolateeater]

65. Thank you for posting this. n/t

[RafterMan]

64. I'll repeat

it was the whole speech that was bizarre, not the audio balance on the scream. Maybe some Dean supporters were just inured by months of watching his regular campaign appearances, like doses of iocaine powder.

[chocolateeater]

72. Yes, a good inspiring speech is like cocaine.

*Sniff* Whoa, that was some good stuff! You should try it sometime, dude.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

49. It only meant something because

the media played it up SO hard and SO repeatedly.

Otherwise, it meant NOTHING.

[NYCGirl]

32. I love the way Dean's decided to "own" it. He tells jokes about

the "scream" at public appearances (and gets big laughs), he's now done the charming Yahoo commercial. I think it's going to end up being a great thing for him. Mark my words.

[janx]

36. What Yahoo commercial?

?

[chocolateeater]

46. Here is the link.

It's hilarious.
http://www.ysearchblog.com/files/howard_dean_ylocal.mp3

[janx]

52. Thank you!

[NYCGirl]

54. Thank you so much for posting that!

:yourock:

[chocolateeater]

68. You are both welcome. n/t

[CAcyclist]

43. I agree - he's doing a good job with that

This type of thing is going to happen every time we run a strong candidate - the only way to beat it is for the candidate to turn the tables like this. And for those of us who see through the bull*&(t to protest as loudly as possible.

[Phentex]

100. I can't stand to hear that commercial...

It was funny the first couple of times, but it does grate on you when you hear it over and over...

[AlinPA]

35. The media used it to destroy his chances.

[symphony]

39. loved it

A first/only display of real and honest emotion on the campaign trail. Too bad they made it look like a negative thing.

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

45. I watched it live in CSPAN

and funny, at the time I really didn't think much of it except, "MAN he's determined! That's great!"

Then the Dean bashing by the media began in earnest.

Then I learned it didn't sound ANYTHING like that to the people who were there (his mike was turned way up for the TV crews, but people there could hardly hear him). When he came out, there were always VERY loud cheering crowds.

Totally overblown. Totally. It JUST wasn't that big of a deal.

Though I have to say, I've heard his radio commercials for Yahoo! and it CRACKS my shit up. He speaks normally but yells the name of every state he says in the commercial. I love a guy who can laugh at himself. God knows bush can't, and there's plenty to laugh at there (and cry about).

[janx]

48. Are these radio commercials on Air America?

Where did you hear them?

[Moonbeam_Starlight]

51. Just on regular radio. There's a link above, I believe.

It's funnier than shit.

[NYCGirl]

53. Yes, the commercial is wisely booked on Air America!

NT

[janx]

56. I listen to Air America in the car on the way to work and then

again a little later, but I haven't heard the Yahoo commercial yet.

Edit: I tried the link, but I'm on dial-up, and it didn't work.

[NYCGirl]

57. I've heard it a few times there...it's so great!

Edited to add: I listen to the WLIB (NYC) affiliate. Perhaps it's mostly a local buy?

[janx]

61. It could be. I'm in Colorado.

But I'll listen, just in case...!

[NYCGirl]

62. Here's an MP3 of the ad that chocolateeater was kind enough to post above:

http://www.ysearchblog.com/files/howard_dean_ylocal.mp3

[chocolateeater]

63. Iam on dialup myself

and had to download the clip to be able to listen to it.

[janx]

78. Thanks! It worked!

[greekspeak]

66. An idiot sits in the WH & fucks up America daily but Dean "screams"

and he is blackballed? Howard, my dear gentleman, you were ROVED!

[Mr. Mousie]

77. seriously!!!

Bush says stupid bullshit everytime he opens his mouth, but Dean was taken out with one scream at a very emotional rally. That ought to alert you to something.

But the question is WHY was he taken out, and Kerry put in. I don't think Dean was any great shakes, really--even HE said that it was pretty pitiful that he was considered "left".

But the DP elites liked how Dean was bringing people who were fed up with the DP's spinelessness back into the party, back into electoral politics, and out of the streets. But ultimately they feared those same people making too many demands, so they ditched Dean and went with Kerry.

[kohodog]

69. Dean was done before the scream

And I am still a Dean supporter. DFA is more important than Moveon act and others IMHO.

I remember telling my family and friends that he was toast after he said he wanted to regulate the media. Immediately he went from darling to enemy. Time and Newsweek has negative cver stories. The television shows went from semi balanced (a liberal for every conservative to two conservatives and a moderate) on the Sunday shows. It was dramatic and obvious.

His campaign had been destroyed before the scream. The scream was the icing because theyh removed the crowd noise with the mike and made him look "unpresidential"

I am really happy he is still moving forward and has done so much for so many local races. He'd be a much better head of the DLC than Vilisec (sp). Howard Dean gave the Democratic Party it's voice back. Without him Bush would actually have a mandate.

[mtnsnake]

70. I love Dean but I thought his scream had the same affect as when

Kerry made his remark about Mary Cheney in the last debate. Both incidents made me feel right then and there that the fat lady had sung. At least Dean's scream was spontaneous. LOL

[PopSixSquish]

71. Didn't Think It was a Big Deal

but it allowed the corporate media to do several things. First, make Dean look bad which they were waiting to do.

Secondly, the story out of Iowa, became the fact that Howard Dean lost and not that John Kerry won and John Edwards pulled himself into the top tier of candidates. They both had to answer questions regarding "their thoughts on the scream" as if either gave a damn, rather than their own victories.

Third, they also used it to put down grassroots movements or organizations. Rather than focus on the positive of both the Dean and Clark campaigns, the media was dismissive. I remember one idiot comentator saying something to the effect of "what do you expect from this type of candidate" Nice.

But it will come back if Dean decides to run in 2008. This is the same group of fools who ridiculed Al Gore for growing a beard.

[Mr. Mousie]

75. It wasn't the scream that did him in...

"I actually do think the endorsement of Al Gore began the decline. The establishment in Washington really realized that I might be the nominee, and they did not like it."
Howard Dean, on Larry King Live

By that he had to have meant the Democratic Party establishment as much as the Repukes. He was soon after declared "unelectable", and Kerry, who had approved of Bush's every war move, was put in place as the frontrunner.

[janx]

76. Bless that man's heart. Just look at what his organization

has accomplished since then!

I think that rather than reliving all of this, though, we should support DFA as much as we can--2006 will be here before we know it!

[greenohio]

80. I thought it was hilarious.

and I don't think it was the cause of his demise. Placing third when he was supposed to win Iowa did more damage.

[2Design]

81. he was excited - he never imagined he would come so far -

and with so many people backing him - it was unbridled joy -

[Freddie Stubbs]

82. Dean's campaign was over BEFORE the scream

He had already lost Iowa that night and was far behind in NH by that point. He had already lost his momentum and the appearance of inevitability of his nomination.

[tsuki]

84. I thought at the time, and I still think. He dissed the media, and they

got him. Revenge.

[XemaSab]

85. I was there, and

Quite frankly, I feel personally responsible for the whole "scream" incident.

I thought it was a terrific speech, and I loudly indicated my approval of the Good Doctor, causing him to have to raise his voice slightly from his usual sober manner of speaking.

Dean had inspired us to go to Iowa, and Dean has continued to inspire us even now.





PS The media are assholes and they will burn in a special hell created just for them. :grr:

[HoosierClarkie]

86. I remember watching it live..

and thinking "holy sh*t this guy is losing it"!
It wasn't the media that made more of the feelings it invoked from people. The feelings were there from people watching it. The media just capitalized on it! Remember the look on Harkin's face. He looked completely confused by it. In hindsight, I still feel the same. Dean made a mistake. The media ran with it.

[proudbluestater]

87. Overplayed and Misinterpreted by the right-wing media n/t

[sampsonblk]

88. We Need More of Them

Great enthusiasm.

[AP]

90. Dean already lost the campaign when the caucuses voted. The scream...

...was the media's way of saying, "here's the kind of shit we could have been doing to you but we didn't becuase we were trying to get you nominated. So there."

[jojo54]

91. I agree with...

everybody who said it was the media that "did him in", and it was orchestrated for Dean to lose. Like other opinions, Dean had the spark, like Bill Clinton, and it threatened the RNC to the point of making it a huge issue.

I'm sick and tired of hearing about "checks and balances" when it comes to politics. I'm wondering if we should go back to "whistle stop tours" and little to no media participation. Or, maybe the Dems should start lying through their teeth like the RePukes do. Maybe then we'll get elected, no matter how emotional the candidates get.:kick:

[Dehumanizer]

92. As mentioned, Dean's campaign was done prior to that..

but media-wise, the scream was the final nail in the coffin.

What pisses me off about the media is that we have a President who has said and done things which are 10000000000000000000000000000000x worse than Dean and his scream could even hope for, yet the media conveniently ignores that.

[ever_green]

93. I love it. I wanna scream too YAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:) The media can go to hell.

[LiberteToujours]

94. I think as little of it now as I did then

It was a media created sensation.

[killbotfactory]

97. "He's not as evil as Hitler!"

It was disgusting bullshit. I couldn't believe. I hate the media.

[RivetJoint]

101. It cost him any chance he ever had of being President

of the US. Just my opinion.

[Cheswick2.0]

102. What's the point of this flame bait thead?

[Tom Rinaldo]

107. I was wondering that too.

Most of us agree that "the media is not our friend". They have an agenda to further their own interests, which are essentially identical to the financial interests of their corporate owners. When they are not pushing an overt political line they at the very least keep looking for "Christians to throw to lions" in the grand old tradition of the Roman Empire. "News" and "Reality TV" are now one and the same, a never ending hunt for juicy plot lines and situational set ups. That's when they DON'T have a covert political agenda, and usually they do.

Howard Dean has done AND IS CONTINUING TO DO many great things for the Democratic Party. That is the real story, why buy into their manufactured news by constantly rehashing it? Whatever possible insights there were to be gained were fully extracted 9 months ago. Yes one can safely assume that from time to time, when Dean is "in the news", someone will try to trot out "the scream". That happens with the perceived "gotcha" moments, real or manufactured, of every leading Democrat. We can't allow that to program what we talk about and we can't allow them to keep disqualifying our leaders for us by playing into their game.

Howard Dean's political career has moved forward since that night. He fought tirelessly for Kerry, and was well received across the country while doing so. Democracy For America is a vibrant organization hands on involved in reinvigorating the Democratic Party from the bottom up. If we want to talk about Howard Dean, there are more important things to talk about.

[Sputnik]

104. It never bothered me

I was (and still am) a Clark supporter, but it was obvious that the media was using the "scream" to destroy Dean. Didn't CNN admit that they aired it over 600 times?

I hated what they did to Dean then and I hate it now.

If you're a Democrat and you raise your voice (like Dean or Gore) you're painted as a lunatic. But a Republican VP saying "go fuck yourself" is just dandy.

[midnight armadillo]

105. I use it as my email notification sound at work

It makes me chuckle every time I hear it.

Seriously though, the media hated Dean since he spoke openly about breaking up media companies. unfortunately, the scream gave them enough rope to hang him publicly.

[Goldmund]

106. What I think about it...

...is that I can't believe anybody's talking about a damn scream.

[Padraig18]

108. I think the same thing now that I did then.

It was nothing more or less than an attempt to 'rouse the troops'. It was disgusting how the media over-reacted and essentially used it to murder gov. Dean's candidacy. Still furious...

:grr:

[WI_DEM]

110. it has been discovered how the media manipulated that scream

and blew it out of proportion. It is a non-issue just like it should be.

[greenohio]

112. It didn't take much to discover that, I must have heard it dozens of times

but the problem was the scream was in response him placing 3rd in Iowa. The campaign was already imploding.