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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 05:45 AM
Original message
Nobody could have predicted 9-11
I don't think anybody could have predicted that these people would take an airplane and slam it into the World Trade Center, take another one and slam it into the Pentagon; that they would try to use an airplane as a missile, a hijacked airplane as a missile. All of this reporting about hijacking was about traditional hijacking. You take a plane -- people were worried they might blow one up, but they were mostly worried that they might try to take a plane and use it for release of the blind Sheikh or some of their own people.


Condoleezza Rice, statement can be found at:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/05/2002051...

***

Really?

***

The FOX TV series The Lone Gunmen (X-Files spin off) airs their opening episode " Pilot" six months before 9/11 which depicts a secret U.S. government agency behind a plot to crash a Boeing 727 into the WTC via remote control and blame it on foreign terrorists in the hopes of generating a bigger military budget.

Why didn't that media pick up on this bizarre coincidence of life imitating art? A Boeing 700 series commercial airliner about to crash into the WTC and being blamed on foreign terrorists shown just six months before the real thing happened on a major TV station? I mean come on?!!

The real irony is that a lot of conspiracy investigators think that this scenario is essentially what really happened on 9/11!

http://thewebfairy.com/killtown/lonegunmen.html

incl. Link to full movie!

***



Frank Spotnitz, Co-Autor:

What's disturbing about it to me is, you think as a fiction writer that if you can imagine this scenario, then the people in power in the government who are there to imagine disaster scenarios can imagine it, too."

***


Scenario 12 d was most likely come true on 9-11.
But there's another coincidence: In the Pilot of "The lone gunmen" a plot was hijacked ( they good boys try to steel a computer chip )
I suppose the same happened on 9-11.

Theory:

They know that there were terrorists that want to hijack planes to set free the blind sheik Muhammad Omar Abdel-Rahman in US-custody ( the man behind the first WTC bombing 1993 )

There are some hints:

-As I remember, at least two suspected terror-helpers ( Moussaoui, http://wid.ap.org/documents/courts/zmtrans.pdf and Motassadeq ) were sentenced for membership in terroristic organisations, without beeing sentencend for 11-9 in special.
Mossaoui said: "9-11 was not my conspiracy, our goal was to set free the blind sheik"

-Able Danger

-The infiltration of islamic terror groups with agents, probably since 1993. ( google for CIA and the blind sheik )

-Their cooperation with Osama and the ISI.

And many, many others, which I can't explain complete here
( Hopsicker, entries and departures of the suspects in USA, Spain, Indonesia... )

So, it's possible that even with long time overdue passenger list will be published with the names of the suspects on it, that their plot was completely hijacked and they were only useful idiots to made scenario 12 d more likely.

And the excuse no one could predict 9-11 was downright ridiculous, unless they don't have a tv to watch FOX.
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spooked911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
1. It's interesting to see her full quote-- in particular that she knew about
the plot to free the blind Sheikh.

But the biggest problem with her BLATANT LIE is that NORAD ran several drills before 9/11 simulating hijacked aircraft slamming into major US targets. Moreover, the pentagon ran a drill before 9/11 where a plane crashed into the pentagon...

and so forth...
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 10:23 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Yeah
that's true.

Just more hints they know- and planned it in advance.






http://www.willthomas.net/911/911_Commission.htm
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spooked911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. great pictures!
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janedoe Donating Member (540 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. What about the location of the Pentagon hit?
The actual location where it was hit by "something," was being renovated.

The actual location where it was hit by "something," was a harder-to-hit region.

The actual location where it was hit by "something," was where they were running an exercise that morning, with a scenario of "something" hitting the Pentagon. Conveniently, they already had a fire truck at the location before the "something" hit the Pentagon.

So, why would they have an emergency "exercise" at a location where it was least likely to happen? Pretty interesting coincidence.

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Kevin Fenton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 02:29 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Not really
"The actual location where it was hit by "something," was being renovated."
American 77 hit at the join of Wedge 1, which had been renovated, and Wedge 2, which had not.

"The actual location where it was hit by "something," was a harder-to-hit region."
Why do you think this? To me it looks like the easiest to hit region.

"The actual location where it was hit by "something," was where they were running an exercise that morning, with a scenario of "something" hitting the Pentagon."
Could you post a link please?

"Conveniently, they already had a fire truck at the location before the "something" hit the Pentagon."
The fire truck was totalled by the explosion, which appears to be strikingly inconvenient.
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Rice admits foreknowledge of Atta and Co.
And this was an analytic piece that tried to bring together several threads -- in 1997, they talked about this; in 1998, they talked about that; it's been known that maybe they want to try and release the blind Sheikh -- I mean, that was the character of it. And so the actions were being taken in response to the generalized information that was being reported here, too. And the President was aware that there were ongoing efforts that were being taken.


***


What more do we need?
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janedoe Donating Member (540 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #1
7. She'll simply plea "incompetence" like the others have.
So, when can incompetence no longer be used as an "excuse?"

Note the similarities between Brown's "not watching TV news" enough to realize there were people in the NOLA Convention Center, and Condi not being aware of FOX's Lone Gunman show.

I don't know if it actually aired. But, if it did air, why didn't Condi know about it? If it didn't, why didn't it? Who would have "pulled it" from airing, and why?

In any case, a National Security Advisor is supposed to be thinking of possible story lines about what "our enemies" might do.

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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. incompetance
this is also the same NSA person that didnt know who al quada even was prior to taking office.

what happened on 9/11 was due to incompetance from the top on down thru the administration.


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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Grand failure theory
<- BS.
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janedoe Donating Member (540 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #11
15. Is it incompetence to think that planes only hit buildings
when Clinton is in the White House?

I forget what year it was (1996?) when some guy tried to ram a plane into the Whie House. I may not remember the exact date, but I do remember it happened. Is it too much to expect that the National Security Advisor would be aware of previous attacks on buildings in DC?
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Sorry for the unbiased source
but your are right again, as you can see here:

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2002/jan2002/sept-j16.shtm...
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janedoe Donating Member (540 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. Excellent reference! Thanks! (n/t)
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pauldp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #11
17. To assume incompetence with this Cabal is a grave error.
Dick Cheney was Secretary of defense under Bush Senior During the Gulf War. Do you really think he would not be aware of what was going on in that region? Do you think the Bush Family with all of its ties to intelligence operations and its business dealings with Saudi Families like the Bin Ladens and others who were major terrorist financiers, were really that clueless to what was happening? These are the same criminals who pulled off Iran Contra - selling arms to our sworn enemy and passing the funds along to mass murdering narco terrorists. All the while letting those same narco terrorists destroy many of our inner cites by smuggling tons of crack cocaine, and everybody getting fat from the profits. Then when they all got caught they got a slap on the wrist and a Presidential pardon. Do you think Halliburton and Unocal think that this administration was incompetent with respect to 911? Oh no, these men are not incompetent, not in the least, they knew exactly what they were doing. I could see perhaps making a case for CRIMINAL NEGLIGENCE - perhaps - but certainly NOT incompetence.
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mirandapriestly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
4. Everything this administration has done could not have been possible
without 9-11. The Iraq War, The Patriot Act and attempts to reign in our civil liberties, the ridiculous power afforded to the office of the POTUS,the compliant media, and sheep like citizens...It is so obvious to me, especially given the omissions of the 911 Commission and the contradictions from Rumsfeld, etc..., hijackers that are still alive or that couldn't fly a plane...the unlikely collapse of the towers...
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 11:51 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Your so right
Edited on Sun Nov-20-05 11:55 AM by SittingBull
I can't explain my thoughts very well in english, but as you can see that were exactly my thoughts, as e-mailed to presstitute Tucker Carlson on his show-interview with Prof. Steven Jones:

There are too many questions that you can't afford to dismiss this subject via: "I can't imagine such stuff."

Please remind what Prof. Jones stated: First the science!



My standard sentence for all this "cannot be possible I couldn't imagine" was:

The world doesn't care somewhat to what you can imagine. The world follows a strong functionally principle.

Money rules. That's nearly all you need to know.

And: Why does the government seems to doing such terrible things- because they can. Full stop.
They can, the have the possibility, the opportunity and the aim for this crime, mostly all motives for a commited crime were complied.

And they have a great chance to get away with it, the bigger the lie was, because people like you coudln't imagine this.

And yes, the insights may be painful, but does that mean you don't have to look at it? *


You said: "for obviously no reason". That's clearly false. They got their deserved "New Pearl Harbor", which was
prospected and needed, stated in the "Rebuilding of Americas Defense, Page 51 ff, PNAC, http://www.newamericancentury.org )

They get their Unocoal-Afghanistan Pipeline, worth some 15 trillion dollars. Also remember the Cheney Energy Task Force of 2001,
in which plans and tactical orders were discussed with the energy-companies.


They got their "rule of fear", with unprecented approving rates for the president, their agenda comes through without congressional resistance, and they could dismiss
all possible "not elected rumors" for a long time.

And they got their long planned iraq-war, too ( see Statement on above mentioned website, Letter to Clinton 1998! )

Iraq oil reserves worth: Some 15 trillion dollars, too.

Now: If you have to make a decission: 30 trillion Dollars, 3000 lifes. How would you choose? You??

And then imagine what this bunch of people which connected to every scandal in the modern US-history ( Bay of Pigs, Operation Northwoods, Kennedy-Assasination,
Vietnam, Team B, Iran-Contra, Heroine-smuggling ) to corporate-industry-military-complex connected people will choose.

Please remember also that there's plenty of evidence for wars built on lies in the history:

Pearl Harbor was known in advance, but nothing was done ( Stinnet! )

Tonkin was completely faked. The Operation Northwoods was well planned, but not worked out- but only the long time need for the planning shows
what your government is able to do.

The Kuwait-baby-scandal was completely faked under governance of a media-agency. And so on.

******************
*Edit on spelling*
******************
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Rich Hunt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
10. Summer of 2001

Wasn't it reported in the Summer of 2001 that al Qaeda would attack the G8 with planes flying into buildings?
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Yes
on the G8 meeting in Genova italy July 20 th - 22 th there were flak batteries.

Here's the headline- original published in the NYT, I suppose.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/waronterror/story/0,1361,5586...

Please also remember Crowley and the Phoenix papers.
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Link to Phoenix memo ( Rowley )
http://www.time.com/time/covers/1101020603/memo.html

Link to PDB 01-08-06

http://news.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/terrorism/80601pdb.h...

Please consider: german intelligence near reporter Oliver Schrm suggest, that 11 pages were missing.

And we should believe him, he was the source that stated the titel of the briefing correctly before it was known.

http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=2306
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petgoat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. If you look at the pdf of the PDB you'll see redactions at the
center of the bottom of both pages (if I remember right) that would be
consistent with page numbers being covered over.
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petgoat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 03:35 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. The Italians installed SAM batteries at the airport in Genoa
to protect the G-8, and W slept on an aircraft carrier for security.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/waronterror/story/0,1361,5589...

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philb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
21. There were thousands who knew of the plans to attack WTC & Pentagon
using airplanes;

Here is one plan that was discussed by many in Gov't & elsewhere many times for years before the actual attack:

1995- A plan by al-Qaeda operatives(including Khalid Shaikh Mahammed and Ramsi Yousef) involved in the 1993 attack on the WTC buildings was discovered on computer disks, involving using commercial airplanes in terrorist attacks and including plans to attack the WTC buildings and the Pentagon, was discovered by U.S. and Philippine intelligence agents resulting in conviction and jailing of Yousef and others. Its code name was Project Bojinka and the plan and 9/11 was carried out exactly 5 years after Yousef was convicted on Sept 11, 1996, at such time Yousef again discussed plans for carrying out Project Bojinka.

and U.S. intelligence had developed a similar plan as part of war games much earlier. And there were hundreds of warnings to Admin. in the leadup to 9/11
http://www.flcv.com/warnings.html
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SittingBull Donating Member (398 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 11:25 PM
Response to Reply #21
23. Wow
that was new for me- thanks!
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PerpetualYnquisitive Donating Member (218 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-20-05 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
22. If A 707 Hit The World Trade Center?...
MD-90 From United States, joined Jan 2000, 5288 posts, RR: 11
Posted Thu Nov 30 2000 04:39:15 UTC+1 and read 173413 times:

When the two towers that make up the World Trade Center were built, they were designed to withstand the impact of the largest airliner of the day, the Boeing 707 Intercontinental. The Empire State Building survived a B-25 medium bomber crashing into it on very foggy day. It was during the weekend when most people weren't there, but still, 14 people died.

Anyone wanna bet that the World Trade Center could survive an 767-300 impact?

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/r... /

Nothing to see here, now move along.
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