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When 9/11 happened, how did they know it was al Qaeda so quickly??

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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:46 PM
Original message
When 9/11 happened, how did they know it was al Qaeda so quickly??
I remember it being reported that they found an ID of Mohammad Atta at the scene. It seemed highly unlikely to me, but whatever. But, almost immediately, they made the statement that Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda were the responsible Party.

How did they know? Did they have hints ahead of time? Did they have intelligence, other than the PDB of August 6th, that we were going to be attacked? And they still could not protect us??
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NoPasaran Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:47 PM
Response to Original message
1. The amazing thing is
In eight years, this is the first time this question has been asked.
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
17. They didn't. They suspected but didn't know until the claims of responsibility came in. Remember?
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 07:16 PM by timeforpeace
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:44 PM
Response to Reply #17
32. Osama bin Laden DENIED responsibility, remember?
Bin Laden says he wasn't behind attacks
September 17, 2001 Posted: 11:21 AM EDT (1521 GMT)


DOHA, Qatar (CNN) -- Islamic militant leader Osama bin Laden, the man the United States considers the prime suspect in last week's terrorist attacks on New York and Washington, denied any role Sunday in the actions believed to have killed thousands.

In a statement issued to the Arabic satellite channel Al Jazeera, based in Qatar, bin Laden said, "The U.S. government has consistently blamed me for being behind every occasion its enemies attack it.

"I would like to assure the world that I did not plan the recent attacks, which seems to have been planned by people for personal reasons," bin Laden's statement said.

"I have been living in the Islamic emirate of Afghanistan and following its leaders' rules. The current leader does not allow me to exercise such operations," bin Laden said.
http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/09/16/inv.binladen.deni... /



Why would he deny involvement in the worst attack ever on American soil? That's no way to recruit members to your terrorist organization, is it?

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #32
44. He didn't deny responsibility in the secret video of him.
He's happy to take responsibility for it now.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 03:51 AM
Response to Reply #44
56. Produce your evidence for this claim or retract it
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #56
59. All right.
Osama talking about carrying out 9/11 and discussing details of the operation a couple of months after the attacks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KhctMpvszqQ

Osama in 2004 released his own video tape, also claiming responsibility for the attacks and threatening more:
http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/10/29/binladen.tape /

Go find some other playthings.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 03:48 PM
Response to Reply #59
63. 2004? Really?? Osama bin Laden has been dead since December of 2001..
What's the date on the youtube video? I can't do youtube, I'm stuck on dial-up way out here in the sticks..

One other thing... how was it a "secret tape"? Did someone within his organization secretly record him and sneak it out? Who recorded the tape?

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. "Osama bin Laden has been dead since December of 2001."
Produce evidence for this claim or retract it.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #64
68. Here ya go....
Fox News: "Bin Laden Already Dead"

Wednesday, December 26, 2001

Usama bin Laden has died a peaceful death due to an untreated lung complication, the Pakistan Observer reported, citing a Taliban leader who allegedly attended the funeral of the Al Qaeda leader.


"The Coalition troops are engaged in a mad search operation but they would never be able to fulfill their cherished goal of getting Usama alive or dead," the source said.

Bin Laden, according to the source, was suffering from a serious lung complication and succumbed to the disease in mid-December, in the vicinity of the Tora Bora mountains. The source claimed that bin Laden was laid to rest honorably in his last abode and his grave was made as per his Wahabi belief.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,41576,00.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The Death of bin Ladenism
By AMIR TAHERI
Published: July 11, 2002

Osama bin Laden is dead. The news first came from sources in Afghanistan and Pakistan almost six months ago: the fugitive died in December and was buried in the mountains of southeast Afghanistan.
Pakistan's president, Pervez Musharraf, echoed the information. The remnants of Osama's gang, however, have mostly stayed silent, either to keep Osama's ghost alive or because they have no means of communication.

With an ego the size of Mount Everest, Osama bin Laden would not have, could not have, remained silent for so long if he were still alive. He always liked to take credit even for things he had nothing to do with. Would he remain silent for nine months and not trumpet his own survival?

Even if he is still in the world, bin Ladenism has left for good. Mr. bin Laden was the public face of a brand of politics that committed suicide in New York and Washington on Sept. 11, 2001, killing thousands of innocent people in the process.

What were the key elements of that politics?

The first was a cynical misinterpretation of Islam that began decades ago with such anti-Western ideologues as Maulana Maudoodi of Pakistan and Sayyid Qutb of Egypt. Although Mr. Maudoodi and Mr. Qutb were not serious thinkers, they could at least offer a coherent ideology based on a narrow reading of Islamic texts. Their ideas about Western barbarism and Muslim revival, distilled down to bin Ladenism, became mere slogans designed to incite zealots to murder.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9405EFDE...


As far as I can see, these reports have never been retracted or disputed.

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #68
69. U.S. Strongly Believes Bin Laden Still Alive, Official Says
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #69
72. Looks like we have a Mexican Standoff, doesn't it?
Who to believe, who to believe....

Pakistan's old president, Pervez Musharraf, echoed the statement that bin Laden was dead, their new president says their intelligence believes he's dead.... but the US "strongly believes" he is alive.

The US really needs their boogeyman, don't they?

I guess it's up to each of us to decide who we believe, then we'll just have to agree to disagree (if we do) until solid proof is shown as to whether he is dead or alive...


Peace,

Ghost

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 06:07 PM
Response to Reply #72
73. One of your sources is less sure these days, if not outright on the other side.
http://nrd.nationalreview.com/article/?q=MTdlMmNmOWU3MT...

Many in the region were even convinced that Osama bin Laden, the self-styled supreme guide of al-Qaeda, had died as early as December 2001 this despite audio and video messages broadcast in his name on a few occasions since 2004.


Of course, that was just the opinion piece you quoted. The other is sourced to a Pakistan newspaper, and the evidence of the audio and videos since 2004.

And the video from Afghanistan, the first one I sourced, is dated November 2001.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 04:37 PM
Response to Reply #73
86. I'm not seeing anything in that sentence that says Mr Taheri is less sure, or on the other side now
When taken in context with the whole paragraph, he seems, to me, to be saying that people still believed bin Laden was dead, despite the audio and/or video tapes that were made. This, to me, implies that even they thought the tapes were faked...

By 2005, all three objectives had been achieved. The world had absorbed the message that, if attacked, the U.S. would fight back. U.S. and allied forces had destroyed every single terrorist base used by dozens of groups, many with no links to al-Qaeda, throughout Afghanistan. They had also killed or captured most of the terrorists present in Afghanistan at the time. By 2007, in fact, of the 25 senior leaders of al-Qaeda, only three were still alive and free, presumably hiding in Pakistan. Many in the region were even convinced that Osama bin Laden, the self-styled supreme guide of al-Qaeda, had died as early as December 2001 this despite audio and video messages broadcast in his name on a few occasions since 2004. The U.S. had also supervised a process of consultations and referenda that led to the writing of a new democratic constitution and the election of a new parliament and president in Afghanistan.



I guess I'm just not reading into it what you are...


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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #86
87. Since he was one of those, I found the use of the past tense interesting
Not "many in the region ARE convinced", but that they "were convinced". Since he was one of those convinced back in December 2001, his use of the past tense tells me he no longer counts himself in that number, and that the 2004 video and audio messages changed his mind.

And, wow, be careful swerving around the actual date of the original video...
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #87
89. I see your point, and understand where you're coming from...
I'm just not seeing it that way myself...

I'll be able to watch the video you linked to here in a couple of weeks. They finally got Verizon Wireless high speed out here in our part of the sticks :-) That's one of the drawbacks to living in a very rural area, 15 miles from town: no cable tv, no DSL, nothing.... hell, we still get our sunshine piped in from the next town over :-)


Peace,

Ghost

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #89
90. Did you know that Amir Taheri is the source of the BS idea that Iran was going to start
forcing non-Muslims to wear colored badges?

"Stop looking at Al Qaeda! Iran is badbadbad!"

Just saying...
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 05:24 PM
Response to Reply #90
91. I just started reading his wikipedia entry...
The first thing that caught my eye was the first sentence:

Amir Taheri (born 9 June 1942, Ahvaz) is an Iranian-born conservative journalist and author based in Europe.<1>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amir_Taheri


This part also stood out:

Shaul Bakhash of George Mason University has accused Amir Taheri of concocting nonexistent conspiracies in his writings, and states that he "repeatedly refers us to books where the information he cites simply does not exist. Often the documents cannot be found in the volumes to which he attributes them.... repeatedly reads things into the documents that are simply not there."<11> Bakhash has stated that Taheri's 1988 Nest of Spies is "the sort of book that gives contemporary history a bad name."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amir_Taheri#Nest_of_Spies


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Twist_U_Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 06:16 PM
Response to Reply #64
74. ok
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #74
76. The first one that Ghost offered.
Please try to keep up.
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jberryhill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 05:00 PM
Response to Reply #32
88. Why would he deny it in that statement?

Hmmmm... maybe there's a clue in there....

"I have been living in the Islamic emirate of Afghanistan and following its leaders' rules. The current leader does not allow me to exercise such operations," bin Laden said.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 05:31 PM
Response to Reply #88
92. Yet some people think that the taliban was protecting him because they didn't turn him over
to the US for prosecution...

That's why Bushco invaded Afghanistan. The taliban told the US that they would turn him over *IF* the US provided credible evidence that he was involved in the attacks... Bushco basically said fuck you, then started bombing.

There is no *credible* evidence, anywhere, that bin Laden was involved. Period. Even the FBI has said so. If you have some credible evidence, please contact your local FBI field office....


Peace,

Ghost

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Neily Donating Member (208 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 03:50 AM
Response to Reply #17
82. 2 Major Flaws to the Claims of Responsibility
1. His initial statement denied it, although he has a history of openly admitting his "achievements." If he was the mastermind/puppet master, then this would have been his biggest success in history. So, why would he deny responsibility for the first time ever.

2. His "Secret Video" has several flaws, including the size of his nose, beard shape, and skin color and the U.S. intelligence translation of the video has been criticized by many in the world. (Plus if I recall correctly, that video shows him wearing a ring although he has never been observed wearing jewelry, due to his religious beliefs.)

So, unless you speak the language natively and can prove that is him in the video, I don't think it is fair for any of us to say we saw video of him claiming responsibility.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #82
83. Bullshit....
1. He was being harbored by the Taliban in Afghanistan on the condition that he refrain from activities like the bombing of our embassies and the bombing of the USS Cole, so it should hardly surprise anyone he initially denied responsibility.

http://www.911myths.com/html/responsibility.html
http://www.911myths.com/html/previous_claims.html

2. The so-called "fat bin Laden" tape has been repeatedly explained.

http://www.911myths.com/html/fake_video.html
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Neily Donating Member (208 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #83
93. Do your homework...
Edited on Tue Sep-29-09 11:05 PM by Neily
"1. He was being harbored by the Taliban in Afghanistan on the condition that he refrain from activities like the bombing of our embassies and the bombing of the USS Cole, so it should hardly surprise anyone he initially denied responsibility.

http://www.911myths.com/html/responsibility.html
http://www.911myths.com/html/previous_claims.html "


A majority of the "direct" admissions come from an interview with Peter L Bergen. Have you actually read his books? And, do you actually consider him a reliable source? He denies the CIA/Bin Laden link ever existed... For crying out loud, he works at the same school (SAIS) as Zbigniew Brzezinski... the man who created Al-Qaeda. Not to mention all of his other connections to the Elite.

"2. The so-called "fat bin Laden" tape has been repeatedly explained.

http://www.911myths.com/html/fake_video.html "


Real good de-bunker... doesn't even mention the most glaring difference... the nose! Kinda hard to completely change the shape of the nose at all angles when merely trying to "enhance" the video for viewing ease.

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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #93
94. Dude...
Edited on Tue Sep-29-09 11:20 PM by SDuderstadt
think this through logically for a moment. Are you honestly expecting us to believe that the perps would produce a fake video with someone who doesn't even look that closely like bin Laden? Really? As far as your "translation claims", if the video has been "faked", do you really expect us to believe the perps wouldn't have the "actor" in the video saying precisely what they wanted him to say? Really?

And, yeah, I consider Peter Bergen a reliable source. At the very least, far more reliable than you, dude. You can believe the crap you believe if you want. I prefer to live in an evidence-based world.
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YOY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:48 PM
Original message
They knew something was coming and they knew that AQ was the one who was doing it.
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 06:48 PM by YOY
That summer was high alert all over the US Government...especially abroad.

How did they know...jeeze your guess is as good as my conspiracy theory.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 10:08 PM
Response to Original message
78. PLUS . . . they had 24 hour surveillance of Taliban . . .
and two of the alleged hijackers were on the FBI's high security watch list --

24 hour surveillance . . . while the alleged hijackers were supposedly buying plane

tickets -- one way -- and charging them to their credit cards . . . in their real names!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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rucky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:48 PM
Response to Original message
2. That was the first question I asked.
Then they worked so quickly on the PATRIOT Act, and the Axis of Evil speech. I've been suspicious ever since.
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Trajan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:48 PM
Response to Original message
3. Wasn't there a memo or sumfin ?
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
4. I have always wondered that. I remember hoping that they would
investigate further while I was watching the scenes on tv.
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MindPilot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
5. That is something that has always bothered me too.
Within what, two or three days, the front page of every major daily had names and pictures of most of the hijackers?
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:50 PM
Response to Original message
6. Very likely suspect! They admitted responsibility for the
earlier trade center bombing. It's like looking for a rape or child abuser perp and finding there's one living next door to the victim.
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rollingrock Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #6
51. It was like another Oswald moment
taken straight from the JFK playbook.
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Octafish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #51
58. The JFK Assassination and 9/11: the Designated Suspects in Both Cases
Peter Dale Scott explains:

The JFK Assassination and 9/11: the Designated Suspects in Both Cases

It's clear: The behavior of the US government since November 22, 1963 shows its not We the People who call the shots.
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:51 PM
Response to Original message
7. You know, when someone passes gas and points to someone else.

Like that.

:shrug:

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Mrs. Overall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
8. I talked to someone in the NSA and according to that person--
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 06:57 PM by Mrs. Overall
they (NSA) knew something was going to happen around Sept. 11th, they just didn't know where. This person stayed at work for three days around Sept. 11th because everyone was working around the clock. Bush was specifically sent to the elementary school in Florida because they were worried about threats to his life as well.

I don't remember if the exact terrorist group was known. I just remember being very surprised that they knew it was coming and they were basically monitoring possibilities and waiting.

It still seems strange to me that the military was running exercises that morning (and of course, when I talked to this person, it was right after 9/11 and some of the oddities hadn't been reported or uncovered yet, so I didn't ask about that).
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. I remember an assassination attempt had failed...
And the next day, Bin Laden and the Taliban assassinated the leader of the Northern Front (or some name similar), our ally in the north of Afghanistan. Then 9/11 happened within the next couple of days.
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. Also, Rumsfeld on the 9th told a press conference that the DoD was missing
$2 Trillion, which 9/11 completely overshadowed and which was all but forgotten.
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Also, in the previous week or so before it happened...
It was reported that Colin Powell, Secretary of State, had offered the Taliban a pay-off of $45 million dollars, but we never learned what that was about? Although some speculated that they wanted a pipeline run thru Afghanistan to the Indian Ocean, rather than running it across the entire Baltic area to the Meditteranean. As far as I know, we never found out the entire truth of the matter.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Contrary1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. They were worried about threats to Bush...
so they sent him to an elementary school? Makes perfect sense. Maybe the deep thinkers thought that miniature human shields would make a difference to terrorists.
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Mrs. Overall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:23 PM
Response to Reply #15
23. That was very shocking to me.
Wasn't there a point in the first Gulf War or some subsequent bombing of Iraq that Saddam had a group of children at one of his palaces, knowing it wouldn't be bombed?

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Fire_Medic_Dave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:33 PM
Response to Reply #8
26. We warned India about the Mumbai attacks 24 hours ahead of time.
We didn't know a specific target. They rounded up all the known terrorists in and around Mumbai. Unfortunately the cell that committed the attacks had just come into the country and wasn't yet in Mumbai.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #8
79. Meanwhile, ALL the intelligence coming to the WH and our intelligence agencies aid hijackers . . .
and some of the intelligence gave names --

The question is the same as ever ...

"HOW COULD THEY NOT HAVE KNOWN?"

United Nations Security Council sent their representatives to the White House and

our intelligence agencies in AUGUST ..... Russians had names of some hijackers.

They were concerned about WH "operation ignore."

So -- that was the time to send part of our jet fighters off to Canada and Alaska

for a pretend match with the Russians? And other blocks of our jet fighters off to

South Carolina for another exercise?



:evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
9. I believe bin laden's name came up first on CBS at 9:34am. n/t
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #9
80. And weren't there some other wild claims that they found "How to fly a plane" book
in a car left at the airport by the alleged hijackers ???

Plus a will?

And other nonsense?

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Kievan Rus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
12. Bushco saw it coming and let it happen
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Deleted. Image too large. n/t
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 07:22 PM by Subdivisions
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timeforpeace Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:18 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. Yes of course, that's right. Forgot this is truther central.
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gleaner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. I have often ...
had the thought that they did let it happen. Bush and others were given intelligence beforehand that planes were going to be used to attack buildings. They basically held action in abeyance, and did not even warn airport security that there had been a threat.

The usual US military response to an "event" over U.S. soil which had been worked out for years and years was not triggered. It was held back. Bush desperately needed an event which would allow him to seize the extraordinary power that he did. I compared it in one post to the Nazis burning the Reichstag to terrorize the German people into supporting them by making them believe that a conspiracy of enemies of the state had started the fire. This gained Hitler the support he needed to gain power.

It seems that Bush gained from 9/11 the same way that Hitler gained from the Reichstag fire. And the fear generated by 9/11 helped keep Bush's grip on this country so tight that he was for all intents and purposes a dictator. I don't think Bush triggered the actual attack. Even I can't go that far. On the other hand I don't think he did anything to prevent it either.
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Arkana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:13 PM
Response to Original message
14. I thought Osama claimed responsibility in short order...?
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kentuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #14
18. Everybody claims responsibility when something like that happens.
That is, everybody that hates America. I think we would have needed proof from somewhere??
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:45 PM
Response to Reply #14
43. See post #32... n/t
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lapfog_1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:17 PM
Response to Original message
19. They had the passenger lists
from the airlines. Atta and his cohorts did nothing to hide their identities.

But what WAS bothersome was them finding intact passports and drivers license reportedly from the hijackers. This after a passenger jet disintegrates in a ball of fire some 100's of feet in diameter when colliding with a large steel building.

And they still find laying about on the street mostly unburned passports?

It smelled then and it still smells now.
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. You think it's odd that such things survived
a fire so intense, it caused buildings to pancake unto themselves? How silly of you.
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TheWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #22
31. But The Official Story is the only Acceptable and Allowable Truth that Americans will ever be
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 07:40 PM by TheWatcher
afforded.

One good thing came out of 9/11 though, at least from the perspective of a select few.

Oligarchs now know, at least in America, they can get away with anything.

There is no limit to the lies Americans will fight and die for, so that they can cling to their precious false paradigm of what passes for freedom and democracy. And they will cling to ANY fabricated truth, no matter how ridiculous or implausible, to keep that Truman Show alive.

A lot more than 3000 people died on that day.

A country died too.
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90-percent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #19
30. the official answer
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 07:45 PM by 90-percent
An FBI official was asked how he came upon the passports so quickly; "We got lucky" was his perfectly acceptable and, unquestioned to this day, answer.

Why wasn't Bush's Elementary School bombed by airliner also? Hell, they got lucky! Why did they think the school was so frigging safe to begin with? I understand it's right next to the local airport and therefore easily found on a Rand McNalley map. Did Osama have any maps before 9-11? One can only wonder.

-90% Jimmy

PS - the winner of the most useful factual post of the thread is post #9, copied below.

9. I believe bin laden's name came up first on CBS at 9:34am. n/t

that's pretty darn quick to figure out who to blame it on, if you ask me. Didn't it take them a lot longer to find out who did it for Oklahoma City? The source of the information is something I would really like to know. Was it from the US government or was it the lucky guess of a CBS permalancer?
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Gidney N Cloyd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:24 PM
Response to Reply #30
38. Wasn't the "We got lucky" thing about finding the flight school?
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tiny elvis Donating Member (619 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 01:53 AM
Response to Reply #38
54. In the August 25, 2003 edition
of The New York Observer, author Gail Sheehy recounts an exchange following a formal meeting between senior FBI agents and the 9/11 widows known as the Jersey Girls. Kristen Breitweiser was having difficulty reconciling something:

I dont understand, with all the warnings about the possibilities of Al Qaeda using planes as weapons, and the Phoenix Memo from one of your own agents warning that Osama bin Laden was sending operatives to this country for flight-school training, why didnt you check out flight schools before Sept. 11?

Do you know how many flight schools there are in the US? Thousands, a senior agent protested. We couldnt have investigated them all and found these few guys.

Wait, you just told me there were too many flight schools and that prohibited you from investigating them before 9/11, Kristen persisted. How is it that a few hours after the attacks, the nation is brought to its knees, and miraculously FBI agents showed up at Embry-Riddle flight school in Florida where some of the terrorists trained?

We got lucky, was the reply.

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JPZenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:19 PM
Response to Original message
21. Richard Clarke knew because he was warning about it
Richard Clarke was Clinton's head of counter intelligence. He was demoted under Cheney-Bush. He had been warning about this threat for years, and he said he knew instantly it was al quaida.
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. Thank you for your answer. Keep repeating it please
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lapfog_1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:47 PM
Response to Reply #21
33. Not only that, but I believe he was the ONLY high ranking
(and not that high after Bush came in) official to ever offer a heartfelt public apology to the victims families.

He earned a place of deep respect from me that day.
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KT2000 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:33 PM
Response to Original message
27. Good question and
I also wondered that at the time.

They immediately got the surveillance photos on Atta et al. in Boston and had lots of info on them
That happened really fast with all the other connections.
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NightWatcher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:35 PM
Response to Original message
28. pointing out the obvious? you must be some kind of nut.
it was a fix. everything about it was a fix
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RedCloud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
34. Bush hid for three straight days. Why was he welcomed as a hero?
It seems more like he was hoping something wouldn't get divulged. And the censorial and secretive behavior of his administration and pretty much telling professors to shut the fuck up speaks volumes in my book.
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 07:55 PM
Response to Original message
35. another thing I wondered about, maybe someone remembers...
right before 9/11, there was a Florida news scoop that was supposed to have breaking news about the stolen election of 2000....and the day the story was supposed to be printed was 9/11..it was supposed to be headlines...anyone remember?
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #35
81. Think that was the report by the press Consortium? They held that up after 9/11 . . .
in act, the 2000 stolen election had to be another impetus for Bush/Cheney Co. to pull

9/11 -- questions about that election weren't going to stop.

And between both the election and 9/11, Patriot Act/Homeland Security they had to shoot

Anthrax at the Congress!!!

Close it down for months!!!

Imagine what info people were trying to get thru to Congress at that time??
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grantcart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
36. Because of the bombings of the Embassies in Africa

Not really big news here but it was in the government.

Al Queda was the only one with a successful sustained attack on the US.

The ID on Mohammed Meta (and the others) was done quickly from the flight manifests. Some of those flying were travelling under their actual names and known to be AQ sympathizers.
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undeterred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
37. Bill Clinton said he knew it was Osama bin Laden
as soon as he heard what happened.
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troubledamerican Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:25 PM
Response to Original message
39. How did they have the USA PATRIOT Act drafted so quickly?
Cue: Bush defenders who will describe how it wasn't unusual at all for that bill's 9/11-specific Fascist Wish List provisions to have been whipped-up so fast.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
40. I remember being ASTOUNDED
That they had ALL the names of the 19 conspirators before WT7 hit the ground.

It was literally A FEW HOURS that they had it figured out.
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #40
46. "they had ALL the names of the 19 conspirators before WT7 hit the ground." Bullshit
Produce your evidence for this claim or retract it.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. "Produce your evidence for this claim or retract it."
Edited on Sun Sep-27-09 09:39 PM by Ghost in the Machine
Debunk it or keep quiet...

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 10:12 PM
Response to Reply #47
48. There's nothing to debunk if someone can't produce evidence for their claim.
Newsflash: My behavior is not your personal project to improve. Stop stalking me or you'll be talking to the moderators about it.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #48
49. It shouldn't be hard to do at all... you don't need their evidence to provide your own evidence
against it. Can't you look up a timeline, or something, and provide evidence that debunks their claim? Do you honestly think you can't debunk a statement?

"Stop stalking me" :rofl: :spray: :rofl: This is a public forum, dude... if you don't like people responding to your silliness you can either stop acting silly.. or stop posting... it's your choice.

Newsflash for you: I've already talked to a moderator, and I can respond to you, or your claims, any time I want to as long as it's relevant to the topic being discussed. This is a public forum, not your private playground. The only way you pick and choose who you talk to is by using your ignore feature. That, however, doesn't stop me from responding to your posts.

Now debunk the original claim or move along... don't waste bandwidth with your inane behavior, attempts to quash discussion or attempts at the usual nuisance/distraction games. Stick to the topic..

Thanks,

Ghost

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. Repeat: there is nothing to debunk until the prior poster establishes his claim.
It would be one thing if you were treating everyone in this forum the same way that you treat me, but only I get the focus of your "improve Bolo" project. Believe you me, you will be banned if you don't hop off of me or start treating everyone the same way in this forum.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 12:17 AM
Response to Reply #50
52. He "established" his claim when he *made* the claim...
Believe it or not, statements *can* be debunked without any evidence supporting the statement.

If someone made the statement that "RFK shot JFK", would you need them to show evidence of this claim, or could you not debunk it by finding evidence that showed that RFK was at his home in McLean, Virginia when he was told of JFK's death?


"It would be one thing if you were treating everyone in this forum the same way that you treat me, but only I get the focus of your "improve Bolo" project."


Awwwww... It was your choice, remember? I offered you a truce and you wanted no part of it, now you just have to play the hand you dealt yourself...


"Believe you me, you will be banned if you don't hop off of me or start treating everyone the same way in this forum."

Your hollow, self-absorbed threats mean nothing to me, bolo. Haven't you figured that out yet? Once again, stick to the context of the thread, this isn't about you or me...

Thanks,

Ghost


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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 01:07 AM
Response to Reply #52
53. Bullshit. n/t
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 03:44 AM
Response to Reply #53
55. Produce your evidence that it's bullshit or retract it
Now would be a good time...

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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #55
60. You have no concept of the burden of proof. n/t
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #60
66. You don't need proof if a statement can be easily debunked. I've already shown you that..
Edited on Mon Sep-28-09 04:03 PM by Ghost in the Machine
I think what the problem is is that you *can't* debunk it. I'm sure you've searched around to at least try, haven't you? I'll bet that what you've found is the statement by the FBI agent who said that they were able to identify all the hijackers, "almost immediately after the attacks" because of the luggage they found that belonged to Atta, with the lists of names and everything.

Here lies the problem, and maybe we can work together to find the answer: What time did they seize this luggage and discover the names? I can't find a timeline for that. If they found it before WTC 7 collapsed, then the statement the other poster made, "they had ALL the names of the 19 conspirators before WT7 hit the ground" is true. If not, then it's false...

What time did they seize Atta's luggage?

edited: html tags (grrrr)
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #66
67. The burden of proof is not mine. n/t
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #48
61. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #47
57. Ghost...
you know that's not how it works. The maker of the claim bears the burden of proof.
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Ghost in the Machine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #57
70. I know that's how it normally works...
.. but some things that can be easily proven, or debunked, really don't need much more evidence than a simple statement...


How have you been, dude? Is your friend doing ok now?


Peace,

Ghost

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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #70
71. Yeah, but it's still your burden of proof....
My friend in still in the danger zone, sad to say.
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rschop Donating Member (493 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-30-09 01:43 AM
Response to Reply #40
96. That they had ALL the names of the 19 conspirators before WT7 hit the ground.
WTC 7 came down many hours after the first airplane hit the North WTC Tower. All they had to do was look at the passengers with middle eastern names on the flights that were hijacked.

Didn't take a genius to figure that one out.

They probably had the names 30 minutes after the United 93 went down, several hours before WTC 7 came down.


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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-30-09 01:55 AM
Response to Reply #96
97. Well, acquiring the passenger manifests would have given them all the names, but
the names had to be confirmed. The names had to be shown to be associates and to be actual identities of the people on board. And until that process was completed, it can't be said that they had the names of the hijackers. A couple of the names were known to investigators immediately, but not all of them.
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
41. Off to the dungeon with 8 votes
*sigh*
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
42. You may be interested in this interview with Lawrence Wright
whose reporting on al qaida in The Looming Tower is very different from the corporate media's characterization of bin Laden and the group. He doesn't talk about the question you're raising but his version of al Qaida is more "the gang that couldn't shoot straight" than "international criminal master-minds".

http://www.booktv.org/Watch/7430/After+Words+Lawrence+W...
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-27-09 09:17 PM
Response to Original message
45. They recognized names on the passenger manifests. n/t
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rschop Donating Member (493 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 01:29 PM
Response to Original message
62. re: how did they know it was al Qaeda so quickly??
Edited on Mon Sep-28-09 01:32 PM by rschop
They knew it was al Qaeda because the CIA and FBI HQ had been receiving warnings since April 2001 that a al Qaeda attack of catastrophic proportions was about to take place inside the US.

On August 22, 2001 CIA Officer Tom Wilshire, and FBI HQ Agent Dina Corsi, were told that long time al Qaeda terrorists, Khalid al-Mihdhar and Nawaf al-Hazmi, were inside of the US. Wilshire and Corsi even knew when given this information, as did the CIA and many people at FBI HQ that Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US in order to take part in this massive al Qaeda attack.

So what did these agents and the rest of the CIA and FBI HQ that also were aware of this information do with this horrific information?

First they kept this information secret from the FBI criminal investigators on the Cole bombing, including FBI Agent Steve Bongardt, lead FBI investigator on the Cole bombing in the New York office, and his team of FBI criminal investigators, investigators that could have found Mihdhar and Hazmi quickly and could have prevented the attacks on 9/11.

But they not only kept this a secret, they kept secret the fact known by the CIA, Wilshire and Corsi, that the CIA had been deliberately hiding the photograph and of Khallad Bin Attash, mastermind of the Cole bombing, taken at the Kuala Lumpur al Qaeda planning meeting, planning the Cole bombing with Mihdhar and Hazmi. The CIA did not want Bongardt and his team to have enough information to start any investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi and in July had even forbidden Wilshire twice, on July 13, 2001 and on July 23, 2001, from turning the information on the Kuala Lumpur al Qaeda planning meeting over to the FBI Cole bombing investigators, even though this information directly connected Mihdhar and Hazmi to the planning of the Cole bombing.

Second, when Bongardt and his team accidentally found out that both Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US on August 28, 2001 and knew they were in the US to take part in a horrific al Qaeda attack, Corsi and her boss, Rod Middleton, shut down their investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi. The FBI HQ agents used the reason that the information the FBI criminal investigators would need to start any investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi came from the NSA and this information was restricted from being passed to FBI criminal investigators until the NSA had issued a written release for this information.

What the FBI criminal investigators were "not told" was that the NSA had already given the FBI HQ agents, including FBI HQ Agent Dina Corsi written permission the day before on August 27, 2001 to turn this information over to the FBI criminal investigators on the Cole bombing who wanted to investigative Mihdhar and Hazmi.

When the Bongardt persisted in his request to investigate Mihdhar and Hazmi, because he thought the information that the NSA had had no connection to any FISA warrant, he asked the FBI HQ agents, both Corsi and Middleton, to get a legal ruling to find out if the FBI HQ lawyers would allow him and his team to investigate Mihdhar and Hazmi and stop any attack that they might be part of. The attorney that Corsi contacted, Sherry Sabol, told Corsi on August 28, 2001, that since the NSA information had nothing at all to do with any FISA information, the FBI Cole bombing investigators could start or take part in any investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi, and if Corsi was still confused she, Corsi, could go to the NSA and get a release herself unaware that Corsi had already gotten a release two days earlier.

Unfortunately Corsi fabricated Sabol ruling and told Bongardt on August 29, 2001 that the attorney had ruled that he and his team could have no part in any investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi. And even more tragic, blocking Bongardts investigation cost the lives of 3000 people on 9/11.

When the CIA and FBI HQ were sabotaging any chance that the FBI Cole bombing investigators could investigate and search for Mihdhar and Hazmi, they clearly knew that as a direct result of their actions thousands of Americans were going to perish in these upcoming al Qaeda attacks.

So it is clear how they found out so fast, they already knew a huge al Qaeda attack was about to take place inside of the US, knew al Qaeda terrorists Mihdhar and Hazmi were going to take part in this attack and even knew that both Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US in order to take part in this attack. See www.eventson911.com for additional details on all of this.






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rschop Donating Member (493 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #62
75. re: how did they know it was al Qaeda so quickly??
Let me make a slight correction to my last post.

The statement; They knew it was al Qaeda because the CIA and FBI HQ had been receiving warnings since April 2001 that a al Qaeda attack of catastrophic proportions was about to take place inside the US.


This should read; They knew it was al Qaeda because the CIA and FBI HQ had been receiving warnings since April 2001 that a al Qaeda attack of catastrophic proportions was about to take place against American interests. After July 2001 they knew the attack would take place inside of the US and knew that Khalid al-Mihdhar would take part in this attack. After August 22, 2001 when the CIA and FBI HQ knew Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US, they knew they were here in order to take part in an al Qaeda attack of catastrophic proportions.
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rschop Donating Member (493 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #75
85. K&R
They knew it was al Qaeda so quickly because the CIA and FBI HQ had been receiving warnings since April 2001 that a al Qaeda attack of catastrophic proportions was about to take place against American interests.

After July 2001 they knew the attack would take place inside of the US and knew that Khalid al-Mihdhar, and Nawaf al-hazmi, who the CIA knew in July had already entered the US, would take part in these attacks.

After August 22, 2001 when the CIA and FBI HQ knew Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US, they knew they were here only in order to take part in an al Qaeda attack of catastrophic proportions.

So it was no suprise at all when the attacks on 9/11 took place. The CIA and FBI HQ even knew the names of some of these terrorists who were going to take part in this attack prior to the attacks on 9/11 taking place.
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aldo Donating Member (297 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 03:58 PM
Response to Original message
65. Patsies in place.
That's what it's called.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-28-09 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
77. The same way they "knew" that Oswald had killed JFK . . .
:evilgrin:
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MinM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 02:46 PM
Response to Reply #77
84. After 9/11, McCain Linked Anthrax to Iraq very quickly...
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-29-09 11:28 PM
Response to Reply #84
95. McCain is so filthy . . .
Had the Repugs not done 9/11 and anthrax . . . we would have succeeded in impeaching

Bush on a stolen election -- at least that's my daydream!

:)

But, really, they had to close down Congress!
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CrunchMaster Donating Member (308 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Oct-01-09 02:40 AM
Response to Original message
98. The Hijackers were watched and protected by American and German and Euro goverments
Edited on Thu Oct-01-09 02:59 AM by CrunchMaster
The goal to frame up Arabs for the New Pearl Harbor has been a story long in the making. The hijackers and Bin Laden and all of the rest were under surveillance a very long time. I suspect that Bin Laden was paid to be an agent provocateur just like all of the recent FBI false flag terror busts that have been in the news where there were no real terrorists, just an FBI paid provocateur and a group of doofuses getting paid by the Provocatuer to pretend to be terrorists.

The recent Provocateur guy busted was based in Denver, the same city where dummies were busted for threatening Obama before he is elected... the same city where the CIA plans to move most of its operations. So the recent guy busted set up shop in Denver and then drove all the way out to New York to stage terror? Why would he do that? Why do terrorists always set up base so close to U.S. intelligence?

So Bin Laden was chosen to be designated bad guy from the get go... and now what they needed before 9/11 was to seed a trail implicating his patsies in terror operations... although from what i see most of these "hijackers" seem to have been nothing but drug pilots.

They were after all involved with Wally Hilliards flight school Huffman Aviation which was busted by the FBI for flying heroin into Florida. Were the hijackers simply drug pilots on remote controlled planes, framed to look like hijackers???

USA, Germans, Israelies were all watching these guys for a long time.

9/11 followed the same outline and story as the Oklahoma City Bombing and the World Trade Center bombing in 1993. Both involved Muslim Brotherhood and Neo-Nazis from Europe(in particular Germany. Both involved agent provocateurs hired to entrap patsies in terror plots in order to take the blame while in each case the provocateur was allowed to escape(Strassmeier escaped to Germany by way of KKK Lawyer Kirk Lyons, Ali Mohammad is in hiding and protected)

In the Oklahoma City bombing, German guy Andreas Strassmeier came to the U.S., got involved with Civil War re-enactors and Texas militias before winding up at Elohim city to agitate neo-nazis to attack the U.S. government.

In 9/11, Mohammad Atta and his family met a German couple in Egypt(the old Nazi/Muslim Brotherhood/Egypt ties?) Atta went back to Germany to go to school and stay with this couple. While there, the CIA and German government both kept an eye on him.

Then Atta and a bunch of his friends were allowed into the USA where they went into various Red States(no surprise) like Oklahoma, Arizona, Minnesota, South Florida, San Diego and started training at flight schools. You will notice that these are the same states that tend to generate your most extreme Rethuglican nutcases(Michelle Bachman) Who were there American contacts in the U.S.?

While in the US some of these hijackers were being watched by FBI informants(like in San Diego.) Some of these informants had been involved with both OKC bombing in 1995 and 9/11.Melvin Lattimore for instance. So it is the same operation in which the FBI was on the inside and in both instances allowed the attacks to occur essentially unmolested.

If you ask me, all of this is a Euro-Nazi and American Extreme Right axis.

Prescott Bush's bank was somewhat cozy with the Nazis. George H.W. Bush was Skull and Bones... Skull and Bones was started in Germany. Lead Hijacker Mohammad Atta's close associates included Swiss, Belgian, German and Dutch pilots and trainers. He got money from an American/German fund to be in Germany to school. A German couple hosted him there. And later the FBI mostly covered up any European connections to the Arabs.

Then there is the construction company Turner Construction which had overseen controlled demolitions around the USA before 9/11 and which was doing work in the World Trade center elevator shafts before 9/11. In 1999 Turner was bought out by Hochtief company of Germany.
http://www.911blogger.com/node/19889

Looks like a job by Nazis and Muslim Brotherhood... and their sympathizers in the U.S. government and patriot movement. Same story back in 1995, same story in 2001, same story now. Discredit and trash the government in order turn it more police state. Israelis were also involved at least in the respect that they were spying on these operations tagging along behind the operants.. and also allowed themselves to be latched onto by the Far Right as a buffer agaisnt criticism.

Short answer to your question is that Bin Laden was named as suspect number one so fast probably because he was in on the deal from the beginning. Signed and sealed. Paid or rewarded to be a provocateur stooge. Remember that story about the CIA visiting Bin Laden in the hospital before 9/11??? How Bin Laden was allowed to escape at Tora Bora?
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
99. Link to a previous DU discussion on the subject.
Edited on Sat Oct-10-09 12:46 AM by go west young man
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

I watched the MSNBC coverage this past September 11th and also noted it was Andrea Mitchell first reporting for MSNBC that it was the work of Bin Laden.

Here is also an Internet Video Archive link to MSNBC coverage where Andrea Mitchell cites an unnamed high level source and speaks of Bin Laden for the first time on MSNBC. Her interview takes part at the 19:30 mark. Bin Laden is brought up around 20:35 in the video. http://www.archive.org/details/nbc200109110912-0954
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #99
100. Interestingly at the 38:20 mark in the video MSNBC has
Edited on Sat Oct-10-09 02:03 AM by go west young man
Former Head of the FBI James Kallstrom on to add his two cents. He speaks about the perils of living in a free society and speaks of gorups that hate the US. Here's a link to a partial bio on him. http://911review.org/Sept11Wiki/Kallstrom,James.shtml He was instrumental in getting John O'Neill out of his job and reassigned to the WTC. He was also heavily involved in the TWA 800 investigation. Link here: http://911review.org/Wiki/IntoTheBuzzsaw.shtml

Ironically he has managed to implement greater government secrecy as noted in this excerpt from the first link.

Thanks to OBM Watch (who is keeping a list of information removed from government websites) we learned, that on "January 17, 2002, James K. Kallstrom, Director of the Office of Public Security and James G. Natoli, Director of the Office of State Operations in New York, issued a confidential memo to agency heads and commissioners on "agency sensitive information." The memo instructs agencies to review all "sensitive" information held by the agency and what information is made publicly accessible via the Internet, freedom of information, or other ways. Sensitive information should no longer be made available to the public except where specifically required by law. Logs over the past year of who has accessed sensitive information should be made available to the Office of Public Security and the Office of State Operations. All of this was to be accomplished by February 17 and certified by agency heads through a confidential report..."
Source: http://www.ombwatch.org/article/articleview/213/1/1

Finally here's Kallstrom on Fox talking about "updating' security in the US and how Americans need to give up their rights to privacy for the sake of security. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AymSv1nu30
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #99
101. "it was Andrea Mitchell first reporting for MSNBC that it was the work of Bin Laden" -- Bullshit.
Go back and listen to it again. She says only that the best known terrorist organization is that of Osama bin Laden's, not that this was his work.

Please stop making factually inaccurate statements. Thanks.
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #101
102. Grow up Bolo.
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 02:43 AM
Response to Reply #102
103. That's your response? You post factually inaccurate statements...
I prove them wrong, and you say, "Grow up"?

It is not I that inhabit Never Never Land.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 08:38 AM
Response to Reply #103
104. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #104
105. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #104
106. If the "tide is turning"...
when can we expect this?

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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #106
108. The smoking gun is right in front of your eyes if you choose to see it.
It's called Iraq and Afgahanistan and the "wa on Terra". Deductive reasoning will give you your smoking gun. Who has beneffitted the most from the "wa on terra". Follow the money trail and you have your smoking gun. Alas you will only accept the official government smoking gun so mine won't work for you! C'est la vie.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 10:28 PM
Response to Reply #108
109. You don't seem to actually understand what a smoking gun...
is, dude. Maybe you should study "post hoc rationalization".
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-11-09 09:00 AM
Response to Reply #109
112. Read some Conan Doyle dude.
Edited on Sun Oct-11-09 09:03 AM by go west young man
Consequently: GAO deals with protested selection decisions that are not supported with a complete record by looking at the record that remains.
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-11-09 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #112
113. Thanks for a totally incoherent response...
dude.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #103
107. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-10-09 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #107
110. Umm, it wasn't Bolo, dude...
Edited on Sat Oct-10-09 10:34 PM by SDuderstadt
Maybe you should simply follow the rules like the rest of us. If you don't know what they are, I'm sure the moderators would be glad to help, dude.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-11-09 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #110
111. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-11-09 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #111
114. You seem a little upset...
maybe you should take a deep breath and count to 10 or something.
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-11-09 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #101
115. She brings up his name. That's what the Op was looking for.
Thanks for the distraction as usual.
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 12:01 AM
Response to Reply #115
116. But what she said was NOT saying it was his work.
So it is NOT what the OP was looking for at all.

Face it. You spread a little bullshit and you got caught. Admit it and move on.
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #116
117. Ah Bolo!
Edited on Mon Oct-12-09 02:24 PM by go west young man
You say the word bullshit so often. I guess that makes you king of the bullshitters. You don't seem to realize you have done our work for us here. You are reaffirming that Andrea Mitchell brought up Al Qaeda first on MSNBC. That's all the Op was ever looking for. How did they know it was Al Qaeda so quickly. I think I've pulled you off base from your normal distractions. You admit Andrea Mitchell throws out Al Qaeda first here don't you? Wheather it's speculation or not. She has planted a seed. And you have reaffirmed for us all that she raises the specter of Al qaeda. Thank you Bolo. Thank you.
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Bolo Boffin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-12-09 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #117
118. Andrea Mitchell mentioning the name is not evidence of "how they knew it was Al Qaeda so quickly"
It's amazing to me to watch you state otherwise.

Al Qaeda had just blown a hole in the USS Cole eleven months earlier. They had attacked two American embassies a couple of years earlier. Andrea Mitchell mentioning that Osama bin Laden headed the most well known terrorist network at the time of this attack is NOT suspicious at all. And it is NOT evidence that they "knew it was Al Qaeda so quickly."

You need to discover the real world again.
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go west young man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-13-09 11:58 AM
Response to Reply #118
119. Thanks for the confirmation!
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KDLarsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-13-09 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #118
121. Incidently, Danish TV has put their 9/11 news archive up
And guess what, it starts out with the guest (former news correspondent in Washington iirc) talking about how the US had previously attempted to force the Taliban to extradite bin Laden.

The description says that it starts around 3.30 pm (Danish local time, CEST), which would have been 9.30 am EST.
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OnTheOtherHand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-13-09 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #117
120. that isn't even factually accurate
Bolo didn't say anything about whether Andrea Mitchell was first to mention Al Qaeda. I would guess that's because Bolo realizes that he doesn't have perfect knowledge of every media outlet in the world -- never mind every person in the world -- and therefore has no way of knowing who was first.

Now, you originally claimed that "Andrea Mitchell first report{ed} for MSNBC that it was the work of Bin Laden." Unless you're actually going to support that assertion, it's pretty whimsical to credit Bolo for "reaffirming" your perspective.

So, for the moment: no thank you gwym. No thank you.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-13-09 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
122. They knew because they had set up Taliban/Al Qaeda and were financing them . . .!!!
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KDLarsen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-14-09 02:42 AM
Response to Reply #122
123. Not that you have even the slighest evidence of that, right?
Have you learned the difference between the Afghan Mujahideen and bin Laden's Arab group yet?
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SDuderstadt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Oct-16-09 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #122
124. I have a general question for anyone who read D&P's blatherings...
Does anyone take him or her seriously in the slightest?
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