Have we heard the truth about camp Falcon yet? How many deaths?

[wholetruth00]

No one seems to be talking about it. That's why I believe there were many more deaths than reported.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

1. reports of deaths are from a suspicious source

However, not to be discounted until proof of the opposite is shown...

[unhappycamper]

3. I checked four random names from that article

against icasualties.org, and did not find one match. Not one.

[Lithos]

12. The source

Also claims that Hitler should have received the Nobel Prize along with generating many other anti-Semitic screeds including support for the Protocols. The author apparently also is famous for his numerous pseudonyms that he creates whenever his earlier efforts are shown to be forgeries. The office space also is shared with another Willis Carto launched site which is also a well known anti-Semitic revisionist site whose primary author also apparently engages in similar activities.

[The Magistrate]

2. Probably There Was Very Little By Way Of Casualties, Sir

Ammunition storage is arranged with an eye towards the potential for disaster. There are bunkerings and blast walls, and the stuff is located a good distance from where the people are. Sentries on the fence doubtless depart at the first hints of incoming fire. The explosions are certainly spectacular, and the incident was both inconvenient and a great shot in the arm to the people who pulled it off, but that is all.

The stories in circulation are devised as propagandas by the other side in the conflict. Lies are hardly a monopoly of the U.S. government, after all....

[Rageneau]

4. No casualties -- from THAT fire?? Bullshit!

You are assuming that good sense and sound military planning would have been employed at Camp Falcon and that would have prevented any casualties from that awful conflagaration.

That seems to me to be a pretty risky assumption, considering how successful our military endeavors so far have turned out to be. Over and over again we have learned that Rumsfeld's Pentagon has overruled ground commanders for pigheaded, usually political, reasons. Time and again, we have learned how cronyism, not competence, is what counts in this administration's Iraq policies.

To the point where, now, we have to assume that it was just as likely that all that ammunition was left out in the open in an attempt to intimidate Bin Laden by spelling out Arabic insults in 500 pound bombs that would show up in Al Quaeda's satellite photos.

Because somebody thought that would be a good idea.

[yy4me]

5. It seems to have disappeared but I saw this morning,

a list of over 300 names w/rank, unit etc. here on Underground. A post indicated that it would be locked. I cannot seem to find it not so I guess it was removed.

[jberryhill]

13. High level malfeasance is one thing...

But the construction and operation of an ammunition storage facility is not something that Rumsfeld et al. are personally directing.

[The Magistrate]

15. Indeed, Sir

The people who set thgese things up do it by the book, well aware of the number of lives that depend on getting it right.

[madokie]

6. I call bullshit on this, sorry

Ammo depots do not blow up and no one gets hurt. If no one got killed or hurt then it would mean there were no one guarding the stockpiles, it don't happen. No bunker would protect you from this type of explosions. IMHO

[The Magistrate]

14. You May Do So All You Wish, Sir

But you have no ground to stand on as you do.

This was not an instanteous detonation of everything in the place: it was a sequence of sympathetic detonations and "cooking-offs" from heta of fires, that consumed a great deal of time. Sentries on the fence would have been in shelter from the first small detonations, and while the conflagration developed and raged, no one would have gone near the thing.

[tenseconds]

19. "sir"

Your use of "sir" in responding to other posters is degrading. I'm sure there are others here that would agree.

[achtung_circus]

21. I think you should learn the ropes and the posters

and the Mods before a crack like that.

That Magistrate is a DU institution, unfailingly pleasant, polite and reasonable.

How he does it I don't know.

[mirandapriestly]

22. Unfailingly supportive of corporate media information as well...eom

[achtung_circus]

26. Riigght, I forgot. This is the dungeron. Sorry. nt

[mirandapriestly]

41. No, I'm sorry, I forgot how many venerate authority

and those who they perceive are in authority , and ridicule those who don't/aren't , although from your name you seem to consider yourself a rugged individualist living on the razor's edge, lol

[vincent_vega_lives]

39. Note how both ends bring up the "______ media" claim

when you disagree with the content. But link to it willy-nilly when they agree with it. ;)

[vincent_vega_lives]

40. No but NOT BEING THERE would

Note the location of the barracks.



Note the flimsy plastic porta pottys.

http://www.blackanthem.com/News/military200610_1476.shtml

It was definitely crazy to watch. Anyone living near the site was evacuated to a safe location until everything was secure," Schmitt said, speaking about the explosion that sent flames and a rainfall of sparks into the night sky.

Soldiers and base employees were moved immediately to the safety of hardened buildings and structures on the base, Schmitt explained.

[KharmaTrain]

9. You Are Very Correct

If people want to learn about what a munitions explosion can do...research the accident at Port Chicago, California during WWII. That pretty much set a lot of the standards on how munitions are handled and stored...and as you say, with disaster in mind.

It sure was a fine 4th of July show, but that probably was the extent as the moment that stuff started blowing, anyone with half a wit of sense would have gotten their butts away from that confligration. From on commentary I heard, this really wasn't that large of a ammo depo and that there are dozens even hundreds of these munitions stockpiles lying around that have been targets of the insurgents. The only difference with this one is it was close enough to Baghdad that it made some nice flashy TV pictures. Also, the explosions were in the middle of the night...i would hope we wouldn't have too many troops roaming around that ugly country at that hour.

While folks here would love to see this regime embarassed with more carnage and the worse news the better, I'll leave my tin foil hat out of this one.

[wildbilln864]

10. I wonder why we can't get threads categorized correctly?

It seems that this thread has nothing to do with S11! So why is it in the S11 forum thread? This happens alot and is very frustrating to me!
I know this post maybe off topic but then this thread is off the topic of the category. Hmm.

[RedSock]

17. conspiracy

the mods will dump anything that sounds like a conspiracy in the S11 folder.

[wildbilln864]

18. JMO, but...

I wish they'd make a new folder for general conspiracies like those. This is the specific September 11th thread. I wish we got more respect.
Just sayin!


I know there's much more to Sept. 11th than the Bush cabal wants exposed, and I'm pretty sure it would mean jail for a few of them if it was exposed!

[RedSock]

20. i request that

about a year ago, i requested a non-9/11 conspiracy folder (many posters here have also wished there was one) and was told that according to DU rules, you need 10 donors to "sponsor" you.

i posted a thread as per the rules and it was promptly deleted. not locked, but wiped out.

i was told that all conspiracies are going in one folder and one folder only -- and this is it.

[mirandapriestly]

24. That sounds like a conspiracy

Seriously.

[mirandapriestly]

23. well, then everything about the Bush administration

should be in the 9-11 folder.

[quickesst]

25. Kind of funny...

How anything that has happened, or supposedly happened that falls under "conspiracy theory", get's booted down here to the dungeon, but conspiracy theories that have not happened, ie, the October surprise, will they stage a fake terrorist attack to steal the elections, blah, blah, blah, are welcome and are rife in the GD. Double standards are the norm when it comes to these subjects. Just an observation. Thanks.
quickesst

[quicknthedead]

36. Hey, wildbilln864, this Falcon Base question is...

near and dear to our hearts. Those are our guys over there and they are sure on our minds. Any matter regarding their risk or safety is of concern to us.

I know it is to you too.

I am totally against this mal-adventure into Iraq by the criminal Bush cabal, and I say:
SUPPORT OUR TROOPS...BRING THEM HOME NOW!

However, you are also right about S11 getting other threads mixed in, but this is explained by another poster who states this is just the way it is here at DU.

But here is the kicker, my friend...there is a DIRECT CONNECTION BETWEEN 9/11 AND THE WAR IN IRAQ. When you care for your friends and neighbors (as we are "all in this together"), this takes even greater standing in our thoughts.

To me, if Bush et al had not pulled off 9/11, we would not be in Iraq...and I have a good friend over there right now, and his life is also on the line.

So...SUPPORT OUR TROOPS...BRING THEM HOME NOW!
and...NOW IS THE TIME FOR A REAL 9/11 INVESTIGATION, EXCEPT THIS TIME ONE WITH TEETH!

It's good to run into you again here in the threads, bill! Take care!

[rman]

29. We all make mistakes, Sir

I won't hold this one against you.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

7. Good question. And would be interested in the dollar value of the damage

and lost ordinance as well if there were no casualties.

[HamdenRice]

8. Another bullshit notion: Falcon as ammo dump; it wasn't

Another reason I think the MSM story is probably wrong is that they are spinning Camp Falcon now as an ammo dump. It wasn't. It was one of the biggest forward operating bases, that housed and serviced three battalions of soldiers. According to the AP:

The blaze broke out in an ammunition holding area, where material is kept temporarily before distribution to the units at Falcon, said Lt. Col.Jonathan Withington, a spokesman at the base. He said more than three battalions were stationed there at the time of the fire but he would not give a specific number of troops.

Foreign reports, even discounted for exaggeration, cite eyewitnesses saying that army recovery units were hauling out burned and destroyed tanks, humvees and other vehicles.

It's hard for me to believe that tanks could be destroyed by these explosions, but not people.

[Lithos]

11. Camp Falcon also...

Comprised many thousands of acres (several square miles) containing many large buildings and structures including internet cafe's, px's, large scale dining facilities, exercise and training fields and an ammo dump and motor pool capable of servicing the needs of active military troops. This was a permanent facility.

And because it was designed to be a permanent facility the ammo dump which serviced the troops would have been part of the military vehicle pool (hence the tanks/humvees). The ammo would have been likely housed in one or more concrete bunkers sheltered in a way that mishap would NOT cause casualties should there be a mishap.

[The Magistrate]

16. People Do Not Live In The Tanks, Sir

If you cooked off every automobile in a parking lot outside a football game, how many people would be in them?

[HamdenRice]

27. Depends on the size of the explosion in the parking lot, doesn't it?

If it was big enough, say, to collapse part of the stadium near the parking lot, I would expect some casualties.

[vincent_vega_lives]

33. Brilliant answer.

:eyes:

[HamdenRice]

34. Lousy irony and sarcasm nt

[vincent_vega_lives]

32. Hard to belive the tanks were not occupied at the time?

These idiotic accustions come up here from time to time.

[rman]

28. Over 300 American troops :

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2459251

[Flirtus]

30. two hours too late to follow your link

What's Up?

[seemslikeadream]

31. are these videos of Falcon?

just asking :shrug:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ps0v1bIFup4

http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/

[DrDebug]

37. Yep and it is from the mainstream Iraqi television

Before: (The camera is at least ten miles from the source)


Whole screen turns white: (Still looks like a nuke or a comparable WMD given the flash)


That was a big 'un: (A new sun was born)


Mushroom developing:


Yep that's a real mushroom:


No casualties my ass!

[vincent_vega_lives]

38. Its an light enhancing camera

tactical nuke :eyes:

[HamdenRice]

35. I guess Sy Hersh is a bat shit crazy conspiracy theorist as well

for suspecting that the military -- which has openly proclaimed that it is fighting an information war along side the physical war -- might not be telling the truth.

There is a thread on the greatest page stating that Hersh is looking into the ammo explosion story.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2460228

So please, let's hear how Sy Hersh is batshit crazy.