Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Chris Hedges: Israel’s Racist in Chief

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Israel/Palestine Donate to DU
 
marmar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-13-09 05:58 AM
Original message
Chris Hedges: Israel’s Racist in Chief
from Truthdig:



Israel’s Racist in Chief
Posted on Apr 13, 2009

By Chris Hedges


It was unthinkable, when I was based as a correspondent in Jerusalem two decades ago, that an Israeli politician who openly advocated ethnically cleansing the Palestinians from Israeli-controlled territory, as well as forcing Arabs in Israel to take loyalty oaths or be forcibly relocated to the West Bank, could sit on the Cabinet. The racist tirades of Jewish proto-fascists like Meir Kahane stood outside the law, were vigorously condemned by most Israelis and were prosecuted accordingly. Kahane’s repugnant Kach Party, labeled by the United States, Canada and the European Union as a terrorist organization, was outlawed by the Israeli government in 1988 for inciting racism.

Israel has changed. And the racist virus spread by Kahane, whose thugs were charged with the murders and beatings of dozens of unarmed Palestinians and whose members held rallies in Jerusalem where they chanted “Death to Arabs!” has returned to Israel in the figure of Israel’s powerful new foreign minister, Avigdor Lieberman. Lieberman openly calls for an araberrein Israel—an Israel free of Arabs.

Lieberman, a former nightclub bouncer who was a member of the Kach Party, has the personal and political habits of the Islamic goons he opposes. He was found guilty in 2001 of beating a 12-year-old boy and fined by an Israeli court.

There has been a steady decline from the days of the socialist Labor Party, which founded Israel in 1948 and held within its ranks many leaders, such as Yitzhak Rabin, who were serious about peaceful coexistence with the Palestinians. The moral squalor of Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu and Lieberman reflects the country’s degeneration. Labor, like Israel, is a shell of its old self. Lieberman’s Yisrael Beiteinu Party, with 15 seats in the Knesset, is likely to bring down the Netanyahu government the moment his power base is robust enough to move him into the prime minister’s office. He is the new face of the Jewish state.

Lieberman, a former nightclub bouncer who was a member of the Kach Party, has the personal and political habits of the Islamic goons he opposes. He was found guilty in 2001 of beating a 12-year-old boy and fined by an Israeli court. He is being investigated for multimillion-dollar fraud and money laundering and is rumored to have close ties with the Russian mafia. He lives, in defiance of international law, in the Jewish settlement of Nokdim on occupied Palestinian land. ..........(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20090413_israels_ra... /





Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Liberal Democratic discussion forum
   Replies to this thread
  - Mcuhas as I despise Lieberman,  eyl   Apr-14-09 04:56 AM   #1 
  - Lieberman never belonged to Kach  henank   Apr-14-09 06:13 AM   #2 
  - There are allegations  eyl   Apr-14-09 06:40 AM   #3 
  - Kach's former secretary general says different:  Scurrilous   Apr-16-09 07:49 AM   #34 
  - When you step back and look at the big picture, Israel's trajectory has been tragic  HamdenRice   Apr-14-09 07:29 AM   #4 
  - I would dispute your golden view of 1967-76, which could be characterized as Labor's  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 07:41 AM   #6 
     - I think those comments are taken out of context somewhat  HamdenRice   Apr-14-09 07:46 AM   #7 
     - Those comments speak for themselves. And you can't dispute the settlement activity of  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 07:47 AM   #8 
     - The famous cut-and-paste Meir quotes again  oberliner   Apr-14-09 08:22 AM   #9 
     - Oberliner, do you believe those views didn't seriously inform the policy of the state of Israel?  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 08:33 AM   #10 
     - Here are some other Meir quotes that inform the policy of the state of Israel  oberliner   Apr-14-09 09:12 AM   #11 
        - Like my mom always said: talk is cheap. The subsequent settler activity tells the story.  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 09:20 AM   #12 
        - Settlement expansion became official Israeli policy when the Likud party took over in 1977  oberliner   Apr-14-09 09:40 AM   #13 
           - And it all began in 1967... as well you know. nt  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 02:32 PM   #19 
           - Weren't the West Bank and Gaza Strip occupied from 1948-1967?  oberliner   Apr-14-09 04:13 PM   #20 
              - Must we go through this AGAIN?  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 04:33 PM   #22 
                 - I am responding to your statement about it all starting in 1967  oberliner   Apr-14-09 04:45 PM   #23 
                    - No I don't. I think the Allon plan in addition to the settler activity in Jerusalem  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 09:01 PM   #26 
                       - Here are some statistics  oberliner   Apr-15-09 05:42 AM   #27 
                          - I counted 25 settlements established before 1977; among them are the "worst."  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-15-09 06:05 AM   #28 
                             - Wikipedia has the settler population from 1972  oberliner   Apr-15-09 10:08 AM   #31 
           - What about the Nahal?  azurnoir   Apr-14-09 04:49 PM   #24 
        - No-one with any knowledge would try to deny that Meir was intransigent and no dove at all...  Violet_Crumble   Apr-15-09 06:07 AM   #29 
           - Golda Meir, intransigent, no dove at all? Can you please name some Israeli leaders who were doves  shira   Apr-16-09 09:59 AM   #36 
     - Anti-Israelis often revert to false or out of context  Sezu   Apr-14-09 10:04 AM   #14 
     - Clear equivocation on Meir part here. Semantic obfuscation  Malikshah   Apr-14-09 12:29 PM   #16 
        - She has made numerous other remarks on the subject  oberliner   Apr-14-09 04:17 PM   #21 
           - Have you read 'Scars of War Wounds of Peace' by Shlomo Ben-Ami?  Violet_Crumble   Apr-15-09 06:10 AM   #30 
              - Have you read her autobiography "My Life" ?  oberliner   Apr-16-09 05:27 AM   #32 
                 - Is there a chance you'll answer the question I asked you?  Violet_Crumble   Apr-16-09 06:01 AM   #33 
                    - There was no condescension intended  oberliner   Apr-16-09 09:15 AM   #35 
     - Not one of you have touched the point: illegal settlement began in 1967  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 02:28 PM   #18 
        - It may have begun with Chiam Herzog's  azurnoir   Apr-14-09 05:21 PM   #25 
        - Settlements began in 1967 due to Israel winning a defensive war  shira   Apr-16-09 10:12 AM   #37 
  - The salient point remains unchallenged: "acceptable" thinking vis-a-vis Arabs  ProgressiveMuslim   Apr-14-09 07:31 AM   #5 
  - K&R  IndianaGreen   Apr-14-09 11:54 AM   #15 
     - Facts on the ground. n/t  Karenina   Apr-14-09 02:09 PM   #17 
 
eyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 04:56 AM
Response to Original message
1. Mcuhas as I despise Lieberman,
Hedges isn't exactly winning points for honesty - unless he's changed it recently, Lieberman's proposal isn't to "ethnically cleansing the Palestinians from Israeli-controlled territory", but rather to redraw the borders so Arab-majority areas are outside of Israel
(actually reducing Israeli territory in the process) - a twist of the two-state solution (albeit IMHO an unacceptable one for a numebr of reasons)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
henank Donating Member (755 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 06:13 AM
Response to Original message
2. Lieberman never belonged to Kach
amongst other lies in this ranting piece of propaganda masquerading as news.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 06:40 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. There are allegations
that he was biefly a member. OTOH, the Kachnik's aren't exactly happy with him.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Scurrilous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-16-09 07:49 AM
Response to Reply #2
34.  Kach's former secretary general says different:
Haaretz exclusive: Avigdor Lieberman was member of outlawed radical Kach movement

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 07:29 AM
Response to Original message
4. When you step back and look at the big picture, Israel's trajectory has been tragic
and I don't think you can blame the Palestinians or Arabs for it. Mostly the blame lies with an increasingly venal, cynical and extremist political leadership.

Back in the 1960s, before the 1967 war, and pretty much from 1948 to 1967, Israel considered itself a developing, third world, socialist. It was self-reliant and tried to pursue morally upstanding policies. It was friendly with many other developing and third world countries. The exigencies of development and hostile neighbors meant that successive Labor governments, marshaling scarce resources, was incorruptible.

Even after 1967, I remember as a kid reading about Israeli politicians' helpful and generally benign relations with the Palestinian mayors of West Bank cities, towns and villages, who were allowed a significant amount of self governance.

How did it become this corrupt, militarized, cynical government that sees its future mainly through the lens of dependence on the US, led by the likes of Netanyahu and Lieberman?

It's sad that the ideals of Labor simply don't appeal to Israelis anymore.





Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 07:41 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. I would dispute your golden view of 1967-76, which could be characterized as Labor's
"no such thing as a Palestinian people" years...

There were no such thing as Palestinians. When was there an independent Palestinian people with a Palestinian state? It was either southern Syria before the First World War, and then it was a Palestine including Jordan. It was not as though there was a Palestinian people in Palestine considering itself as a Palestinian people and we came and threw them out and took their country away from them. They did not exist.
-- Golda Meir, statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.


"How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to."
-- Golda Meir, March 8, 1969.

The issue of the ongoing and purposeful deprivation of human and political rights for the occupied people of Palestine began in 1967, under the labor party, not in 1978 or 1996 or with the election of Ariel Sharon.

The ongoing violent military occupation of Palestine isn't a Likud achievement but a Zionist achievement. All major political parties have had a strong hand in the exponential expansion of settlements, INCLUDING LABOR!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
HamdenRice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 07:46 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. I think those comments are taken out of context somewhat
The point that those Labor politicians were making wasn't that the West Bank was some kind of tabula rasa without people; it was that the proper party to negotiate a land for peace deal was King Hussein and Jordan, not the PLO.

Jordan itself did not cede all its claims to the West Bank until 1988, recognizing the PLO as the legitimate representative of the Palestinian people.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 07:47 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Those comments speak for themselves. And you can't dispute the settlement activity of
that period.

The halcyon days you allude to are fiction.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 08:22 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. The famous cut-and-paste Meir quotes again
Edited on Tue Apr-14-09 08:26 AM by oberliner
The "nobody to return them to" quote was in reference to the fact that the Arab states refused at the time to engage in any negotiations with Israel after the 1967 War. You, of course, will recall the famous "3 No's" connected with the Khartoum Declaration. No peace with Israel, no negotiations with Israel, no recognition of Israel. It was unclear exaclty with whom to negotiate at that point - Jordan, Egypt, Syria, etc. The PLO was only first formed in 1969.

The other quote you cited is one that Meir elaborated on in an interview with the NY Times, saying the following:

To be misquoted is an occupational hazard of political leadership; for this reason I should like to clarify my position in regard to the Palestinian issue. I have been charged with being rigidly insensitive to the question of the Palestinian Arabs. In evidence of this I am supposed to have said, ‘There are no Palestinians.’ My actual words were: ‘There is no Palestine people. There are Palestinian refugees.’ The distinction is not semantic. My statement was based on a lifetime of debates with Arab nationalists who vehemently excluded a separatist Palestinian Arab nationalism from their formulations.

<end of citation>

You are no doubt aware of the popularity of the pan-Arab movement during that time and the attempts unify the countries of the Arab world into a single national entity.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Oberliner, do you believe those views didn't seriously inform the policy of the state of Israel?
Oberliner, I could list 100 quotes of Israeli leaders that dehumanize and delegitimize Palestinians and their national aspirations.

My point, which is unchallenged, is that those early years of the occupation under labor were not years we can look back on fondly. That is pure fiction.

Do you dispute that?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 09:12 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. Here are some other Meir quotes that inform the policy of the state of Israel
If you are going to make claims about Golda Meir or Israeli policy based on those selective quotations allow me to share with you some of her other quotations.

The aspiration to peace is not only the central plank in our platform, it is the cornerstone of our pioneering life and labour. Ever since renewal of independence, we have based all our undertakings of settlement and creativity on the fundamental credo that we did not come to dispossess the Arabs of the Land but to work together with them in peace and prosperity, for the good of all.


Can we, from now on--all of us--turn over a new leaf, and, instead of fighting with each other, can we all, united, fight poverty and disease and illiteracy? Is it possible for us to put all our efforts and all our energy into one single purpose, the betterment and progress and development of all our lands and all our peoples? I can here pledge the Government and the people of Israel to do their part in this united effort. There is no limit to what we are prepared to contribute so that all of us, together, can live to see a day of happiness for our peoples and see again a great contribution from our region to peace and happiness for all humanity.

Our region is now at a crossroads: let us sit down together, not as victors and conquered, but as equals; let us negotiate, let us determine secure and agreed boundaries, let us write a new page of peace, goodneighbourliness and cooperation for the profit of all the nations of the Middle East.

* On 8 November 1968, Foreign Minister Abba Eban presented to the General Assembly of the United Nations a detailed peace programme in nine clauses:

- The establishment of a just and lasting peace;

- The determination of secure and recognized borders;

- Security agreements, including non-aggression pacts;

- Borders open to travel and trade;

- Freedom of navigation in international waterways;

- A solution to the refugee problem through a conference of representatives of the countries of the Middle East, the countries contributing to refugee upkeep, and the United Nations Specialized Agencies to draw up a five-year plan; the conference could be convened even before general peace negotiations began;

- The Holy Places of Christianity and Islam in Jerusalem to be placed under the responsibility of the respective faiths, with the aim of formulating agreements which will give force to their universal character;

- Mutual recognition of sovereignty;

- Regional cooperation in development projects for the good of the whole region.

To attain peace, I am ready to go at any hour to any place, to meet any authorized leader of any Arab State--to conduct negotiations with mutual respect, in parity and without pre-conditions, and with a clear recognition that the problems under controversy can be solved.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. Like my mom always said: talk is cheap. The subsequent settler activity tells the story.
Edited on Tue Apr-14-09 09:22 AM by ProgressiveMuslim
Just like today. Bibi Netanyahu talks peace, while appointing Lieberman...

Israel has a long history of saying the words of peace, while doing whatever the hell is pleases on the ground.

As I said, I used those quotes as a stupid heading.

Please address the substance of my post, which is that 67-76 were not golden days to be remembered nostalgically.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Settlement expansion became official Israeli policy when the Likud party took over in 1977
It was then that the settlement numbers really started to explode.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. And it all began in 1967... as well you know. nt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Weren't the West Bank and Gaza Strip occupied from 1948-1967?
What are your thoughts on that time period?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. Must we go through this AGAIN?
Edited on Tue Apr-14-09 04:35 PM by ProgressiveMuslim
Can we just accept that we each have a different view of the history of this conflict? I know you want to paint the Isarelis as no worse than the Jordanians or Egyptians. I beg to differ, as neither of those countries established permanent settlements or stole land.

Believe as you wish. I know I won't change your views.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 04:45 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. I am responding to your statement about it all starting in 1967
You had scoffed at the notion of 1967-1976 being "halcyon days" but I would argue that, while they were not necessary halcyon, they were not especially worse than the 1949-1967 period and that the 1977 Likud elections marked a significant turning point.

Do you believe the period between 1967-1976 was significantly worse than the period between 1949-1967 for the Palestinians living in the West Bank and Gaza?

Don't you think it was the Likud government which took over in 1977 that led to a major policy shift in the occupied territories?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 09:01 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. No I don't. I think the Allon plan in addition to the settler activity in Jerusalem
disqualify that period as being anything to remember fondly.

Do you have stats for numbers of settlers for that period?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-15-09 05:42 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. Here are some statistics
http://www.fmep.org/settlement_info/settlement-info-and...

Almost all of the activity is from after Likud came into power into 1977.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-15-09 06:05 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. I counted 25 settlements established before 1977; among them are the "worst."
None of those show settler population year by year, which is what I am really looking for.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-15-09 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #28
31. Wikipedia has the settler population from 1972
Which you can compare to the settler population ten years later.

Don't know how reliable their info is though.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
azurnoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. What about the Nahal?
Edited on Tue Apr-14-09 04:49 PM by azurnoir
Nahal" is the Hebrew acronym for "Noar Halutzi Lohem"- Fighting Pioneer Youth-a military cadre unique to Israel. It is a framework which combines military service in a combat unit with civilian service in a newly founded kibbutz or moshav (collective and semi­collective settlements).

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Society_&_C...

they were settling the west bank long before 1977
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Violet_Crumble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-15-09 06:07 AM
Response to Reply #11
29. No-one with any knowledge would try to deny that Meir was intransigent and no dove at all...
Why would you trot out quotes with no context and no references as to where they came from in order to argue otherwise?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shira Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-16-09 09:59 AM
Response to Reply #29
36. Golda Meir, intransigent, no dove at all? Can you please name some Israeli leaders who were doves
and not intransigent before the 1980's? Maybe you don't believe there were any?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Sezu Donating Member (920 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 10:04 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Anti-Israelis often revert to false or out of context
quotes to further their propaganda. Hopefully PM was simply duped by something she read somewhere.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Malikshah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. Clear equivocation on Meir part here. Semantic obfuscation
Edited on Tue Apr-14-09 12:30 PM by Malikshah
at its best. Heaven forbid we have quotes regarding Arafat, etc....or how about quotes from Ahmadinejad...hmmmm

Sorry folks--obfuscation is obvious and tiresome.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 04:17 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. She has made numerous other remarks on the subject
I think it is ridiculous to extrapolate her views from this one quote that gets cut-and-pasted all over the place as "evidence" of her "true feelings" about Palestinians.

Similarly, I think it is ridiculous to do the same for the President of Iran vis-a-vis the "wiped off the map/vanish from the pages of time" line.

Anyone who wants to get a true sense of the views of either of those two figures would have plenty of actual speeches and interviews to peruse if they so chose.

The cut-and-paste quote lists that populate the internet are less than helpful.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Violet_Crumble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-15-09 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #21
30. Have you read 'Scars of War Wounds of Peace' by Shlomo Ben-Ami?
That and other books give a very good indication that she was in no way a peace-seeking dove. btw, no matter how you try to excuse away what she said about the Palestinian people, it was a nasty statement from her that pretty much was in keeping with most of her other views on the Middle East...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-16-09 05:27 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. Have you read her autobiography "My Life" ?
If you want to find out what her views on the Middle East were you ought to check it out, if you have not already. She wrote it in 1975 I believe.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Violet_Crumble Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-16-09 06:01 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. Is there a chance you'll answer the question I asked you?
I know what her views were on the Middle East, which is why I'm objecting to yr attempts to portray her as some sort of dove, but thanks for the condescending book recommendation...
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
oberliner Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-16-09 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #33
35. There was no condescension intended
I think it's a great book to learn about her POV during that time period. I'm not sure why you would respond to my suggestion the way that you did. The book is quite revealing and actually presents a rather complex picture of the woman.

I've read the book you mentioned. Much of it is available on Google Books for free for those who are interested. He definitively presents Meir in a negative light, calling her a "self-righteous, intransigent, stubborn iron-lady."

I would urge you again (and without condescension) to take a look at her autobiography to read her own views in her own words if this is something that you are interested in.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. Not one of you have touched the point: illegal settlement began in 1967
and continued under every gov't since them: Labor, Likud, national unity or Kadima.

Settlement in Israel is not the domain of right-wingers. It's a function of Zionism.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
azurnoir Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #18
25. It may have begun with Chiam Herzog's
Edited on Tue Apr-14-09 05:22 PM by azurnoir
destruction of the largely Muslim "Moroccan Quarter" because of it's proximity to the Kotel

"When on June 7, 1967, Israel seized the Old City during the Six Day War, they found that a third of the Jewish Quarter's buildings had been demolished by the Jordanians.<6> Three days later, on the evening of June 10, the 650 inhabitants of the Moroccan Quarter were told to vacate their homes on a few hours notice. Workers under the guard of soldiers then proceeded to demolish the quarter, consisting of 135 houses, the al-Buraq mosque, the Bou Medyan zaouia and other sites, with the exception of a mosque and a zaouia which were demolished two years later. According to Etan Ben Moshe, the officer in charge, several persons died following their refusal to leave their homes; one woman from the quarter who did not hear the calls to vacate was buried beneath the rubble, her body found the next morning under the ruins of her home.<5><7> In the following days all of the Palestinian Arab inhabitants of the Jewish Quarter were also evicted.<8>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mughrabi_Quarter
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
shira Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-16-09 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #18
37. Settlements began in 1967 due to Israel winning a defensive war
Edited on Thu Apr-16-09 10:14 AM by shira
Had there been no Arab aggression in 1967, there would be no settlements now. It's ridiculous to assert that settlements are a function of "Zionism".

By making such a statement, it appears your goal is to delegitimize Zionism as a whole, and therefore delegitimize Israel as a state.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ProgressiveMuslim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 07:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. The salient point remains unchallenged: "acceptable" thinking vis-a-vis Arabs
has shifted hugely in the past 2 decades.

Surely neither of you dispute that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 11:54 AM
Response to Original message
15. K&R
It is the ideology that drives the building and expansion of Jewish settlements on the West Bank, East Jerusalem, that is racist. Lieberman is merely a mouthpiece for a racism that permeates Israeli society.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Karenina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-14-09 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. Facts on the ground. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Jun 19th 2013, 09:39 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Israel/Palestine Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC