Iran: Holocaust is big lie

[oberliner]

Iran's government spokesman on Tuesday branded the Holocaust a "big lie" created to place the Islamic republic's arch-foe Israel in the Middle East, the state IRNA news agency reported.

"The Holocaust is a concept coming from a big lie in order to settle a rootless regime in the heart of the Islamic world," Gholam Hossein Elham told a conference on Gaza in central Iran's religious city of Qom.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3662696,00.html

And there is this story from the Iranian News Agency:

Reformist: Holocaust believers main accomplice in Israeli crimes

Tehran, Jan 27, IRNA -- A reformist figure dealing with the issue of Holocaust has said that those believing in Holocaust are the main accomplice of Israel and are the enemies of truth.

Holocaust denier Dr Fredrick Toben said at a press conference that Holocaust is a big lie.

"All western rulers know that if the falsehood of Holocaust is proved, Israel's very existence will be at stake. They know that if the issue is raised, they will no longer be able to use Holocaust as a powerful weapon against Palestine. Today, anybody in the so-called western democratic world supporting Holocaust, is Israel's accomplice in Holocaust and the genocide of the Palestinians," said Toben.

http://www5.irna.ir/En/View/FullStory/?NewsId=323087&idLanguage=3

[Idealism]

1. Don't people have anything better to do?

[bif]

2. Well isn't that a nice way to start a dialog with the U.S.

They're fucking nuts.

[cali]

3. ooh, and on Holocaust Memorial Day too.

An accident, I'm sure. And Toban is a real cretin.

[nichomachus]

4. Things haven't been quite right in Iran since

the US overthrew their democratically elected government. Imagine if we had let democracy flourish, instead of installing a fascist regime.

[oberliner]

5. Didn't the Iranians overthrow the US installed facist regime?

Haven't they been free of the Shah for some time now?

[Howardx]

7. mossadegh

Mohammad Mosaddeq ( Mossadeq (help·info)) (Persian: محمد مصدق‎ , pronounced , also Mosaddegh or Mossadegh) (19 May 1882 – 5 March 1967) was a major figure in modern Iranian history who served as the Prime Minister of Iran <1> <2> from 1951 to 1953 when he was removed from power by a coup d'état. From an aristocratic background, Mosaddeq was an author, administrator, lawyer, prominent parliamentarian, and statesman, famous for his passionate opposition to foreign intervention in Iran. He is most famous as the architect of the nationalization of the Iranian oil industry,<3> which had been under British control through the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company (AIOC), (later British Petroleum or BP), and which is thought by many to be the reason for his deposition.

Mosaddeq was removed from power on 19 August 1953, in a coup d'état, supported and funded by the British and U.S. governments and led by General Fazlollah Zahedi. <4> The American operation came to be known as Operation Ajax in America, <5> after its CIA cryptonym, and as the "28 Mordad 1332" coup in Iran, after its date on the Iranian calendar. <6> Mosaddeq was imprisoned for three years and subsequently put under house arrest until his death.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Mosaddeq

[oberliner]

10. Right - then after that, the Iranians overthrew the Shah in 1979

The Iranian Revolution was the revolution that transformed Iran from a constitutional monarchy under Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi to an Islamic republic under Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, the leader of the revolution and founder of the Islamic Republic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_Revolution

[ProgressiveMuslim]

17. "constitutional monarchy" -- that's a nice euphemism for what Iran was under the Shah!

[oberliner]

20. Go edit it!

It's Wikipedia after all - knock yourself out!

[nichomachus]

23. Yes, and the theocrats installed another fascist regime to replace the Shah

[cali]

6. yep.

that is so true.

[GoesTo11]

9. Do the Iranian people think the current government is right?

If not, why don't they overthrow it?

[nichomachus]

24. Probably for the same reason

we put up with the Bush regime for eight years

[GoesTo11]

27. Lazy and gutless?

[nichomachus]

38. Probably a bit more complex than that

in both cases

[LeftishBrit]

11. Very true. But other places (e.g. Chile) eventually got rid of such regimes in favour of more

progressive democratic states, instead of something at least as far-RW, only in a different way.

Maybe Iran will eventually do so too.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

16. Sometimes progressives are so suppressed by those the US backs

that it takes a loooooong time to recoup.

I hate to say it, but often, the last opposition to US installed dictators seems to be religious fundies.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

15. Damn, makes one wonder what the world would look like if the West didn't

behave with regard for ONLY its own interests?

[Vegasaurus]

18. Always blaming everything on "western" imperialism

Maybe this is just what they believe.

Seems that way.

[oberliner]

22. Brutal and violent like it is currently

There was plenty of violent conflict and brutality going on all over the world before any contact was made with the West.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

26. Western imperialism imposed a unique kind of tyranny on Africa and

the Middle East, with horrible consequences.

Even you can agree with that.

[oberliner]

28. Brutality, violence, and slavery existed in Africa before Western imperialism

These attributes are not unique to the West.

Surely even you would not dispute that.

[Vegasaurus]

34. Agreed, and the present factional conflicts (and bloodbaths)

in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Gaza/WB, as well as the genocides in the Sudan, Rwanda, etc cannot be blamed on the West.

There would be this in-fighting no matter what the US, members of the EU or Israel did.

Part of growing up is taking responsibility for actions, and this Arab on Arab or Muslim on Muslim violence is not the fault of imperialism.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

36. I'm thinking more about how the colonized world was prevented from developing

and growing through the 1800s and early 1900s. So much growth and change and the colonized world was locked in the cellar so to speak.

Why all the denials, Oberliner? Why are you trying to minimize this? What does this defensiveness come from?

[oberliner]

39. Nobody is denying anything

Obviously European colonialization was horrific, brutal, and massively destructive.

I just think it is insulting to present pre-colonial Africa as some kind of utopian society of peace and tranquility. It was certainly not that.

[DonCoquixote]

30. True, however

That does not make Holocaust deniers any less vile, or more noteworthy.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

37. The urge to minimize/deny/excuse is certainly not unique to the Holocaust.

[cali]

41. huh? is it that hard for you to

actually say that holocaust denial is vile? your response had nothing to do with the comment you were responding to. It appears you're always trying to rationalize and equivocate when it comes to something like this.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

42. Really? how so?

I see much denial going on here and observe that it is not uncommon for humans to engage in that behavior.

Are you accusing me of denying the Holocaust?

[Shaktimaan]

31. I guess we could imagine...

but that's all it would be. There's no way of knowing what would have happened had the US not gotten involved. I suppose that's obvious, and it isn't meant to be an excuse for US intervention, or anything, either.

It's just that, realistically, there's no reason to think that Iran would have become some kind of democratic utopia by now if only we hadn't intervened. But even if there was, hindsight is always 20/20. It's impossible to tell what our actions will ultimately result in, regardless of our intentions at the time. Iran is actually a perfect example of that truth. I mean really, who could have anticipated...?

[GoesTo11]

43. The Shah is a big lie

There was never any Shah, this is just a lie that Iran's rulers use to justify their reign.

[oberliner]

44. Have you seen this?

http://www.revisionism.nl/Moon/The-Mad-Revisionist.htm

Pretty amusing.

[LeftishBrit]

8. Ugh. Wasn't Toben one of the participants at that disgusting conference in Iran in 2006?

He and his 'Adelaide Institute' are just revolting.

[oberliner]

12. Yes I believe he was - along with America's own David Duke

Shameful.

[Vegasaurus]

13. He has lots of company

Even the "moderate" Abbas wrote a dissertation denying the Holocaust.

This is the mainstream view, even among Arab/Muslim moderates.

[ProgressiveMuslim]

14. Fredrick Toben is Iranian???

[cali]

19. He's Australian, and a useful tool

[oberliner]

21. Gholam Hossein Elham is Iranian

Two separate stories posted - sorry for any confusion.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

25. Careful, we must be culturally sensitive and not offend the august dignity of the Ayatollahs

even when they spout total crap.

Toben is a known quantity and an oxygen thief.

[oberliner]

29. Ahmadinejad: Breaking lock on Holocaust box would kill Zionist regime

At Tuesday's conference he said in a message read out by the government spokesman that "the illegitimate Zionist regime is one of the consequences of the Holocaust," state broadcaster IRIB reported on its website.

"Breaking the lock on the Holocaust box and opening it is tantamount to cutting the Zionist regime's life jugular and the bulk of the philosophy would collapse," said his message to the conference at Sharif Technical University.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1059329.html

[cali]

32. perhaps this is OT but I find the denial that

Ahmadinejad means Israel- not the Israeli government- when he refers to the Zionist Regime, really curious.

[oberliner]

33. I share your feelings on that subject nt

[rockymountaindem]

40. How come?

It's obvious he is against the entire concept of Israel existing as a state.

[Adsos Letter]

35. Brilliant!

Way to go Iran...this is really helpful in convincing the west that you have any real interest in peace in the region. :eyes: