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zonmoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-21-09 09:13 PM
Original message
Israel's disconnect
The call came at 8pm, in unaccented Arabic, to a foreign resident of the seafront neighbourhood of Ain Mreisse, on the other side of the city from the Hezbollah-controlled southern suburbs of Beirut. The voice was friendly, even though the words were not. "Beware of Hezbollah," it said. "Beware of Hamas. Think of yourselves. Don't give your support to these groups. You know what the results would be." And then it signed off, in case the listener had any doubt. "This is the State of Israel!"

We do indeed know what the results would be. In 2006, more than 1,000 people died in Lebanon, the vast majority of them civilians, when Israel launched air and artillery attacks against targets including Beirut airport, bridges and highways, and established an air, land and sea blockade following Hezbollah's capture of two Israeli soldiers from the Israeli side of the border. War crimes were committed and there has been no accountability, making the next war that much easier. In Gaza so far, more than 1,200 Palestinians have died (and 13 Israelis), the vast majority of whom were non-combatants. A quarter were children, straining even Israel's definition of "terrorist" as, according to its own experts, it expands the definition of "legitimate target" and, in so doing, narrows the definition of "collateral damage".

As jurist Amos Guiora, who served as a military lawyer in Israel for 19 years, has said: "Israel declared war on an organisation, and by extension on all those involved in that organization active and passive alike. (The italics are mine.) This is how Operation Cast Lead is different from all previous Israeli operations."

Senior IDF officers have already warned that the "third Lebanon war" will be in the same vein: more "disproportionate" than the second was. A heavily rearmed Hezbollah will not be the main target. Maj Gen Giora Eiland, former head of the National Security Council, has gone as far as to say that Israel failed in 2006 because it fought the wrong enemy Hezbollah rather than Lebanon itself. "The only good thing that happened in the last war was the relative damage caused to Lebanon's population," he said. "The destruction of thousands of homes of 'innocents' preserved some of Israel's deterrent power. The only way to prevent another war is to make it clear that should one break out, Lebanon may be razed to the ground."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2009/jan/19/mid...
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 12:10 AM
Response to Original message
1. So this post has been up for a couple of hours now...
Where's the usual crowd of people flinging themselves forward to say Israel can do no wrong, is always innocent, and would never ever hurt anyone who wasn't a danger to it?
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shira Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 05:13 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. pretty hard to take seriously
Edited on Thu Jan-22-09 05:21 AM by shira
when the author claims the vast majority of those killed in Lebanon 2006 were civilians. She claims the same now in the Gaza war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_Lebanon_War#Hezbollah

There's no point for me to continue reading when I see Hezbollah/Hamas propaganda like that.

Now that you asked, why haven't you yet responded in this thread to the latest facts that refute your allegations:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 04:48 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Because Shita, every time I beat your "facts" to a jelly-like pulp...
You simply change the terms you use and present the exact same argument again. While I admire tenacity, I do get bored with repeating myself against your defeated-but-rehashed arguments.

And did you just give me a link that says Lebanese estimates put the civilian death toll at 1,123 and the Hezbollah death toll at 600 (Israeli estimate, and we know they're fucking flawless, after all) as evidence that the majority of those killed weren't civilians?
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zonmoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 09:48 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. Looks like except for one fellow that responded to you they are all hiding from
the consequenses of working for their criminal master.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 10:04 AM
Response to Original message
4. How does this not garner any response?
"The only good thing that happened in the last war was the relative damage caused to Lebanon's population," he said. "The destruction of thousands of homes of 'innocents' preserved some of Israel's deterrent power. The only way to prevent another war is to make it clear that should one break out, Lebanon may be razed to the ground."


Wow.
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DogPoundPup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. If Israel ignores the U.N. laws and regulations, then shouldn't the world ignore the U.N. laws
that created Israel?

Just asking...I think it is something to seriously be considered.















:rofl: AS IF, Huh?
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Israel declared it's independance before the UN resolution came into effect.
Just saying. I have to agree with them in a way, true sovereignty is taken, not given.
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DogPoundPup Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. I see, a long history of TAKING but not too proud to be GIVEN U.S. welfare
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-22-09 10:31 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. But they aren't really sovereign now, they are very much dependent.
This is obvious. In the end autonomy is not something you say, it's something you do.

I was just pointing out that Israel will not acknowledge any debt to the UN for it's creation.
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