Weekly report on Israeli human rights violations

[newyorican]

Full Title: Weekly report on Israeli human rights violations in the Occupied Palestinian Territories 27 Oct - 9 Nov 2005

• 18 Palestinians, including 5 children, were killed by IOF.
  
  
• 9 of the victims were extra-judicially executed by IOF in the northern Gaza Strip.
  
  
• 58 Palestinian civilians, including 5 children, were wounded by IOF.
  
  
• IOF launched 21 aerial attacks on civilian targets in the Gaza Strip.
  
  
• IOF conducted 63 incursions into Palestinian communities in the West Bank.
  
  
• Houses were raided and 108 Palestinian civilians, including 10 children, were arrested by IOF.
  
  
• 17 houses were transformed by IOF into military sites.
  
  
• IOF have continued to impose a total siege on the OPT; they have closed all border crossings of the Gaza Strip; they expanded Za'tara checkpoint to separate the north of the West Bank from other areas; and they arrested 16 Palestinian civilians, including two children, at various checkpoints in the West Bank.
  
  
• IOF have continued to construct the Annexation Wall in the West Bank.
  
  
• Israeli settlers have continued to attack Palestinian civilians and property in the OPT; 5 Palestinian civilians, including 3 children, were injured; and 8 houses were damaged.
  

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Hmmm...18 dead including 5 children. I know someone who thinks this is another "step in the right direction".

[PDJane]

1. Israel

Was born in terrorism, has institutionalized repression.....and yes, terrorism......against the Palestinians. I cannot support what they have done and are doing.

[Jim Sagle]

2. Israel RRRRRAWWWWKSSSSS!!!!!

:beer:

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lithos]

5. It was a period of terrorism and strife

Israel or a Palestinian state would have been born in such an environment. This was a time of awakening nationalism by both the Israeli's, but also the Palestinians. Israel did many things in the name of the state which were far from honorable. So did the Palestinians.

Morality and the laws of war are the first things to go in these types of conflicts.

While I believe that while Israel did the majority of such acts up thru the end of hostilities in 1948, I feel that had Israel lost, we would be talking about the horrible events that would have been enacted upon those in the Yeshiva.

Israel and the Nakba were ultimately the products of very near-sighted British diplomacy and governance of the Palestine Mandate. If you want to blame anyone, then blame them. But, realize that by 1936, the die was pretty much cast as to what was going to happen. The events of WWII just insured that the Israeli's would be the winners.

[Colorado Blue]

9. Some links from Wikipedia, which might explain things a

little better. It is a complex and difficult situation, one that had its genesis in a terribly violent time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jew
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_refugees
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_Mandate
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisemitism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_antisemitism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_terrorism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haj_Amin_Al-Husseini
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Israeli_conflict

[Englander]

10. That's a very interesting list, CB.

Noticeable by their absence, are any specific mention of, say, Irgun,
or the Stern Gang, or Plan D, &tc. Allow me to attempt to provide some
balance;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irgun
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stern_Gang
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haganah
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palmach
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Irgun_attacks_during_the_1930s
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avraham_Stern
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Mandate_of_Palestine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plan_Dalet
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Arab-Israeli_war
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_villages_depopulated_during_the_1948_Arab-Israeli_war

:)

[newyorican]

11. Another site...

in the interest of balance.

www.israelipalestinianprocon.org

[Englander]

12. Thanks for that, I've bookmarked it. n/t

[Colorado Blue]

15. This is interesting also. nt

[Colorado Blue]

14. These articles get better all the time, folks. Especially the

sections about the Arab-Israeli conflict. The proPalestinian point of view is clearly indicated.

I think that balance is fine but no amount of balance will change the facts of Jewish history, which is what I'm challenging in the comment by the poster to whom I responded.

Irgun, Stern Gang, etc, are all mentioned in the articles.

[Englander]

17. No they're not.

--Irgun, Stern Gang, etc, are all mentioned in the articles.--

There wasn't a single mention of Irgun, &tc in any of the Wiki
articles you listed. 'Militant groups', or 'militias' are mentioned,
but there was not a specific mention, by name, of Irgun &tc.

On edit;

My mistake. There's *one* instance, in the al-Husseini article.

[Colorado Blue]

20. I thought the Irgun was mentioned in the articles about Israel,

and the Palestine Mandate, but I was mistaken.

"Militant groups" and their activities were mentioned, but not specifically Irgun.

In any case, my goal was to present some history that would balance the posters' opinion that Israel was the sole guilty party.

Obviously, the poster already knows about the Irgun and believes this characterizes Israeli culture and history, when in fact it does not.

[Englander]

27. It's certainly a *part* of Israeli culture & history -

that's one aspect of Begin's & Shamir's & others gift to their
beloved country, the undeniable historical *fact* that, 'terrorism'
was a factor in the creation of Israel. Those 'terrorists' became
great, & famous Israelis, & that is part of Isreali history, which is
an unescapable *fact*. I'm sure I could easily find quite a few egs
of Irgun &tc being celebrated, a topical eg is the ongoing Livnat
scandal.

[pelsar]

31. can you?

I'm sure I could easily find quite a few egs
of Irgun &tc being celebrated,

that would actually be interesting....if there are any terrrorist acts (the targeting of civilians) and the celebration by the israeli zionist enterprise as a whole celebrating it....it would surpise me...so go for it.


as far as the street names, stamps etc. thats pretty much standard for all countries after their independance, israel being no different.....so i would say if its a worldwide standard it becomes a mute point

I've been looking and cant really find much in terms of the irgun targeting civilians (dir yassin being the infamous one)....if they didnt I would say it makes it rather difficult to compare them to the jihadnikim which are looking to kill women and children eating in resturants.

or are we doing the "higher standard thing" here as well?

[eyl]

32. There were some others

prior to Dir Yassin *which was one of the last, actually), but there certainly weren't mass celebrations by the Yishuv after those attacks; on the contrary (see the Saizon, for instance).

[Englander]

34. No-one's suggesting that there were -

No-one's suggesting that there were 'mass celebrations', I've made
clear what my intended meaning was, pelsar's indulging in some
'creative reading', ie apparently misrepresenting my stated opinion.
I'm talking about the present day, about the glorifying of Irgun &tc
that's a part of contemporary Israeli culture.

[Englander]

33. lol.

Read the *whole*sentence*. I'm defining 'celebrate' in this instance
as meaning 'commemorate', 'honour', & to 'observe an anniversary ', all
of which I've provided, if you look in this thread, & others.

No, you're completely wrong in saying that Irgun &tc didn't target
civilians, they bombed, & exploded landmines, in marketplaces, cinemas,
trains, train-stations, & Post Offices, &tc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Irgun_attacks_during_the_1930s

[Englander]

35. From everybodys' bestest buddy, Benny Morris;

'NOVEMBER 7, 2003
Hijacking History
The Israeli Right Sets Out To Magnify Its Role in History and the Creation of the Jewish State

>snip

Golan hagiographically reviews the careers of such men as Ze'ev Jabotinsky, the founder of the Revisionist stream of Zionism, and Avraham Stern, the founder of the Lehi, and focuses on the particular stories of individual fighters/terrorists, such as Eliahu Hakim and Eliahu Bet Zuri, who assassinated British Minister Resident in the Middle East Lord Moyne in November 1944, not knowing — like Golan himself — that Moyne was by this stage a supporter of a Jewish state. The murder greatly angered Moyne's close friend, Prime Minister Winston Churchill and may thus have contributed significantly to the deferment of Jewish statehood.

One may or may not view the Irgun and Lehi policy of attacks on British Mandate personnel from 1944 through 1948 as a legitimate means of evicting a foreign occupier. But Golan completely fails to describe the dark side of the Irgun's (and, to a lesser degree, Lehi's) activities vis-à-vis the Arabs — the mass indiscriminate murder of civilians in retaliation for Arab attacks on Jews during the 1936-39 Arab Revolt and the start of the 1948 war. These bombings preceded, and resemble nothing so much as, the contemporary Hamas-Islamic Jihad-Tanzim bombings of Israel's buses and markets (which the Arabs contend are in reprisal for Israel's oppressive occupation and specific attacks on Arabs by Israeli troops). In one obtuse, deliberately obfuscating reference to the Irgun bombings in 1937 through 1938, Golan writes of the "planned retaliatory bombings in areas used as rendezvous by the Arab gangs." Later, he briefly mentions the repeated Irgun bombing of the Haifa market (which he claims, without offering any proof, deterred further Arab attacks on Jews in Haifa), without giving the reader any sense of the mayhem and fatalities caused, as he does when referring to Arab attacks on Jews. (Indeed, Golan devotes three whole pages to describing in great detail the British torture of one Irgun operative, Benjamin Zeroni, the man who planned the Haifa market bombings.) He doesn't tell his readers that on July 6, 1938, an Irgun bomb, placed inside milk canisters in that market, killed 21 shoppers and wounded 52; or that three weeks later, on July 25, another bomb, in a pickled cucumber can, killed 39 shoppers and wounded at least 70 at the same site. Nor does he tell us that the exiled Jabotinsky, ostensibly in charge of the Irgun, objected to these operations. The Lehi's robbing of banks, including Jewish-owned banks, in the early 1940s is described by Golan as "relieving" these institutions of their funds.

But, clearly, attempting to whitewash the Irgun and Lehi weighed on Golan's mind. At one point, Golan states:

A cursory glance at the above list of almost two dozen acts of sabotage and mayhem perpetrated by the Lehi reveals not one directed at women, seniors riding buses, innocent people walking to work or children playing in schoolyards.... To specifically target women and children would have been unimaginable for any of the Hebrew forces.

Golan seems to be arguing against comparing the Irgun and Lehi with contemporary Palestinian terrorists. But his argument won't fly. I see no difference between planting bombs in Arab markets (1937-38) designed to kill as many shoppers as possible and planting bombs on Jewish buses (2000-03) designed to kill as many passengers as possible. Killing as many civilians as possible is, in both cases, the name of the game.

Google cache;
http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:ySbEZAtKLFEJ:www.forward.com/issues/2003/03.11.07/arts3.html+July+bomb+1938+haifa&hl=en

[Englander]

29. Here's one eg of Irgun's influence on contemporary culture-

The Israeli football/soccer team, Beitar Jersualem FC, are named after
the Revisionist youth movement, Betar.

More about Betar's history(for those who don't know);

'>snip

BETAR (the initials of Brit Yosef Trumpeldor, Joseph Trumpeldor Alliance), the educational youth movement of the Revisionist Zionist Organization and, subsequently, the Herut movement, was established in December 1923 in Riga, Latvia. The ideology of Betar included the establishment of a Jewish state in all of the territory of Mandatory Palestine, ingathering of the exiles, Zionism without a socialist component, a just society, military training for self-defense and a pioneering spirit.

The first members of Betar who settled in Palestine established a kvutsa (forerunner of the kibbutz) called Menora in Petah Tikva, and were active in settlement enterprises around the country. Betar spread to other countries, and established a world organization with Ze'ev Jabotinsky as its head (1931). The movement solidified and expanded its membership vigorously in the 1930s, playing an influential role in organizing clandestine immigration in the years before World War II.

It is active today in Israel and in the Diaspora, with a membership of 14,500 in Israel and 8,500 around the world.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Society_&_Culture/Youth.html

________________________________________

From 'Besieged Jerusalem 1948, Memories of an Irgun Fighter',
by Yehuda Lapidot;

'>snip

Betar was a youth organisation affiliated with the Nationalist movement. Members of Betar arriving in the country were required to spend two years in a 'Labor Brigade', where they worked during the day and trained in the evening for future service in the Irgun.

http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:TEwQUi9rtjEJ:www.daat.ac.il/daat/english/history/lapidot/5.htm+betar+irgun&hl=en&client=firefox-a

[Englander]

30. More egs of Irgun, &tc & the influence on contemporary culture -

Or, if you like, egs of 'glorifying terrorists';

A commemorative stamp, from '91, to honour the 'Lehi Freedom Fighters';
http://www.stamps-international.com/product_info.php?cPath=&products_id=583&osCsid=18294a48d27d33d18d783fb3b50bf2a9

A museum, where the exhibits are-

'devoted to "Lehi" organization (Fighters for Israel freedom) and one of its founders - Abraham Shtern'
http://www.ilmuseums.com/museum_eng.asp?id=81

There are numerous other egs, where streets are named after
'terrorists', where national institutions are run by ex-terrorists,
where stamps, & medals are issued to honour the same.

[Wordie]

13. This one, however, perhaps should be first on the list:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism

And to even begin to understand that article, it may be useful to also read the debate on some of the elements that went into it, here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Zionism

(I love wiki.)

[Colorado Blue]

4. Uh huh. Any word about the Israelis injured in the recent

attacks? The dead are already dead so it's too late to discuss THEM. But there have been at least nine, six in the homicide bombing at Hadera, which blew up a bunch of really dangerous individuals looking for fruit, and three who were hitchhiking. Wow. Serious threats to the Palestinians, all of them - I have no doubt.

Many more were injured in both the bombing and the shooting incidents and I'm wondering if you have updates on their health?

The IDF actions are intended to catch terrorists and stop the rocket attacks but I guess that's too subtle for certain people to grasp.

Better the Israslis should just lie down and die peacefully, I suppose?

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Violet_Crumble]

16. What's that got to do with the article that was posted?

n/t

[Englander]

18. Fa, I'd say. n/t

[Colorado Blue]

21. BALANCE. The article posted is a list of casualties

inflicted on Palestinians but it doesn't list the Israeli dead and injured, WHICH WERE THE MOTIVATION for the attacks. Just reading the above list one gets the impression the IDF is wantonly inflicting pain on the Palestinians, for no reason. In fact, the violence has been constant since the Gaza withdrawals, people have been killed and injured and the rocket attacks have caused damage and distress.

Also, I will now publicly protest the use of the term "IOF". This isn't the proper name of the Israeli Army, which is IDF.

I understand this term is used by Palestinian NGO's etc. However, in Islamic terminology, the land is "umma", motherland, and the terms "occupy, occupied, occupation" etc, have some extremely inflammatory and negative connotations in Arabic, beyond what are understood in English.

I believe, in order to further civil discourse, the most neutral and proper terms for people should be used. And it is important to understand that words in English don't have the same connotations in other languages, so what may appear to be merely descriptive actually is promoting some not so civil meanings.

[eyl]

22. It's one thing not to mention Israeli casualties

but much more seriously, they don't mentione the status of the Palestinian casualties and their deaths. How many of those were "militants", for example? Does this llist include people who died in the course of commiting an attack on Israelis?

[Violet_Crumble]

24. The article went into a fair bit of detail...

My guess is all five children were 'militants'. btw, I find it totally ridiculous to expect the article to mention Israeli casualties, as it was clearly labelled 'Weekly report on Israeli human rights violations in the Occupied Palestinian Territories 27 Oct - 9 Nov 2005'...

[eyl]

25. mea culpa

I admit I didn't read that part too carefully. I note, however, that according to that report Israel has only arrested civilians? That leads me to think that they're applying a generous standard when assigning someone to the "civilian" catagory.

I didn't say the children involved were terrorists, nor did I mean to imply that. However, that doesn't mean their deaths were criminal actions. For examlpe, look at the case of the child who was shot because soldiers mistaked the toy gun he was waving at them for a real one (note that this was in the middle of a firefight, IIRC); even in a police setting, such a shooting could be ruled justified.

And as I mentioned above, I don't think Israeli casualties should be mentioned in detail; but actions against Israelis should be mentioned as part of the background, since those led to the IDF attacks (though I suppose I shouldn't expect anything approaching context in an article which insists on using the term "IOF")

[Violet_Crumble]

23. So, will I see this same need to BALANCE in threads about Israeli dead...

...and wounded? This curious mind would like to know. :)

Way too often in this forum for as long as I can remember there's been attempts by some posters on both sides to turn casualties into some tit-for-tat game. All too often it comes across as looking like it's 'Don't talk about THEIR 'unworthy' victims! Let's talk about MY 'worthy' victims instead!'

I'm not sure I'm understanding what yr saying. The article went into detail about the circumstances of these deaths and injuries. I'm not sure why you think it should list Israeli dead and injured. Using that sort of logic, shouldn't you then be insisting that the article list the Palestinian dead and injured that were the MOTIVATION for the attacks, and keep on going back and back and back doing a whole cycle of blame thing?

Protest duly noted. There is nothing inflammatory or lacking in civility about the use of the term IOF. The term is used correctly because it refers specifically to the forces OCCUPYING Palestinian territory, and is used by not only NGO's, but also officially by the PA. Can you explain why you think the term 'occupation' has some extremely inflammatory connotations in Arabic?

Violet...

[Colorado Blue]

28. I don't think any of this can be taken out of context. As far

as "IOF" is concerned, it most certainly is offensive. It's offensive on its face, because it calls the Israeli army by an improper name. That in itself is upsetting.

In America, Native American tribes are upset because a football team in Washington, D.C., is called the "Redskins". Again, it isn't just the word, but the connotation(s). I will post some links about this also.

As far as the connotations of "Umma" are concerned, I don't have much time now but I'm preparing some documents to help explain this.

Briefly, Arabic is one language that is extremely difficult to translate exactly. This is a problem, I understand, with truly understanding Quran if you're not an Arabic speaker.

But, as an example, the word "Leili", used in a mahwal, doesn't just mean "night." The singer isn't singing "ya leili ha ya leili" and meaning just "the night oh the night". He is singing about the desert sky, billions of stars, shifting sands under a new moon; the longing in his heart, often in scales of pure desire. Dancing to music like that is moving like a hawk on wind.

Whoa. Here I am 55 years old and remembering that, remembering those voices, those words that could paint a desert sky bejeweled, remembering when I had the body to fly like that, gives me chills.

Similarly, "umma" is like the word "Israel". It means land but also people, community. And if "ya leili" has power, imagine "Umma".

I'll try to find some links that really clarify this, and why "occupation" - by infidels no less - isn't a simple word or concept.

[Violet_Crumble]

36. Sorry, but the Israeli army is OCCUPYING Palestinian territory..

I'm not sure how calling an army carrying out an occupation can be seen as being in any improper or offensive...

Many languages are extremely difficult to translate exactly. Arabic is no better or worse than many other languages. Also, I'm very skeptical of any claims that occupation in Arabic has 'inflammatory connotations', especially if those claims are being made by anyone not fluent in Arabic because I've come across people who claim that even the English use of the word 'occupation' is a terrible thing...

Violet...

[Englander]

26. Ah, I see.

So, you appear to be saying that the occupying forces, the idf, are
motivated by a desire for revenge? Which really is an extraordinary
claim to make, one I don't think I've seen made in this forum before,
or at least made so explicitly. Nevermind the desire for 'self-defense',
or any regard for the RoE, or legality, or any of that, you appear to
be saying that the army of the occupying power is avenging the Israeli
dead & injured, that all of the collective punishment, & the assassinations
&tc, are merely a form of vengeance?

--I understand this term is used by Palestinian NGO's etc. However, in Islamic terminology, the land is "umma", motherland, and the terms "occupy, occupied, occupation" etc, have some extremely inflammatory and negative connotations in Arabic, beyond what are understood in English.--

Link, please?

[Wordie]

8. It helps to put a human face on those who are "collateral damage" to many.

[number6]

19. thank you newyorican and Englander for the info

;) :kick: