GUNS IN THE NEWS--August 23, 2004

[MrBenchley]

As CO Liberal sez:
Please try to adhere to the following voluntary guidelines, in order that we can have an orderly discussion of gun-related news topics:
1 - Feel free to add any CURRENT stories to this thread by replying to this message. In order to be considered current, stories should have been originally posted on the Internet within the previous 24 hours, or provide follow-up to a story that was previously posted on the J/PS board. EXCEPTION: On Mondays (since many people do not log in to DU over the weekend), stories can be posted from Saturday, Sunday, or Monday.
2 - Both pro-gun and anti-gun stories, editorials, and press releases are welcome in this thread, as long as they're current. Please do not post links to items from a few years back that support your position.
3 - Bear in mind that any links to extremely right-wing sites (such as Newsmax, CNS, or the Washington Times) or intentionally pro-gun or pro-control sites (such as the NRA or the Brady Campaign) are not considered reliable sources by many DU-ers. If at all possible, try to find a link for your story from a more mainstream source, such as a general-circulation newspaper or magazine site. If you choose to use a slanted site, be prepared for any negative feedback you may receive.
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5 - Do not change story titles. In other words, if the Oskosh Gazette's web site runs a story titled "Two Killed in Holdup", the title of your message should read "Two Killed in Holdup". Don't change it to "Gun Owner Kills Two People", or anything else that changes the meaning of the story.
6 - If it's not clear from the title where the story occurred, add the city, state, or country in parentheses after the title.
7 - The person adding a news story to the "GITN" thread is allowed (and encouraged) to comment on that story, indicating their position on the topic being discussed. These comments can appear either at the beginning or end of the post; if possible, place comments in a different typeface so readers can separate the comments from the story. Others who wish to comment on a posted story can do so by replying to that story; this allows other readers to follow the comments by scrolling through the subthread.
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9 - If you object to these guidelines (or the basic concept of the "Guns In The News" thread), do everyone else a favor and go to another thread.

[MrBenchley]

1. 4-Year-Old Kills Himself While Playing With Gun (AL)

"BIRMINGHAM, Ala. -- A 4-year-old boy in Birmingham was killed Saturday when he shot himself while playing with a gun.
Willie White Jr. died from a gunshot wound around 4 p.m.
Birmingham Police said the boy accidentally shot himself with a gun he found at home.
Officials don't know exactly where the gun was or how the boy got ahold of it."

http://www.nbc13.com/news/3672221/detail.html

[MrBenchley]

2. Three Shot In Baltimore Town House

"BALTIMORE -- A triple shooting overnight sent two teenagers and a 34-year-old woman to the hospital.
Baltimore City police say they got a call about 2 a.m. Monday about a shooting in the 2200 block of Pentland Drive in Northeast Baltimore.
When they arrived they found three females suffering from gunshot wounds on the second floor of the town home. Authorities say a 34-year-old woman and a 14-year-old girl were shot in the head and a 16-year-old girl was shot under the arm."

http://www.thewbalchannel.com/news/3672836/detail.html

[MrBenchley]

3. Police Say Thursday Night Shooting No Accident (MN)

"Minneapolis (AP) Police say they are looking for several suspects in connection with Thursday night's shooting in north Minneapolis that killed one man and wounded another man.
The Hennepin County medical examiner says 20-year-old Darrius Dixon of Minneapolis died of multiple gunshot wounds. He and another man were found shot on a residential street near Lucille's Kitchen, a restaurant that closed earlier this month.
Police say the other victim was a 20-year-old Fridley man who was treated for a gunshot wound. "

http://wcco.com/localnews/local_story_234145505.html

[Pert_UK]

4. Greek Guard Killed as Prank Goes Wrong

"A Greek soldier guarding an Olympic facility in Athens has been shot dead after apparently playing a game of Russian roulette with a policeman, security sources said.

Greek police were questioning a policeman in connection with the pre-dawn shooting at the gates of an Olympic village hosting escorts to Olympic teams in the Metochi Parnithas region of Athens.

It appeared that a prank had gone wrong while the pair were playing with a service revolver containing a single bullet, the sources added.

The 25-year-old soldier was shot in the forehead."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200408/s1183278.htm

[Remmah]

7. Ouch.

So much for the theory that only the police and the military are trained well enough to be the "only" ones responsible for exclusive firearm ownership.

[MrBenchley]

9. Clearly

Civilian blowhards with a gun fetish and a mouthful of NRA propaganda should not be trusted with guns if even trained police do idiotic things like this....

Just following along on this RKBA "logic" or whatever the hell it is.....

[Remmah]

10. I support mandatory training and education.

Sig, Smith and Wesson, and a few other manufacturers have opened their training facilities for training on non-police persons. Prices for training have also come down. There are many a civilian out there that are better trained than police and military persons.

Plus through the magic of the First Amendment there is plenty of book and online training material available.

A little worldly education was resposible for making me a convert, first time gun owner later in life. Much of it had nothing to do w/the NRA krew.

[TX-RAT]

11. Interesting statement

(There are many a civilian out there that are better trained than police and military persons.)
How would you verify that?

[MrBenchley]

13. They all seem to be able to spout the NRA talking points

word for word....

[Remmah]

15. Observations

Most small town police departments and small county sheriff departments do not have annual firearm qualification shoots nor annual classroom safety training. The civilian gents from my conservation club regularly out shoot the local PD department teams. For major cities, state police departments, and federal agencies; "annual qualification" with firearms is all that is required. SWAT teams (state, city, federal) are the only persons who practice on a month to month basis.

I know several 10 to 20 year career military persons who have gravitated to the office combat zone. They occasionally get rotated overseas to fly desks there (and carry an M-9 or a M-16). They have not qualified in years. My sister being a flight line combat nurse (retired) has qualified more times than her hubby because he was considered in a non-combat career position. My sis's hubby (brother in law) did two tours in Bosnia, he practiced with his Taurus M-9 equal, US military had no requirements for him to quality. (Private, civilian gun ownership, being used to train US military.) Brother in law is a good person, I can outshoot him and field strip my Beretta 92FS faster than he can.

[TX-RAT]

20. OK

(Most small town police departments and small county sheriff departments do not have annual firearm qualification shoots nor annual classroom safety training.)
Actually our patrol officers qualified monthly, only desk officers qualified annually.

(The civilian gents from my conservation club regularly out shoot the local PD department teams)
At what?

[MrBenchley]

12. Whoop-dee-fuckin-do!

Now show me where any state requires mandatory training and education before a gun is sold....

"A little worldly education was resposible for making me a convert"
That's funny....it was my noticing what a dishonest pantload the RKBA cause was and what scummy politicians and public figures were embracing it that caused me to adopt my current position.

[Remmah]

16. NY requires mandatory safety training in order to get a handgun permit.

Really.

Major criminal background check too. (FBI).

[MrBenchley]

17. Yeah, but it doesn't require dick for a long gun, does it?

[Wcross]

24. You are correct. Women can buy them too :) n/t

[skippythwndrdog]

27. ROFLMAO!!!!!!!

[skippythwndrdog]

28. Good news!

That means that you can buy one, too!

[skippythwndrdog]

26. Are you sure that's all that caused it?

That's funny....it was my noticing what a dishonest pantload the RKBA cause was and what scummy politicians and public figures were embracing it that caused me to adopt my current position.

I smell another factor involved.

[MrBenchley]

30. No, skippy, that was enough for me...

That isn't enough for you?

[MrBenchley]

31. No, skippy, that was enough for me...

That isn't enough for you?

[MrBenchley]

5. 1 dead of gunshot wounds (TX)

"The Austin Police Department say one man died in a deadly shooting early Saturday morning in northeast Austin.
They said it happened around 5 a.m. at the Saint John's Apartments in the 7600 block of Blessing Avenue.
Officers responding to the scene found a man in the parking lot dead from a gunshot wound. "

http://www.news8austin.com/content/headlines/Default.asp?ArID=117341&SecID=2

[TheRovingGourmet]

34. Turns out the deceased was buying $80 worth of crack and

chose to run instead of paying the bill.

[MrBenchley]

35. Yeah, lowlifes and guns just go together naturally

Just like the RKBA cause and right wing horseshit...

[TheRovingGourmet]

36. The man had an addiction to a very terrible substance. That

does not mean he is a lowlife.

[MrBenchley]

37. Yeah, your compassion was dripping through in the other post....

Refresh my memory...which one of them had the gun? The guy with the "addiction to a very terrible substance" that you were chortling over before, or the crack dealer who shot him?

[TheRovingGourmet]

38. Both did. One did not bring his though.

[MrBenchley]

39. Sez you...

and by now we can see what that's worth.....

[TheRovingGourmet]

40. Yes, I do say. I also say that it is fun to have a portion of DU

that is void of most rules. Civility can be such a downer.

[MrBenchley]

41. Yeah, rule number one sure doesn't apply

to the trigger happy....

[TheRovingGourmet]

42. I wouldn't know. I've just been reading the posts addressed

to me at the moment.

[MrBenchley]

43. Those would be the ones that point out that I have sources

and you got nothing but right wing hot air and horseshit...

Go ahead...post the link to the news story that backs up your claim that this law-abiding gun owner left his gun at home when he went out to feed his tragic addicition.....

[TheRovingGourmet]

44. Law-abiding? What gave you that idea? And you are welcome

to register and read our local paper if you like.

[MrBenchley]

45. In other words, I got sources and you got nothing

but right wing hot air and horseshit.

But then what does anyone expect from our "honest" RKBAers, really?

TheRovingGourmet
108. Who said I was pro-gun?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=80864&mesg_id=81284&page=

[TheRovingGourmet]

46. Who said I was for or against the RKBA? I'm just here to run

up my post count by talking to the resident troll. A high number matters for some reason.

[MrBenchley]

48. Like I said.....we can see what your posts are worth

[MrBenchley]

6. Teen found in ditch had been shot in the head (MO)

"Investigators believe a teen found dead Saturday night of a gunshot wound was the victim of a homicide.
"Yes, most definitely," said Lt. Jim Arnott of Greene County Sheriff's Department.
An autopsy performed Sunday showed Robert Jo Wilson, 17, of Springfield died of a gunshot wound to the head, Greene County Medical Examiner Paul Spence said. Toxicology tests will be performed later, Spence added.
Still to be determined is why Wilson was shot and who shot him."

http://springfield.news-leader.com/news/today/0823-Teenfoundi-162152.html

[MrBenchley]

8. Man Critical After Shooting In East Chattanooga

"An East Chattanooga man is in critical condition following a shooting Monday morning.
Police said the shooting occurred around 5:20 a.m. at 1804 Newell Ave.
When officers arrived on the scene they found Julius Foster inside the house bleeding from several gunshot wounds. Mr. Foster was shot in the arm and in the chest area. "

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_54515.asp

[MrBenchley]

14. Man wounds wife, then takes own life (MI)

"Barbara and Dermont Warren met at Grand Rapids' Iroquois Middle School more than 25 years ago, starting a life together in which they had four children, a home and many happy moments.
But relatives say Dermont Warren was depressed lately, after three heart surgeries in a year and the loss of his job.
Still, loved ones are struggling to understand how the 40-year-old Warren could turn a gun on his wife -- seriously injuring her -- and then take his own life. "

http://www.mlive.com/news/grpress/index.ssf?/base/news-16/1093272330280900.xml

[MrBenchley]

18. Women shots, kills mother, then herself (SC)

Subliterate journalism...

"ROCK HILL, S.C. -- A mentally ill woman shot and killed her mother, then apparently took her own life at her parents' home, police and family members said.
Emma Jean Giles, 41, of Rock Hill had been diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia and had previously tried to kill her mother, Emma Ree Giles, 77, their family said.
The mother and daughter were found dead by family members in the mother's home in northwestern Chester County on Saturday morning, police said."

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20040822/APN/408220841

[MrBenchley]

19. GHS senior jailed in connection with Miller shooting (MS)

Youth charged with murder
"A Greenwood High school senior has been charged with murder in the shooting death of fellow student Travis Miller.
Kevin Lloyd, 17, of 802 W. Henry St., was initially arrested Thursday night and held pending an investigation of the fatal shooting. He was formally charged in the case late Friday afternoon, Greenwood Police Chief Ronnie White said Saturday.
Lloyd remains in the Leflore County Jail until a preliminary hearing in the case can be held later this week. He has been charged as an adult in the shooting, White said.
The police recovered a 12-gauge shotgun believed to have been used in the shooting in Whittington Park, White said. He noted the gun's barrel had been sawed down to make the weapon easier to conceal."

http://www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=12750720&BRD=1838&PAG=461&dept_id=104621&rfi=6

[MrBenchley]

21. Police arrest two suspects in Huron Street shooting (NY)

"Syracuse Police made an arrest in a drive by shooting that happened early Sunday morning.
Authorities say Alvin Clark and Jeremiah Donerlson fired shots from a vehicle that hit a by-stander on Huron Street.
Police arrested the men shortly after the shooting occurred.
Authorities say they stole a vehicle that was used in the drive-by from a woman they met in a bar. "

http://news10now.com/content/all_news/Default.asp?ArID=26472&SecID=83

[MrBenchley]

22. Man killed in Severn as 2 shootings occur minutes apart (MD)

"Anne Arundel County police yesterday were searching for motives in two shootings that occurred within minutes of each other in a Severn neighborhood Friday night, leaving one man dead.
A motorist notified police about 10:25 p.m. Friday after discovering an unresponsive man in a vehicle parked on Carriage Drive near Gallop Way. Police found Jones sitting in the driver's seat of his vehicle with gunshot wounds to his upper body. Paramedics brought him to North Arundel Hospital, where he was pronounced dead, police said.
About 10:30 p.m., an officer speaking with a resident on the 1700 block of Wood Carriage Drive heard a gunshot and saw a muzzle flash. A woman reported an unknown individual shot at her as she entered her vehicle on the 7900 block of Heather Mist Drive, near Carriage Drive. No one was injured, although several vehicles were damaged, including the woman's. "

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/bal-md.br.shooting22aug22,1,2259479.story?coll=bal-local-headlines

[MrBenchley]

23. Police probing two unrelated shootings (VA)

"Newport News police are investigating two unrelated shootings that happened within an hour of each other Thursday night in the East End.
A 53-year-old resident was in the 800 block of 35th Street when a stray bullet hit him in the arm around 10 p.m., said Newport News police spokeswoman Holly Hileman. Police are trying to find out the identities of six to nine young men who they say participated in the shootout.
Hileman didn't know the number of shots fired, but the gun battle left behind more than a dozen casings. The victim was treated at Riverside Regional Medical Center.
In an unrelated incident about an hour earlier, a 28-year-old man was shot as he stepped through the front door of his home on Nansemond Court, Hileman said. The victim told police he saw two men across the street firing at him."

http://www.dailypress.com/news/local/dp-64665sy0aug21,0,1378350.story?coll=dp-news-local-final

[MrBenchley]

25. Shooting At Endwell Nightclub (NY)

"Broome County sheriff's deputies continue to search for a man wanted in connection with a shooting here at Winnie's Dance ranch early Sunday morning.
About 500 people were inside the club for a rap concert around 3 o'clock Sunday morning when at least one shot was fired.
Thomas Fagan Junior of Elmira was hit and taken to Wilson Hospital. Besides that, deputies are having a hard time getting information.
Broome County's Undersheriff David Keller says, "We're kinda stuck because the way things are right now, the victim is not very cooperative. Also, we're not getting alot of cooperation from witnesses or people who were there that night.""

http://www.wbng.com/data/web_6357.shtml

[skippythwndrdog]

29. I gotta say it

All's well at Endwell

[MrBenchley]

32. Trial To Start Today In Fatal Shooting Over Bicycle (MD)

"BALTIMORE -- A 57-year-old West Baltimore man is scheduled to go on trial today for the fatal shooting of a teenager who was apparently trying to steal his bicycle.
The shooting happened in July 2002 behind Edward Day's home in the 2300 block of Harlem Avenue. David Stewart, 15, was killed with a double-barrel shotgun."

http://www.thewbalchannel.com/news/3672751/detail.html

[MrBenchley]

33. Save the Assault Weapons Ban

"Starting Sept. 14, our law-enforcement officers and the general public will face a more dangerous environment in our communities. It appears that President Bush and Congress are going let the federal Assault Weapons Ban expire. This makes no sense.

The ban was passed for very practical reasons. Prior to 1994, criminals were armed with enough firepower to outgun the police, making them nearly impossible to subdue, and allowing them to wreak terrible havoc in public places. The ban kept military-style assault weapons out of the hands of criminals. Since the passage of the ban, federal crime statistics show a dramatic 66 percent drop in the incidence of assault weapons traced to crimes. Given that, I can't think of a rational reason not to renew this law.

Police across the nation face danger on the job daily. Why should Congress and the president be allowed to increase that danger? None of us - in the law-enforcement or civilian community - should have to face military-style assault weapons and high-capacity magazines. Law-enforcement officers, for the most part, take pride in the ability to maintain the peace with a sidearm. If this ban is allowed to expire, our nation's law-enforcement leaders will be faced with the reality of having front-line officers out-gunned by every street gang, drug trafficker, and common criminal with access to the neighborhood sporting-goods store. The reality is, when the family firearm becomes an AK-47 or Tec-9 assault pistol, they also become the easy weapon of choice for would-be school shooters and other violent teens. How many more lives will the gun lobby put at risk to sell more assault weapons?"

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0824/p09s02-coop.html

[FeebMaster]

47. So where were the guns in this "news"? (nt)