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safeinOhio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 01:54 PM
Original message
Don't want handguns registered?
Then do not, I repeat, do not get a CCW. Once you do, you are now registered with the Federal government (on LEIN) as a registered handgun owner. If the government ever wants to take away guns, they'll knock on your door first.
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. Who cares if the govt wants to take away your guns. People with guns never
use them against our true enemies anyway.
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
14. Who are our "true enemies"? (n/t)
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
2. Yowsa! They're coming for your guns, even as I write.
Bury them all in the back yard, wrapped in cosmoline, right away. There's no time to lose. They're just down the street, heading your way. :sarcasm:
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rl6214 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:03 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. Lost all mine
in a boating accident.
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #10
19. Yes, well, OK, then...
Whatever. Mine are still in my house, safe and sound. I don't have any reason to take them on my boat. I don't shoot fish. I have other equipment for fishing.

You have a nice day, now.
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RSillsbee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 04:59 PM
Response to Reply #19
27. You never fished for shark? NT
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #27
30. Actually, I did. I fished for sharks with a bow and arrow.
Edited on Mon Apr-25-11 06:55 PM by MineralMan
I even wrote an article about it for Western Outdoors magazine back in 1980. Why do you ask? No firearms were on my boat. The bow was sufficient.

Here's the first page of the article. You can see the whole article at; http://www.osomin.com/BowfishingSharks.htm Feel free to ask any other questions:

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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #30
33. Awesome! My vote for best-post-of-day. n/t
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 07:22 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. A guy doesn't get an opening like that every day, you know.
My Boy Scout training taught me to "Be Prepared!" So, I had that article on my website, just for this occasion.

My beard and hair are white now. That was a long, long time ago. :rofl:
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. A good straight line is a thing to treasure. Well played, sir. n/t
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RSillsbee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #34
36. You win
I am going to read that article too
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MineralMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-11 08:09 AM
Response to Reply #36
38. Just funning you a little. What are the odds that you'd
ask someone that question and get the answer I gave. I thought it was really funny.

BTW, that article started a little boom in bowfishing for sharks in that location. It lasted for about three years. I was amazed.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. I'm ok with being registered, as long as my guns are not.

There is a difference.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
4. Oh, wait ... wasn't government allegedly for the 2nd amendment ... what happened???
Finally admitting that the threat isn't from the left it's from the right --

the GOPs/NRA has sold their political attack on liberal and moderate government

as "freedom" -- but it is actually just more fascism --

fascist in targeting liberals and moderates in government --

fascist in creating violence in America for the benefit of the rightwing.

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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #4
21. Somehow I am having a hard time figuring out how my concealed weapons permit ...
is a fascist plot by the GOPs/NRA to target liberals and moderates in government.

My view is if the Democratic Party wants to win more elections they need to stop supporting "feel good" gun control legislation such as another assault weapons ban. Attempts to pass foolish and useless gun control schemes have hurt our party in recent years. We keep shooting ourselves in the foot and we blame the NRA and the GOP for our losses when it's our finger that is on the trigger.

The voters no longer support the views of the extremely liberal element of our party on gun control. One look at this map tells the story.



We have far more important issues to deal with and we need the support of many voters who refuse to vote for Democrats who advocate ideas proposed by organizations such as the Brady Campaign.
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tularetom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
5. Duh - I've been arguing that for years with the CCW freaks
Amazing how people that are so paranoid about "the government" taking their guns are so willing to apply to "the government" for permission to carry those guns.

Don't forget the 2nd amendment confers the right to bear arms to all citizens.
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petronius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. Perhaps that means that the people you've been conversing with aren't paranoid freaks at all,
but rather responsible citizens willing to accept a reasonable compromise, as long as it doesn't unduly infringe on a basic right.

(And as been pointed out, having a permit doesn't necessarily say anything about the ownership of specific firearms, or any at all.)
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Atypical Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:26 PM
Response to Reply #5
17. The fact is people don't have any choice.
Many people don't like the fact that you have to ask for government permission to exercise their constitutional right, but right now, it is the law of the land in most places that if you want to carry a gun you have to get a permit.

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YllwFvr Donating Member (757 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-11 08:48 AM
Response to Reply #5
39. Asking permission, exactly
Thats why unlicensed open carry is a good idea
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safeinOhio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
6. I'm all for registering handguns and
government coming to take them away if you commit a felony.
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #6
23. Are you aware that criminals are constitutionally exempt from a gun registration requirement?

Haynes v. United States

Haynes v. United States, 390 U.S. 85 (1968), was a United States Supreme Court decision interpreting the Fifth Amendment to the United States Constitution's self-incrimination clause. Haynes extended the Fifth Amendment protections elucidated in Marchetti v. United States, 390 U.S. 39, 57 (1968)

Background of the case

The National Firearms Act of 1934 required the registration of certain types of firearms. Miles Edward Haynes was a convicted felon who was charged with failing to register a firearm under the Act. Haynes argued that, because he was a convicted felon and thus prohibited from owning a firearm, requiring him to register was essentially requiring him to make an open admission to the government that he was in violation of the law, which was thus a violation of his right not to incriminate himself.

Majority opinion

In 7-1 decision, the Court ruled in favor of Haynes. Earl Warren dissented in a one sentence opinion and Thurgood Marshall did not participate in the ruling.

As with many other 5th amendment cases, felons and others prohibited from possessing firearms could not be compelled to incriminate themselves through registration.<1><2> The National Firearm Act was amended after Haynes and the new registration provision was upheld in United States v. Freed, 401 U.S. 601 (1971).<3>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haynes_v._United_States
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Glassunion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:11 PM
Response to Original message
7. Link?
Edited on Mon Apr-25-11 02:26 PM by Glassunion
On EDIT:
I checked and my state does not compile these licenses into our version of LEIN(JNET).

Also, at no time during the application do we supply any information on firearms that we do or do not own. My wife had her license before she owned a firearm.
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Surf Fishing Guru Donating Member (57 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 11:16 PM
Response to Reply #7
37. Glassunion
I checked and my state does not compile these licenses into our version of LEIN(JNET).


Yeah but PA State Police do maintain an illegal database of firearm sales transactions that is used every day as a -punch a name or address into a computer and the guns owned pop right up- registry.

OT - You a glazier? Phila LU252 for 31 years here.
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cleanhippie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. Thank you for showing just how wrong one can be on this subject. Your bravery is to be applauded.
Perhaps you were simply trying to make the distinction that having a CCW permit does not mean you actually have to OWN a GUN, or if you do own a gun, just HOW MANY you do own.
It is an important distinction that a PERSON is registered that have had a background check and are not disqualified from exercising their civil right, but it in NO WAY registers a gun at all.

Thanks for taking one for the team by pretending you did not know the difference and made an ignorant post where you thought you did, just to make a point. Bravo, and well done.
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ileus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
9. They can have the two handguns I've bought since getting my CHP
I'll keep the rest.
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Callisto32 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:15 PM
Response to Original message
12. Really?
That doesn't make sense, since owning a handgun is NOT a requirement for issuance of a CCW permit anywhere, as far as I know.
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spin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
13. True, the government knows that there is an excellent possibility that I own a handgun ...
as I have a concealed weapons permit.

That fact does not tell them the serial number and the make and type of the handguns I own. I'm not required to list any of this information on my application for a concealed weapons permit. Florida has no system set up for the registration of handguns as such a system is forbidden by law.


The 2010 Florida Statutes(including Special Session A)

790.335 Prohibition of registration of firearms; electronic records.
(1) LEGISLATIVE FINDINGS AND INTENT.
(a) The Legislature finds and declares that:
1. The right of individuals to keep and bear arms is guaranteed under both the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution and s. 8, Art. I of the State Constitution.
2. A list, record, or registry of legally owned firearms or law-abiding firearm owners is not a law enforcement tool and can become an instrument for profiling, harassing, or abusing law-abiding citizens based on their choice to own a firearm and exercise their Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms as guaranteed under the United States Constitution. Further, such a list, record, or registry has the potential to fall into the wrong hands and become a shopping list for thieves.
3. A list, record, or registry of legally owned firearms or law-abiding firearm owners is not a tool for fighting terrorism, but rather is an instrument that can be used as a means to profile innocent citizens and to harass and abuse American citizens based solely on their choice to own firearms and exercise their Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms as guaranteed under the United States Constitution.
http://archive.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode...
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oneshooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 07:02 PM
Response to Reply #13
32.  Texas does not require a list of calibers, types, or serial #s either. n/t
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AtheistCrusader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
15. In such a hypothetical situation, what would stop XYZ person from offering a single .22 caliber pist
ol to 'surrender' their carry weapon?

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Atypical Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:25 PM
Response to Original message
16. This is why I don't have one.
I have never gotten a CCW permit for this exact reason. Aside from the fact that I think it is highly unlikely I will ever need a firearm outside my home, of course.

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gravity556 Donating Member (576 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:29 PM
Response to Original message
18. Never got my CCW
Of course, I live in an OC state (constititional carry, now) that requires no registration. All of my guns but one were purchased FTF from friends and friends of friends-saves on sales tax and if you're patient (and have friends who like to gamble) you can get some smoking deals that way.

Never saw the point in CCW laws-I either have the right to be armed or I do not-whether you can tell if I have a gun on or not, I seriously doubt that there will ever be a heated exchange somewhere..

"You, sir have a gun! It discomfits me, and just the knowledge of its presence in this plane of existence is causing me great psychic harm! *sob*
Why just the very proximity of that death machine has me verging on a panic attack, requiring me to physically confront you!"

And that's where the conversation goes off the rails. When I do open carry, I get maybe 1 in 150 people that say anything negative. And I never quite get the negative responses. A clerk at a convenience store that I saw 5 times a week happened to be in on the weekend. I was open carrying. It was the strangest thing-she was all smiles and jokes and chit chat until I reached for my wallet. She must not have noticed the gun until then-and it was like someone flipped a switch. Going on and on about how I must be a "tough guy" just looking to shoot someone.

Is it just me? Am I the only person who sees a logic failure in intentionally provoking someone that you apparentlty ferverently believe is not only armed, but excessively aggressive as well?
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. " Am I the only person who sees a logic failure..."
Sadly, it seems some people here actually advocate such action as you describe. They claim to have done it themselves, but I haven't seen pictures yet....
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gravity556 Donating Member (576 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 04:31 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Sadly, it seems some people here actually advocate such action as you describe
"See that grizzly bear over there, kids? I'm gonna sneak up behind him and stuff this pinecone right up his arse! Everyone says it's not a good idea to tempt fate. but I'll just remind the bear that we're only tourists...."
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PavePusher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. This:
joecartoon.libsyn.com/goanna-humper
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OneTenthofOnePercent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
20. Knowing someone owns guns is pretty far from knowing *what* they own.
If people do ever come knocking on my door for guns - they sure won't get them all... and there's no way they'll know it.
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safeinOhio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 04:55 PM
Response to Original message
25. After they search and take away
all of the guns of folks with CCWs, they'll be knocking on the doors of all NRA members.

:rofl:
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RSillsbee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 04:57 PM
Response to Original message
26. That's why we're trying to get Vermont carry nationwide NT
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Smokewagon Donating Member (17 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 06:13 PM
Response to Original message
29. Just because
I have a concealed handgun license, and am a member of the NRA, doesn't mean I own one of those nasty ol' guns, that commits crimes and mayhem.
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S_B_Jackson Donating Member (564 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-25-11 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
31. "I'm sorry.....
but all of my firearms, except for a Hungarian FEG PA-63, were lost in a tragic boating accident on the Bay. If you'll wait a moment, I'll retrieve the Coast Guard incident report as well as the police report that was filed with the sheriff's dept to report my loss. Will there be anything else?"
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guardian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-11 06:25 PM
Response to Original message
40. Then give them your
cheapest and least reliable gun.....errr....I mean your ONLY gun.
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S_B_Jackson Donating Member (564 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-11 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. LOL
I had the same reaction.

If such a policy were ever to go into effect, I think you could probably walk from across Galveston Bay on the bottoms of capsized boats as all of the Houston metro gun owners arranged to "lose" their firearms. And local hardware stores and auto parts stores would be reporting unexected runs on plumbing supplies, fittings, and axle grease. :evilgrin:

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benEzra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-26-11 10:06 PM
Response to Original message
41. Few if any states require information about guns in order to issue a CHL,
Edited on Tue Apr-26-11 10:06 PM by benEzra
I see what you are driving at, but carry licensure as practiced in most states does not involve any gun information at all.

I have mentioned here that I own and carry an S&W Ladysmith and hold an NC CHL, but the state of North Carolina does not know what I own and that information is irrelevant to the carry license.
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